"What of Moiraine's statement, "I have something those other seekers have not"? Rand notes that she half-looks at Loial as she says this. Is there something significant about having an Ogier among the group?"

**********

My interpetation of that passage was that Moiraine was using that glance to intentionally mislead Agelmar (but without speaking an untruth) so that he would think that she was referring to Loial. I would think having the Dragon Reborn and/or three ta'veren with her would be more significant than having a seemingly random Ogier they picked up along the way.

Also, if I remember correctly she did not want it to become general knowledge that the Dragon was reborn. If she had looked at Rand, that would have raised questions asking 'Why is HE so special?'.

"Here's another unanswered question: is there a possibility the Eye could be refilled? I'll admit, with the taint cleansed from saidin, there might not be a need for a second Eye of the World. However, Moiraine puts a lot of emphasis on the fact that both men and women channelers are needed to make a pool of the Power."

I highly doubt it will be refilled. When it was made the channelers sacrificed their lives to make it. Granted, they might not have to sacrifice themselves this time since the taint is now gone. However, I still don't see a good plot reason for why another Eye would be needed.

"I see two possibilities: either it's Lews Therin's memories Rand's acquired through the Power of the Eye, or it's the instinctual channeling that wilders typically learn. We see examples of Egwene and Nynaeve using weaves instinctually. There is a good example of Egwene doing this, and knowing she's doing this, in The Dragon Reborn."

Rand was observed to have been using more weaves simultaneously than the observing Asha'man had ever seen. That would include scores of Asha'man channeling at the same time. In TSR, Elayne notes that Rand was able to handle many more weaves than she was. However, Rand's current ability to channel so many weaves and so much power simultaneously is not easily explained. Rand took out an army of Shadowspawn in TOM using weaves similar to what he used when he cleaned out the Shadowspawn in TSR. However, in TSR Rand needed callandor to achieve a much smaller feat.

I personally think that Rand has obviously accessed a much stronger power than any other channeler has ever realized before. It can't just be normal saidin, otherwise it wouldn't have affected darkfriends the way that it does. This power certainly has something to do with the 'veins of gold' inside of Rand that Nynaeve was able to delve. And I agree with you that Rand may have gained these 'veins' from accessing the EOTW.

Rand also now has the power to regenerate life and to create order back from chaos. This was witnessed by his restoration of the apples and the Food supply in Arad Doman. Also several before report feelign invigorated in his presence. Rand has obtained a power that is opposite of the Dark One's ability to decay and cause chaos. I think that clearly Rand has obtained some kind of connection to his soul and to the Creator.

Thanks for bringing the quotes about the cords of light connected to both Aginor and Rand. This clearly shows something much deeper has happened to Rand. Obviously Aginor was too dark of person to be able to handle that much light.

One final thought: We may not have seen the last of the Green Man. I believe that his 'tree' may still be able to yield a new Green Man. If the Tinkers and Ogier are going to sing together in the last battle, I could see the rebirth of the Green Man as a huge boon to their cause.

i think that while there is not a direct pysical link between someone and the power, that there is somthing there, hence why nyneeve is able to heal it.

@pandemonium.

in my opinion rand powers and abilities were always there,he just didn't

know how to use them.

in tsr lanfear told rand that he is not using even one tenth of his powers.

eventually rand got better using a combination of buried memories and instincts,but after the epiphany of gold episode,when he became one with

lews therin,he learned his full abilities.

the same with the strands of light in rands mind,he always had them,probably from birth,we just didn't know it until nynaeve abilities grew.

Maybe it's a dumb question, but was it actually confirmed that the Eye was a pool of saidin? Could it be the pool of Light instead, Moiraine being wrong one more time?

There's one thing that bothers me: mysterious statements concerning the DO blinding the Eye and the Eye serving Rand. What does it mean? I know Ishy could lie, but the pool of saidin seems too unimportant for such serious statements - unless the Eye was made to protect the Seals and the Shadow was aware of that. Perhaps "blinding the Eye" meant in fact acting to the detriment of Rand, not the Pattern or the Creator directly, as without the Eye Rand would have stayed blind - and he actually was blind anyway, for a time.

@mashiara sedai,

rand did not just accept lewis therin memories,it was never that simple,

rand accepted lews thering whole being.(inside him)

when rand met egwene in tom,she asked him:

which are you?

and rand answered: i am both.

This interviewwith Robert Jordan talks about Aginor's desire to channel the Eye of the World. Jordan's reply seems to fit in with the Eye being a pool of saidin.

It seems to be a perfect Aes Sedai answer, actually :) And if this is all we've got... Well, then I'm surprised.

@Mashiara Sedia: Moiraine is trying to mislead Aeglmar, she needs Rand to admit / accept being the Dragon. Borderlanders knowing the proficies as pertains to them Rand at this point probably would have run from it all.

Something else to consider, Rand severed Asmodeans "lines" with his "Powerwrought" sword, Lanfear in the Stone shies away from that sword. Yes, the sword works as a real sword in dealing death but being who she is why does she actually seem afraid of it. Is it because it's the only thing that can sever her from the Dark One ? Cut her connection as it did Asmo ?

Maybe Rand using the Eye started the process of the seals weakening. It held hidden a seal and Lews Ts' banner. Because later Rand with help from ??? at his school realizes he needs to break the seals. So in that respect, possibly they will need to refill the pool to reseal his prison as it is a part of the whole thing.

@Mashiara Sedia: Moiraine is trying to mislead Aeglmar, she needs Rand to admit / accept being the Dragon. Borderlanders knowing the proficies as pertains to them Rand at this point probably would have run from it all.

 

Something else to consider, Rand severed Asmodeans "lines" with his "Powerwrought" sword, Lanfear in the Stone shies away from that sword. Yes, the sword works as a real sword in dealing death but being who she is why does she actually seem afraid of it. Is it because it's the only thing that can sever her from the Dark One ? Cut her connection as it did Asmo ?

 

Maybe Rand using the Eye started the process of the seals weakening. It held hidden a seal and Lews Ts' banner. Because later Rand with help from ??? at his school realizes he needs to break the seals. So in that respect, possibly they will need to refill the pool to reseal his prison as it is a part of the whole thing.

The pool was created with both men and women Aes Sedai. I don't believe the refilling of the pool to be a part of the resealing process for a few reasons that I can think of at present. 1.) Lews Therin has stated that the women refused to go with his plan so the pool couldnt have been part of the first sealing. 2.) An actual seal was inside the pool which I interpret as the pool being created after the sealing and then the seal placed in the pool afterward.

Hey, Mashiara!! Let's have a Padan Fain theory next! He's my favorite literary lunatic, so let's show him some love!

Negative Nancy, back again. This "the Light" business seems like Rand just being a 19 year old country bumpkin who has no better way to describe what's going on as he channels for the 3rd? time. We aren't given any insight as to what channeling entails until the wonder girls are in the Tower in the Great Hunt. From Rand's povs, we know he doesn't have much of a grasp on how it works til midway through the Dragon Reborn. I'd love to be proven wrong in the end, but for now, Rand's "Light" seems like a combination of his ignorance, and awe at consciously being aware that he's channeling.

SOME ADULT CONTENT FOLLOWS.

I kind of agree with snowball on this. Saying that Rand is channeling "The Light" is akin to Masema saying that Rand is "The Light made flesh." Neither is literal, even if Masema thinks it is.

Or for a contemporary "real world" comparison, it's like the first time you experience a screaming, earth-shattering orgasm. You might feel like you've had a spiritual experience, but it's really just biochemistry. REALLY GOOD biochemistry. With Rand, he's not literally channeling "THE LIGHT." He's channeling saidin, which is merely one-half of the power that drives the Wheel of Time. It only FEELS like he's channeling "THE LIGHT" because of the ecstasy that comes along with channeling. At least, that's how I always understood it.

Personally, I'd say Rand at the Eye was desperate Rand,not zen Rand (who makes apples blossom in Towers of Midnight). I'm not concrete on it, but it seems to read so much differently. A pov from a rebel Aes Sedai can assert that Logain was set up by the Reds, because they believe it. An early pov from Rand can have him assert that he was full of the Light out of pure ignorance. I'll concede that if it reads literally, your connection with that later scene is spot on.

@snowball.

your zen rand is also a one man army now lol.

there is the apples blossom in the beginning of tom,but also the destruction of the trolloc army in maradon.

in the veins of gold episode,rand overcame his ultimate crisis point,and i find the change in him utterly fascinating.

for the first time since the eye of the world book he behaves like a real leader,powerful,in control but also compassionate.

That's my point. He wasn't a leader in Eye of the World. He wasn't a channeling star. He was a country bumpkin who confused saidin with "the Light"

78WARLOCK, on , said:

 

"Maybe Rand using the Eye started the process of the seals weakening. It held hidden a seal and Lews Ts' banner. Because later Rand with help from ??? at his school realizes he needs to break the seals. So in that respect, possibly they will need to refill the pool to reseal his prison as it is a part of the whole thing."

 

The pool was created with both men and women Aes Sedai. I don't believe the refilling of the pool to be a part of the resealing process for a few reasons that I can think of at present. 1.) Lews Therin has stated that the women refused to go with his plan so the pool couldnt have been part of the first sealing. 2.) An actual seal was inside the pool which I interpret as the pool being created after the sealing and then the seal placed in the pool afterward.

A couple more things:

In Rand's flashbacks of the Aiel's history in Rhuidean (specifically the 7th vision I believe), he see's from Jonai's perspective and enters on Aes Sedai discussing another person's visions and have Callandor and Lews Therin's banner at hand along with Someshta the Nyhm (aka The Green Man). They make mention of the taint on Saidin and a handful of young male Aes Sedai that they could get help from as it wouldn't be strong in them yet. So we know this is post sealing and the banner has yet to be hidden (thus lending to the fact that the pool was not already in place to hide the seal and/or the banner at that time).

We can also infer that the seals were hidden during and/or post breaking as in one of the earlier books it makes the comment about the Amyrlin Seat being titled "Watcher of the Seals", but that they no longer know where the Seals are located as the knowledge was lost around the time of the Trolloc Wars.

It's also unlikely that Rand using the power in the Eye caused the weakening of the seals as at this point it's clear they are ALREADY weakening considering at least Ishamael, Aginor and Balthamel had freed themselves from Shayol Ghul before the power there is used.

As far as the purpose of the Eye goes, it likely was involved in the Prophecies of the Dragon in some fashion and the Eye needed to be emptied to gain access to the Dragon banner which in turn was needed to direct the forces that were called by the Horn of Valere. Both Callandor and the banner were present when those ancient Aes Sedai were (presumably) discussing the visions of the Dragon being reborn (with the Green Man present no less) so they clearly must have been planning the securing/hiding of said items.

It perhaps even was placed in case of the need to 'kick start' the reborn Dragon into being made aware of his ability to use Saidin, or even to help bring Lews Therin and/or his memories near the surface. It's clear that some stuff was placed specifically for him (such as Callandor) and this could very easily be yet another such thing.

To continue along Pandemonium's line of thought, I think The Eye of The World is something more than Saidin. I think it's the opposite of the True Power. It's the Creator's version of the True Power. The links or cables of power can easily be explained as the links to the Creator and the Dark One that are acquired through access to the "Super" Powers, also allowing communication with either invisible leader. The "veins of gold" give him current access to it, allowing him to accomplish bigger feats without needing to use the True Power.