Question/speculation for book readers who watch the show

[Guire]

24 minutes ago, Sir_Charrid said:

Perrin has already long given up the axe by this point, he gives up one hammer to make a new one. 

I think Perrin is still carrying dagger Layla gave Mat.  Since we are dumping fantasy language for modern vernacular, Perrin can change from Young Bull to Knife Bro.  Pure snark here btw.

[nsmallw]

19 hours ago, Sir_Charrid said:

Perrin has already long given up the axe by this point, he gives up one hammer to make a new one. 

True, he's given it up internally and the scene in COT is his physical act to reflect that internal choice. 

Further, he also is accepting leadership and acknowledging that he is a leader and embracing his destiny. 

[Durinax]

On 8/15/2023 at 12:18 PM, Guire said:

I think Perrin is still carrying dagger Layla gave Mat.  Since we are dumping fantasy language for modern vernacular, Perrin can change from Young Bull to Knife Bro.  Pure snark here btw.

Would that make him Longtooth in this iteration? May be the only reference to Elyas we get.

[Guire]

1 hour ago, Durinax said:

Would that make him Longtooth in this iteration? May be the only reference to Elyas we get.

I actually thought about that but i was snarking.  We are getting Elyas in season 2.  Not sure if he will be called Longtooth.

[Durinax]

20 hours ago, Guire said:

I actually thought about that but i was snarking.  We are getting Elyas in season 2.  Not sure if he will be called Longtooth.

Really, that is surprising since they missed him introduction. Not sure how they will manage to do it now. 

[Guire]

10 minutes ago, Durinax said:

Really, that is surprising since they missed him introduction. Not sure how they will manage to do it now. 

Pretty sure he is replacing Hurin as tracker for Shienarins with Perrin being EF5 member on horn hunt.  

[nsmallw]

18 hours ago, Guire said:

Pretty sure he is replacing Hurin as tracker for Shienarins with Perrin being EF5 member on horn hunt.  

I can't recall but is Elyas seen in any other promotional stills, videos etc aside from when Perrin and the group find the Myrddraal pinned to the door?

 

I wonder if he just joins the group temporarily because the wolves tell him about Perrin and he's only travelling with them a short time to get Perrin on the wolfbrother track. 

[Guire]

10 minutes ago, nsmallw said:

I can't recall but is Elyas seen in any other promotional stills, videos etc aside from when Perrin and the group find the Myrddraal pinned to the door?

 

I wonder if he just joins the group temporarily because the wolves tell him about Perrin and he's only travelling with them a short time to get Perrin on the wolfbrother track. 

To my knowledge that is only scene with Elyas.  you could be righr.  He may just dip in shortly how he does in EoTW with Perrin and Egwene.

[Scarloc99]

On 8/16/2023 at 9:14 PM, Durinax said:

Would that make him Longtooth in this iteration? May be the only reference to Elyas we get.

If they don’t include elyas properly then Rafe is missing the point of the key part of Perrin journey. 
 

Perrin meets 2 wolf brothers in the story. 
One he thinks has lost himself to the wolf dream, the other he thinks has kept his sanity by not going full wolf. Hopper shows him instead that what both men are showing him is choice. 
 

Noam chooses to go feral so he can escape the reality of his life. He doesn’t lose himself to the wolf he gives himself willingly. 
 

Elyas chooses to remain a man, he chooses not to fully embrace that wolf side that lets him hunt and exist in the world of dreams. 
 

Rafe has to include both Elyas and Noam to really help to show the audience the truth that Perrin comes to accept, the truth that lets him then let go and truly embrace the wolf nature as he needs to win his key fight at the last battle. 

[Elglin]

1 hour ago, Sir_Charrid said:

If they don’t include elyas properly then Rafe is missing the point of the key part of Perrin journey. 
 

Perrin meets 2 wolf brothers in the story. 
One he thinks has lost himself to the wolf dream, the other he thinks has kept his sanity by not going full wolf. Hopper shows him instead that what both men are showing him is choice. 
 

Noam chooses to go feral so he can escape the reality of his life. He doesn’t lose himself to the wolf he gives himself willingly. 
 

Elyas chooses to remain a man, he chooses not to fully embrace that wolf side that lets him hunt and exist in the world of dreams. 
 

Rafe has to include both Elyas and Noam to really help to show the audience the truth that Perrin comes to accept, the truth that lets him then let go and truly embrace the wolf nature as he needs to win his key fight at the last battle. 

This is some really great analysis. I must admit that the concept went absolutely over my head on both the first and the subsequent rereads - until this very summary. I would hence hazard a guess that this would also go over the head of a your average show fan, which ironically makes it an omission target.

However, you could rework both Noam and Elyas into one-episode (or two-episode) wonders, which would make it much more filmable.

[Scarloc99]

On 8/19/2023 at 10:15 AM, Elglin said:

This is some really great analysis. I must admit that the concept went absolutely over my head on both the first and the subsequent rereads - until this very summary. I would hence hazard a guess that this would also go over the head of a your average show fan, which ironically makes it an omission target.

However, you could rework both Noam and Elyas into one-episode (or two-episode) wonders, which would make it much more filmable.

To be fair when Perrin realises it the scene where he meets Noam again in the wolf dream is a quick blink and you miss it, post hopper dying I think it is given barely a paragraph by Brandon Sanderson. 

[DojoToad]

On 8/19/2023 at 3:46 AM, Sir_Charrid said:

If they don’t include elyas properly then Rafe is missing the point of the key part of Perrin journey. 
 

Perrin meets 2 wolf brothers in the story. 
One he thinks has lost himself to the wolf dream, the other he thinks has kept his sanity by not going full wolf. Hopper shows him instead that what both men are showing him is choice. 
 

Noam chooses to go feral so he can escape the reality of his life. He doesn’t lose himself to the wolf he gives himself willingly. 
 

Elyas chooses to remain a man, he chooses not to fully embrace that wolf side that lets him hunt and exist in the world of dreams. 
 

Rafe has to include both Elyas and Noam to really help to show the audience the truth that Perrin comes to accept, the truth that lets him then let go and truly embrace the wolf nature as he needs to win his key fight at the last battle. 

I agree with your post, but do you really think Rafe has to do anything?  Rafe has missed (or added) lots of key journey points for multiple characters.  Rafe will continue doing what Rafe does...

Edited August 21, 2023 by DojoToad

[Scarloc99]

7 hours ago, DojoToad said:

I agree with your post, but do you really think Rafe has to do anything?  Rafe has missed (or added) lots of key journey points for multiple characters.  Rafe will continue doing what Rafe does...

Oh I know he can do anything, and for me not including these 2 characters will be a travesty. I will say the things he has tweaked and added, or not yet included, have not fundamentally changed the character journey, season 1 was all about that introduction and so I am not massively unhappy personally. Noam and Elyas are a key part of that journey and I have no issue with either being introduced later in the story then they are in the books, or in a different way, but they are one of those things that needs to exist to tell the arc of Perrins journey to the last battle. But we will have to wait and see what he does :).