The Founding of Quahog (Peter's Progress) Mafia - Game Over

[Shad_]

@ Verb ok you did explain it later. Just answer my first question then

 

Can you elaborate on how his wagonomics chat impacts your read on him vs how mine impacts your read on me?

[Andrej]

Vote Count

 

Verbal32 - 1- Turin Turambar

BFG - 1 - Gentled Ben

 

4 to lynch

 

Deadline in 15 hours

[Shad_]

Sometimes, scum are universally town read. I'm going with my gut. 

 

I would prefer winning over losing, but I'm not very attached to it at this point in this game, and when I said "So what?" I meant sometimes you're wrong. I'm not going to not make a read just because I might be wrong, and I still don't see why you're supposed to be town. Nothing you did at the start irt me looked like town, and since then, you have only left me confused. You have long post after long post and all you conclude from them is that you aren't sure who the wolves are. I'm not convinced that if you are town, you're doing any better at it this game than I am. I could argue that you're doing worse, since I at least didn't lynch the doctor. And I am not doing very well without nearly as much verbosity. I am eloquent and succinct in my apathetic floundering.

You will encounter many different players with many different play styles. Part of the challenge of Mafia is learning how to figure out those that are drastically different from your own. You have to place yourself in someone else's brain, to the best of your ability, and try to think like they think, and see if it fits a coherent pattern of problem solving.  It's precisely your capacity or lack thereof to do this with a particular player that places them on the spectrum of a ridiculously easy read to a hopeless challenge.

 

I think you're actually on the really really easy side of that bar for me.  The results of this game will tell. 

 

I'm clearly not easy for you.  This is why most of what I say confuses you.  When we can't solve an individual, it is often wise to consult with someone we trust who can.  That's part of how a strong village is formed really.  BFG is often an incredibly obvious villager to me.  If she's able to call Chris town with 99% confidence and I am able to call Sooh town with 99% confidence and we trust each other and it keeps expanding outward from there, well, it's not an accident that we lynch scum on D1 here fairly often.  And yes, a wolf can sneak into that pack sometimes, but even then you can at least reasonably determine the existence of a deep wolf pretty early and weigh degrees of confidence more heavily from there.  We may have been consensus villagers in Gilmore Girls, but once the cannon fodder was out of the way we weren't exactly sitting pretty. 

 

In some games it blossoms more than in others.  This has been a rough one. 

 

You can look at my content in this game and say "well it's too much for me to process so I'm going to just keep calling him a wolf" or you can try to continue to apply your knowledge of how I think towards reaching the best conclusion you are able.  My inability to reach a definitive conclusion on who the wolves are is an incredibly superficial aspect of my game to be concerned about, and taking issue with the fact that the villager I helped lynch happened to flip doctor is just petty frustration on your part.  Yes, I encouraged you to say a lot without really saying anything and to feign uncertainty at a level roughly on par with the average villager in our last game.  I tried my best to practice the same and pulled it off well enough to at least make it to lylo.  What do you recall of my approach to it?  I was cautious about making enemies, calling everyone a villager and emphasizing how hard it was, dropped some seeds of doubt here and there and prepared to capitalize in our QT on the only one that took any root.  What was it, Kaylee being a little too aware of Dice's stance on her?  A stupid little thing.  Sure, the field is not as tight here.  Scum!me has more leeway to shade everybody, I guess.  But do you ever really remember me directly grappling with people, debating it back and forth for pages on end, flipping my read from positive to negative and back again a dozen times, challenging everyone to take a stance on my alignment and poking and poking and poking and poking until I got the results I wanted?  Do you see me writing this post to someone in Gilmore Girls?  Don't give me some crap about obviously I can mix up my game because you can.  You can't, not convincingly at least, unless you are scum here which I doubt.  Being a wolf takes extraordinary effort.  You worry about how every little thing you type is going to rub off and no matter how fast you get at pumping out posts you've still got a weight bearing down on you every time you click submit.  Being a villager is easy.  You just have to want to win.

 

Here's the deal.  I think you're a villager.  I'm a villager.  I think that if we make it to tomorrow you're going to vote me and we're going to lose.  You might not care about winning anymore, but I do, so don't do it.  Given our protracted experience together as scum mates, do you really think I am going to beat you over the head about this for the entire freaking game if I am a wolf here?  Was anything about my game even remotely similar to this beyond superficial crap like "well you said you didn't know who the wolves are"?  At least BFG saw me in my best scum game on DM and was a survivor so had less vested interest in solving, and her hesitance still annoys me a little bit.

 

Or let's put it a different way.  My approach hasn't been working with you, clearly.  I'm still taking it.  Is that how I wolf, really?  Do I just smack my head into a brick wall a hundred times and call it a game?  We're both mules Ben, I'm just wordier.  Call me a villager or I swear to god I will type another 5000 words and make you read them.

[Shad_]

[v]No Lynch[/v]

[Andrej]

Vote Count

 

Verbal32 - 1- Turin Turambar

BFG - 1 - Gentled Ben

No Lynch - 1 - Shad_

 

4 to lynch

 

Deadline in 13 hours

[Turin Turambar]

BFG is town.

 

Little worried about Clov.

 

Still think Shad is town.

 

Verb, Tiink, Ben lynch pool.

 

 

 

 

I knew someone would put forward the lynch Turin scheme. Clov :(

 

[BFG]

I actually think we should lynch today

 

Games divided and if we no lynch we need all town to vote together tomorrow which is currently difficult to see

 

Today we have a ~mostly confirmed town

[BFG]

Turin can you explain your reads?

[Turin Turambar]

Turin can you explain your reads?

I have no idea what I'm doing, LOL.

 

Seriously though, give me a ticket and I'll give a brief synopsis of my thoughts.

[BFG]

I've been flicking through the lovers game and have zero understanding of what Chris did that set me off

 

I don't think mafia!Chris would feel great about not voting day 1. With 4 1 vote trains no wolves are in danger but anyone could be in danger, putting 2 votes on any train stabilizes the wagons some

[BFG]

 

Turin can you explain your reads?

I have no idea what I'm doing, LOL.

Seriously though, give me a ticket and I'll give a brief synopsis of my thoughts.

Lol I say I want to lynch but I don't really know where

[Turin Turambar]

Actually I guess you mean Turin?

 

I meant the other correct play is to ~mass claim, but that always feels cheap and even thinking it makes me feel icky

This post and the emotional reason behind it makes me think you are town. Also your questions of Clov. I don't see you taking that stance as mafia.

[Turin Turambar]

I'm saying the mechanical play is lynching Turin. If he's telling the truth, he dies and we go to night, which is exactly what happens if we no lynch and he's telling the truth (again, he almost certainly is).

 

He's the sacrificial lamb because we're essentially lynching a unanimous townread.

This troubles me because although technically correct if there is no consensus on the best lynch it doesn't resolve anything. What changes from today to tomorrow? I'm dead. Maybe another townie gets deaded. The questions and candidates remain the same. Instead of needing 2 town votes for Maj it only takes 1.

[Turin Turambar]

Shad: I think he is either playing a superior mafia game or more likely is town. I think the early mafia claim silliness with Ben was directly related to the last game. He has been present and interactive and the worst thing I can say about him is he has been a smidge navel gazey.

 

I still think he is town.

[Turin Turambar]

Ben: his snip at me feels like he was all set to come out D2 and push at me, the easiest lynch. He didn't read the thread and see my claim and when confronted with it doubled down with the "it's just a claim in a game based on lying". To me it felt like frustration bleeding into game play.

[Turin Turambar]

Verb: his position on Tiink and Ben feels wrong/fake. Again I think he is giving excessive credit to Tiink for his wagonomics. The bit with Shad Re: Sooh pinged to me also. As does his continued shade at me. It is unnecessary and I feel it is an attempt to discount my views.

[Turin Turambar]

Tiink: his vote on me for "weirdness" still doesn't sit right. I don't remember a real case. It felt like he just decided to vote a random person (townie) and peace out. Others have voiced additional concerns and I agree with some of them. Mainly the lack of action about his Clov suspicion.

[Turin Turambar]

Maybe Ben is just a scummy villager??

 

Does Verb/Clov or Tiink/Clov make sense????

 

Oh well. I'll be dead soon then I won't have to worry about it.

 

FYI. I have a trick or treating date tonight and may not be here at DL. Hopefully we will have cleaned up enough to back by then tho.

[Clovdyx]

 

I'm saying the mechanical play is lynching Turin. If he's telling the truth, he dies and we go to night, which is exactly what happens if we no lynch and he's telling the truth (again, he almost certainly is).

He's the sacrificial lamb because we're essentially lynching a unanimous townread.

This troubles me because although technically correct if there is no consensus on the best lynch it doesn't resolve anything. What changes from today to tomorrow? I'm dead. Maybe another townie gets deaded. The questions and candidates remain the same. Instead of needing 2 town votes for Maj it only takes 1.

This is partially why I was avoiding wanting the same scenario tomorrow.

 

The other being laziness

[Clovdyx]

I actually think we should lynch today

Games divided and if we no lynch we need all town to vote together tomorrow which is currently difficult to see

Today we have a ~mostly confirmed town

I was going to say we need basically a consensus today, but I guess that's not true. We just need town to not pile on other town

[Shad_]

My biggest thought on no lynch is if no one is going to claim there is a decent chance of banking the game on a CFD.

 

Doesn't mean we have to claim today but I am hesitant to assist a potentially game-ending lynch without it.

 

That and I don't know what I'm doing.

[Shad_]

That being said I think it's pretty obvious that for all of my inability to make up my mind I'm probably more likely to vote one of Verb or Tiink than one of BFG or Clov.

 

I want to know why Verb blatantly drew attention to Ben and especially Tiinker being more likely town than Turin.

 

I want to know Verb's assessment of my wagonomics statements made by people who aren't Tiink since that seems to matter so much for him.

[Shad_]

Ooo there was one of those sentence corrections us wolves do

[Shad_]

I also kind of want to focus my time on Nanowrimo silliness starting tomorrow so a swift end won't break my heart but I have a hard time accepting that a lynch would be optimal under present circumstances.

[Andrej]

Vote Count

 

Verbal32 - 1- Turin Turambar

BFG - 1 - Gentled Ben

No Lynch - 1 - Shad_

 

4 to lynch

 

Deadline in 6 hours