Another one:

Amazon Already Has The Next Great Fantasy Series, And It Isn't The Rings Of Power (looper.com) 

Thought you might like this article.

12 hours ago, Mailman said:

The fact that the commander of the children of the light recommends an Aes Sedai healer totally undercuts the entire forest scene. How a non-book reader would understand that is beyond me.

It doesn't undercut it.  It introduces a very important concept: That the Whitecloaks are not a monolithic organization, nor are they an organization dedicated only to defeating/killing Aes Sedai.  In the Show Universe, at least, there are many Whitecloaks who absolutely just want to kill as many Aes Sedai as they can, but there are also another significant faction of the Whitecloaks that aren't there to defeat Aes Sedai, but genuinely are out there to fight Darkfriends, or at least accomplish a political gain.

In the books, Jordan accomplishes this through an extended set of interactions between Bornhold and Perrin.

In the show, they accomplish that with just one line.

You're far from alone on thinking that it's poorly written. On the other hand, fans who enjoyed it are also 'far from alone' and seem to currently outnumber the ones who don't like it...especially among non-book readers.  It's hard for any of us to get a true perception of how it was received overall, because of the way our media universes are divided we tend to see only those opinions that mirror our own.  Review bombing and those who disliked the show solely because it didn't follow the books muddy the water for anything else.  I do think Amazon's edits cut too deeply for WOT, and not deeply enough for ROP.  Game of Thrones is a very very different beast, and we didn't have anything else of the type to compare with anyway at the time.  Even then, even having read the books, there was plenty there that was unexplained and confusing. It wasn't perfect.  It's just audiences were more friendly, and were not looking for wokeness (either to complain about it or to request more awareness of diversity).

Different scales of relevance to the story.

The Showrunner isn't the dictator. Rafe wrote the season to have 10 episodes and a 2 hour pilot, as I understand it. He didn't get that.  He doesn't get to choose his runtime. Amazon chose that.  Amazon saying "This episode is 1hr 5 minutes. It has to be less than an hour", means Rafe has to do it. 

The Stepin stuff took 14 minutes of total runtime in Episode 5.  Total.  That 14 minutesdoes so many things for the series that are straight from the books.  At least if it goes the way I'm guessing it does.

• It sets up why Moiraine in S2 sets up transferring Lan's bond upon her death (probably Alanna instead of Myrelle).   This is a huge conflict between Moiraine and Lan through Great Hunt, Dragon Reborn, and Shadow Rising, and we see that in lots of places but rarely front and center on screen because we look through the 'kids' POVs. 
• It sets up why Gawyn fights as he does in the Tower Coup as his teachers go mad due to their Aes Sedai being killed and start killing those around them.
• It sets up Alanna bonding Rand and makes Moridin's final play at Shadar Logoth, using Alanna against Rand, a very real thing.
• It sets up a lot of significance for Elayne bonding Birgitte, and the three-way bonding with Rand.

Some of those things, like the Moiraine setting up the transfer of Lan's bond, happen in the series in the Great Hunt...that's S2.  We have to set that up ahead of time.

They /also/ set up the corruption on Saidin and Madness with Logain's story, showing the voices speaking to him and how he was interacting with them.  They didn't introduce the new terminology because they weren't trying to overload the viewer with new terms, but they certainly showed its effect as part of an actual story. Stepin was the same. 

Having people talking about it is not the same as making the audience actually feel the threat of what happens when an Aes Sedai dies.  

He said he wanted to put in those scenes but couldn't.  That's why they were cut.  Not because he prioritized Stepin or whatever.  They were cut after they were written, then were written as part of episode 2, and cut most likely for time, or perhaps because they weren't moving the story forward in focused enough fashion.  There was nowhere else after episode 2 that they were all together in order to put them back in.  It's very likely he didn't even have the choice about it being cut.

It's easy to think it's all a zero sum game...that including this thing I don't like here is clearly what cut this thing I do like from this completely other place, but that's not how it works. 

3 hours ago, DojoToad said:

So would the credit for those awards go to Amazon, Rafe, or both?

Depends on the award. They went to different organizations responsible for those specific things.

Except that's exactly why 'back seat screenwriting' doesn't work.

Let's say you want to stick close to the books, and you want to skip repeat beats, and you need every single episode of the season to have an A Plot with rising action, conflict, a climax, and falling action, and, ideally, a B and C plot for character development.  This structure isn't necessary in books...it does the same thing over the whole story...but is vital in television.

What conflict, rising action, climax, and falling action would you insert in a story that runs before Shadar Logoth?  You'd basically need to insert an entire episode there, What could you pull back?   That's not the best part of the story.

The A Plot of the Stepin episode is Egwene and Perrin against the Whitecloaks.  Stepin is a B plot.  Rand and Mat is the C Plot.  Ditching the Stepin part means ditching those other two plots as well...you can't move them before Shadar Logoth.

If you want to remove Stepin, which is fine, I guess...it /has/ to be a plot that can run simultaneously with Rand meeting Loial and the Rand/Mat stuff, and simultaneously with Perrin and Egwene vs. the Whitecloaks.  There is no time in that timeframe for Lan training Mat, Perrin, and Rand. 

A fair chunk of Mat's skill can be attributed to similar sources. The only one with very little training who needs it is Perrin, who is naturally big and strong, but not necessarily weapon-trained. I hope we see some of Perrin being trained by Uno et al in S2....we'll see.

Mostly, yes.  I was just recording it.

Wheel of Time won CLIO awards for: 
 

Bronze Award for Creative Content (Ogier Longing Origin Video)

Bronze Award for Outdoor Advertising (London Marquee)

Shortlist for Integrated Advertising Campaign

Short List for Main Title/Credits

Short List for Television/Series

Short List for Billboard

Short List for Single Video

2 hours ago, DojoToad said:

I would expand it to say that a lot of 'good' people are petty and selfish.

 

But I think the show needs to be more organic about how this is shown.  Dana gives a little speech to the 'good' guys.  She was telling instead of showing.  Saves time, but a pretty ham-fisted way to explore character depth.

It's a speech Jordan didn't find time to include in 14 books though.  

They are already doing this for the show.  Dana has a far more sympathetic presentation and persuasive argument than any darkfriend presented in the book series, except Ingtar and perhaps Melindra.  Padan Fain gives an explanation for his own opinion, and it's not the same reason as Dana's.  

On the other hand, the books aren't as simplistic as you might suppose.  The Foresaken are petty and selfish, but so are a lot of the regular people.  Taim has a persuasive storyarc in the books from a man who just wanted glory and credit for the things he does. He could have otherwise been very good, he did build the tower and do what Rand wanted, but he never got the respect he was due and eventually it turned him towards the dark. We just don't see it in his own POV.

13 hours ago, Mailman said:

He can't compulsion everyone he can form the rings with it but it's still not going to sit well with all the generals, soldiers and general population.

Who are going to be far too busy in the middle of the last battle to protest, even if they are not dead.

And if any survive...they have good reason to end the civil war by going over to Tuon's side for having been used by a Foresaken.

If the Foresaken do rings via compulsion, then Demandred doesn't need a Seanchen society that accepts male channelers...He just grabs them and forces them to accept. If the foresaken don't, then there's no conern for needing male channelers. In either event, a Seanchen civil war instead of Sharans works.

14 hours ago, Mailman said:

Large rings are not necessary to the final battle.

 

However, the show has established them as completely overpowered and in the context of a world ending event the risk would be taken. 4 weak or new channelers and Nynaeve obliterate what is considered a massive force of shadowspawn. The implications for using even just the 13 strongest Aes Sedai would be destruction on an insane scale.

 

It's the equivalent of having nuclear weapons with leaders that have no choice but to use them.

The strength of 4 Means that large rings are unnecessary. They can do the same effect with smaller rings.  The show never needs to introduce the idea that a ring can go over 13.

Giant rings aren't necessarily that important to the last battle, especially with sufficiently powerful channelers.  Large ring innovations (like the Androl ring) can be a triumphant moment for the light, but also can, in Show Universe, not be something anyone is willing to do eagerly because of the risk of burnout.

Its 3000 years ago in e8

Like I said...Demandred doesn't need to channel publicly until his group of Seanchen is already pretty defeated and don't have any choice to accept him or not.  So it doesn't really matter.

He doesn't have to start out channeling, either. In fact, that lowers CGI costs a bit. Remember the battle can't be quite as long. He can start out just using the damane on his side and all his armies, and only 3/4 of the way through the battle when he's really depleted does he start channeling for real. At that point it's too late for even those on his team to stop him, especially if those very close to him are compelled.. It makes a good late-battle twist, and makes sense why Gawyn/Galad/Lan at that point close on him and can get close...most of his Seanchen forces are dead.

Verin isn't very strong and manipulates the weather.  No one is saying Amelisa could do much with lightening if not plugged into two of the strongest channelers in 1000 years, only that she could be particularly good at it relative to her own own strength, or have tried hard to study it.

37 minutes ago, Mailman said:

I like the idea of having dual sides in the seachan the main issue that I see is Demandred and his use of the one power during the final battle being acceptable from a hardcore damane power control point of view.

That is a good question. My thought, for what it was worth, is either that by that time it's too late...either they are fanatically devoted to him, or they are compelled, or just not where they can back off, OR....I had this random idea.

Have a whole additional thing where Male Channelers are not killed in the Seanchen Empire, but taken to the Towers of Midnight, which is a terangreal that dampens/blocks the power of all the prisoners within until they die.  To strengthen their side and 'win', the rebels (under Demandred's control) have losed the Male channler prisoners to use them as weapons against the Empress's side. Or something like that.  So they accept male channeling as a short term weapon to give them victory in the end.

 Just ideas.

I don't know how he is going to do it, but MY recommendation for the show is to remove Shara completely, and add a secondary Seanchen plotline, one that is already sort of in the books, but develop it further.

In Seanchen, dismay at how poorly the Return is going after Falme causes dissent against the Empress.  Two Foresaken arrive on the continent to cause chaos...Semirage and Demandred. Semirage finds her place on the side of the Imperials, and Demandred nestles himself with the dissenters, so they can use the Empire against Rand no matter which way the wind blows.  

Have Tuon start out as she does in the books, under the influence of Semirage and generally in synch with the priorities of her culture.  However, make her just a little different, playing up her rebellious streak and making her personally questioning the harshness and slavery of her culture and  while she could be a sul'dam, she chooses not to, though she is not in a position as heir to pursue that rebellion further.  When she is kidnapped by Mat, she questions that even more and comes to determine that what she has been taught is wrong and vows to end slavery in Seanchen.  She slips Semirage's leash.  And she finalizes her marriage to Mat, in part, because she sees in him the general who can help her defeat the rebels who she thinks killed her mother.

Her disappearance, rumors of her 'softness' to the damane and that Tuon will free them, the dissent, and the actions of Demandred, lead to a coup on the continent of Seanchen. The current Empress is assassinated to put Semirage fully in power. But Tuon is returned safely before Semirage can fully cement her control, and she has to slip away.  Semirage attacks Rand under Tuon's guise as a last ditch effort to use her half of the Seanchen for the Dark One, and is killed just like the books.

Tuon, now fully in control of the loyalist faction of the Seanchen, is free to do whatever she did in the books, but now is doing it with some internal opposition. She wants to help Rand in the Last Battle, but if she uses her own forces, she leaves herself open to be pulled down by her rebels (whom she doesn't know are led by Demandred).  She waivers, but in the end puts the fate of the Pattern over her own best interest and offers her forces to Rand.

During the Last Battle, it is not the Sharans who arrive, but the other half of the Seanchen, the rebels under Demandred. The war is Seanchen vs. Seanchen, over slavery and damane as well as everything else.  Tuon's false retreat is 'labeled' as her retreating to retake the Crystal Throne, but she's just doing a fakeout to return like she did in the books.

That gives us a few things.  No need for a new nation out of nowhere. No icky implications with black 'wild people'. An end to slavery in Seanchen.  A reason Tuon married Mat so readily.  And it makes Tuon a nicer character we're a bit happier to see Mat end up with.  

1 hour ago, Cranglevoid said:

Cool story, bro. They've changed too much. It's a re-imagining and way too far from the source material. Feel free to disagree.

And things like that, after receiving a long, careful explanation about why the changes were necessary, are why it feels like discussing these topics is done in bad faith.  If you can't accept even be bothered to read Sir_Charrid's careful explanation about why the changes were made, you can't accept the premise of what an adaptation into this format must be.  Nothing that will fit this format and be successful on TV will be acceptable to some. They won't even try to consider it.