Mat - Strange Sense of Honour

[trakand_01]

I dont think there's a thread for this already.

 

Does anyone else think Mat would be mortified if he realised that actually he's a pretty nice guy?

 

He's portrayed (to me) as the selfish one of the three lads, the one who prefers a bit of fun and a lot of coin to responsibility and duty. He spends all his time huffing and puffing and complaining at having to get Nynaeve and Elayne out of scrapes but underneath it all... he does it not only because he's told to look after them by Rand, but because that's just how he is. I think it is heightened after he 'adopts' Olver, but he looks out for them in a brotherly way, rather than an 'annoyed person appointed to look after you' way.

 

Same with Egwene, just before he sets off with Elayne et al to Ebou Dar. She is walking towards him with the Little Tower trailing her. She's alone, and Mat, having known her from childhood, reads her well. He doesnt just think 'she got herself into this, its her problem' as you might expect him to think, he thinks 'poor Egwene, they're using her as a puppet' and takes it upon himself to bow to her, signalling to his men to do the same - he actually showed some care and affection for her.

 

Personally i think he'd be devastated to learn people see him as more than just a cad... but then again... maybe he wouldnt!

 

I also have a theory that he actually isnt so irresponsible as you may think (perhaps you dont, but it's the initial impression i had created for me). What is put forwards as one of his main traits is his desire to avoid being 'dragged' into things. He vowed to leave Rand's party so many times on the way to the waste. You could be forgiven (at least i hope i'm forgiven) for thinking this is because he doesnt care, because he's lazy and just wants a quiet life - not his problem. I actually think its because he knows that BECAUSE he cares for his friends, if he stays he will get himself right into the thick of it, earning himself more work and hassle. Because subconsciously he knows that if he stays around, he cannot stand by and let his friends struggle without his help.

 

 

[RobertAlexWillis]

He'll settle into it.  He's only 21 after all.

 

I think Siuan nailed him best, in TDR ch 20.

 

"You remind me of my uncle Huan.  No one could ever pin him down.  He liked to gamble, too, and much rather have fun than work.  He died pulling children out of a burning house.  He wouldn't stop going back as long as there was one left inside."

 

Its interesting to me that Lanfear, in that same chapter, saw in him a gloryhound, where Siuan saw a reluctant hero.  I think Mat is one of Jordan's best characters in that he portrays the potential in all of us to go either way.  Certainly he's not the only one, but its there in him.

[Lord_Naryb]

Yeah, our little Mat is all grown up ;D

 

As a side note what do you think Mat's reaction would be at the end of KoD, if Lanfear made the same offer she did in the Tower (you know the whole power, riches, fame thing)

[RobertAlexWillis]

As a side note what do you think Mat's reaction would be at the end of KoD, if Lanfear made the same offer she did in TGH (you know the whole power, riches, fame thing)

 

He laugh in her face, and tell her something like this:

 

"Power is just responsibility, and I already have more than that than I ever wanted.  My dice can get me all the money I need, and fame just makes you a target."

[trakand_01]

I'll let you know when ;) i get that far.

 

I think he's great. Personally i'm a Rand-gal but Mat is definitely 3rd in line  ;D

[Lord_Naryb]

I doubt he'll be 3rd for long. Perrin was my early fav, but Mat has since taken his spot.

[trakand_01]

Perrin was good in the first few books, before he married Faile. I actually quite like Faile but i dont like what RJ did to Perrin after they married.

 

I've read up to book 10 and Rand is still #1. Lan #2 and Mat#3. Gawyn#4, and then Elyas #5 (I have a mental image of Kris Kristofferson as Whistler in Blade for this one).

[trakand_01]

I think the Siuan's quote about Mat reminding her of her uncle is very apt. With his excellent (inherited) battle wit, his luck and a certain level of intelligence to start with (I have never imagined any of the 3 lads to be stupid in the slightest) I dont personally believe Mat will die in battle. I see him dying doing something other than fighting. Helping others is probably what will finish him off!

 

I know he is embroiled in other plots but i personally would love to see him return to the Two Rivers to help Perrin.

 

Despite their reluctance to stay close to him for different reasons i think that both Perrin and Mat have the mentality of 'together we stand, together we fall' towards Rand, of course taking into account the fate of the world also.

 

I think Rand is beating himself up about 'using' Mat and Perrin, but in actual fact if he didnt direct, they would probably end up doing it anyway because they can see it needs doing.

[DemandredFO]

Rand is Taveren, that's the ONLY reason Perrin is doing what he's doing.  If Rand weren't Ta'veren I think it would take Mat longer to realize his destiny but I think Siuan's quote is very apt.

[Lord_Naryb]

Rand is Taveren, that's the ONLY reason Perrin is doing what he's doing

 

Well, I disagree with that statement. I think Perrin would have done it anyway, but yeah I see Mat dying helping others (not in the Last Battle obviously, but later in life). I just can't see Mat dying of old age.

[hurryupnwait]

Mat has from the very beginning been my favorite character of WoT.  I think of the three boys he is the only one to retain a sense of himself.  He still likes to joke, laugh, ogle the women, dice, and dance.  He has added some maturity to go with that, but if you were to skip all the way from TDR to KoD I think you would still get Mat, I don't believe you would get that same sense of familiarity with Perrin, and Rand.  Rand has turned to stone, he is so concerned about reacting the way the Shadow wants him to that he has lost himself, and in a sense become what they want him to be.  Perrin has become a cryboy that constantly laments things with his wife, and his sudden elevated station.  I want to smack him sometimes.

[PrinceOfRavens]

one thing i would LOVE to see is that Mat rides in the two rivers with his 30.000 men and him riding in the village:P then his father sees him and goes like  ??? ??? ??? :-X WTF

[phlpr23]

Has anyone sort of noticied the "New" Mat resembles the "Old" Rand ? That might merely be my interpretation though.

 

In the beginning of the books I really ranked them as (Rand,Mat,Perrin). I really enjoyed Rand's character once his discovered his birth mark but the pain of responcibility has cut his soul like a knife. When reading his passages I just can't feel regret, and a hope that he may retain himself. At the time of his highest Rand was "Powerful, Careing, and Fun", but strangely enough as Rand evolved into a Stone, Mat suddenly began picking up those traits until he really switched roles with Rand (Mat,Rand,Perrin).

[Harmless Bandit]

Trakand_01, I share your vision of Mat. Deep down he cares, but he invests his personality with a small dose of gruffness. He's certainly not one to proclaim at the top of his lungs that he cares about this or that. A bit of bad boy. And I don't think he means his complains, rather he does it just for the sake of doing it.

 

Has anyone sort of noticied the "New" Mat resembles the "Old" Rand ? That might merely be my interpretation though.

 

In the beginning of the books I really ranked them as (Rand,Mat,Perrin). I really enjoyed Rand's character once his discovered his birth mark but the pain of responcibility has cut his soul like a knife. When reading his passages I just can't feel regret, and a hope that he may retain himself. At the time of his highest Rand was "Powerful, Careing, and Fun", but strangely enough as Rand evolved into a Stone, Mat suddenly began picking up those traits until he really switched roles with Rand (Mat,Rand,Perrin).

 

 

I can see where you are running with this, and I will race you there. :D

 

IMHO, Mat and Perrin represent more or less two ends on a personality scale, with Mat seeming irresponsible, unthinking, careless, etc, etc, and Perrin the opposite of that. Rand is--was--somewhere in the middle, as he could easily be as goofy as he was serious.

 

Now Mat has progressed to Rand's old personality, light-hearted but responsible as well.

Don't ask me what Perrin has progressed into.  ???

 

[The Lost One]

One part in the books that really demonstrates Mat’s true character , to me, as seen though the eyes of another character was:

 

When he tries to give Elayne the medallion when they realize the golham (sp?) might come after them.  Elayne had been trying to get that medallion away from him to study for so long and he wouldn’t budge.  He wouldn’t have given up that medallion no matter how much she pushed, threatened, prodded, etc.  But the second he thought it could possibly protect her or Nyn,, he offers it up without even thinking about it. 

 

That just shows the kind of guy he is. 

 

 

[trakand_01]

One part in the books that really demonstrates Mats true character , to me, as seen though the eyes of another character was:

 

When he tries to give Elayne the medallion when they realize the golham (sp?) might come after them.  Elayne had been trying to get that medallion away from him to study for so long and he wouldnt budge.  He wouldnt have given up that medallion no matter how much she pushed, threatened, prodded, etc.  But the second he thought it could possibly protect her or Nyn,, he offers it up without even thinking about it. 

 

That just shows the kind of guy he is. 

 

 

 

Exactly, and i cant remember the exact passage but i'm sure it was accompanied with a grumble about how Rand would have his skin if he let any harm come to her. It's got nothing to do with Rand, its just Mat  ;D

[trakand_01]

Does anyone here ever watch Lost? In a very basic way, does Sawyer remind you of Mat?