Brandon Sanderson’s Public Comments on Adapting the Books

[Katherine]

 

1 hour ago, ilovezam said:

I don't think Lan would ever be cool with abandoning Moiraine for love either. Maybe they could have had Nynaeve lead Lan to Moiraine using some saidar tracking shenanigans (instead of "she has a tell") through the Blight they could have given Lan some cool action sequences to protect her, and then Rand can take Tarwin's Gap like he's supposed to T_T

 

 

Yeah... when I first heard him describe that scene I loved it. I still think it would be a beautiful stand alone moment.

 

However, the cornerstone of Lan's personality is his belief in duty before self. That moment would have hone against everything he stood for.  

[Ralph]

17 hours ago, ilovezam said:

I assume you mean these are the specific points that you agreed with? Because there is a lot more than this

17 hours ago, ilovezam said:

 

• Perrin's lackluster arc, wife fridging was a bad move that went nowhere. 

Should have killed someone else and had a better payoff. Not the whole idea which was on board with. 

17 hours ago, ilovezam said:

 

• Nynaeve and Egwene should have been set up to want to train after realizing their impotence at Tarwin's Gap
• Lan needed to have something to do at the Blight, he suggested a moment where he defended Nynaeve trying to channel at Trollocs like a Warder and his AS. He wouldn't even have gotten his Ep 1 fight scene without Sanderson pushing for it. 

 

 

 

Iirc, he has said this previously, and explicitly that he was referring to the bit where he jumps onto her to protect her from the falling Inn. Not the fight which was in from the beginning. Was it not in the early draft script that people had on here not long ago? 

17 hours ago, ilovezam said:

 

 

• Episode 6's screenplay was his favourite because it is unique in that it was entirely Moiraine's POV but after seeing what's shot Episode 4 was his favourite.
• He had little influence with Ep 5-6, and none with 7-8. 

Didn't say little influence, said less than the first ones. And said he loved 4-6.

 

17 hours ago, ilovezam said:

On Rafe:

• He doesn't endorse people trashing Rafe and does not want his criticism to be used to support that.
• He thinks Rafe did a "good" and "decent" job with the "adaptation style they chose".

This is an outright misquotation. If you really think he said that I have never seen a better example of confirmation bias. 

He said Rafe did a good job. He then said he chose a type of adaptation that suited the writing team's style. Not "with" as a modifier. Decent was specifically referring to the Wolf brother story, and he said he thought it was very difficult and they did it well. He also said repeatedly that he is very happy Rafe is the show runner. 

 

 

[ilovezam]

9 hours ago, Ralph said:

This is an outright misquotation. If you really think he said that I have never seen a better example of confirmation bias. 

He said Rafe did a good job.

 

I have no doubt that he thinks Rafe did a good job, but it was framed in the context of being the kind of adaptation that it was. Given his previous comments about how he had to regard it as a different timeline and how it was between LOTR and the Shining in terms of closeness to source material (while LOTR is between Harry Potter and Shining). I think it's pretty clear what he's saying, and it wasn't supposed to be a negative take. I think you might be reading too much into this. You're right that the "decent" was from another part of his video though, so I'll edit that with his actual words "pretty well". 

 

Here's a full, direct quote for the rest to decide for themselves. (19:07):

Quote

I think Episode 1 really needed another 30 minutes, watching it, in hindsight. Now, that's, you know, after I switched my head over to "this wasn't a straight adaptation of the books". It's very dangerous in some ways for me to even talk about all this, because the fandom is very passionate about the Wheel of Time and very passionate about Rafe. I don't want my criticisms of the show to turn into me saying "you guys are all right", if that makes sense. I think there's legitimately some things to talk about this show. I am not in the camp that what Rafe had done was some tragedy, and things like that. I think Rafe has done a good job. I think that he has adapted a very difficult book to adapt, he picked an adaptation style that suited his writing and his team's vision for it, and they executed on that pretty well.

 

9 hours ago, Ralph said:

Didn't say little influence, said less than the first ones. And said he loved 4-6.

He repeatedly emphasised how little influence had over the series overall, even the first ones. I also explicitly pointed out that his favourites were 4 and 6.

 

9 hours ago, Ralph said:

Iirc, he has said this previously, and explicitly that he was referring to the bit where he jumps onto her to protect her from the falling Inn

I'm not familiar with what he said previously, but here he's talking about "that top-down shot where Lan is protecting Moiraine ... she's channeling and he's keeping Trollocs away." (49:35)

Edited January 28, 2022 by ilovezam

[DaddyFinn]

On 1/28/2022 at 6:56 AM, ilovezam said:

Given his previous comments about how he had to regard it as a different timeline and how it was between LOTR and the Shining in terms of closeness to source material (while LOTR is between Harry Potter and Shining).

IIRC

 

Harry Potter movies 1&2 100% faithful adaptation.

 

LotR 50% faithful adaptation

WoT ~45%  (he said something like WoT is a bit below LotR towards Shining)

 

Shining 0% faithful adaptation

 

I don't remember the video this was discussed so can't link it

[Scarloc99]

On 1/27/2022 at 9:39 AM, Requiem said:

Brandon understands that his words have weight with the wider community and doesn't want anything he says to be taken out of context or used to attack Rafe. He isn't ever going to really comment on these things, it isn't his place to do so and he isn't going to burn bridges unnecessarily. 

 

He can do more good by giving them feedback on the scripts than he could if he was asked not to continue because he trashed the show repeatedly online.

Agree here, anyone else remember how some took his early Reddit comments to mean he hated the show and Rafe? He has realized that things can be copied out of context and spun in any way. 
 

I am pleased he has done this, it hopefully ends those arguing Brandon is on there side with hating the show. 

Edited January 31, 2022 by Sir_Charrid

[Scarloc99]

On 1/27/2022 at 11:57 AM, king of nowhere said:

Actually, i wasn't aware that bookcloak was derogatory. I heard that they have their own reddit subforum where they call themselves thusly, so i figured it was a neutral designation.

 

And i agree that brandon may not be the best scriptwriter. But he's an awesome storyteller, so they should probably listen to him for plot structure.

When brandon descrived nyn and egw fighting at fal dara, realizing they are not trained enough to be effective, lan helping nyn and protecting her like he did moiraine... I though, what a wonderful chance we missed

See you have this opinion, I have tried 3 of Brandons own books now, the only author I cant actually finish, I find his stories contrived, don’t like his world building and find his books generally feel like teenage fiction not adult fantasy. I would possibly dislike a Brandon tv show based off his own writing. 
 

I am actually impressed he was able to change his style so much for the final 3 WOT books. 

[king of nowhere]

6 hours ago, Sir_Charrid said:

See you have this opinion, I have tried 3 of Brandons own books now, the only author I cant actually finish, I find his stories contrived, don’t like his world building and find his books generally feel like teenage fiction not adult fantasy. I would possibly dislike a Brandon tv show based off his own writing. 

I won't dispute artistic preferences, because tastes cannot be argued, but there is one point i have to ask:

You like wot, with the whole concept of the pattern causing the most contrived coincidences to happen to - we could call it to "railroad the plot". With ta'veren being focuses for all those unlikely coincidences to happen, and the whole plot moved by that.

And yet you find sanderson's books to be contrieved?

[Cauthonfan4]

50 minutes ago, king of nowhere said:

And yet you find sanderson's books to be contrieved

Not to mention him calling Sanderson teen fiction when the overall reading difficulty of WoT is high school at best. 

[Deviations]

9 hours ago, Sir_Charrid said:

Actually, i wasn't aware that bookcloak was derogatory. I heard that they have their own reddit subforum where they call themselves thusly, so i figured it was a neutral designation.

I wear that badge with pride....

[Cauthonfan4]

On 1/30/2022 at 12:53 AM, DaddyFinn said:

WoT ~45%  (he said something like WoT is a bit below LotR towards Shining)

I'd put wot mote like 30% 

[KakitaOCU]

4 hours ago, king of nowhere said:

You like wot, with the whole concept of the pattern causing the most contrived coincidences to happen to - we could call it to "railroad the plot". With ta'veren being focuses for all those unlikely coincidences to happen, and the whole plot moved by that.

And yet you find sanderson's books to be contrieved?

I think the issue is that real life experience really does influence how you interpret a work.

To drag out Modesitt again (favorite author, what can I say).  I have seen reviews saying his books are trite and unrealistic and have conflict that could easily be resolved by (insert whatever here).  And when I read them as a teenager I understood those argument.  Then as I entered the real world, dealt with what real politics both government and inside big businesses are like..  Yeah, the books hit hard home for me as being VERY realistic to the nonsense people go through IRL.

It also might be a matter of which 3 the poster read.  Because if you asked me to judge Sanderson purely on say Elantris, Warbreaker and the first Mistborn, I'd put him in a box just slightly ahead of Terry Brooks or Keith Baker where the stories are fun and solid but ultimately forgettable.  It's the Wax and Wayne series and Stormlight that changed my mind.

[Scarloc99]

5 hours ago, king of nowhere said:

I won't dispute artistic preferences, because tastes cannot be argued, but there is one point i have to ask:

You like wot, with the whole concept of the pattern causing the most contrived coincidences to happen to - we could call it to "railroad the plot". With ta'veren being focuses for all those unlikely coincidences to happen, and the whole plot moved by that.

And yet you find sanderson's books to be contrieved?

Parts of them, it might be because I couldn't get into them. There is a great Film reviewer I watch who talks about a director earning the right to make illogical actions in a movie. He uses the John Wick films as an example, so much of those films feel visceral and real and as a whole draw you in that events and choices that are made that just seem contrived or unbelievable can be glossed over by an audience because you have earnt that through everything they have seen up until that moment. 

I can. accept the aspects of ta'veren because, I also accept that only in this specific turning of the wheel have all these events contrived to this point. In others they don't. but as a whole the books get me invested enough to be willing to overlook that, and other weaknesses in the story. I just didn't like BS work and I have tried reading 3 different books of his. 

[Scarloc99]

1 hour ago, KakitaOCU said:

I think the issue is that real life experience really does influence how you interpret a work.

To drag out Modesitt again (favorite author, what can I say).  I have seen reviews saying his books are trite and unrealistic and have conflict that could easily be resolved by (insert whatever here).  And when I read them as a teenager I understood those argument.  Then as I entered the real world, dealt with what real politics both government and inside big businesses are like..  Yeah, the books hit hard home for me as being VERY realistic to the nonsense people go through IRL.

It also might be a matter of which 3 the poster read.  Because if you asked me to judge Sanderson purely on say Elantris, Warbreaker and the first Mistborn, I'd put him in a box just slightly ahead of Terry Brooks or Keith Baker where the stories are fun and solid but ultimately forgettable.  It's the Wax and Wayne series and Stormlight that changed my mind.

It was the first Mistborn (still sits half read on my shelf), Elantris and Warbreaker (also half read). 

I can't put my finger on exactly why I struggled with them, generally I have 2-3 books on the go at once and they just didn't grab me enough to stick with them when deciding what I was going to read. I don't think thats a bad thing, and I would never say someone who likes him is wrong, if we all liked the same stuff then life would be boring. I have given it 3 books and just couldn't get it. 

[Scarloc99]

4 hours ago, Cauthonfan4 said:

Not to mention him calling Sanderson teen fiction when the overall reading difficulty of WoT is high school at best. 

Maybe thats the issue here, I started to read WOT when I was 16, I tried getting into Brandon Sanderson the past few years now I am in my 40's WOT as with many books I read as a child/teenager I forgive far much more then books I read now. Harry Potter is another example of this, the style of writing of especially the first books is very young, but, I can still go back and read them. 

[KakitaOCU]

21 minutes ago, Sir_Charrid said:

It was the first Mistborn (still sits half read on my shelf), Elantris and Warbreaker (also half read). 

I can't put my finger on exactly why I struggled with them, generally I have 2-3 books on the go at once and they just didn't grab me enough to stick with them when deciding what I was going to read. I don't think thats a bad thing, and I would never say someone who likes him is wrong, if we all liked the same stuff then life would be boring. I have given it 3 books and just couldn't get it. 

Yeah, those are his earlier books and show because of it.  With Jordan we had the benefit of the Wheel not being his first novels.

I would recommend you try The Way of Kings if you ever get the chance and free time.  If you still don't care for Sanderson at that point, I'd say it's just taste differences.  But it might surprise you.

[VooDooNut]

34 minutes ago, KakitaOCU said:

Yeah, those are his earlier books and show because of it.  With Jordan we had the benefit of the Wheel not being his first novels.

I would recommend you try The Way of Kings if you ever get the chance and free time.  If you still don't care for Sanderson at that point, I'd say it's just taste differences.  But it might surprise you.

I'll check out The Way of Kings, per your recommendation, but I feel similarly about Brandon Sanderson outside of his WOT contributions. Just...not a fan. I don't like how he writes his magic, nor how he builds his worlds. I read the first book in Mistborn and was not blown away.

[Cauthonfan4]

4 minutes ago, VooDooNut said:

I read the first book in Mistborn and was not blown away.

I too did not like Mistborn. on the other hand i absolutely loved Way of the Kings. Two very different books with two very different approaches.

Edited January 31, 2022 by Cauthonfan4

[Deviations]

1 hour ago, Cauthonfan4 said:

I too did not like Mistborn. on the other hand i absolutely loved Way of the Kings. Two very different books with two very different approaches.

I read Way of Kings but didn't follow the series any further.  I honestly don't remember what it was about except that I liked the cover art.  Funny how I really didn't like most of WOT cover art but couldn't wait for each installment in the series.

[zacz1987]

23 hours ago, Sir_Charrid said:

See you have this opinion, I have tried 3 of Brandons own books now, the only author I cant actually finish, I find his stories contrived, don’t like his world building and find his books generally feel like teenage fiction not adult fantasy. I would possibly dislike a Brandon tv show based off his own writing. 
 

I am actually impressed he was able to change his style so much for the final 3 WOT books. 

 

I am the same way. I have tried to get into a few different Sanderson books but could not get into any of them. I can't put my finger exactly on why I don't like them but I suspect it must be something do with the style of his writing. I rarely DNF a book even if I don't like it much but I have DNF'd multiple Sanderson books.

 

I even struggled with the last three WoT books that he wrote. I made it thorough them mainly because I was already invested in the characters but I did find the change in writing style very jarring and it never clicked with me.

Edited February 1, 2022 by zacz1987

[Chivalry]

On 1/31/2022 at 10:13 AM, Sir_Charrid said:

It was the first Mistborn (still sits half read on my shelf), Elantris and Warbreaker (also half read). 

I can't put my finger on exactly why I struggled with them, generally I have 2-3 books on the go at once and they just didn't grab me enough to stick with them when deciding what I was going to read. I don't think thats a bad thing, and I would never say someone who likes him is wrong, if we all liked the same stuff then life would be boring. I have given it 3 books and just couldn't get it. 

 

I couldn't get through 1/2 of this book, but I'll probably give it another try. I remember that Sanderson kept writing "he smiled" about the main character, and it drove me nuts. He smiled way too much for me. Not even clowns smile as much as that dude.

 

But I loved the first couple of Stormlight books, found them very enjoyable.

[Terry05]

59 minutes ago, Chivalry said:

 

I couldn't get through 1/2 of this book, but I'll probably give it another try. I remember that Sanderson kept writing "he smiled" about the main character, and it drove me nuts. He smiled way too much for me. Not even clowns smile as much as that dude.

 

But I loved the first couple of Stormlight books, found them very enjoyable.

I'm going to have to give Way of Kings another go by the sounds of things

[JeffTheWoodlandElf]

On 1/31/2022 at 8:20 AM, Deviations said:

I wear that badge with pride....

#BannedFromWoTShow

[Deviations]

58 minutes ago, JeffTheWoodlandElf said:

#BannedFromWoTShow

I resemble that!