Does the Dark One Stand a Chance?

[Guest Toad]

The deck seems to be stacked against the Dark one at Tarmon Gaidon:

 

The Dark One:

Himself

Black Ajah

Renegade Ashaman

Dark Friends

Shadow Spawn

Forsaken

 

The Light:

The Dragon

Aes Sedai - greatly out number Black Ajah (I think)

Dragon-loyal Ashaman - I don't know what percent this would be

Borderlanders, all the other armies (Tear, Cairhein), Aiel, and even the Seanchan don't tolerate darkfriends/shadowspawn

Just a handful of Ashaman and/or linked Aes Sedai can handle tens of thousands of shadowspawn

Ogier

Seafolk

The Kin

Lan and the Malkier

 

Doesn't seem like much hope for the dark one, but I'm sure there are many things I'm not appreciating. What do you all think?

[RAND AL THOR]

Despite the Light having all that, they are not sufficiently organized.

 

1)The Seanchan are at war with all of Randland.

2)Aes Sedai are divided and the Tower at its weakest in Tower history.

3)Very few loyal Asha'man. I think that almost all Asha'man are DFs and only the Soldiers and the-other-rank-that-I-cannot-remember are not all DFs.

4)The various armies are presently not organized well.

5)The number of Ogier is in question. They may not make much of a difference. (We are talking about the whole of Randland going to war). Though they would certainly boost morale.

 

 

6) DO is pretty strong. He can taint the Power that drives the universe. He can bring dead people back to life. Who knows what other hidden tricks he's got? Do not underestimate the Dark One.

7)Several members of the BA remain free. They can effectively kill many AS before they themselves are taken. Despite their limited number, they are a serious threat. Lets not forget that at least two Amyrlins have fallen prey to them.

8)Renegade Asha'man-Rand is not even aware of the powerful opposition to him in the B Tower. This is a devastating blow to the Light. A nice number of Asha'man as trained in saidin as possible in this Age-against the Light.

9)Shadowspawn-when talking about millions of trollocs and hundreds of thousands of mydraal- it becomes a formidable number.

10)Forsaken-though they seem pretty incompetent at times, they have accomplished a lot in Randland that has weakened the Light. They are formidable foes to most AS. Perhaps Rand and Nynaeve can match their strength but most AS cannot do so. And we can hardly expect Rand and Nynaeve to be hunting the Forsaken at TG.

 

So the Dark doesn't seem so weak after all.....

[Ahaz Flagg]

Sad to say the Great Lord stands 0 chance to win, we know this because of the 4tn age quotes through the books, we also know this because RJ has stated he would give us a little information on the after math of the last battle. 

 

 

[Guest Toad]

Despite the Light having all that, they are not sufficiently organized.

 

1)The Seanchan are at war with all of Randland.

2)Aes Sedai are divided and the Tower at its weakest in Tower history.

3)Very few loyal Asha'man. I think that almost all Asha'man are DFs and only the Soldiers and the-other-rank-that-I-cannot-remember are not all DFs.

4)The various armies are presently not organized well.

5)The number of Ogier is in question. They may not make much of a difference. (We are talking about the whole of Randland going to war). Though they would certainly boost morale.

 

 

6) DO is pretty strong. He can taint the Power that drives the universe. He can bring dead people back to life. Who knows what other hidden tricks he's got? Do not underestimate the Dark One.

7)Several members of the BA remain free. They can effectively kill many AS before they themselves are taken. Despite their limited number, they are a serious threat. Lets not forget that at least two Amyrlins have fallen prey to them.

8)Renegade Asha'man-Rand is not even aware of the powerful opposition to him in the B Tower. This is a devastating blow to the Light. A nice number of Asha'man as trained in saidin as possible in this Age-against the Light.

9)Shadowspawn-when talking about millions of trollocs and hundreds of thousands of mydraal- it becomes a formidable number.

10)Forsaken-though they seem pretty incompetent at times, they have accomplished a lot in Randland that has weakened the Light. They are formidable foes to most AS. Perhaps Rand and Nynaeve can match their strength but most AS cannot do so. And we can hardly expect Rand and Nynaeve to be hunting the Forsaken at TG.

 

So the Dark doesn't seem so weak after all.....

 

Never said he was weak.  Just that he is facing overwhelming odds.

[Majsju]

 

 

6) DO is pretty strong. He can taint the Power that drives the universe. He can bring dead people back to life. Who knows what other hidden tricks he's got? Do not underestimate the Dark One.

 

That line is the big thing. We can be pretty sure that we have noit seen everything the shadow has at its disposal. Just take the hints about the really scary creatures in the Blight. The Forsaken seems a bit awed by the Worms, and there are things in the Blight that eats Worms...

[Ahaz Flagg]

 

 

6) DO is pretty strong. He can taint the Power that drives the universe. He can bring dead people back to life. Who knows what other hidden tricks he's got? Do not underestimate the Dark One.

 

That line is the big thing. We can be pretty sure that we have noit seen everything the shadow has at its disposal. Just take the hints about the really scary creatures in the Blight. The Forsaken seems a bit awed by the Worms, and there are things in the Blight that eats Worms...

 

I surely hope we see some of these in the final Battle!!

[Guest Toad]

If the dark one can have tricks up his sleeve, how about the creator putting in an appearance?  Now that could be some fireworks.

[havoc110]

He stands an excellent chance to just about escape the Bore,

before getting sealed back up again.

 

He's almost gonna make it this time, guaranteed.

[Ahaz Flagg]

If the dark one can have tricks up his sleeve, how about the creator putting in an appearance?  Now that could be some fireworks.

 

We learn fast that will not happen, Only the chosen one can do that.  As we now know, Rand is the chosen one.

[Guest Toad]

If the dark one can have tricks up his sleeve, how about the creator putting in an appearance?  Now that could be some fireworks.

 

We learn fast that will not happen, Only the chosen one can do that.  As we now know, Rand is the chosen one.

 

So the creator fights by proxy.  Let the humans do the dirty work.

[Daphilip]

The creator probably don't want to fight the DO... The battle might destroy the world/worlds^^ (or something in that style)

[Ahaz Flagg]

The creator probably don't want to fight the DO... The battle might destroy the world/worlds^^ (or something in that style)

 

That is what I read some where!!

 

The creator is in the battle Toad, Rand is his chosen vessel, and to some extent Mat and Perrin imho!!

[runner1]

I also would like to see new baddies fighting in the Last Battle, like others have mentioned, those "Worms" and other scarier things than the Worms would be nice! :o

 

I know it is always said that once the Dark One gets free, all hell breaks loose in the world, but does anyone think the DO will get free for a brief time (seconds, minutes, an hour?) before getting put back in?

I kinda want to see the Dark One himself.LOL.

I'm soo curious as to how the Last Battle will be played out!!

I hope the Last Battle gets a lot of page time. ;D

 

 

[RAND AL THOR]

The Creator would not want to fight the DO because he needs the DO to balance the world.

 

I too hope that we see the DO and that it doesnt end up like LOTR where we never actually see Sauron at all. (That is a clever writer's tactic. The evil overlord is hence kept permanently in mystery which makes him look far more threatening).

 

There is so far no evidence at all about the Creator ever interfering with the world after Creation so I don't expect him. Please don't quote the incident in EOTW against this statement as that is still unexplained. ;)

[Bob T Dwarf]

Actually, there's no need for the DO at all.

 

Even in the idyllic Age of Legends, there was more than enough purely human evil to require Ogier police, and "binders" for criminals.  Humans have always ( and probably will always ) have the innate capacity to **** up a free lunch.

[RAND AL THOR]

Actually, there's no need for the DO at all.

 

Even in the idyllic Age of Legends, there was more than enough purely human evil to require Ogier police, and "binders" for criminals.  Humans have always ( and probably will always ) have the innate capacity to **** up a free lunch.

 

True, but who to balance the Creator? Those bad guys balance the good guys.

 

My view:

The Creator: GOOD

The Wheel: NEUTRAL

The Dark One: BAD

 

All necessary.

[Mr Ares]

Actually, there's no need for the DO at all.

 

Even in the idyllic Age of Legends, there was more than enough purely human evil to require Ogier police, and "binders" for criminals.  Humans have always ( and probably will always ) have the innate capacity to **** up a free lunch.

True, but who to balance the Creator? Those bad guys balance the good guys.

 

My view:

The Creator: GOOD

The Wheel: NEUTRAL

The Dark One: BAD

 

All necessary.

Shai'tan and the Creator both stand outside the Pattern. The Wheel maintains a balance within the Pattern.