How did the show hold up for you?

[DojoToad]

30 minutes ago, Katherine said:

Something super interesting (to me) about how this show was received.... 

 

There was a couple of new subreddits on LOTR news yesterday and today... Amazon finally released the name of the series. Anyways, in each of these forums it took about no time at all for the comments to turn to... "I was excited about this but WoT was so bad I have lost hope." 

 

One or two comments would have been unoticeable.... but that theme kept popping up over and over again. Maybe only toxic fans are on the internet.... or maybe Amazon made a mistake in releasing WoT first...

 

 

 

Interesting.  Decisions have consequences...

[fra85uk]

Oh but they did give to the A-list show 3 hours for the first two episodes...

[Gothic Flame]

51 minutes ago, Katherine said:

Something super interesting (to me) about how this show was received.... 

 

There was a couple of new subreddits on LOTR news yesterday and today... Amazon finally released the name of the series. Anyways, in each of these forums it took about no time at all for the comments to turn to... "I was excited about this but WoT was so bad I have lost hope." 

 

One or two comments would have been unoticeable.... but that theme kept popping up over and over again. Maybe only toxic fans are on the internet.... or maybe Amazon made a mistake in releasing WoT first...

 

 

 

 

[Katherine]

23 minutes ago, Gothic Flame said:

 

Apparently all of this was done with practical effects.... which is freaking awesome. 

[Weird_Old_Lady]

1 hour ago, Skipp said:

 

Showing the relationship between Rand and Egwene.  It is going to be a lot more impactful when they realize that they are not for each other.

 

The relationship between Lan and Nynaeve is so much more fleshed out in the show.  Part of this is because we don't see everything only through Rand.

 

I adored the confrontation between Rand and the DO in the show more than the way it is shown in the book as it parallels the ending of the series nicely.

 

I prefer the Tinkers in the show compared to the books.  I think the show did a much better job of making the Way of the Leaf enticing.  Aram is a much more enjoyable character in the show.

 

I think making the Whitecloaks more of a threat for the show is going to work out well.  I loved every scene with Valda and am hoping to see more of Bornhald.

 

This is what I can think off of the top of my head this morning.

 

So far for me the best change is the lack of RJs spanking fetish. 

[Juan Farstrider]

1 hour ago, Skipp said:

 

Showing the relationship between Rand and Egwene.  It is going to be a lot more impactful when they realize that they are not for each other.

 

The relationship between Lan and Nynaeve is so much more fleshed out in the show.  Part of this is because we don't see everything only through Rand.

 

I adored the confrontation between Rand and the DO in the show more than the way it is shown in the book as it parallels the ending of the series nicely.

 

I prefer the Tinkers in the show compared to the books.  I think the show did a much better job of making the Way of the Leaf enticing.  Aram is a much more enjoyable character in the show.

 

I think making the Whitecloaks more of a threat for the show is going to work out well.  I loved every scene with Valda and am hoping to see more of Bornhald.

 

This is what I can think off of the top of my head this morning.

 

The acting from Daryl McCormack, Narinder Samra, and Maria Doyle Kennedy I think is what makes the Tinkers really stand out in the show. I don't know if the "changes" made by the show are responsible or just the casting choices. Darly's charisma and Maria's presence really stand out to me. Maria and Narinder have long resumes. I've seen her in a lot of things, and she doesn't really ever disappoint. Even her one time on Father Ted is great. 

I don't know if making the Whitecloaks more of a threat will be better until we know how much of a threat they pose to the Aes Sadai and how they pose it. Egwene fared much better than the collection of rings would have predicted. How? How can be pulled off well or not, but even if it is ignored it will not really be ignored (if that makes any sense).

I don't really see how the Rand/Egwene not being married is made stronger by the changes. If Perrin is married is widowed, then it would stand to reason there was nothing standing between Rand and Egwene already being married. Mat isn't married because all the clothing budget was spent on Whitecloak outfits, leaving Barney to wear a filthy bathrobe. So obviously no one is marrying him. The books convey the Rand/Egwene dynamic well. The coming tensions and conflicts between them can convey it all as the bad cliche "acting is conflict" (not really true in an all encompassing way anyway) is applicable. 

As for the others, I'm glad you liked them! Obviously all these are matters of taste, I like reading, and occasionally sharing, thoughts on how it was done. 

[notpropaganda73]

15 hours ago, Katherine said:

Apparently all of this was done with practical effects.... which is freaking awesome. 

 

That is amazing! But I have to say when I first watched I thought "hmm this CGI is a bit dodgy" hahaha. I remember reading something about a lot of VFX work goes in to making something look less real on screen, because if you leave it exactly as filmed, the realness is really jarring to many. I'll try and dig it out

[notpropaganda73]

14 hours ago, Juan Farstrider said:

The acting from Daryl McCormack, Narinder Samra, and Maria Doyle Kennedy I think is what makes the Tinkers really stand out in the show. I don't know if the "changes" made by the show are responsible or just the casting choices. Darly's charisma and Maria's presence really stand out to me. Maria and Narinder have long resumes. I've seen her in a lot of things, and she doesn't really ever disappoint. Even her one time on Father Ted is great. 

 

Mr McLove is not an equal opportunities employer ?

 

I agree with you on the Tinkers but I think they also have some of the strongest writing in the show. Ila's explanation of the Way of the Leaf to Perrin really stands out to me. 

[fra85uk]

The actress doing Ila is awesome

I would Have loved her interacting with an equally good Elyas

[Asthereal]

I was in the "like it" camp before the last episode, but that one dropped me down to "neutral". Boy, that one was messy. Probably mostly because of the departure of Barney Harris (sad, his Mat is excellent!), which probably forced them to change a lot in the reshoots, but hey, I can only judge what I get, not what could have been.

Baffling things that can't be explained by Harris leaving:
-Why did they include an extensive storyline about a warder losing his Aes Sedai, getting depressed, killing himself and then the others mourning for him? Not that I hated it. I thought it was quite powerful. But the story is packed as it is, so why not spend that time developing the main cast of characters, or expand upon the main story? I don't get it.
-The Seanchan sending a massive tsunami to kill one little girl? They probably want to imply that there's more sensible targets somewhere along that coastline, but we don't get to see any, so it looks like its just a hundred channelers sending a tsunami to kill one child.

Awesome things that I adored:
-A random darkfriend in a village in the middle of nowhere sporting a similar philosophy to Ishamael as reason to join the Shadow, but more apt, in fact, as she's in a position that suits that philosophy more. Actress did a great job, too.
-Thom Merrilin! Completely different from the books. Rough, edgy. But awesome!
 

Scary stuff I fear may happen:

-Logain and Taim being condensed into one character. Please please please don't do this!

Edited January 20, 2022 by Asthereal

[EmreY]

1 hour ago, Asthereal said:

Why did they include an extensive storyline about a warder losing his Aes Sedai, getting depressed, killing himself and then the others mourning for it?

 

Read only if you've finished the books:

 

Spoiler

Alanna, if they have any wits.  If that is the case, that's why they had to drive it home so hard.

 

1 hour ago, Asthereal said:

The Seanchan sending a massive tsunami to kill one little girl?

 

To level the coastline, I suspect.  And the Seanchan don't have a Royal Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Pets.  Or Girls, for that matter.

 

 

Edited January 20, 2022 by EmreY

[Cauthonfan4]

18 minutes ago, EmreY said:

Read only if you've finished the books

Could have done that with judt rhe one episode though. When she gets killed have stepin go berserk and die in the process. Mission accomplished and you have a whole another episode where you can build up the main cast instead of giving them next to no development.

 

[Lethira the second]

19 hours ago, Weird_Old_Lady said:

So far for me the best change is the lack of RJs spanking fetish. 

Don't worry, I'm sure they'll get to it soon enough!

[EmreY]

4 minutes ago, Cauthonfan4 said:

Could have done that with judt rhe one episode though. When she gets killed have stepin go berserk and die in the process. Mission accomplished and you have a whole another episode where you can build up the main cast instead of giving them next to no development.

 

 

For book readers, it is really not necessary at all.  But remember that people who have no idea of what the bond breaking may cause may end up viewing two different scenes 5-7 years or so apart.  It needs to be driven home very very hard.

 

It may be that you have excellent memory when it comes to TV series, but I honestly can't remember what happened three episodes ago, so if I'm going to go Ooooh, aaaah, oh, no, I need assistance.

Edited January 20, 2022 by EmreY

[Cauthonfan4]

1 minute ago, EmreY said:

But remember that people who have no idea of what the bond breaking may cause may end up viewing two different scenes 5-7 years or so apart

So like I said. Have her die during the battle like she did, and Have him go berserk during the battle, xlearly in reaction to her death. Mission done. 

 

By your argument the Alanna scene pays off during season 8. Meaning it's not an immediate need. Meanwhile most our main cast has gotten almost no development.

 

 But then again why should I be surprised. We have a magic system and a world with no development too 

[EmreY]

10 minutes ago, Cauthonfan4 said:

So like I said. Have her die during the battle like she did, and Have him go berserk during the battle, xlearly in reaction to her death. Mission done. 

 

Enough for you.  Not enough for me, by any stretch of the imagination.

 

10 minutes ago, Cauthonfan4 said:

By your argument the Alanna scene pays off during season 8. Meaning it's not an immediate need. Meanwhile most our main cast has gotten almost no development.

 

 But then again why should I be surprised. We have a magic system and a world with no development too 

 

I'm pretty sure if we have another warder-goes-berserk scene somewhere in Season 7 or 8, you'll be complaining that it detracts from the story then, or slows it down, or that we've had it before.

 

The magic system in WoT is nowhere near as well-defined as you seem to think, not even with all the addenda published.

Edited January 20, 2022 by EmreY

[Lethira the second]

36 minutes ago, EmreY said:

I'm pretty sure if we have another warder-goes-berserk scene somewhere in Season 7 or 8, you'll be complaining that it detracts from the story then, or slows it down, or that we've had it before.

 

But we haven't had *any* warder goes berserk scenes.  We've had an angry warder and a sad warder but not a berserk warder.

[Adam in Philly]

Hello all. Just joined this group. I’m just finishing up book 13 and I’m looking forward to joining these discussions without worrying about spoilers!

 

I’m currently reserving judgement about the TV show due to the pandemic interruptions and Mat’s surprising exit. It’s hard to know what they planned vs what they were forced to change. However, I do think eight episodes a season is not nearly enough for a story of this scope. Hoping for at least ten in season two.

[EmreY]

5 minutes ago, Lethira the second said:

But we haven't had *any* warder goes berserk scenes.  We've had an angry warder and a sad warder but not a berserk warder.

 

We must have different ideas of what "berserk" means.  Launching himself at a False Dragon is berserk in my dictionary.  And, thanks, I should have said intensely depressed too - part is even more necessary.

[Lethira the second]

Just now, EmreY said:

 

We must have different ideas of what "berserk" means.  Launching himself at a False Dragon is berserk in my dictionary.  And, thanks, I should have said intensely depressed too - part is even more necessary.

Berserk -out of control with anger or excitement; wild or frenzied.

 

When Kerene died, the reaction was mild.  He went running to see her.  What was portrayed on screen was *not* someone out of control with anger.  While he was clearly distressed he had enough control to run to the cave, identify the target and attack that one person.  Perrin attacking the trolloc was 'berserk'

[Gothic Flame]

10 minutes ago, EmreY said:

 

We must have different ideas of what "berserk" means.  Launching himself at a False Dragon is berserk in my dictionary.  And, thanks, I should have said intensely depressed too - part is even more necessary.

Lan depressed? 

[EmreY]

8 minutes ago, Lethira the second said:

Berserk -out of control with anger or excitement; wild or frenzied.

 

When Kerene died, the reaction was mild.  He went running to see her.  What was portrayed on screen was *not* someone out of control with anger.  While he was clearly distressed he had enough control to run to the cave, identify the target and attack that one person.  Perrin attacking the trolloc was 'berserk'

 

Death takes time to sink in.  Attacking a False Dragon, shielded though he might be, is not the definition of cool and collected.  His action is a textbook example of berserk.

 

3 minutes ago, Gothic Flame said:

Lan depressed? 

 

I am talking about Stepin, apologies for any confusion.

[Lethira the second]

5 minutes ago, EmreY said:

 

Death takes time to sink in.  Attacking a False Dragon, shielded though he might be, is not the definition of cool and collected.  His action is a textbook example of berserk.

 

You and I are unlikely to agree on this! 

 

No, death does not take time to sink in, that is an emotional reaction of a human being.  We are talking about a magical bond being snapped.  It is clear from the books the only thing that stopped Lan from going the same way was that Moiraine had transferred the bond, even then he was trying to fight it.  The instances we have of Aes Sedai dying in the books shows it as being completely uncontrollable, lashing out at anything and everything.

 

That was neither cool and collected nor berserk.  He was in control when he attacked -though it was not the smartest decision he made, he was still in control.

[EmreY]

@Lethira the second Indeed, on this we are unlikely to agree. ?  

 

 

[Skipp]

37 minutes ago, Lethira the second said:

You and I are unlikely to agree on this! 

 

No, death does not take time to sink in, that is an emotional reaction of a human being.  We are talking about a magical bond being snapped.  It is clear from the books the only thing that stopped Lan from going the same way was that Moiraine had transferred the bond, even then he was trying to fight it.  The instances we have of Aes Sedai dying in the books shows it as being completely uncontrollable, lashing out at anything and everything.

 

That was neither cool and collected nor berserk.  He was in control when he attacked -though it was not the smartest decision he made, he was still in control.

I could be wrong but I think @Emrey meant that Kerene didn't immediately die.  She was stabbed by the power and Stepin felt that during the battle.  But it was only after Stepin got to the cave that Kerene actually died.  That is how I took the scene but that is totally subjective.