Diablo the mafia game!

dicetosser1 · December 4, 2015

Is low volume indicative of much from Tress?

One of the biggest things that struck me yesterday was that she only made two game-related posts all phase.

it means nothing. She gets busy at times. I have seen her say im busy with work and exhausted enuff to not blink anymore. Its not alignment indicative. Its just tress

sometimes she will get a bit of time where she gets active then she gets swallowed again. id say expect a period where she suddenly posts a bunch in a short space but then dont be surprised if she drops off a bit again

wrong about Lenlo.... AJ NK'd.... i'm getting a déjà vu from the matrix game all over....

*raises glass in honor of AJ*

Now... re-read, reassess (<- i hate that word, somehow).

And, hi all

dont go there cause i am NOT scum this time

Is low volume indicative of much from Tress?

One of the biggest things that struck me yesterday was that she only made two game-related posts all phase.

I'm not sure anyone here has played with Tress as mafia. Maybe Pral or BFG? I've seen her as serial killer once and I think she was maybe quieter than normal early on? But I don't remember.

As town, she's still not an overly active player. Less active than me, I'd say, but I certainly expect more than she's given so far.

But to be honest, I care more about what she's saying than how much. She has this weird problem where she says her thoughts without a filter, and she is kind of easily influenced by her emotions at times - makes it incredibly to tell she's town. I haven't seen anything like that.

pretty sure I have. ive at least played enuff with her to know that if i mod a game I only rand tress vig if i want to be the one she shoots.

dicetosser1 · December 4, 2015

Killed the thread.

Also, Dice and Bender are probably town. Still going to try to lynch Zander, just for the hell of it, though.

Dice is definitely town.

Dice

Tab

BFG

Thane

Bender

Yates

Clov

Tress

Pralaya

Notbob

Scum need to scumtell more imo. -_-

Going to remove Dice from my PoE

thats nice cause i aint removing you

Clovdyx · December 4, 2015

How was he a POE candidate, Zander? I know you and I have disagreed on him for most of the game, but it seemed like you genuinely had him as a strong suspect, not just left overs. Your reads list doesn't make it seem like you had enough people to really be POEing anybody.

Clovdyx · December 4, 2015

Is low volume indicative of much from Tress?

One of the biggest things that struck me yesterday was that she only made two game-related posts all phase.

it means nothing. She gets busy at times. I have seen her say im busy with work and exhausted enuff to not blink anymore. Its not alignment indicative. Its just tress

sometimes she will get a bit of time where she gets active then she gets swallowed again. id say expect a period where she suddenly posts a bunch in a short space but then dont be surprised if she drops off a bit again

wrong about Lenlo.... AJ NK'd.... i'm getting a déjà vu from the matrix game all over....

*raises glass in honor of AJ*

Now... re-read, reassess (<- i hate that word, somehow).

And, hi all

dont go there cause i am NOT scum this time

Is low volume indicative of much from Tress?

One of the biggest things that struck me yesterday was that she only made two game-related posts all phase.

I'm not sure anyone here has played with Tress as mafia. Maybe Pral or BFG? I've seen her as serial killer once and I think she was maybe quieter than normal early on? But I don't remember.

As town, she's still not an overly active player. Less active than me, I'd say, but I certainly expect more than she's given so far.

But to be honest, I care more about what she's saying than how much. She has this weird problem where she says her thoughts without a filter, and she is kind of easily influenced by her emotions at times - makes it incredibly to tell she's town. I haven't seen anything like that.

pretty sure I have. ive at least played enuff with her to know that if i mod a game I only rand tress vig if i want to be the one she shoots.

Then would you say what I said about her overall play is correct?

Shad_ · December 4, 2015

I'm about 2/3 through a WoT on you that I'm not sold on actually posting because most of it wavers around null anyway, but here's my big issue: I feel as though you did absolutely nothing whatesoever to try and formulate a read on Lenlo.

And I don't know, when someone has a go at me I tend to walk away from it with a relatively strong read one way or the other because it's an easy situation to ask loaded questions from. I know what I was actually thinking so I know what to ask to see if it's a misunderstanding or just scummy. I felt like you never really fired back or took advantage of the situation.

I don't think this is true at all. Yeah, I spent more time explaining MY position to him so that I could see him readjust, but saying I did nothing towards him isn't true at all.

First, "I'd" is clearly a typo. I have a hard time believing you couldn't figure that out from context, and...oh...I dunno. The F and D being right next to each other. But I digress.

You say that I sound unconcerned with his vote (which is a pretty accurate take on that post), but I'm being too defensive/reactive. It literally can't be both. Either I don't care that he voted me, or I care entirely too much. Which is it?

Beyond that, why do you find it odd somebody is reacting to actual gameplay? AJ's move was pretty much the first thing that mattered in the game. My job is, first, to figure out what his motivation is, so I can figure out if he's mafia or just misguided town. Second, to show MY thought process so everybody else can form reads about me.

I point out why his case doesn't fit and ask him to take a stance on what I was doing, and I directly ask him to explain his thought process on why the reaction was scummy.

First, "I'd" is clearly a typo. I have a hard time believing you couldn't figure that out from context, and...oh...I dunno. The F and D being right next to each other. But I digress.

You say that I sound unconcerned with his vote (which is a pretty accurate take on that post), but I'm being too defensive/reactive. It literally can't be both. Either I don't care that he voted me, or I care entirely too much. Which is it?

Beyond that, why do you find it odd somebody is reacting to actual gameplay? AJ's move was pretty much the first thing that mattered in the game. My job is, first, to figure out what his motivation is, so I can figure out if he's mafia or just misguided town. Second, to show MY thought process so everybody else can form reads about me.

Your unconcerned in your initial reaction, but later on you seem to be trying really hard to explain away AJs vote as nothing. Harder than I think you should. Like, your TRYING to come off as unconcerned when you actually are, you dig?

Its not that your reacting to it thats odd, its HOW you react to it.

I don't think I ever explained his vote as nothing? I explained why I could actually see him having some concern about me, so I don't see how that's "explaining it as nothing"; if anything, it's the exact opposite.

Bold - Okay, ignoring the seeming contradiction from your previous post, explain to me what you think is "odd".

Here I reply to where he "answers" my question without answering it, so I ask for further information. The top red wasn't really a direct question, but it certainly opened the door for him to explain.

First, "I'd" is clearly a typo. I have a hard time believing you couldn't figure that out from context, and...oh...I dunno. The F and D being right next to each other. But I digress.

You say that I sound unconcerned with his vote (which is a pretty accurate take on that post), but I'm being too defensive/reactive. It literally can't be both. Either I don't care that he voted me, or I care entirely too much. Which is it?

Beyond that, why do you find it odd somebody is reacting to actual gameplay? AJ's move was pretty much the first thing that mattered in the game. My job is, first, to figure out what his motivation is, so I can figure out if he's mafia or just misguided town. Second, to show MY thought process so everybody else can form reads about me.

Your unconcerned in your initial reaction, but later on you seem to be trying really hard to explain away AJs vote as nothing. Harder than I think you should. Like, your TRYING to come off as unconcerned when you actually are, you dig?

Its not that your reacting to it thats odd, its HOW you react to it.

I don't think I ever explained his vote as nothing? I explained why I could actually see him having some concern about me, so I don't see how that's "explaining it as nothing"; if anything, it's the exact opposite.

Bold - Okay, ignoring the seeming contradiction from your previous post, explain to me what you think is "odd".

Let me explain the bold in a way that should be obvious. Its not odd that you react to something. AJ threw a rock at you, you react to it. Fine, whatever. How you react to getting hit with the rock is whats worth looking at here. The rock AJ threw was his vote. Your reaction at first was a joking, haha, I hate you to. But then you start trying to figure out AJs vote rather than just say ASK HIM. but the only options you gave him were "To get the thread started" or "Im being abrasive and you might not like that". The way that was setup was like a pick one AJ, otherwise im gonna grill you cause the one you picked isnt a viable option. You pigeon holed him from how I see it.

Thing is, neither of those options make his vote one of substance. Neither of those options are very defensible as a case. By leaving him those options you basically dismiss his vote as nothing against your alignment cause well he either wanted thread reactions or hes just reacting to an attitude I have decided to adopt right before this game without telling anyone. Its not great.

Then go back and re-read.

Because you are wrong. I had no reason to ASK him, because he had already been asked. Taborline asked him directly what he didn't like. I said I had thoughts on the matter - which did - and I was going to wait until after he answered, specifically so I DIDN'T spoonfeed him an answer.

He gave the answer of "vibes" and then asked what MY take was. I told him what I had figured his mindset was. I never forced him to choose between one; I never said it HAD to be one of them. I said those were the two scenarios that I could have seen him reaching it as.

So your statement about me grilling him if he didn't choose one is objectively wrong, because he didn't...and I didn't.

These two work together, since I feel like I've pretty well demonstrated why I felt he was wrong. As in - objectively wrong; what he was saying didn't really jive up with the thread flow. So now that I've given him more information about my thought process, I tell him to go re-evaluate. This was so I could see if he would adjust his read at all or stay firm in his position.

He seemingly didn't bother with that. How am I supposed to take that?

Beyond that, I addressed my feelings on him yesterday closer to deadline, after AJ asked me where I thought we should lynch. If you're going to say "You never directly said Lenlo was scum" - you're right. All I did was call him the best option, vote for him, explain why I thought his vote looked scummy, and continue to refute what he was saying about me.

With the exception of "Okay, ignoring the seeming contradiction from your previous post, explain to me what you think is "odd"," I didn't really read these as questions in the traditional sense. Like "It literally can't be both. Either I don't care that he voted me, or I care entirely too much. Which is it?" comes off to me not so much as a question expecting an answer as a re-emphasis that Lenlo was objectively wrong. Maybe it's the way that the questions are encased in self-defense statements that rubbed me. But when I read red in isolation it comes off a lot better. I can hesitantly give you that.

Shad_ · December 4, 2015

And Yates, it looks like your record has ended.

lolololololol

Morning folks.

I peeked Tab last night after I realized her top two reads were Dice and Bender and that made no sense after they fooled everyone in Matrix Reloaded.

She's villa.

I understand your reasoning here but do you not think it would have been more beneficial to peek us or Yates to if anything else clear things up some?

If I got a dirty peek on Yates I could have never pushed it through without blowing cover. Town on either of you wouldn't have made me want to lynch the other, and town on you could be a wasted peek if you get lynched anyway. You were the counterwagon to a town lynch. If I got a dirty peek on you, yeah, I'm confident I could get you lynched without making it obvious. But ultimately I could do the same with Tab and I still think your slot can be resolved through Besie, Tab proved herself unreadable to me in Matrix.

Shad_ · December 4, 2015

Shad - to further answer your earlier question, the serial killer game I played with her, Tress had about 60 posts in a game of roughly 1,000. There might be a bit of style difference between her town game now that I'm reviewing it, but I don't put much confidence in a sample size of ONE (and it's worth noting she was under the impression there was mafia in the game so she was somewhat trying to scumhunt - but there wasn't).

Is there something that stood out to you to make you vote her?

Besides the feeling that she's skating by without doing much? No. I don't think Pral or NotBob will show up even if they have a vote on them. Tress has been around ~enough to notice.

Zander? · December 4, 2015

How was he a POE candidate, Zander? I know you and I have disagreed on him for most of the game, but it seemed like you genuinely had him as a strong suspect, not just left overs. Your reads list doesn't make it seem like you had enough people to really be POEing anybody.

Dice and Yates were my PoE, so I'm not following. And why I removed him should be obv. Am i missing something?

Clovdyx · December 4, 2015

It's your use of the term "PoE" that's giving my hang ups. It almost certainly means nothing towards your alignment (or his). It just seemed strange that you have two major candidates through "process of elimination" when you're really not eliminating that many from the pool.

December 4, 2015

What makes you more concerned about NotBob than Pral at the moment?

Hi Shad, sorry, I'm with my friend. Zander said you asked a question.

I'm not more concerned with him. I'm more annoyed with him. Because he asked whether I had posted yet and I've been posting since like page 3/4. And he didn't know we were Bender. It says we're bender in both the sign up thread and page 1.

Clovdyx · December 4, 2015

Shad - to further answer your earlier question, the serial killer game I played with her, Tress had about 60 posts in a game of roughly 1,000. There might be a bit of style difference between her town game now that I'm reviewing it, but I don't put much confidence in a sample size of ONE (and it's worth noting she was under the impression there was mafia in the game so she was somewhat trying to scumhunt - but there wasn't).

Is there something that stood out to you to make you vote her?

Besides the feeling that she's skating by without doing much? No. I don't think Pral or NotBob will show up even if they have a vote on them. Tress has been around ~enough to notice.

I can accept this. I'm looking forward to seeing what she has to say today :) overall but especially towards Bender and me.

December 4, 2015

Honestly Besie I think you just firmly removed your slot from my POE for today.

Where did this come from, Shad?

"MY TEAM" - meaning JUST Zander - is not advising me much. He DID however say that people tend not to vote for Yates early in game. Which, being a beginner, feels silly to me. If he is wolf, why are you all protecting him?

In the same breath: Clov has a point here:

Why is Yates that motivated to get rid of towns?

Replying to a couple things here. Obviously quote choppage, but it's not really relevant.

To the top part, first, Yates is a very good player - and he's not really the easiest to read, regardless of alignment. He's good enough as mafia to sound like town early on, and he's a fancy enough player that he'll do things as town that make him seem like mafia. I (and I assume most people) wouldn't say don't bother trying to read him or anything of that nature...he's just unlikely to be a solid candidate, so if he is mafia, you're probably better served trying to find his teammates early on.

Beyond that, I'm not sure exactly what you're getting at by saying people are protecting him. I'm assuming this is at least MOSTLY directed at me, given that you're replying to my post, but I actually had him as one of the people I wasn't feeling great about. If it was just a general "you all", that's different, but then who were you referring to? And what posts did you have in mind?

For the bottom, your point is bad. I understand why you might feel that way, but you're overlooking a very important aspect.

Oh, sorry Clov, no it's not directed at you. It's just me finding it strange that no one wants to or can be sure of him D1. From what I've been told, this is just a beginner problem. As you, and Zander, have told me: he's just that good.

Clovdyx · December 4, 2015

Honestly Besie I think you just firmly removed your slot from my POE for today.

Where did this come from, Shad?

"MY TEAM" - meaning JUST Zander - is not advising me much. He DID however say that people tend not to vote for Yates early in game. Which, being a beginner, feels silly to me. If he is wolf, why are you all protecting him?

In the same breath: Clov has a point here:

Why is Yates that motivated to get rid of towns?

Replying to a couple things here. Obviously quote choppage, but it's not really relevant.

To the top part, first, Yates is a very good player - and he's not really the easiest to read, regardless of alignment. He's good enough as mafia to sound like town early on, and he's a fancy enough player that he'll do things as town that make him seem like mafia. I (and I assume most people) wouldn't say don't bother trying to read him or anything of that nature...he's just unlikely to be a solid candidate, so if he is mafia, you're probably better served trying to find his teammates early on.

Beyond that, I'm not sure exactly what you're getting at by saying people are protecting him. I'm assuming this is at least MOSTLY directed at me, given that you're replying to my post, but I actually had him as one of the people I wasn't feeling great about. If it was just a general "you all", that's different, but then who were you referring to? And what posts did you have in mind?

For the bottom, your point is bad. I understand why you might feel that way, but you're overlooking a very important aspect.

Oh, sorry Clov, no it's not directed at you. It's just me finding it strange that no one wants to or can be sure of him D1. From what I've been told, this is just a beginner problem. As you, and Zander, have told me: he's just that good.

I don't understand this. You're saying that you were told nobody having a good read on him is a beginner problem? From who?

December 4, 2015

Lol no. The beginner problem is not knowing how good he apparently is.

Clovdyx · December 4, 2015

Lol no. The beginner problem is not knowing how good he apparently is.

He's okay.

Who are you interested in lynching today? I know you said you were okay trusting Zander's feelings on Tress, which was...not so great (but not the bottom). Are you two mostly in agreement on reads or do you have some notable differences?

December 4, 2015

Mostly agreement. I don't see anything scummy about tress except the things that shad has posted. (I'm on mobile so I'll go find it for you and post the quote separately).

Then ofc NotBob but I believe that might just be me being annoyed with his pure lack of any kind of attempt to even play this game. He didn't even read who the players are. I'm trying to decide whether he has a reason for that confidence.

December 4, 2015

Okay Clov, it's not Shad but actually your judgement on tress that I'm accepting at this moment.

Is low volume indicative of much from Tress?

One of the biggest things that struck me yesterday was that she only made two game-related posts all phase.

I'm not sure anyone here has played with Tress as mafia. Maybe Pral or BFG? I've seen her as serial killer once and I think she was maybe quieter than normal early on? But I don't remember.

As town, she's still not an overly active player. Less active than me, I'd say, but I certainly expect more than she's given so far.

But to be honest, I care more about what she's saying than how much. She has this weird problem where she says her thoughts without a filter, and she is kind of easily influenced by her emotions at times - makes it incredibly to tell she's town. I haven't seen anything like that.

And that is, for now, the only think I have to go on. I think my other half is going to look at her in depth for us.

December 4, 2015

I saw Tab is in our "probably town" list but I can't remember why that didn't bother me. I checked the little notes I have and she seems to jump around in thoughts a bit (post #482 vs #783). I know that's quite a gap and that I have changed my thoughts quite a bit too but I have nothing inbetween and very little before that. I asked Z-der to look into it for us too.

Clovdyx · December 4, 2015

Mostly agreement. I don't see anything scummy about tress except the things that shad has posted. (I'm on mobile so I'll go find it for you and post the quote separately).

Then ofc NotBob but I believe that might just be me being annoyed with his pure lack of any kind of attempt to even play this game. He didn't even read who the players are. I'm trying to decide whether he has a reason for that confidence.

Zander had me among his stronger town reads this morning. Last I saw, you made me think you weren't feeling so great about me, based on the interactions I had with Lenlo. There is no argument to be made now that him and I were bussing one another is teammates. Based on that, where do YOU stand on me?

Shad_ · December 4, 2015

I'm kind of annoyed by the lack of activity out of half of this game.

Shad_ · December 4, 2015

Basically I have to lock in my vote for the phase in like six hours and most players haven't checked in yet.

December 4, 2015

Honestly, clov, you are towny imo. I can try to find a reason why.

I guess it's mostly the fact that you're looking at everyone. From us and Dice on p8 to AJ on p14, to len in post #437 (p22), tab in post #442 (p23), bfg in post #647 (p33) and now tress on p45.

If I'm wrong, I'd were wrong, and you turn out to be scum, it's going to be quite hard for me to look for someone you did NOT at some point in time look at, or treated differently. Does that make sense?

I don't count absent AJ or nonchalant NotBob.

What are your thoughts on Sooh/Shad?

December 4, 2015

That weird "I'd" should be "if"

Shad_ · December 4, 2015

Oh ffs we have an extended DL for the weekend. There's still over 48 hours left.

December 4, 2015

And "we're", "not were".

Sorry, such a cliché but it's my phone's autocorrect.

Diablo the mafia game!

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