[BASIC/STANDARD] Warcraft: War of the Ancients Mafia - GAME OVER, MAFIA WINS

[Turin Turambar]

Oh, also nice narrative. BTW. 

 

Okay let me see if I can go back and find some of the things I wanted to reply to. 

[Turin Turambar]

 

 

 

 

 

#278 Turin, I want to point out that this is now a false meta on Lenlo. He's been changing how he plays. Zander comments on this #363 too, and I agree with his statement. Lenlo all growed up now

I assume you meant #287, I recognize that Lenlo's game has improved but what is false about Turin's statement?

 

Yes it was 287, oops.

 

I said false because that's not necessarily Lenlo's meta anymore. Turin is commenting as if Lenlo is here just to be the life of the party, but he's actually started becoming a solid player who is good for the town. Just seems an outdated meta to supply on thread and that's why Zander and I called it out.

 

 

 

 

 

@ Cass, I would say that Lenlo posting in that manner is completely null for him (1). Also too early for it to mean anything about Shad as they were basically the only two in thread at that time (2).

Ty! (*Numbers added to points for reference)

1) What differences would you expect from Lenlo as either alignment?

2) Do you have a read on either?

 

In that particular jokey exchange I would expect Len to be exactly the same in either alignment. He loves to have fun with the other players even if it makes him potentially look bad. The fun is (or at least was) more important to him. That is why I said it is completely null.

 

Now if at a later time he tries to use that read as valid then I would find him most suspicious.

 

 

 

Ok, well, I didn't get the "just the life of the party" idea from Turin. I got that Lenlo enjoys joking around and isn't worries about people misinterpreting it regardless of his alignment. I think this is generally true and stands independent of improvements to Lenlo's game, though tbf I never knew the "old" Lenlo so if he did the salami lolcat thing a lot then I can see where you're coming from. Turin's observation that Lenlo pressing it as a serious read later would be scummy is absolutely true, though the odds of that happening after forewarning from multiple players is approximately non-existent.

 

I was trying to find a post in an earlier game that relates to what I'm trying to explain but I'm not quite getting there and it's more than way past my bedtime. ANYWAYS, Lenlo used to be a floater and never really added much to the game. He was here to hang out and joke around and probably be a mislynch day 1. Now, since his improvements, he's town telling and actively getting involved in the game. That has resulted in the extension of his life in games as well as the development of a strong town player.

Alanna, I think that your description of Len's "old" game is not giving enough credit. Len was always a player that could come up with strokes of genius when motivated and engaged but frequently didn't really have the time to do so. (sort of like me for the past year or so). Regardless, I am aware that he has committed himself to improving his game in general. My point is that this is jokey interaction is NOT necessarily part of his game but is part of his personality. I don't think that has changed.  

 

I don't like your statement to him to basically just "shut up and accept your town read of him". It feels like you are saying "get back in my pocket". 

[Turin Turambar]

First read done but now re-read.

 

I think I found one villager already which is good. I just want to see if I can agree with my gut on it.

 

 

Re-read complete, and my villager leans are thusly

 

We're not giving points for everything this time, that leads to runaway (Lenlo) scumreads which are sucky and don't reverse until it's problem. Instead posts which are likely town but more easily faked as scum are 0 with the word town next to it.

 

Askthepizzaguy (again!)

Cassy +5 initial wtf reaction has been clarified a lot. Yeah blue.

Shad +3 not outside his scum game but much improvement

Laine +2 Not confident but in my top 3

Zander Null points, but +1 overall (Not outside his scum range but I get good vibes)

Csarmi Null points, but +1 good feels

Turin Null points, but +1 good feels

Kaylee Null

Lenlo Null

Celeste Null

 

Wish True Null

Pralaya True Null

Nolder True Null

 

 

Zander, are you really having issues trusting Turin, Kaylee, and Celeste?

 

That's my exact bottom 3.

 

Not that they're super scummy, I just don't think we've ever mindmelded that hard this early before.

 

 

I had it as Turin, but then it became a wash of uncertainty.

 

Or is it awash.

 

Either way, it's still not clean.

Can you go through what changed your read? 

[Turin Turambar]

 

MOD NOTE:  Random scenes for flavor may occur from time to time for the mod's amusement.  These are in no way intended to be clues.

 

==========

 

Present day Azeroth, in the Stonetalon Mountains...

 

Broxigar Saurfang had survived three wars, including a terrible battle in the recent conflict against the Burning Legion that had left his entire division dead.  He was a brave orc, to be sure, but there was something wrong in these mountain passes - something that should not be. Brave as he was, every part of his being urged him not to go further.

 

Nevertheless, he gestured to his companion to follow his lead.  They had seen the massive red dragon descending just beyond this peak, with the human mage on his back.  Whatever Warchief Thrall had wanted him to find in these mountains, he was determined to find a brave and valiant death.  If the human and the dragon wished to engage him, he would go out fighting.

 

The dragon could not, however, have passed through that narrow opening in the cliffs ahead, and neither Brox nor the young warrior with him had seen the dragon take to the air again.  Two sets of footsteps marked the trail into the mountain pass, and Broxigar determined that wherever the dragon was, he may very well come to the aid of the mage if attacked.  When attacked, he amended his thought.  Relations between the orcs and the humans were tenuous at best, despite their temporary alliance against the demons of the Burning Legion.

 

Just beyond the narrow pass, the trail widened, but Broxigar stopped dead at the sight that met him.  He could not find the words to identify what his eyes were seeing - a huge, shimmering mass of... something, floating just above the trail, constantly expanding and contracting, its fiery edges seeming to consume whatever it touched.  And it was moving.

 

It was moving toward Brox, whose desire for a valiant death would not be served being swallowed by this entity.  He turned and ran as fast as his powerful body could take him, but it was a matter of seconds before the mass overtook him, and he felt himself nearly ripped apart in the vortex as time itself seemed to expand, contract, and double back on itself.

 

 

Then he knew nothing. 

 

[Cass]

 

 

 

I have a question for all of you

 

You are on the side of a road walking down the sidewalk.

You have a gun with 1 bullet in it.

Two people are walking towards you.

The one on your left has a baseball bat the other is wearing a cowboy hat.

Who do you shoot?

Umm what does this prove Nolder? Seems like pointless WIFOM.

 

 

Well... There's one post I can't read into.

 

XD

 

 

 

 

 

 

also, can someone explain to me what the entire note taking thing was about anyway? I don't see how that generated reads at all, if it did.

 

Wasn't meant to, it was me sharing a website that I find useful for generating a list of numbers which I use when keeping track of my reads.

 

Not every post is explicitly for finding scum. Most of them should be.

I actually disagree, somewhat. I think you can read a lot into one post, even about things that are unrelated.

Hmm... Can you give me a rundown of Lenlo's meta? Don't recall.

 

And Lenlo, I want you to describe Pizza's meta to me as well. Ty!

 

I refuse. Why? Because I feel like being difficult. Actual reason? I cant. He just feels the same as previous games. Im not the kind of player who can put that into words.

 

 

@Lenbot, I'm tone reading you too guarded :P. Please elaborate your thoughts more/get actual opinions of posts on the record if you haven't already. Go out on a limb. 

I'm ok with you Town reading me to some extent here because Snakes reads. I can follow your logic wrt Penny and somewhat agree. BUT I feel like if you're scum you would have to make these two particular reads or be called out.

 

I want to see you bring something else to the table and actually give an opinion. You weren't shy giving reads about players you didn't know in the DT, why are you holding yourself back here?

 

1. What do you disagree with?

2. Did you get any reads/leans out of any of this whole situation?

 

@Lenlo

Which games? What alignment?

 

 

Lenlo's meta I am still working on. I don't even think I had a specific reason for finding him scum when I did in that game he was actually scum in, I just got my attention put there probably by Zander his wolf-mate and then agreed it wasn't strikingly townie.

 

Sometimes wolves will help you find other wolves. For whatever purpose, it's still a dead wolf when you lynch that guy.

 

His town game I hope I'm getting a better feel of after last game, but he wasn't strictly a townie in the game prior and I had very conflicted reads on him and even said "serial killer" was a likely alignment for his third party survivor with killing power.... role... thing.

 

So basically I need to see more Lenlo. Last game gave me some, but he was under the gun for being weird for most of D1, and the game moved too fast for him to generate much content after that.

 

So I don't have much "normal" Lenlo meta.

 

How was Lenlo's content in the scum game when it got busy? Same problem?

 

@Kaylee roping you in here - is content level any sort of tell for Lenlo?

 

 

If a wolf is particularly bussy (as I sometimes am in the mid-game, or at least D2 onward) then they have that perfect info of who is a wolf.

 

Then they'll make cases on wolves and say why they're scummy.

 

It's a great help. It's like when you're trying to infiltrate a terrorist cell and they tell you all about a rival terrorist cell that they know about because they're also a terrorist.

 

Can't discount the excellent work wolves do in destroying other wolves. Especially if they're bussing. Man, that's a great help.

 

I absolutely cannot tell what the motivation is behind this and that feels deliberate. No idea if it's alignment indicative with Pizza having only seen him Scum, but these are the sort of posts that gave me scum feels on him last game. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

With that said, bye. *poofs*

Another tell for Celeste being town is her scum reading me. That's something I expect, because she's a lot more uncertain of herself as town and also absolutely can't read me. ;)

this is not true all the time and you know it.

 

Do you believe, even if it is inaccurate, that this is her honest opinion? You're saying she's remembering incorrectly or is lying deliberately or neither.

I believe this is her honest opinion despite forgetting that simple fact.

I want to know what you think of me, actually. And since I trust you so far, I would also like your gut reads.

 

(What works, works. Meh.)

 

 

I think your slight town so far. Although I have my reservations. Cass as slight town too. Shad feels iffy to me a bit. I want to hear more from Laine.

 

 

Penn

1. Why does Shad feel iffy?

2. Why Laine/what are you waiting for?

[Turin Turambar]

Where I am currently...

 

1. Shad: I didn't like the meta incident. Further I really didn't like the way he tried to frame the argument that it was a stupid discussion. It felt like an attempt to nullify any resistance without having to actually back up his earlier statement.

2. Kaylee: I am concerned about two times that she basically asked a question but then gave an easy "okay" to the answer. If this is holding cards close then it might be acceptable but it felt like looking like trying to solve without actually trying to solve.

3. Zander: He seems to be asking the right questions and he did repeat some of the questions I was asking when he was catching up and posting. The shouting has come down some which makes him easier to physically read if not as obvious in his alignment. 

4. Turin: by Role PM 

5. Pizza: Unsure.. I didn't like the entire note taking thing that felt like something non-game related to post to be "helpful". Maybe I would care about it if I took notes. Active and doing things but nothing that makes him obvious town. also curious to see what his thoughts were about he changing read on me. I may be biased there however.

6. Csarmi: not much content. I read his OP as null. Value does not equal alignment. Need more from him.

7. Laine: Disagree with her point about me. Also didn't like the comment to Lenlo regarding her having him as top town read. Feels like pocket attempt. 

8. Leno: Nothing so far that is pinging to me. I know that he has improved his game all around but I will give credit for his willingness to question someone that was town reading him. 

9. Wish-tree: Trying to remember what she has said. Nothing coming to me ATM. 

10. Pralaya: Starting the pool for when he makes his first post. I got 04/01/2016 2230 GMT. That is January 4th for americans.

11. Celeste: Despite her attempt to claim otherwise some posts reading as AtE. Also never liked people coming in and saying they are playing at a higher level. This may be clouding my view a bit however. 

12. Nolder: not much so far from Nolder aside from his question and results. Seems like an easy thing to post in either alignment.

13. Cass (with Cory mentoring): Good questions. Solid so far. 

 

WTL: Shad, Laine, Celeste, Kaylee. 

 

Out for a few hours. see ya all later.

[Cass]

Zander felt abit defensive about Cass and hasnt done much since. That worries me with him.

 

Nolder im gonna let do his thing as I believe he will reveal himself as wolf or town on his own. I dont feel he has alot of lasting power, like he skews towards one direction or the other as the game progresses.

 

Kaylee havnt played with in forever. Same with Turin.

 

Ill agree with Pizzas read of Shad for now, but im going to want more from him before he gets out of my PoE

 

Complete mind-melding with Lenlo on this post. 

 

@ZANDER

 

 

THIS DOESN'T MEAN I THINK YOU'RE SCUM. It means I'm still trying to figure your alignment out.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I don't even know what that last bit about townie who was actually an SK meant.

 

Wasn't quite a townie, wasn't a serial killer, was a third party survivor with a kill power.

 

Tricky to define.

 

 

The role was: Survive to F3, every night get a random role. So like a survivor Joat. I had no control over what powers I got each night.

 

Lenlo, is that a Town-type role overall?

 

 

 

 

 

 

*snipped*

 

He came out and said he had good meta on Lenlo. When asked to elaborate, he refused to do so. The story he told was gobbledygook to me. It leads me to believe he was merely making it up. I don't see a good reason to do that as town.

Ok makes sense. I don't have a read on him yet. I questioned your vote because it came without explanation.

Fair enough I guess. I did post the question and his non-answer which I thought made it clear.

 

 

Understood Turin's bold, had the same reaction. Slight problem with the suggestion posting the question and non-answer makes anything clear. Liked Kaylee questioning the lack of initial explanation. Null on the rest.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

With that said, bye. *poofs*

Another tell for Celeste being town is her scum reading me. That's something I expect, because she's a lot more uncertain of herself as town and also absolutely can't read me. ;)

this is not true all the time and you know it.

 

Do you believe, even if it is inaccurate, that this is her honest opinion? You're saying she's remembering incorrectly or is lying deliberately or neither.

I believe this is her honest opinion despite forgetting that simple fact.

I want to know what you think of me, actually. And since I trust you so far, I would also like your gut reads.

(What works, works. Meh.)

I think your slight town so far. Although I have my reservations. Cass as slight town too. Shad feels iffy to me a bit. I want to hear more from Laine.

I actually have nothing on Shad so far. He hasn't appeared yet to talk to me, but what Pizza/Lenlo said about his claiming he has meta on other people was interesting to me. I'd be curious to know what meta he actually has.

Talk to me about Shad. Gut read?

Yeah, from reading his posts once I joined. They seem a bit forced. What reads do you have?

 

I'm liking Cass, you, Pizza, maybe Lainey.

 

Reservations on calling Shad town or scum until he comes back to defend himself.

 

Lenlo and Kaylee are slightly towny for now.

 

Other people need to stop ignoring me and talk to me.

 

 

Could agree with these reads at the time. Less sure of Penny now.

 

Don't like Lenny bold. Lenn, if you want people beyond that circle to talk to you, get out and engage them yourself. I'm distrustful of you right now. IMO there's no way to tell the difference between Lenbot/ScumLenny motivation. You have to drop the bot or you're policy lynch.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Oops. Forgot to go back and get Lenlo-Shad posts.

 

Shad Obv Town, 11 more to go.

 

Ok so Lenlo's lock town ldo.

 

Freaky double timing and calling each other Town. Insta-paranoia says they could have planned it if they are wolves (let's have each other lock-Town! Wolves never do that!), attempt at rational/occam's brain says it is actually unlikely for W-W to interact so much and then blatantly call each other Town so early in the game.

 

I'm trying to go with rational where I can, or you're all going to be scum in my brain for the rest of the game.

 

 

 

haha

 

I almost want to legit town read you for saying that when I did.

Lets take this game by storm, me and you against the world.

 

 

This was the one that stood out most and made me go back and re-read. 

Basically, Shad sounded more carefree, Lenlo more controlled. I can't read Lenlo's bold but thoughts were if not sarcastic or good friends/frequently play together this 'against the world' (when Town is the majority) seems wolfy. Not pushing anything further, just an observation.

 

 

 

 

Cass I dont hate this response but look at like me and Cory in NBC it can just happen as well as town vs. town.  But maybe I missed the post I will double check but what do you think this actually is atp?  T/T, W/W, or one of each?

 

 

Maybe you missed what post?

 

100% agree could be T/T. I don't know what I think it is - there's not enough to go on yet and I don't know how to read either player. 

(Hence not pushing anything further :P). The explanation of my thought process on Lenlo is there because people asked for elaboration, my only pertinent observation is that I don't think they're W-W.

 

 

Ok my dear I didnt mean to tell you what to do!!!!  It was more a suggestion so Im honestly sorry if that rubbed you the wrong way!!!

 

Also you avoided answering the question really at all imo and Im not a fan of that at all.

 

And you know I   you but my post count will not stop!!!!

 

lolololololol

 

 

 

No great problems with this for now other than the bold, which stands out because I was 100% hyper-joking with my CAPS, and your response reads too serious to me (it's the "I'm honestly sorry" if that rubbed you the wrong way!!! that does it). Since when would anyone seriously yell 'DON'T TELL ME WHAT TO DO!' right there??? 

 

I'm not a fan of people avoiding questions either (ENFPTWINFTWorsometimesfail!). I'll wait for your response to the post where I did answer the question before I make a call on the use of this :P

 

I didn't expect the post count to really stop!! 

 

 

I <3 you always and will never yell at you except in jest. For now. I'd need to know your alignment and be hugely frustrated for that to happen, IMO. I tend to keep a very tight reign on expressing serious negative emotions

 

 

 

 

First of all how do you think I feel forced?(1)   Second "our scum game" Have we played together before....???? Or are you referring to Alanna?(2)

 

Cory knows my soul and he will be able to help clear things up for you!!!!

 

 

1. Did you get to the post where I actually sat down and answered the question yet? Read on that (and this post) please..!

2. We've never played together before. I'm referring to Alanna.

 

I'm slightly insulted/incredulous that you think you may have forgotten if we'd played together. I also thought it was obvious that I was talking to Alanna, so you being dramatic about it makes me raise an eyebrow.

 

I don't particularly like the things I bolded coming from you, but when I look at the points I'm lining up against you it's like looking in a mirror. I will so laugh if we are T-T tinfoiling our way to misreads! I can totally see us doing so, based on paranoia/possibility personality. Again, not voting to lynch you yet. But if you're a wolf, I'm gonna hunt you down 

 

I think it's too early for either of us to call the other wolf tbh. Not removing wary gut feels, but definitely allowing for the possibility you may be Town  .

 

What's your actual take on our interactions right now?

 

 

 

 

Where you may have explained what it was i was looking for.

 

I will straight up as either alignment, apologize if I feel like a may have actually upset somebody or legit bothered them with something Ive said.  I've never played with you before so I have no idea about your posting style and mannerisms.  And I assume you've played enough mafia to know that a) people can get legit upset over stuff that doesnt seem to make sense why to others. b) People can fake being upset as well to serve their own agenda's and purposes right?

 

I wasnt quite sure hence why I asked my dear!!! 

 

Rest assured this runs both ways!!!!

 

ENFP paranoia mixed with pinged gut feels from both sides imo.  The thing from my end that I can speak on is I'm trying to determine if yours is legit or are you just trying to make it seem that way.

 

Zander. The more I read of you, the more it's like looking into a mirror of my mind \m/ . Your 'pinged gut feel' is wrong. I'm legit me here, I'll figure you out!

[Kaylee]

 

Mmm called it.

 

 

 

[v]Shad[/v] I don't like the vibes i'm getting from him. His tone is scummy to me as well.

 

 

 

lolololololololololololol

Hun you have all of one vote on you so no, you didn't call anything. Your insisting that you'll be mislynched might actually get you there unless you show us you're town.

 

Please explain on Shad. If you've since explained then thanks.

 

Also, good morning.

[Kaylee]

 

Celeste/Penny- Hated the timing of unvote at some pressure when confronted about it.  Find her interaction with my top scum read very awkward.  Think shes overacting and defensive and had an AtE post with her reaction to being mislynched with 0 votes on her....

 

1. It's because I actually know her meta and personality outside of DM so I can figure it out better than you.

2. I'm pretty pissed atm over the close minded thoughts you and others seem to be having

3. I don't AtE

4. If you haven't noticed the early suspicion always gets bandwagoned at the end of almost every D1.

To your last point: some of us are trying to give you the chance to move on and show how you're town.

[Kaylee]

 

The timing was because I would have forgotten that I joke vote her which happens sometimes XD

 

 

Kind of weird but

 

 

The timing was because I would have forgotten that I joke vote her which happens sometimes XD

 

Fair enough I suppose.

Maybe weirder. I mean all Celeste has to do if she's really not sure if she's got a vote out there is check the current vote count or [unvote] before casting a serious one, and I'm not entirely sure what to make of her explanation, but blind "oh ok" acceptance certainly doesn't seem like a natural reaction to it.

It wasn't a blind acceptance but rather a I suppose I can see that response. I wasn't voting her and like to give people a chance to show effort... Esp since as a townie I've been wrongfully accused and lynched. I don't like her attitude of "I'm going to be mislynched now" though before even getting voted.

[Kaylee]

 

 

 

 

[v]Shad[/v] I don't like the vibes i'm getting from him. His tone is scummy to me as well.

 

Go on.

I'm on p17 if you explained later.

bump, I know you've been around a while since I asked

It's simply that I don't like your tone in the first few pages of D1 coupled with the fact that you give me bad vibes.

You're going to have to help me a bit. I like winning, and I'm town, and when I'm town I tend to get my way more often than not, for better or worse, so it's pretty important that I figure you out.  Give me examples.  Point to specifics that you did not like.  Help me understand whether your suspicions are sincere or just a lazy out.

I too am hoping for examples.

[Kaylee]

 

I'm not really sure on Penny/Lenny. I've noted Wish standing up for/defending Celeste regarding the unvote. Not sure if there's something to it yet though...just noted for now.I have Pizza, Len, Cass and you as town leans. Don't really have scum leans atm. There's a lot I'm not sure on as I've not played with them or at least not often.Cass I've already explained my town lean on.Pizza and you are for being vocal and the focus of it. Meaning I've liked what he's had to say and thought the same on some of the same things. Zander- is more how you've latched onto Lenny/Penny and yet aren't tunneling. You're still addressing other things as they happen.Leno- Part meta part I've liked how he's responding as he's catching up. Feels genuine and like his townie self.

 fwiw you haven't said anything in this game that feels remotely outside the range of post-Hallia-lynch scum!Kaylee in Frozen It's nothing personal if you're town. I just remember how much I and others were nodding our heads when you hardbussed Razen out the gate.  Yeah, can't have much better conviction than knowing someone is scum because they're your team mate, I get that, but Verbal at least was very confident that you were town and I think it had something to do with your willingness to really engage and analyze.  Let me dig it up:  

-Kaylee practically locked in as town unless she's heavily changed her scum meta since I last played with her.  Her analysis MQ was a huge townie indicator for me.

  Remember I asked you about those massive spammy quote chains a few pages back? You didn't know what I was talking about.  Which is fair.  It could easily be a subconscious tendency.  It was a little weird to hear you speak out against something you personally tend to do.  But while Verbal was wrong about you, he was wrong while you were gunning down actual scum.  I dunno how much of a difference that makes.  I don't know if you've been disengaged here or if I'm just failing to remember your content.  You're someone I need to put more work into; definitely a part of my POE at the moment.

There Verbal was talking about me using wall of texts, not using quotes requoted to the punt of not being able to read them. (I can only play on mobile most of the time and those get to be one letter inside the quotes... So people using that to say "yeah I agree" or other little comments gets frustrating. That's as either alignment BTW).

[Kaylee]

Ok, caught up.

 

Csarmi

Cass

Pizza

LenoWish-tree

Zander

Nolder

Pralaya

Turin

Kaylee

Celeste

Laine

 

Gee Shad, that's a lot of scum and not many strong town.

 

Very briefly:

 

Yep.  Salami I've explained.  Not someone I would have ever expected to have as top town but stranger things have happened.  Cass has made the sort of observations that my gut instinctively susses, but when I look at what she does with them I see a player who is using initial weak concerns to develop reads and isn't settling into a cozy comfort zone where she can coast through the rest of the phase despite being fairly well town read.  Pizza is playing a clean game and attempting to rally a town core.  It's pro-town.  I'll be looking for how he sustains it.  His progression seems to have stalled a bit on Zander, but that's understandable from my pov.  Lenlo not being himself, but he knows this, and it's not in a scummy way.  He has made a few comments I don't recall off the top of my head that struck me as, at worst, on the fringes of his scum potential.  I think scum!Lenlo is more likely to attempt to attempt to emulate his town norms than to fake taking a different approach.  Wish feels like a pretty proactive town to me, and I'm not really bothered by her protective posture @ Celeste the way a lot of people are.  Zander hasn't really said or done anything out of his wolf range so far.  Nolder's felt fairly absent--a few things I've liked that don't add up to much in the overall lack of much content.  Has Pral even checked in yet?

 

Turin's vote on me was lazy at face value.  I would have liked to prod him for more info on it before explaining why but our availability time hasn't really overlapped tonight.  Kaylee felt a bit disinterested and unopinionated, but picked up the slack some when she started going at Celeste.  Celeste bothered me for a lot of the reasons that wish explained as town signs, tbh.  The unvote/timing, not so much.  Not at all, really, though I find the follow-through of "so I don't forget to unvote later" pretty weird.  Frustration at the attention the unvote drew was most certainly honest but null, and I'm pretty annoyed that she won't put in the effort to develop her read on me.  It's one of those things where why would scum keep doing it if she knows it's drawing attention, but lazyscum don't necessarily stop being lazyscum when you call them out on it.  Laine's comment about me and Lenlo still bugs me, and I know that as scum she tends to provide commentary for the sake of looking busy, but I sometimes get the same impression from highlydistractedandshortontimetown!Laine.  She made a comment irt Cass that I found interesting, want to see how she progresses over the next day or two.

Feeling pretty good about Shad after this post. I like how he's explained where he's coming from.

[Pralaya]

You know the feeling when you wake up and see that the game for the first time and see that it is already in its 35th page !!

 

Well, I am reading the game now. WIll take some time to catch up. Actually lot of time.

 

Till the 8th page - the only thing in my mind - not sure if it is normal for Cass to FoS people right at the beginning of the game. And, not just a joke FoS. 

[Kaylee]

 

 

Lenlo, generally when I say I don't hate a vote, it's because I would vote that way if persuaded a little bit. Also, I read where you said you'd explain it, so why ask a question that's already been asked? lol

 

So hedging then?

 

My list looks something like this... ?

AlannaLenloZander

Pizza

ShadCassWish

Csarmi

Pral

NolderCelesteKayleeTurin

 

This list. Explain Kaylees spot please.

 

Also helps that you're my top town read.

 

/Why/?

 

Why am I your top town read? What have I done to deserve that spot? From my point of view, ive done jack all yet ive clearly been around and available. Town read me abit for early posts and tone and all, fine, but why am I your top town read, beneath only yourself? Please explain it because to me it makes no sense for me to be that high when I have done less actual scum hunting this game than Matrix, where I spent the whole game trying to get a teammate lynched.

You seem offended that people are town reading you. But the point is that you're here and you're interacting with people and in real time. I guess I can say that you seem to be playing very relaxed as opposed to how you seemed in Matrix, though Zander /was/ attacking you the whole start of the game. lol

 

What do you mean by hedging? I generally trust the reads of those I'm town reading. And if more of my town reads are showing distrust of a particular player, I'll adjust my reads to take that into account. My comment on your vote was basically a thumbsup; I don't mind votes going that way and I'm not going to do anything to stop it. Being that I myself suck at actually voting unless I'm sure about something, I generally need more nudges to before I place my own vote.

 

Kaylee's spot is the result of POE and me basically not being able to remember her presence on thread very much. I can't recall a single stance she's taken besides fussing over Celeste's unvote and getting defensive towards Zander for the Frozen comments.

Wasn't defensive about frozen. I wasn't sure what he was getting at.

[Kaylee]

I do need all the townies who survive to the late late game to have demonstrated some kind of scum finding process.

 

If you exist at that point in the game and have demonstrated no giving of any ducks at any point in the process of finding a wolf, that's probably the reason why you're there. You're either a wolf or you've been unthreatening to them, and it's really tough to tell the difference between a closed townie and a low-posting wolf.

 

I like the game to be solvable by analysis, not a coin flip.

Me too on your last point here.

[Kaylee]

Cass: From what I know he'll give content either way. It's the approach that changes. He'll care more about how he's coming across, choose words more carefully correct typos... As mafia.

 

I don't see that here. He's trying something new, he's making his thoughts known and being active. Still getting town vibes.

[Kaylee]

Caught up. Will be gone for awhile. Have to get ready for work and bathe the kids.

[Songstress]

Don't mind me.... computer glitching!

[Songstress]

OFFICIAL VOTE COUNT (unchanged):
 
Shad (2): Turin, Celeste
Celeste (1): Lenlo
 
Not voting (10): Shad, Kaylee, Zander, Pizza, Csarmi, Laine, Wish, Pral, Nolder, Cass

----------
With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch
No deadline has been set at this time.

[Cass]

Turin and Zander -- talk to me! This means you!

 

Turin: apprently not clear to me. It is now though.

 

I sometimes miss things when playing catch up. Besides, I'd rather ask to clarify if I'm unsure then just assume I know what someone's point is.

Kaylee, do you have a read/lean on Turin here?

 

 

 

1. Pretty serious that I thought you'd be less serious tbh!

2. Potentially I expected you to be obvTown to me if you were Town and I'm honing in on you because you're not yet. So kinda the opposite to pre-conceiving that someone's scum (lolannoyingwolfgifisannoyinglol);

 

 

3. Yup. That's what, if anything, will have me lean you Town right now.

 

4. The meta questions stood out to me because I expected you to try and read me on your own. 

 

Basically, looking at it, I think most of it comes down to #assumptions (on my part), and those assumptions are quite potentially silly given that we've never played together before. I'll reign in the tinfoil for a while if you do! :P

 

 

3,  I think im missing something here can you explain it please?

 

4.  The Meta questions felt off because you expected me to read you on my own AFTER I've mentioned that IM A META RELIANT player??? Cass you'll have to understand my #ENFPROCKNROLLMUSICTOWN why that statement really really pings me I hope......

 

 

3. Referred to your "Weighing in the ENFP" from the post I was responding to. Because I've seen proof of how similar we are outside the game, understanding ENFP personality is what could cause me to lean you Town despite the early 'pings'.

 

I get that the ENFP 'x-could-be-possible' paranoia struggle is real in general. I know better than most where the line between struggleTown and struggleWolf lies when playing mafia and as Town I'm learning how to refine it. I should be able to figure you out. I'm giving you space to observe your reactions - in relation to this, me, across the board. Right now you're null. 

 

4. The meta questions stood out to me because I expected you to try and read me on your own. Independent of this game. I can understand how you might read it as pingy.

 

Read the part below again... it basically applies to points 1, 2 and 4 and is the best indicator in that post of where I'm actually at there.

 

1. Pretty serious that I thought you'd be less serious tbh!

2. Potentially I expected you to be obvTown to me if you were Town and I'm honing in on you because you're not yet. So kinda the opposite to pre-conceiving that someone's scum (lolannoyingwolfgifisannoyinglol);

 

 

3. Yup. That's what, if anything, will have me lean you Town right now.

 

4. The meta questions stood out to me because I expected you to try and read me on your own. 

 

Basically, looking at it, I think most of it comes down to #assumptions (on my part), and those assumptions are quite potentially silly given that we've never played together before. I'll reign in the tinfoil for a while if you do! :P

 

 

 

 

@ wish-tree

 

That's valid, but do you think that's what Shad has been doing all round? Or most of it, or is his main motivation so far today?

 

I hadn't gotten that impression. What do you see when you look beyond that one post?

 

Keep in mind it was page 1. There will be a lot of posts on page 1 and many of the early pages which lack a motive. Most of the first few pages are garbage posts.

 

I read them anyway just in case. Shad was an exception to my usual nulls that early.

 

Non-bold is fine and the sort of thing I'd say is generally more likely Town. IMO it comes from Pizza in any alignment   .

 

Bold is weird filler, Pizza.

 

 

 

 

 

Want to vote Celeste but hesitating hard.

Why? Is it because I randomly voted Cass? Or something else.

 

 

I like Penny for Town here. Will be interested to see Pizza's response.

 

 

Why?

 

Because she voted me out the gates and was using it in her interaction with Pizza, essentially. Plus tone pretty much the same as the D1 game we just finished til there.

I'd been waiting for her to jump in for a stronger read, when she did she questioned Pizza, someone I'm not willing to call Town, on a post that had stood out to me, in a way I've seen her do as Town. Premature perhaps, but there you go.

 

I was interested to see Pizza's response because his 'I want to vote but' post on someone I was leaning Town on pinged in itself, and I didn't understand the hesitation if he was really thinking she was scum.

 

 

 

 

@ Cass, I would say that Lenlo posting in that manner is completely null for him (1). Also too early for it to mean anything about Shad as they were basically the only two in thread at that time (2).

Ty! (*Numbers added to points for reference)

1) What differences would you expect from Lenlo as either alignment?

2) Do you have a read on either?

 

In that particular jokey exchange I would expect Len to be exactly the same in either alignment. He loves to have fun with the other players even if it makes him potentially look bad. The fun is (or at least was) more important to him. That is why I said it is completely null.

 

Now if at a later time he tries to use that read as valid then I would find him most suspicious.

 

 

Ok. I think I've got a better handle on Lenlo's tone now, but appreciate you sharing meta. FWIW I was talking in the wider context, not just in relation to that one post. 

You missed the second question and I didn't see the point of the last line.

[Cass]

@Lenlo

 

 

I'm slightly wary of Alanna right now...

 

Lainey, you a wolf?

Why Alanna? What did she do? Its page 3 woman!

I gave the whys in a post further along IIRC. I get it's p. 3! :P

(This is post is just me voicing gut feel on the things I mentioned stood out to me and drawing more out of Alanna to analyse further).

 

 

 

Shad, please attempt to describe your take on Lenlo's meta.

Also, Cass, who is Penny?

 

I like the first question here.

 

Penny is Celeste (and a million other names :P Penn :P ). I've played with her/both of us as Town twice, for a total of 2 in-game days.

Once on PersC where I advocated her mislynch cos she didn't make sense and recently at theOrg where she got taken out by Scum n1. She's a good player.

 

How is this question good? Its just asking who someone is, I dont see how this could be alignment indicative at all. (1)

 

Also, which post stood out? (2) I do like the question to Turin though, I would also like to see what differences he expected from me for either alignment

 

1)  What I liked was Turin's first line of 'questioning' for Shad ("Please attempt to describe your take on Lenlo's meta") because it asked Shad to elaborate/go on the record about how he normally reads you/expects you to act. 

 

2) The post of yours, above my comment and bolded in the spoiler below is the one that stood out.

 

 

 

[spoiler}

 

haha

 

I almost want to legit town read you for saying that when I did.

Lets take this game by storm, me and you against the world.

 

 

 

 

This was the one that stood out most and made me go back and re-read. 

Basically, Shad sounded more carefree, Lenlo more controlled. I can't read Lenlo's bold but thoughts were if not sarcastic or good friends/frequently play together this 'against the world' (when Town is the majority) seems wolfy. Not pushing anything further, just an observation.

First part: Or its not alignment indicative at all and we were joking because we are friends? Or atleast I hope were friends. Shad, are we friends?

 

Second: The last line, bolded, stood out to me. Why mention this?

 

 

The bolded question sounds like one of mine :D :P

Basically just to try and be clear about my thought process - in my head it's the equivalent of "Not putting much stock in read of the inital post right here (therefore not going to push it). Noting this and I think it's more important to be moving on for now". 

 

 

 

@Lenlo:

 

1. Can you please explain why Shad is Town to you at that point?

 

Hes not? It was a joke. About cats, ice trays and breadboxes. Its not a legit read.

Ok :)

 

 

 

I actually like this question. At first alot of her posts seemed like asking questions and such just to look townie, but its starting not to be the case.

 

/SNIP

 

Who has played with Cass before and who can help me understand her? She seems like another brand of Zander and I cant handle that.

 

 

:D Lolololololololololololololololol ( :P )

 

If it helps, Zander and I both score ENFP-A in the Myers-Briggs Personality Test. We pretty much are different brands of each other!

(I lololololol at you here because i)fun and ii)I can understand the frustration of dealing with us in the setting of mafia. Sorry!)

 

 

 

 

 

Essentially, I don't understand why you thought a note-taking system was something worth dropping randomly into the thread. I'm suspicious of motives by nature, and I question things when they stand out. This stood out. I'm after elaboration on your motives in your own words so I can try and read your alignment based on whether or not I find it easy to believe what you say. I can explain my light concern/thought-process further after you answer if you like?
 
Right now I'm confused by the purpose of your post, and I don't like that you didn't just communicate straight up :P
 
The other, less important part is I'm not sure how it would work/I'm wondering if you actually take notes on every post?

It doesn't happen often but sometimes when I find people are struggling with something mafia-related or I have something I think is useful, I share it during the game.

 

Example of which is when during Game 3 I told Road (what game this is and who that is aren't important) how to handle playing a game with way more posts than he might be used to, and discussed using the ignore function for dead villagers to reduce re-read time. I thought he was likely to be scum at the time, but in case he wasn't, I still offered it.

 

It doesn't have any purpose other than hey, maybe this is helpful to someone. And I'd do that as scum, though I can't cite any examples of that from memory.

 

I don't always take notes every post. On other websites where there are fewer posts than here per day phase, it's not needed. I've found it helpful in the past particularly if I survive a long time in a game, because then I can start bolding blue my notes where the villagers died, and it helps me see reactions and patterns of the scumbags.

 

I did this on the Giant in the Playground board, when I was a nilla townie in a long game with a large scum team. Was very useful.

 

 

 

You hung out at GitP? Cool! I didnt know that.

 

1. What's your take on Pizza's actual response there?

 

The comment you made does nothing to analyse the response Pizza gave - to a question you took time to note you 'actually liked', which seems odd.

 

[Kaylee]

Cass: no I didn't have a read on Turin there. I like that he's given thoughts on players with reasons behind it though. He's not one I read well tbh.

[wish-tree]

Catching up.

[wish-tree]

Okay, hi peoples

 

Am feeling pretty sick, and am in two other games, plus trying to fill signups for my own game. These are mere excuses for lack of content, but yeah, this game was not my priority yesterday.

 

I am going back and gonna do what I do best - initial reads.

 

Will try to solve this within the first 10 pages, tyvm.