Logain ?

[aslansrevenge]

This may have been asked before and if so sorry but what part will Logain have in the battle to come? will he fight for the light or will he go to the darkness??

[Raistlin]

From Mins viewings of him it sounds like he will stay to the light side. It also seems he will have some glory in all this.

[Guest Dreadlord]

Well, since Min said the blue and gold halo she sees on him means he has glory to come, I would say he will fight for the Light, mostly because if he had glory on the Shadows side I assume the colors wouldnt be blue and gold, and Min would have probably known if it was something bad.

 

I have a bit of a theory on how he gets the glory, and I dont think it will be for killing Taim, or not just that.

 

Since there was a dream (Egwene?) that Logain would step over a body that looked like Rands but wasnt, I think somebody (Demandred) will impersonate Rand at the Black Tower, and Logain will discover this and kill the imposter. Maybe the imposter doesnt know Rand lost a hand, and Logain figures it out from that.

 

Although I usually like the idea of a one-on-one between Rand and Demandred I think it would turn out well if this happened, it would be a good way for Logains glory to come about, especially if Logain killed Taim as well, as a lot of people think he will.

 

The thing about it being Demandred is that, besides not seeing him at all really, Im guessing book 12 will be his book as much as any other bad guys. He needs to DO something! AND he was supposed to have been watching Rand as Osan'gar was, so I wonder if the Black Tower will be Demandred spot as well when he comes to the fore.

[Guest Toad]

I vote - Light.

 

Maybe Mat will take him to Seanchan and make him a governor after rebuilding the Empire.

[Spirit1025]

That's an interesting theory, Dreadlord.

 

Since there was a dream (Egwene?) that Logain would step over a body that looked like Rands but wasnt

Or is this tied in to the Moridin/Rand bodyswap theory? Is it Moridin in Rand's body that Logain steps over? Hmm....

 

I think Logain is a good guy, even if he's a little shady. He's mysterious, and I like that. I'll be interested to see what happens with him in the future.

 

My own theory on Logain's glory (I'm not sure if I believe it or not, just thought of it) is that after Tarmon Gai'don he will assume some sort of leadership. Possibly the Black and White towers will be united and he will become the new male version of the Amyrlin? It was that way in the Age of Legends, I know. OR....When Nynaeve learns how to Heal death, he helps her heal Rand. (Yes, I'm hoping that something of that nature happens)

 

For some reason I remember Min seeing a similar colored halo around one of the Aes Sedai, either in The Shadow Rising or The Fires of Heaven, but I can't find it.

[Leopoled Boothe]

The thing that really bothers me about Egwene's dream is that after Logain step over "Rand's" body he assends a black rock and begins laughing maniacally.  This is somewhat worrysome because laughing maniacally isn't something that good guys genreally do.  So why is Logain doing this?  I think that Rand's body crumbling away doesn't mean that it isn't Rand but rather that Rand will fade into obscurity while Logain assends to glory.  So how does this happen?  Well, I belive that one of two things will happen to Rand post TG, either he will be dead or he will, quite willingly, give up the limelight and fade into obscurity (either he will be dead or he will let he world believe that he is).  Meanwhile Logain will emerge from TG as the champion of the light, will become head of the Black Tower and will be an influntial leader in the 4th age.  As memory turns to legend and legned fades to myth the story will become twisted such that Logain, himself, was the Dragon Reborn (notice that the 4th age writings concerning the DR never mention a name).  Therefore, Logain is laughing maniacally because despite the fact that he was arested and stilled as a false dragon, as far as history is concerned he did become the Dragon Reborn.

 

One the other hand, as much as I like Logain and hope that he comes down on the side of the light I still think it would be interesting it somehow turns out that Taim is actually with the Light while Logain is the one who is with the Shadow.  I know it doesn't seem that way at present but if anyone could pull off such a twist its RJ.

 

*Oops, it seems I made a serious error in this post.  Rather than correct it I thought I'd leave it an see if you can find it.  Its kind of humerous really.

[DemandredFO]

I agree that human history will record that Lord Logain Ablar was the Dragon Reborn and saved the world.  I seriously doubt that Taim is for the Light.

[Guest Dreadlord]

Was the error "One the other hand?" That'd have been funny if you were talking about Rand...

 

Anyway, I really hope Taim is a Darkfriend. I think he is a better bad guy than most of the Forsaken (way more than Bel'al and Balthamel/ Aran'gar, more than Sammael and even Rahvin). The way Taim comes across when he annoys Rand, with his attitude towards Aes Sedai, as well as his Age of Legends mannerisms and naming Demandred as if he knew him personally when talking to Rand, I think his role (or what I percieve to be his role-a non-Forsaken badguy right under Rands nose, waving a black flag about and nobody seeing it) fits him way too well for him to end up being a good guy. I just hope Taim is Taim and nothing else, a male channeler who went over to the Dark of his own choice.

 

I like Logain, I think he fits being an Ashaman more than the others. For some reason I think it would fit well if he and Cadsuane were heads of the Black and White Towers after Tarmon Gaidon

[Asmo]

Taim aside, I think Logain will temporarily take Rand's place as the Dragon Reborn when Rand is forced to fake his death, and during that pretense he may well kill Taim, if Taim is not who I think he is, and bring the Black Tower to heel. Thereby Logain's glory, and the various viewings about him and Rand coming true.

[Guest Toad]

Is it possible that Rand will burn himself out during the last battle and become 'ordinary' again?  Thus making Logain more pivitol in the fight...

[Asmo]

With Nynaeve close at hand, being severed isn't so drastic any more.

[Guest Toad]

But is there a difference in being severed and being burned out.  For example, if the ability to channel is a string - being stilled/gentled would be like cutting the string in half.  The whole string is still there, just not connected.  Nynaeve's healing bridges that gap.  But being burned out is like burning the string - there is nothing left to bridge.  Could healing actually replace the string?

[Guest Dreadlord]

If anyone makes that discovery it will be either Nynaeve or Damer Flynn I think. But I would like it if being burnt out was final. That being said though, I believe Lanfear was burnt out, so I dont know how that would fit into Cyndane still channeling/being weaker

[Mr Ares]

But is there a difference in being severed and being burned out.

No. Severed is an Age of Legends term, and the only one they used. It covers what the 3rd Agers call stilling, gentling and burning out. There is no evidence that any of these things are harder to Heal than any other. There is also the case of the three AS severed by Rand at Dumai's Wells who are later Healed by Flinn. While they are referred to as being stilled, Rand's own description of what he did to them (crushing in fists of spirit, rather than a clean slice with a sharpened version of the shield weave) is different to the usual description of stilling - indeed, is closer to burn out. If you want to talk about the damage done by burning out, take into account that what Rand did apparently presents no difficulties.

[Guest Toad]

But is there a difference in being severed and being burned out.

No. Severed is an Age of Legends term, and the only one they used. It covers what the 3rd Agers call stilling, gentling and burning out. There is no evidence that any of these things are harder to Heal than any other. There is also the case of the three AS severed by Rand at Dumai's Wells who are later Healed by Flinn. While they are referred to as being stilled, Rand's own description of what he did to them (crushing in fists of spirit, rather than a clean slice with a sharpened version of the shield weave) is different to the usual description of stilling - indeed, is closer to burn out. If you want to talk about the damage done by burning out, take into account that what Rand did apparently presents no difficulties.

 

I see your point, but even crushing suggests that there is something there to work with.  Burning out suggests that the ability was destroyed - nothing left to work with.  But that is probably just semantics.

[Mr Ares]

Burning out suggests that the ability was destroyed - nothing left to work with.

To you, maybe.

[Guest Toad]

Burning out suggests that the ability was destroyed - nothing left to work with.

To you, maybe.

 

Yes.

[Guest Dreadlord]

I understand what you are saying toad and I agree, severing is gentling/stilling, being burnt out os another case altogether I reckon. Rand severed the women at Dumais Wells, as in he stilled them. He didnt burn them out

[RAND AL THOR]

The way burning out is portrayed in the books, I don't think it is possible for someone else to burn you out. It always seems to be something that the AS bring upon themselves by mishandling the power.

[Mr Ares]

I understand what you are saying toad and I agree, severing is gentling/stilling, being burnt out is another case altogether I reckon. Rand severed the women at Dumais Wells, as in he stilled them. He didnt burn them out

Then you are wrong. Severing was an AoL term when they used no other. No arbitrary distinctions between stilling, gentling and burning out. Severing covers all three. Fact. Room for disagreement only comes in with your belief that there is some difference in the ability to Heal these things (no indication of this at all, and some evidence against, as already outlined, so unlikely), and whether or not Rand stilled or burnt out those women (the term stilling is used, but the description is closer to that of burning out. They were Healed, regardless). And rather than string, why not use hands as an analogy? Severing removes your ability to use your hands. Stilling cuts off a womans hands, gentling cuts off a mans. Burning out burns your hands. Rand crushed their hands to a pulp. Stilling/gentling allows them to be sewn back on, burn out or what Rand did? Well, as one can be Healed with no problems, why shouldn't the other be? Is one really more serious or destructiive? We have no reason to think so.

 

The way burning out is portrayed in the books, I don't think it is possible for someone else to burn you out. It always seems to be something that the AS bring upon themselves by mishandling the power.

Burning out has also been done by ter'angreal.

[aslansrevenge]

I understand what you are saying toad and I agree, severing is gentling/stilling, being burnt out is another case altogether I reckon. Rand severed the women at Dumais Wells, as in he stilled them. He didnt burn them out

Then you are wrong. Severing was an AoL term when they used no other. No arbitrary distinctions between stilling, gentling and burning out. Severing covers all three. Fact. Room for disagreement only comes in with your belief that there is some difference in the ability to Heal these things (no indication of this at all, and some evidence against, as already outlined, so unlikely), and whether or not Rand stilled or burnt out those women (the term stilling is used, but the description is closer to that of burning out. They were Healed, regardless). And rather than string, why not use hands as an analogy? Severing removes your ability to use your hands. Stilling cuts off a womans hands, gentling cuts off a mans. Burning out burns your hands. Rand crushed their hands to a pulp. Stilling/gentling allows them to be sewn back on, burn out or what Rand did? Well, as one can be Healed with no problems, why shouldn't the other be? Is one really more serious or destructiive? We have no reason to think so.

 

The way burning out is portrayed in the books, I don't think it is possible for someone else to burn you out. It always seems to be something that the AS bring upon themselves by mishandling the power.

Burning out has also been done by ter'angreal.

 

Gone is gone if you lose the power it make no diffrence to what it is called. If you think of Channeling as running the one power though a tube with Stilling or gentaling this pipe is cut so the one power does not go anywere with burning out the pipe is damaged and all three can be repared to some degree but it will take both a man and a women channeler working to gether to get the pipe back to how it was before the damage happened. When Nynaeve heals it there are gaps and so the person healed can not channel as much as she did before.

[Guest Dreadlord]

I find it hard to believe there is evidence that being severed is like being burnt out since we havent seen anyone that has definitely been burnt out. No good saying this is how it is unless you back it up with real evidence and all thats been said on here so far is what people think. I may be wrong, but provide the evidence that was apparantly already given please as I cant find it

[aslansrevenge]

There is a section in book 11 I thinks when LTT says theat there are 3 of them him Rand and ? could this other person be Logain

[Leopoled Boothe]

There is a section in book 11 I thinks when LTT says theat there are 3 of them him Rand and ? could this other person be Logain

 

Nope, the third person in Rand's head is Moridin because of the link formed between him and Rand at the end of COS.  Why would Logain be in Rand's head?

[sombrastewart]

I find it hard to believe there is evidence that being severed is like being burnt out since we havent seen anyone that has definitely been burnt out. No good saying this is how it is unless you back it up with real evidence and all thats been said on here so far is what people think. I may be wrong, but provide the evidence that was apparantly already given please as I cant find it

 

Setalle Anan.

 

And, honestly, I expect her to be Healed in aMoL.