[Advanced] Nightmare Before Christmas - Town Wins!

[dicetosser1]

when u goin AJ?

[dicetosser1]

in fact who here ISNT excited about SW?? Put your hand up so we can lynch you now

[Thane Vakarian]

in fact who here ISNT excited about SW?? Put your hand up so we can lynch you now

going to see episode VII on saturday. Free food, drinks and tickets for Chae and myself, plus fee, because i'll show up as Darth Vader and entertain some people. Should be fun.

[dicetosser1]

back when at work

[Andrej]

when u goin AJ?

I'm hoping it'll be my Christmas Day present. We have a little tradition of seeing a movie on Christmas and I wasn't able to get any preordered tickets :(

 

Maybe a week in theatres will be enough time so I can actually catch a showing that isn't sold out

[Shad_]

Domestic chores complete, equipped with a delicious breakfast omelet and the WIM of the Ancients, Shad returns to page 10 to resume his scumhunt.

[alannalynn]

Thank you, Shad!

[Shad_]

Thought on p11: Pizza, you seem to look at other games a lot.  If you're feeling up to it, what do you think of Dice D1 in Diablo vs here?  It's the last completed game in this forum, should only be a few posts by him to skim through.

[Shad_]

Thank you, Shad!

 

[Shad_]

Oh, Pizza, my comment above on lurking, I definitely understand your perspective.  And if someone straight up lies, like excusing an absence as they didn't have computer access while they were clearly active elsewhere, it's a good catch.  I just don't think it indicates much of anything in the short term.  Over the course of multiple days/phases, yeah, and there are a few players here I've learned to read by their lack of substantive thoughts when given more than ample time to form them.

[Shad_]

 

Sorry bout the quote chains, I just quote things I am interested in or want to respond to as I catch up.

 

As for Nolder, thank you. I can see what you are saying but this game has only been up for 20 hours or so. Yeah he popped in and then dipped, but that was very early on before any real content started. He could have gone to sleep, or had something to do cause its the weekend. So while I dont disagree with your assessment of those two games/his scum game, I wanna give him abit of time to get involved now that we have gotten serious.

 

If upon his return he stays consistent with your case then I will feel good following you and voting him.

 

Oh hey Nomi. Haha, that game. Never hard bussing like that again.

 

I mostly agree with Lenlo's stance here re: Nolder. Give the dude some time and more rope to (potentially) hang himself with.

 

Lenlo looks pretty villagery so far imo.

 

I guess you're gonna take my advice from last game and actually think about stuff, hm? I'm proud of you :P

 

Very modestly ruffled by this.  I'm feeling pretty strongly town about Lenlo so far, no reason AJ shouldn't too, but the sort of "congrats on towning better this time" felt a little TMI on first read.

[Shad_]

Or better put, it felt like the quote might be what AJ was thinking.  He didn't actually say that.

[Lenlo]

Alright done with my last final

[Andrej]

It was a little tongue in cheek on my part, so that might be where you get the vibe from.

 

If you looked at the DT for Diablo I talked to Lenlo a bit about his game after driving his mislynch over a scum counter wagon

[Shad_]

I know gut feelings I'm having are difficult to reproduce, but could you take a lot at my exchange with NotBob so far.

 

I don't know if I can put it any more simply, and it would help if I could. But I don't often see townies defend other players that they have ranked as null on their list of suspects, where they don't have any strong feelings one way or the other.

 

What I do see is scumbags defend against accusations on other players who are townie- in such a case, the objective is to look "more correct" than the other player, and further drive a wedge between the player who is accusing, and his target, both of them townies. It's a way of keeping the fire going between townies, where agreeing with the accuser would also make the accused not like you, now the accused townie has a reason to appreciate you.

 

Or, they'll defend a fellow scumbag, and of course, when pressed on the reasons why, if they can't offer any, it looks pretty bad.

 

I can't really tell which is which here, but regardless of whether or not I'm correct about Nolder, NotBob's null stance on Nolder yet positive disagreement with me that Nolder is scum, indicates that NotBob is doing one of the above behaviors- defending a townie but not being able to articulate how you arrive at such a position, or defending a fellow scumbag, and not being able to explain why, so he insists that he's not saying that Nolder is a townie, but null.

 

I don't buy it and I don't think that's hardly ever a townie's behavior.

 

If I defend someone or disagree with the case against them, my reasons are hardly ever nonexistent, and my stance on that player isn't null either.

 

Can you spend several minutes looking into this and give me a second opinion, please AJ

If I catch a scum Nolder based on old fashioned analysis that quickly, good for me. But the seriousness of the charges is itself a catalyst for discussion. NotBob's position on the matter is very questionable and wouldn't be known unless I had made that initial case on Nolder and pushed it.

 

That's how little cracks get revealed, in my opinion. That's my theory, that's my approach. I don't have to nail the Nolder case right out of the gate, but the fact that there's stuff to agree or disagree on, and ask people why they feel that way, that is the beginning of real mafia play.

 

I don't want to wait for it to happen, I want it to already be happening, so that is what I've done so far.

 

If either Nolder or NotBob is scum, especially NotBob, that really validates this approach.

 

Is the issue rooted in the defense or how NotBob presented it?

[Shad_]

^ You can disregard that. You explained what I was going to lead towards later on.

[Shad_]

I haven't seen NotBob as scum except once or twice, and the most recent one I didn't even realize it was him until it was pretty much over with (on JetsNation).

 

As a villager though, I think he's fairly easy to spot. He's low-volume as either alignment from what I can tell, so I wouldn't say that's much of an indicator but the way he conveys his thoughts/reads is hard to miss.

 

We'll see how he progresses from here and I don't wanna write his defense for him, but as Pizza pointed out if Nolder or NotBob is scum then the hesitant read doesn't look so good for the other.

Mental note to go ISO him in Alien, because I didn't catch a distinct difference in Diablo. NB plays yolo popcorn mafia as both alignments in my experience.  He can be obvious town.  I tend to think of him as the male Hallia readability-wise.

[Shad_]

Also as of p12 Lenlo strongest town read.  If you're fooling me grats dude.

[Andrej]

Shad remind me later to link you to some games.

 

Off the top of my head check out BFG's American Gods game and Kaylee's Avatar for town games.

 

The scum game I have in mind is from a different site so I'll need to track it down later

[Shad_]

 

Cool, if you're around can you explain why you're looking for meta on NB but happy to go ahead with your read on Snow?

 

NB?

 

NotBob? Because NotBob's play so far has been closed, whereas John Snow's play has been open. I rely far more heavily on in-thread and this-game information with open players.

 

Closed players are ones that don't post often and don't post much when they do, and their reads and opinions are not fully developed or well-explained, or their interactions with other players are not substantial.

 

I can attempt to cold read John Snow, I couldn't begin to cold read a closed player with no personal history between us. Why I had to resort to digging through Nolder's old games given his participation thusfar. And NotBob is also at the top of my research list, given where I stand on him aorn.

 

I can see John's motivations and thought process, that's the difference between an open and closed player. I'm on the extreme end of being an open player. That's why it puzzles me that people want to rely on what they think my meta is. You should be able to read me from game to game, I'm not hiding anything and I'm readily available.

 

 

I understand NotBob being a 'closed' player.  What gave you the impression that this applied to Nolder at the time?

[Shad_]

 

0/3.  Some other day we will play "guess a movie that Shad has actually seen". 

Akira?

 

Now you're talking!

[Lenlo]

Also as of p12 Lenlo strongest town read.  If you're fooling me grats dude.

Im just happy im not an automatic D1 lynch anymore.

[Lenlo]

Just a heads up we have a little over 24 hours to decide on a lynch.

 

 

Vote Count
 
Snow (2) - Dice, AJ
Nolder (1) - Lenlo 
Lenlo (1) - Nol
Zander (1) - Snow
Thane (1) - Pizza
 
Not Voting - Zander, NotBob, Taborline, BFG, Thane, Shad
 
With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Deadline Wednesday 4 pm Pacific Time (GMT -8 hours)

 

Heres the current standings/most current VC. Nolder in front with a 4 way tie.

[Shad_]

 

I mean why aren't you all over him about AJ if you're going to call him dismissive about me?

Is that really your top concern with what I'm doing? Strange thing to pick at.

 

Just a heads up: I consider most consistency arguments to be hogwash. When cornered, mafiosi tend to try to find any inconsistency they can pick at, any uneven application of townie justice, and demand rigorous consistency.

 

It's a thinking process that is alien to townies, at least most of the time. At no point am I going to be concerned, this early on day one, that player A finds player B scummier than player C when both are exhibiting similar behaviors. We have one vote, and can chase one car at a time.

 

I'm all over NotBob, period. I've gone after him quite a bit. Critiquing me for not going after NotBob for something so very minor is... absurd, and really wrong.

 

Personally, I had made a mental note of this prior to Nolder raising the question. Can you tell me why?

[Shad_]

And yes I'm still back on p14.  Any time my wife tells me I can have the evening off I should know better than to assume she means more than an hour.  -_-