[BASIC/STANDARD] Warcraft: War of the Ancients Mafia - GAME OVER, MAFIA WINS

[Kaylee]

Hi Lenofinger!

[wish-tree]

Lenny: Yes but I don't recall the game. Either that or it was the game I modded...

I think I played in the modded game (it was the multi ball everyone is Mafia one).

[Kaylee]

Yup that was it

[wish-tree]

also, can someone explain to me what the entire note taking thing was about anyway? I don't see how that generated reads at all, if it did.

[Lenlo]

@post 149: Didnt read it. To long, to boring. Sorry Pizza.

 

 

 

 

What the hell?

 

Is this at me?

 

 

 

Yeah.

 

Then why not elaborate on your apparent confusion so we can begin to work things out?

 

 

 

That link takes you to a site where you can generate the numbers.

 

I always prefer a period and a space between the numbers and my notes, and it allows you to add that as a suffix. Not sure why it didn't copy over onto the site, it copied into my notes just fine. I think DM drops the space if it's not being used.

 

Ok?

 

I just don't get so much of this. lol. What are the numbers for? What is 'per-post notes'? Why are we even discussing this? 

 

Why are we discussing this?

 

 

Essentially, I don't understand why you thought a note-taking system was something worth dropping randomly into the thread. I'm suspicious of motives by nature, and I question things when they stand out. This stood out. I'm after elaboration on your motives in your own words so I can try and read your alignment based on whether or not I find it easy to believe what you say. I can explain my light concern/thought-process further after you answer if you like?

 

Right now I'm confused by the purpose of your post, and I don't like that you didn't just communicate straight up :P

 

The other, less important part is I'm not sure how it would work/I'm wondering if you actually take notes on every post?

 

I actually like this question. At first alot of her posts seemed like asking questions and such just to look townie, but its starting not to be the case.

 

 

1. Why Lenlo over Shad? Shad can play a good wolf game and Lenlo is pretty null so far.
 
2.The being cute joke comment was saying that they're being really chummy. It wasn't meant to indicate alignments of either, but it is good to note for later in case one of them flips.

 

1. Explained this thought process somewhere earlier (after your post), lmk if something stands out. 

2. Can you elaborate on what conclusions you would draw based on each flip?

 

It was the fact you commented an observation without giving indication of why it was important that stood out. If it's good to note for later, why? If you're Town, why not explain that's what you're thinking? Felt like commenting just to comment because it was the most interesting thing in the thread, but it didn't give us anything to work off - wrt to you, or either of them.

 

 

Yo! Cass, calm yourself. I'm not a wolf. Why are you wary of me?

 

I can't calm! I'm #CASSUNLEASHED!

And I won't believe you're just a wolf because you say so :P

 

Question: Why are you so serious here? I mentioned wary - not gunning for your lynch!

yet :P

 

 

For better or worse, I was wary because feels on the 'looking forward to some content' part of your first post; the Shad/Lenlo observation that tells us nothing; and you keep mentioning when you'll be back etc.

 

I'm going to reserve my actual read on you until I re-read our joint game (won't be reading it tonight).

 

FWIW I found this post very fair:

The one(?) time I played with Cass we were mafia together and she was extremely paranoid, but as far as I know her rampant paranoia is not alignment indicative. She is very analytical though, Turin's right

Slight points for not trying to use my paranoia against me. More points for arguing that it's null. <3 because <3. And lol for analytical. 

 

 

I would actually say Lenlo (I originally just wrote Lenlove? wtf) a little more likely to be town than Shad, due to his willingness to give Shad a town lean like that.

For now..

Lenlo

Shad

Is this a meta thing you have on Lenlo? (Can you explain?)

 

I don't understand how one can be more Town to you when they both committed the same action (calling each other Town).

 

Who has played with Cass before and who can help me understand her? She seems like another brand of Zander and I cant handle that.

 

 

Essentially, I don't understand why you thought a note-taking system was something worth dropping randomly into the thread. I'm suspicious of motives by nature, and I question things when they stand out. This stood out. I'm after elaboration on your motives in your own words so I can try and read your alignment based on whether or not I find it easy to believe what you say. I can explain my light concern/thought-process further after you answer if you like?
 
Right now I'm confused by the purpose of your post, and I don't like that you didn't just communicate straight up :P
 
The other, less important part is I'm not sure how it would work/I'm wondering if you actually take notes on every post?

It doesn't happen often but sometimes when I find people are struggling with something mafia-related or I have something I think is useful, I share it during the game.

 

Example of which is when during Game 3 I told Road (what game this is and who that is aren't important) how to handle playing a game with way more posts than he might be used to, and discussed using the ignore function for dead villagers to reduce re-read time. I thought he was likely to be scum at the time, but in case he wasn't, I still offered it.

 

It doesn't have any purpose other than hey, maybe this is helpful to someone. And I'd do that as scum, though I can't cite any examples of that from memory.

 

I don't always take notes every post. On other websites where there are fewer posts than here per day phase, it's not needed. I've found it helpful in the past particularly if I survive a long time in a game, because then I can start bolding blue my notes where the villagers died, and it helps me see reactions and patterns of the scumbags.

 

I did this on the Giant in the Playground board, when I was a nilla townie in a long game with a large scum team. Was very useful.

 

You hung out at GitP? Cool! I didnt know that.

 

Re-read complete, and my villager leans are thusly

 

We're not giving points for everything this time, that leads to runaway (Lenlo) scumreads which are sucky and don't reverse until it's problem. Instead posts which are likely town but more easily faked as scum are 0 with the word town next to it.

 

Askthepizzaguy (again!)

Cassy +5 initial wtf reaction has been clarified a lot. Yeah blue.

Shad +3 not outside his scum game but much improvement

Laine +2 Not confident but in my top 3

Zander Null points, but +1 overall (Not outside his scum range but I get good vibes)

Csarmi Null points, but +1 good feels

Turin Null points, but +1 good feels

Kaylee Null

Lenlo Null

Celeste Null

 

Wish True Null

Pralaya True Null

Nolder True Null

Why do you have Shad so certain but me with nothing, when we both posted the same amount at the same time to each other? What about that exchange made him seem good to you? Because none of it was actual casing or anything.

 

 

[Askthepizzaguy]

[snipped]

 

She's honest and to the point as town. Even if she joke votes, it's not done with a certain flippant attitude that I see when she's scum. More sass would be scummy, and usually she's super calm as well.

It sounds like you're saying she isn't scum because she's not doing certain behaviors in a very small number of posts.

 

I don't think I can agree with that method. Seems pretty null to me.

 

It looks like a conclusion with a rationalization given to it.

[wish-tree]

Yup that was it

Kk.

 

Besides Cass and Celeste, I'm feeling good about Pizza, I think. Mainly because he's doing a lot of questioning, explaining his reasoning (even if I don't quite agree). Maybe Laine. Her attitude seems natural and relaxed, which is good if I compare it to that one game we were scum together in.

 

I'm gradually gathering reads about other people, but at this point, I haven't caught any scummy behavior. I suppose I could go back to opening posts and look for forced behavior or kind of off tone.

 

I hate that - relying on gut stuff. I prefer the head processes that involve the brain.

[Lenlo]

 

 

 

 

OFC YOU CAN USE THE LOLOLOLOLOLOL

 

ALSO TELL CORY I LOVE HIM!!!!!!

 

 

:wub: :wub:

 

 

I've never played with you/seen you Town, but I'd expect you to just LOLOLOLOLOLOLOL! (or at least Lol first)

No need to tell him, he's reading along :P

 

Cass I have no Meta on you...is joke votes normal for you?  How do you play?  What are your scum tells???  Or is it just straight Rand.Org has forever branded you a Wolf??!!!

 

lmklmklmk

 

- Joke votes are not normal for me except if I feel relatively comfortable with someone both inside and outside the game. 

- Dice and Penny are probably the only players I would jokevote at this stage of my career.

- Voting is not something I do lightly in any case (to this point). I don't like being wrong. I'm think I'm learning the advantages of throwing votes around, but it's not something I easily/naturally want to do when there's a game to win!!

 

I play... differently to this? More carefully/sensored? Usually. As either alignment. But I'm hyper! (winding down) and trying not to take the game so seriously, trying to be more me than a player, if that makes sense? Blame Chris/Cory if I don't make sense. They encouraged the unleashing of #FullCass! :D :D 

 

 

 

 

 

good morning

Morning Turin havent played with you in a long time or really much at all for that matter looking forward to it man!!!!

it has been a while. let's lunch some wolves.

 

 

Lets do this brother!!!

 

#Gutread awkward

 

Turin have you played with Cass??

 

Like do you have any Meta on her?

 

Im a pretty heavy Meta reliant player so I need some info on her.

#Gutread more awkward because bold reads forced/unnecessary

 

 

Z, I think I played once or twice with her in the game. I don't recall a lot about her but I think she is a more analytical player. I recall dice always having to tell her to go to sleep.

For me, I'm Turin and I like lazy Sunday mornings in bed, medium sized walks in the park and living here in the shire.

I'm town. Like always.

 

I can be analytical when I put my mind to it. I like sifting through stuff and finding nitty-gritty inconsistencies. That goes for play in either alignment.

I've tried to sleep more the last couple of games. I think you're more likely to understand me correctly this game if you think like Dice and just question if I seem like me.

 

 

TLDR I'm wary, but I doubt I'm voting you today Zan, because I want fun :D If you're Town and we figure each other out this game will #FULLTWINENFPFTW!

 

 

 

How serious, if at all are you with the lolololololol part??? And also I always need to tell Cory i love him ldo!!!!! lollololololol

 

Thanks for the Meta info, I look forward to hearing others weigh in on it!!!  and I cant wait to see #FULLCASS....i picture something like this....

 

 

 

 

 

It seems like you've already come in with the preconceived notion of reading me scummy and that's not a good look my dear...Like each of my interactions youve felt off about,  I mean I get that people Ive never played with before may sense that but its just that all youre using is Forced and Awkward....and like 6 pages in, that seems very weird, but then I'm also weighing in the ENFP so Im kinda meh with this, but something Im noticing fwiw.

 

Why would you think my Meta talk is forced or unnecessary, especially sense theres a bunch of players I havent played with much or at all and the fact that everyone who has played with me will tell you IM EXACTLY a Meta reliant player???!!!!

 

 

Well I want to make sure we figure each other out because so far it feels a little off putting to me my dear!!!!

 

See, I didnt get the feeling she was calling you scum. Your abit defensive here about it to, which I dont know how I feel about, and thats bad. Focus on being the Zander from previous games or else I may have to lynch you.

 

I have a question for all of you

 

You are on the side of a road walking down the sidewalk.

You have a gun with 1 bullet in it.

Two people are walking towards you.

The one on your left has a baseball bat the other is wearing a cowboy hat.

Who do you shoot?

Baseball bat, cause I hate baseball.

 

 

 

Shad, please attempt to describe your take on Lenlo's meta.

First ya Id like to hear your thoughts on Len's Meta.....and mine as well!!!!!!

Summarize everything I think I know about how Lenlo thinks and behaves as town vs as scum?

That's a long exercise, and one I find borderline counterproductive at this stage, and I don't really think of people as a list of dos and don'ts in the first place. The whole value of a meta read is that it allows you to catch people being dishonest in subtle ways that are not objectively alignment indicative.

I'll call what I see when I see it.

[V] Shad [/v]

 

Why?

 

Hi Lenofinger!

Hi Kaylee! How long has it been since we played together!

 

 

[wish-tree]

 

[snipped]

She's honest and to the point as town. Even if she joke votes, it's not done with a certain flippant attitude that I see when she's scum. More sass would be scummy, and usually she's super calm as well.

 

It sounds like you're saying she isn't scum because she's not doing certain behaviors in a very small number of posts.

 

I don't think I can agree with that method. Seems pretty null to me.

 

It looks like a conclusion with a rationalization given to it.

It kind of is a rationalization. I gut read people I know well, so my explanations of their behavior are kinda bad. I at least try to explain it, but seriously- my tells on people aren't a universal thing that everyone agrees with, but it works for me.

[Lenlo]

So im liking how Pizza has played this game, it feels like previous games, and while I would normally find that scummy im trying to re calibrate for how I read him.

[Lenlo]

Caught up.

[Celeste]

 

 

With that said, bye. *poofs*

Another tell for Celeste being town is her scum reading me. That's something I expect, because she's a lot more uncertain of herself as town and also absolutely can't read me. ;)

 

this is not true all the time and you know it.

 

Do you believe, even if it is inaccurate, that this is her honest opinion? You're saying she's remembering incorrectly or is lying deliberately or neither.

I believe this is her honest opinion despite forgetting that simple fact.

[Cass]

 

@ Pizza:  Please correct me if Im wrong but didnt you mention that lazy reads were a tell of some sort......

 

Want to vote Celeste but hesitating hard.

 

 

Why and why havent you?

 

 

I like both the observation and the question here from Zander. 

I actually liked the entire post except for the 'hmmmmmmm' part of his 'hmmmmmmmm lolololololololol' comment. 

 

More importantly I think it's a good, villagery sign that he's spanning out and focusing on more players. One thing I think I picked up on in ZanderDiaboloScum! was a rather persistently, closed tunneling feel. He felt more restrained and fake. 

 

 

 

 

 

Shad, please attempt to describe your take on Lenlo's meta.

First ya Id like to hear your thoughts on Len's Meta.....and mine as well!!!!!!

 

Summarize everything I think I know about how Lenlo thinks and behaves as town vs as scum?

 

That's a long exercise, and one I find borderline counterproductive at this stage, and I don't really think of people as a list of dos and don'ts in the first place. The whole value of a meta read is that it allows you to catch people being dishonest in subtle ways that are not objectively alignment indicative.

 

I'll call what I see when I see it.

 

 

 

@Shad re the bold. 

I think it's more important that you explain why you see what you see when asked. 

I don't need an entire explanation of Lenlo's meta (though I'd like it!).

 

What I want to know is what you saw/were thinking when you said Lenlo was Town. This response feels like you're avoiding explanation of your read. 

 

 

 

@ Cass why are we making you wary?

 

fwiw- This kind of back and forth between me an Alanna is pretty normal and very null.  Ask Cory in your QT.

 

There was one aspect of it that I wouldn't call "normal", but null as things stand and I'm in wait and see mode on that.  Curious what Cass has to say here.

 

 

 

 

You're going to be an interesting one to figure out.

 

You are demonstrating analysis but seem to be considering events on a somewhat superficial level.  Do you think that Lenlo and I consider each other lock town?  Do you think that scum would be instinctively inclined to describe themselves a a minority in the village?

Shad, relating to Cass:

 

I'm not looking at whether her methods are accurate or useful. I think some of the methods used so far have low utility, in my experience. But a roll of the dice will be right sometimes. Is Cass a villager? That's a far more important question.

 

I think she's demonstrated that she is. If you need more time to figure it out, I can respect that, but I wouldn't pick on her methods that much. That distracts from the alignment hunt itself. example Zander has different methods from me, I think some of them won't work, some of them will work a lot especially if used on scums, but I'm more concerned about is Zander town than how Zander towns.

 

 

I respect the logic of this post from Pizza. Have him wary-nullish for now.

[wish-tree]

I'm going to be blunt here.

 

I will read into opening posts and make my initial reads there.

 

I'm looking for unnatural, forced behavior. If I know the person well, I then look for behavior that deviates from town!them or is indicative of scum!them.

[wish-tree]

Hi people in the thread

 

Can you answer my question about the whole note taking thing? That's a bit random and one of the only things I was really confused about when catching up this morning.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Why do you have Shad so certain but me with nothing, when we both posted the same amount at the same time to each other? What about that exchange made him seem good to you? Because none of it was actual casing or anything.

Shad gets a freebie point for posting essentially at the same time the game began. That indicates a much higher level of enthusiasm than his previous game.

 

Shad got the broken up thoughts tell, in different posts. He did less of that in the previous game as scum and more of that in the previous previous game as town, and it's a thing I do a lot when I'm in a stream of consciousness posting mode.

 

Post 20 made me feel he's townie, gut.

 

Basically, he had an assertion that he knew some people's meta, Then you immediately challenged him on it, and his response did not feel like it was fabricated. Yes, it didn't really answer your question, but I look for motive and agenda and I saw nothing there which lead to any kind of manipulation of you or anyone else.

 

Scum generally post things that specifically do something, or that are fluffy / diplomacy posts. If I see someone doing stuff for no particular reason, that's more townie than not.

 

Your posts in that portion of the game read exactly null to me.

 

1) I'm here

2) ORLY essentially

3) fluff

4) fluff

5) fluff

6) conclusion Shad is town, no raisin

7) Shad reads me town, I read Shad town. EZ

 

That's what I got from those posts. Nothing that varies from town or village play.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Hi people in the thread

 

Can you answer my question about the whole note taking thing? That's a bit random and one of the only things I was really confused about when catching up this morning.

 

I don't think I addressed that yet. Let me see where your original question was. Brb

[wish-tree]

 

 

 

With that said, bye. *poofs*

Another tell for Celeste being town is her scum reading me. That's something I expect, because she's a lot more uncertain of herself as town and also absolutely can't read me. ;)

this is not true all the time and you know it.

 

Do you believe, even if it is inaccurate, that this is her honest opinion? You're saying she's remembering incorrectly or is lying deliberately or neither.

I believe this is her honest opinion despite forgetting that simple fact.

I want to know what you think of me, actually. And since I trust you so far, I would also like your gut reads.

 

(What works, works. Meh.)

[Lenlo]

So you townread him more because he didnt try to manipulate anyone with his response about meta?

[Askthepizzaguy]

also, can someone explain to me what the entire note taking thing was about anyway? I don't see how that generated reads at all, if it did.

 

Wasn't meant to, it was me sharing a website that I find useful for generating a list of numbers which I use when keeping track of my reads.

 

Not every post is explicitly for finding scum. Most of them should be.

[Askthepizzaguy]

So you townread him more because he didnt try to manipulate anyone with his response about meta?

 

Yes. I felt his play in the previous game was more about coloring people's perceptions and skating through to D2.

[Zander?]

 

Why Lenlo over Shad? Shad can play a good wolf game and Lenlo is pretty null so far.

 

The being cute joke comment was saying that they're being really chummy. It wasn't meant to indicate alignments of either, but it is good to note for later in case one of them flips.

Red -- Based on our opening exchange, what would me flipping scum tell you about Lenlo, or vice versa?

 

 

i like this question from Shad.  Cause i dont see how just based off of that alone, youd garner any information one way or the other.

 

 

@ Cass why are we making you wary?

 

fwiw- This kind of back and forth between me an Alanna is pretty normal and very null.  Ask Cory in your QT.

 

There was one aspect of it that I wouldn't call "normal", but null as things stand and I'm in wait and see mode on that.  Curious what Cass has to say here.

 

 

Look forward to hearing from both of you concerning this

 

 

 

Caught up.

 

And have commented on absolutely nothing of consequence thus far or given a thought....noted

 

Come on Nol man give us some thoughts!!!!

 

lololololololololol

 

There has been nothing of consequence worth commenting on.

 

Can you give me ONE GAME where I can play the way I like to play dude?

I've given you the last two games. I was open early even though I didn't like it.

Both as town and as mafia.

 

This time I'm going to play the way I like to play and if you don't like it you can lynch me.

 

When I find something worth talking about you'll see me talking about it.

Right now it's mostly just pointless banter and posturing.

Don't worry though I intend to blow things up this afternoon.

 

 

 

You do you homie.  I'll do me.  Sound good?  fwiw This post feels genuine to me as opposed to his "fight" with Cory in World's End.

[wish-tree]

 

also, can someone explain to me what the entire note taking thing was about anyway? I don't see how that generated reads at all, if it did.

 

 

Wasn't meant to, it was me sharing a website that I find useful for generating a list of numbers which I use when keeping track of my reads.

 

Not every post is explicitly for finding scum. Most of them should be.

I actually disagree, somewhat. I think you can read a lot into one post, even about things that are unrelated.

Hmm... Can you give me a rundown of Lenlo's meta? Don't recall.

 

And Lenlo, I want you to describe Pizza's meta to me as well. Ty!

[wish-tree]

Hey Zander! Are you town? I don't see as many lololols.

 

(Don't even know why I'm reading into that, lolololol).

 

Can you tell me about Lainey? I know you two play together often.

[Celeste]

I have a question for all of you

 

You are on the side of a road walking down the sidewalk.

You have a gun with 1 bullet in it.

Two people are walking towards you.

The one on your left has a baseball bat the other is wearing a cowboy hat.

Who do you shoot?

Umm what does this prove Nolder? Seems like pointless WIFOM.