Niniel - it's not that I don't bus. It's that I don't unncessarily bus. And that's impossible to change because I feel unnecessary bussing is a crutch for weak, incompetent players that I make fun of on akype and brag about how much better I am.

If the situation would be improved by bussing, I do it without hesitation. The vast majority of times it's worthless.

i think sk is scum. i was thinking cory town but im having a hard time wrapping my head around the fact that he popped out a view then turned around to try and get it lynched. thats not normal town cory. Clov ive last couple times caught as scum but iirc it took me a bit to see it. I do want an answer from him about the ben statement. dont know on him yet

You do realize the likeliness of any peek being correct is, while still more probable than not, far lower than any other game right?

Dice - No, I had no idea he was traitor.

as long as i can have an orange peanut

I have an orange peanut.  It's for you.

I'm out for the rest of the night.  I'll try to do better tomorrow.

 

Something something cops have wrong peeks.

 

Sure, but with two true seers and one insane seer, I imagine shooting in the group of people with ~correct peeks would be the optimal move.

I mean it's a guess, but it's all pretty irrelevant. Nolder's dead. We won't know why until post-game. It's a guess :P

 

1) Was half about the setup, was half about knowing my alignment.

2) I am really unhappy with myself right now.

Something something cops have wrong peeks.

So trying to figure out if Nolder being eliminated was for a particular reason, or if it was just to remove someone town?

 

I think he was the first to vote for Ben, so maybe it was a revenge move?

 

Trying to consider this as a glance back through posts.

I would normally say this tends to be a mostly useless effort (with the exception of a few setups), but I kind of what to see where this goes.

I just got done playing with Dice at JN, and somebody claimed scum D1 just like SK did here. Dice immediately went pro "policy lynch anyone claiming scum".

 

Pretty sure that's what he did this game too. Went straight for SK.

 

Other than that I have no quarrel with the rest of that summation Cory. A lot of it feels like meta reads to me.

re: Dice & SK; Dice does do the policy lynch anyone claiming scum thing, but it's usually just an element of his game.

 

Here, it's basically his entire game. He has no interest in other people's alignments, it's basically the only thing resembling a scum read. And he never pursues SK in a meaningful way besides the vote & a few times going "SK claimed scum so I'm gonna lynch him".

 

Doing what people expect you to do is ipso facto how many players approach playing mafia, and dice is included in this. I care much more about what people don't do.

Yeah, I would guess that Dice would argue for someone's lynch that claimed scum regardless of his alignment and their alignment.  I think he would make severely less of an effort to harp on them for it if they were scummates, but I'm pretty sure he would throw the idea out there, for pretty much the reason Cory mentioned regarding his other reads - it's expected of him.

I said it before when Sooh said that post of his wasn't Dicelike, and I'll stand by it - nothing in that post wasn't Dicelike.  They were thoughts I would expect him to have as town, and they were thoughts I would expect him to put out there as mafia.  

It's only for today Clov :P

 

Though I actually am pretty sure you're a villager now outside of my other assumptions, so lol thats nice right?

Are you sure?  I kind of want more people to accuse me of being really incompetent scum.

 

 

Yes, quite annoying, even though I understand that. But you'll have to excuse me if I don't take you at your word.

If this is in regards to Dice being mafia, I totally get that. If it's about Cory's alignment, there is no reason anybody should have concerns about him beyond minor paranoia for not dying. I refuse to believe that Ben sat there and more or less guilt tripped his teammate while simultaneously shading him as a way of getting Cory to back off/signal.

It's in regards to Corys idea of Dice/Ley scum team.

 

Fair enough.

Do not lynch Clov today. Literally for the love of God. Do not lynch Clov today if you are a villager who wants to win this game.

 

TY.

Saving this for the next time we play together.

Yes, quite annoying, even though I understand that. But you'll have to excuse me if I don't take you at your word.

 

If this is in regards to Dice being mafia, I totally get that.  If it's about Cory's alignment, there is no reason anybody should have concerns about him beyond minor paranoia for not dying.  I refuse to believe that Ben sat there and more or less guilt tripped his teammate while simultaneously shading him as a way of getting Cory to back off/signal.

[v] clov [/v] lol

 

Now I'm terrified.

 

 

dice/Ley might be the ~exact wolfteam

 

Ley -> Dice -> DJ -> ....SK/Sooh?  

 

is about where I'm at right now.  I am almost certain I would flip Dice and Ley from an uninformed pov.

 

lol you're prime lynch steak, but I'll vote you friend and bring down upon you white hot fiery justice all over your ahem. I mean. yeah, yeah. Vote dice. But hey do you dude free country.

 

You should ask me how afraid I am.

 

Don't hate the dice votes

 

join me

 

for great justice, and to avoid 30 pages of lzm and clov arguing when they are almost certainly both villagers

 

Okay, you can't blame me, though.  When is the last time somebody actually gave me something to fight, that wasn't Owner calling me scum after driving scum lynches on D1 and D2 while fighting off 3 mislynches?

dice/Ley might be the ~exact wolfteam

Ley -> Dice -> DJ -> ....SK/Sooh?  

is about where I'm at right now.  I am almost certain I would flip Dice and Ley from an uninformed pov.

Guys, I said "all" being figurative but it was actually only 80% correct literally.  I think he has an open and shut case.

 

 

 

No, it's that you argued I figured out he was the traitor. One sentence:

 

Ben is dead because I chose for him to die.

 

 

I realize you don't know me. That's fine. Cory, BFG, and Sooh will assure you - if I'm mafia, there is 0.0% I figure out he's my missing teammate and help lynch him anyway. If you had argued I lynched him thinking he was vanilla town, that would be plausible...except I have no reason to switch there - I can stay on SK and let it go rand, unless you're going to argue I'm teammates WITH SK and hopped to save him (again, they will point out why that's never the case.)

You didn't do squat but buss him at EoD.

Go back and look at the vote count. It was 5-5, with Sooh missing, SK off wagon, and Ben off wagon. I could have stayed on SK and kept it 5-5 and it would have randed; Ben coming in completely takes the possibility away and sinks it.

 

 

And to answer your other point about why I unvoted, I already mentioned it. All of my nulls were voting SK. All of my top townreads were voting Ben.

Bolded is a lie. You have said twice you don't understand why I am in three peoples top town reads. But I voted Ben,parked my vote there in fact.

 

Okay, you're right - that is a literally incorrect statement.  I was null on Dice, I was null on Leyrann, and - at the time of his vote - I was null on Iron.  Meanwhile, I was townreading BFG, Niniel, Nolder, and Cory.  You were the sole null on Ben, Sooh was my offwagon townread.

Incorrect statement. I am guessing you figured Ben out. He was practically shouting it with that reads list of his. "Clov has been scumhunting without falter" or some sad crap. You have been wishy washy on your stances all D1. You literally had 3 different reasons for not wanting to lynch Ben after you unvoted him the first time.

Also, I happen to have viewed both of those on Bens reads list he called town. Now I wouldn't put both scum mates as town in my reads list, but I def. put one in there always. Maybe Ben adheres to those rules, maybe not. What I do know is I have a town view on Ley, and a Scum view on you. This will be my main point I want resolved today. Maybe I'm the insane cop, I dunno.

 

I do not like you're play Clov, I feel Leys play is better than yours and I'm gonna roll with the assumption I am sane until proven otherwise.

 

No.  I don't know if I had the most hard stances on people, but I guarantee you I have a hell of a lot more than most people.

I don't care what you like.  It is literally impossible for me to care LESS what you like.  Like I said...I genuinely appreciate the effort.  There was more thought in that entire post of yours than your entire D1 combined.  I'm not going to demand your head, because it's entirely possible I was framed and it's entirely possible you're insane.  But I know your conclusion is wrong, and if you think I'm going to roll over and die for something I can easily disprove, well...

It's going to be a loooong day.

"But Clov, you said you would vote SK and..."

And I did it.  I had a lynch more or less secured on him for half the phase.  And nobody would have challenged me on letting it go through...but I moved off to vote the traitor I figured out was my teammate.

 

No, it's that you argued I figured out he was the traitor. One sentence:

 

Ben is dead because I chose for him to die.

 

 

I realize you don't know me. That's fine. Cory, BFG, and Sooh will assure you - if I'm mafia, there is 0.0% I figure out he's my missing teammate and help lynch him anyway. If you had argued I lynched him thinking he was vanilla town, that would be plausible...except I have no reason to switch there - I can stay on SK and let it go rand, unless you're going to argue I'm teammates WITH SK and hopped to save him (again, they will point out why that's never the case.)

You do know I'm still scarred by lo ers right?

 

I had no viable alternative there, and you know that.  I said I would kill Desthro before I let a no lynch happen.  It would have been a no lynch if I didn't vote him.  I voted him.

I'll wait for anybody that actually knows what I'm saying is 100% factual to pull my punk card.

....I'll just keep waiting.

 

No, it's that you argued I figured out he was the traitor. One sentence:

 

Ben is dead because I chose for him to die.

 

 

I realize you don't know me. That's fine. Cory, BFG, and Sooh will assure you - if I'm mafia, there is 0.0% I figure out he's my missing teammate and help lynch him anyway. If you had argued I lynched him thinking he was vanilla town, that would be plausible...except I have no reason to switch there - I can stay on SK and let it go rand, unless you're going to argue I'm teammates WITH SK and hopped to save him (again, they will point out why that's never the case.)

You didn't do squat but buss him at EoD.

 

Go back and look at the vote count.  It was 5-5, with Sooh missing, SK off wagon, and Ben off wagon.  I could have stayed on SK and kept it 5-5 and it would have randed; Ben coming in completely takes the possibility away and sinks it.

And to answer your other point about why I unvoted, I already mentioned it.  All of my nulls were voting SK.  All of my top townreads were voting Ben.  

That was actually what I was getting at earlier with Sooh that I said I'd explain later.  Anybody that is familiar with my play (spoiler: those three have seen me play, spectate, advise, mentor, etc. a ton) will tell you I do not unnecessarily bus.  If you're going to argue I knew that Ben was the traitor, you're arguing I am deliberately hurting my team for literally NO advantage.  

Sooh had me as a town read and was feeling worse about me after I, for all intents and purposes, hammered Ben.  I don't expect to be cleared by it - I didn't know he was the traitor, and as mafia, I wouldn't have known that either.  However, in order for me to switch there, I would have needed SOME sort of incentive.  

Literally the only thing I gained is NOT killing SK, who have the game wouldn't have missed and nobody would have pushed me for lynching.  

No, it's that you argued I figured out he was the traitor.  One sentence:

Ben is dead because I chose for him to die.

I realize you don't know me.  That's fine.  Cory, BFG, and Sooh will assure you - if I'm mafia, there is 0.0% I figure out he's my missing teammate and help lynch him anyway.  If you had argued I lynched him thinking he was vanilla town, that would be plausible...except I have no reason to switch there - I can stay on SK and let it go rand, unless you're going to argue I'm teammates WITH SK and hopped to save him (again, they will point out why that's never the case.)

I genuinely appreciate the effort.  I am giving you the benefit of the doubt on your hardclaim.

I am going to destroy your entire argument in one sentence.