Zaida = Darkfriend and Reason?

[Luckers]

So for a long time now ive been a bit bored by the Sea Folk. In truth they offer nothing to the plot, they're annoying, and they've been given way too much screen time. Why? Ok, the Sea Folk have somewhere around 3,000 channelers at their disposal, so maybe they're a source of dreadlords. Yet even so their position is so distant from the real war that its still an issue.

 

Then it occured to me. What is the one real thing that has happenced to influence the Sea Folk's power structure? The death of Nessa din Two Winds. Following that we see Zaida rise to the position of Mistress of Ships. Now Zaida has been around since Lord of Chaos, yet has never had any big issue about her come to play. We don't like her, and she ends up Mistress of Ships. In the first scene that we see her in that role she is brutalizing an Aes Sedai... so yeah, presentation is of a mean spirited bitch. (which to be fair is not much different from any other Sea Folk woman in power).

 

But then we have the specific prophecy that Harine would be Mistress of Ships. Since then RJ has stressed that several times. Moreover, within the prophecy there was the very specific mention of hardship following the Bargain and preceding her ascension. As things stand, Harine stands less chance than a swamp rat of becoming Mistress of Ships.

 

So it occurs to me that Zaida being a darkfriend would solve many issues, as well as explaining many past events. If she is a darkfriend, and influences the Atha'an Miere in favour of the Shadow, and Harine moves to stop her, then we have drama and purpose for the Sea Folk plot and reason for the heavy emphasis on on Harine and Zaida.

 

It's all conjecture of course, but it makes sense to me.

[RobertAlexWillis]

I don't really see alot of evidence either for or against it.  It would certainly add something to the plot ... and it does fit the point you've made about Harine's future ascension.

[oosquaiaddict]

I dont think theres anything more annoying than the sea folk, so I like this. It offers a good reason for them getting as much face time as they are. Otherwise so far the only thing theyve been integral to is me skipping portions of the books with them in it during rereads.

 

I am curious though if anyone remembers the details of Zaidas bargain with Elayne vs. Rands with Harine. I wondered at the time what Zaida did that was so much greater than Harine, cause I thought Harines bargain with Rand was superior to Zaidas with Elayne. Zaida got a square mile of land in Caemlyn. Harine got one square mile in Tear, Illian, Cairhien, probably Ghealdan, the borderlands, I think the words were somethig along the lines of wherever the Coramoor rules or something similar... which by their prophecy should be pretty much everywhere. Harine did give up more by agreeing to provide ships when Rand needs, but she got a lot more than Zaida did.

 

[reyler]

It could be, but given the level of development the Sea Folk have gotten so far, it would be too little too late, I think. More likely Zaida gets herself and possibly her crew killed in some part of Tarmon Gaidon that takes place on water and Harine steps up and saves everyone's butts.

[DemandredFO]

It makes some sense because they're too annoying to be darkfriends, so what better twist than to have some of them actually be darkfriends.  Just as the Aes Sedai will be humbled in aMoL, I think the sea folk will be humbled.  In fact, in the prolouge of the Great Hunt I think Bors saw at least one Athan'Miere.

[Papermache]

Of course there are some Seafolk DF's, but the Seafolk are far from useless to the plot.

 

1. They, with the help of Aes Sedai (not the other way around), fixed the weather. If this had not happened I am sure everyone would be dead of starvation, or melting by now.

 

2. They most probably will be attached to the tower in some way, and are already. They have been taught by Aes Sedai, and if you think Egwene would let a bunch of power-knowledgable wilders roam around....

 

3. They basically control the ocean, though Seanchan can take them down, the Seanchan are now basically shorebound.

 

4. They have humbled Aes Sedai, which needed to be done. Their noses have been too high from the beginning.

 

5. They provide trade for all Rand-controlled nations, as agreed in the bargain.

 

6. They are part of RJ's world. Though they may be an annoyance, they have been as key to the storyline as sa'angreal, and as useless as Shara at some points.

 

[Nelal Hurcran]

I'v pondered long over why the Sea folk have so much screen time, but what I came up with was no where near a romantic as Luckers idea. My theory is this:

 

RJ knowes that there will be several characters in his book that are not likeable, even several that are utright hated *cough*faile*cough*cough*. But all the main characters are, for all intents and perpouses, his children. Like any loving fater, he dosn't enjoy seeing them hated. So he creates this race of minor, stuck-up charachters, that rival even the AS, and shoves them everywhere he can. That way, the readers have them to use as a mesuring stick to hold the others up to when their figuring hautiness.

[Luckers]

Of course there are some Seafolk DF's, but the Seafolk are far from useless to the plot.

 

1. They, with the help of Aes Sedai (not the other way around), fixed the weather. If this had not happened I am sure everyone would be dead of starvation, or melting by now.

 

2. They most probably will be attached to the tower in some way, and are already. They have been taught by Aes Sedai, and if you think Egwene would let a bunch of power-knowledgable wilders roam around....

 

3. They basically control the ocean, though Seanchan can take them down, the Seanchan are now basically shorebound.

 

4. They have humbled Aes Sedai, which needed to be done. Their noses have been too high from the beginning.

 

5. They provide trade for all Rand-controlled nations, as agreed in the bargain.

 

6. They are part of RJ's world. Though they may be an annoyance, they have been as key to the storyline as sa'angreal, and as useless as Shara at some points.

 

 

In terms of the real state, none of this is nessasary.

 

1.RJ could have easily written in a single Aes Sedai with some peculiar interest in the weather to play the role.

 

2. Unlikely. Egwene's intentiong are irrelevant to the Sea Folk. They arn't precisely inclined to listen to her.

 

3. Also played no real unique role.

 

4. Wise Ones and Asha'men play the same role.

 

5. Pointless, and counterproductive. Gateways would serve much better.

 

6. The point is specifically that they have never been overly key to the plot, and specifically that the amount of screen time they have been given is incongruent with the effect they've had.

 

In what way are they even remotely useful to the plot?

 

But you've all mistaken my point. The Sea Folk, as they are, have absolutely no where to go, and no part to play in the next book in terms of the battle. My comments are that Zaida being a darkfriend could well given them that role, and that this matches with predictions we have about Harine's importance.

 

I am curious though if anyone remembers the details of Zaidas bargain with Elayne vs. Rands with Harine. I wondered at the time what Zaida did that was so much greater than Harine, cause I thought Harines bargain with Rand was superior to Zaidas with Elayne. Zaida got a square mile of land in Caemlyn. Harine got one square mile in Tear, Illian, Cairhien, probably Ghealdan, the borderlands, I think the words were somethig along the lines of wherever the Coramoor rules or something similar... which by their prophecy should be pretty much everywhere. Harine did give up more by agreeing to provide ships when Rand needs, but she got a lot more than Zaida did.

 

Zaida gained the Sea Folk something for a price that did not restrict the random Wavemistress. Harine's bargain on the other hand directly effects them, and whilst it is reasonable concidering her is their saviour that they would have to serve him in some manner, the Sea Folk are generically self-centred. They were expecting Rand to save them, and pay them for it.

[elmis]

I like your idea Luckers, though I wouldn't mind it we didn't hear one more word about them. Annoying doesn't even start to cover them.

[KingKastchei]

Interesting that nobody has brought up the death of the Amayar at the end of KoD. Something tells me that has to have something major to do in the plot, but for the life of me I can't figure out what.  It's possible that the death of the Amayar will be what topples Zaida since she's the one in power when it happens, but as far as her being a darkfriend, I see no evidence either for or against.  Could be an interesting plot twist though.

[MsDanya]

I wouldnt mind Zaida being a darkfriend at all. the seafolk have always been the biggest annoyance for me in the series. and it would definatly bring something new to the plot.