Ragnarok Game Thread - Game Over, Town Wins!

[Leelou]

We hate you too

Morning Cory

[Kivam]

VOTE COUNT

Eldrick (2) - Lenlo WISHLeste
Ocicat (4) - Tina, Dice, Eldrick, Mish
Pral (3) - KeyBOOSE, Leelou, Ocicat
Verbal (2) - Sili, Talya
 
Not voting (6): Songstress,  Verbal, Taborline, Pralaya, Sooh, John Snow

9 to lynch

DEADLINE IS NOON EASTERN (GMT - 4) ON WEDNESDAY. No Majority = No lynch
 

 

[Cory Caboose]

 

We hate you too

Morning Cory

 

 

Morning

 

need coffee :(

[Leelou]

 

 

 

We hate you too

Morning Cory

Morning

 

need coffee :(

Me too. I have to wait till the train gets to Boston though.

[wish-tree]

 

 

I was village hunting. Why? :3

I tend to just assume everyone is >>> villager when I am a wolf so I think it's sort of hilariously silly that you were villager hunting as Mafia

Cory - post 475 - "I generally play close to the chest"

You remember that thing I said to AJ in House of Cards about volition?

 

I find it pretty crazy that nobody realizes that I usually am 1000% more involved on the second half of d1 than the first in like every game I ever play. I like to see what people do of their own volition when a game starts, the "bully people into reactions early" element of my game is pretty much gone entirely because I don't think it's ever really helped me catch wolves

I had a feeling it was multiple scum teams, but I wasn't sure how many. That's why I was village bunting.

[wish-tree]

*hunting....

[wish-tree]

I hate hydras. Especially ones that don't communicate amongst themselves. Adding wishleste to my wtl.

<3 <3 <3

I see you have put us in a pocketto of shame.

[wish-tree]

Good morning. My involvement levels are hopefully going to be higher today, I want to do some ISOs on a few people (Ocicat, Wishleste, and Eld) who I've not really looked at in-depth so far.

Yay! Clear up your null-ness for me.

[wish-tree]

Also, I don't understand why it's bad to be disjointed, if we can make a decision in the end. As a slot and a hydra, we might think differently, but we do work together. It's just been difficult because both of us have been busy.

[wish-tree]

Time to shower and go to class. Byeee

[Eldrick4221]

Something bugged me about Sili during our convo yesterday. I went back to refresh my mind, and can't place it.

 

So ima put him back to null for now, cuz I know I had an uneasy feeling, but can't remember why.

[Eldrick4221]

Also, I don't understand why it's bad to be disjointed, if we can make a decision in the end. As a slot and a hydra, we might think differently, but we do work together. It's just been difficult because both of us have been busy.

The part that personally caught my attention is you have opposing views on me. You apparently think I'm scum and Celeste thinks I'm town.

[Pralaya]

So, yeah. Finally caught up with the entire game. Cory and Leelou voting me is not new :)

 

Has been said before. I don't play on weekend and I read the entire game before commenting on it. If the game goes 40-50 pages during the weekend, it is going to take a day or so to read the entire game. Yes, I did post when the game started but that was an inside joke. After that the weekend started.

 

Anyway, now I have caught up and will give my reads soon.

[Taborline]

ISO of Ocicat, pt. 1

 

Ocicat starts out with a vote for JS for being a bit “aggressive” in his lynch for editing joke. It’s an awkward vote on Oci's behalf, when JS was joking to someone who isn’t playing the game. I’d be more suspicious of JS had he said it against an active player. I think Ocicat was joking, but it reads bizarrely. ( Null )

 

Ok, here's your response, Sili. You have a case against me, namely, as I understand, that I have made one relevant but terrible post so far. You can lynch me over it, but I can assure you that would be a mistake. Or you can consider that the post in question was simply a regrettable error. You have this idea that I posted for the sake of activity, but have you entertained the idea that maybe I thought I saw something? Or would you still like to punish me for carelessness? I can't fight that, of course. So why didn't I respond and continue to talk? Perhaps because I recognized that line of thought was in error and saw no value in continuing. But, you say, there are plenty other things I could have commented on by now? Well then. I don't see them. Would you want to lynch me for not seeing the same things you say you do? Or if they're so clear to you, why not enlighten me? I will freely admit I wasn't paying enough attention, if you show me there's what I should have seen. Hm?

 

Really defensive post in answer to Sili’s casing him over that one post. “I can assure you that’s a mistake” is a weird statement to make when you don’t know your alignment, but I think this leans Town more than Scum/Loki, as it’s really early to be that defensive if you actually have something to hide (+ Town)

 

There is then the back and forth with Celeste and Sili. His posts here seem predominantly defensive, with some defense of Celeste as well. He pushes a tiny bit on Mish to Sili:

 

 

No idea what you're saying about mish and why i should react to her reads. I don't really care unless they are informative.

 

Her read was the opposite of yours, yet you didn't care that she seemed to be seeing something completely different than you?

 

 

But then defends her a little bit too (Null):

 

With Misheru's endorsement of Celeste, I feel it worth noting that Celeste had called on her specifically for thoughts before.

 

On page 30, Oci gives a statement on his method for playing the game:

 

 

Ocicat, what would you say that your strategy for this game is?

My approach in general, simply put: Look for contradictions, logic errors, and slips, point them out, and identify and eliminate scum.

 

 

Unvotes on page 33, and asks Dice what his opinion is on John Snow (who he had just unvoted):

 

Also, I'll admit, through all this. I've forgotten I should Unvote​.  ​

Dice, what about you? Do you still not like Snow?

 

Dice doesn't really answer, saying "Ocicat my votes staying where it is at this point." - which is on John Snow. Oci doesn't follow this up to ask Dice for a proper answer. And Oci's next post is this one on page 40:

 

Ok, I see a decent case, and I'm getting bored. Vote: Talya​, ​​although anyone on Sili's list is fair game​.

 

Of all of his Oci's behaviour, this is the post that sticks out as being worst to me. Citing his own statement earlier about finding scum, " Look for contradictions, logic errors, and slips, point them out, and identify and eliminate scum", this doesn't seem to be doing that. I dislike the lack of explanation about what is so decent about the case Sili has built on Talya, or why anyone on Sili's list is fair game. (+ Scum)

 

I agree with Sili's reasoning that she was halfhearted and contradictory in behavior. Additionally, she already has votes. If you're willing to vote and push your case against Verbal for poor content. And btw, going after those who have been absent and have said/done little is not the better course, as they can come in and do enough to look better, while Talya has been fairly active and yet has Sili's points against her. Going after people for bad content trumps going after those with little.

 

This is a bit better, but it still feels like Oci is relatively just following Sili as there's still not much explanation of his own as to why HE thinks Talya is worth going for.

 

If you're willing to vote and push your case against Verbal for poor content. I might join, I meant.

 

Again, more eagerness to follow.

 

 

 

I agree with Sili's reasoning that she was halfhearted and contradictory in behavior. Additionally, she already has votes. If you're willing to vote and push your case against Verbal for poor content. And btw, going after those who have been absent and have said/done little is not the better course, as they can come in and do enough to look better, while Talya has been fairly active and yet has Sili's points against her. Going after people for bad content trumps going after those with little.

 

I don't think all of Talya's content is bad. Voting someone because they "already have votes" sounds ten times worse than voting someone who has "low content" and therefore can "come in and do enough to look better".

 

What posts of hers do you think are halfhearted and contradictory? AFAICT most of what she was talking about with Leelou was her wondering why Leelou was coming at me so aggressively. Not that scum wouldn't defend a villager in that situation, but I still don't get what's contradictory about it.

 

Yes. My point is, out of the people who I would vote now, she has votes, and is the most lynchable. I will be busy tomorrow, and don't think I have the time to start a wagon myself. So I'm joining one I don't mind that's already there, but if you start another one I like more, I'll join that.

 

& I love you and it's fun to meet players I haven't played with before and I don't mean this to be rude

But if I get serious about lynching someone I am going to get them lynched if I have your "support" or not

 

I'm not ready for action or a lynch yet. I'm all for letting the players with low or insufficient content post more, but I don't think we should limit our range of lynch to "active" players and let others ~coast on doing very little. Lack of engagement or desire to engage isn't always a wolf tell, but for the vast majority of players you see it again and again.

 

lol. You're misreading me, and if I may, being a little arrogant. This is not about supporting you. This is about that if you like other cases more than Talya's, make them and start the wagon if you want me or anyone else to join. Yes, we should wait for the low-content players to get into the game, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't lynch today. And here's someone with a fair amount of content that has been pointed out as bad. Why shouldn't I lynch her, and who instead? Answer that with a case and vote instead of being passive-aggressive.

 

Blue: Again, avoiding giving any information with regard to what exactly about Talya makes him feel good about the lynch apart from her being the most lynchable/following Sili. (+ Scum)

 

Cory, you were misreading my post, not me, in that you said I was looking to "support" you. As to why I'm rushing, there's been a deadlock string of single votes for a while, it's finally been broken, the phase does have a deadline planned for tomorrow, and I'll be busy and will almost certainly miss it, so I'm doing what I can to contribute now.

 

Here there was the possibility of Oci voting and leaving, which can swing any way. If Oci is Town, and honestly trusts Sili, then leaving your vote on the train is fine if he really thinks Tal is Scum (though I'm not convinced of why he thinks this). If Oci is Scum and Tal is Town, he still looks relatively fine as he was only following a train, and if Oci and Tal are scum, he potentially looks quite good for getting in on it early. In the absence of a better explanation against Tal, I feel it leans scummier as I still don't believe his certainty about her. (+ Scum)

 

 

 

Cory, you were misreading my post, not me, in that you said I was looking to "support" you. As to why I'm rushing, there's been a deadlock string of single votes for a while, it's finally been broken, the phase does have a deadline planned for tomorrow, and I'll be busy and will almost certainly miss it, so I'm doing what I can to contribute now.

 

Kivam is setting a deadline tomorrow, the deadline is not tomorrow. Usually deadlines that are set are 3+ days from when they are set around here by DM "everything takes forever" standards.

 

And I wasn't saying I was looking for your support. I'm saying that if I decided it's time to make the tides move I'm going with or without you.

I'd love to see what you've concluded from the thread besides "x made a good case" or "why don't you make a case on x?"

 

 

Ok, understood.
And I'm saying that when you make the tides move, I might go with you, but not before. My point essentially was, if you're not ready to move on anything else, can you tell me why I really shouldn't have voted Talya, thinking that's what I had the time to do? And btw, even if the deadline tomorrow gives plenty of time, this phase is dragging on without showing much. The low-content players can come and talk whenever,​ but I think I see scum, and just as, if not more, importantly, I want the info that'll come out of acting on it. That way, I have more material to make more conclusions.

 

 

Still motoring against Tal, to a point which maybe leans Town now. If Tal flips Town, it does put Oci in a bad position of having made himself look like he's pushing so hard for her. (+ Town)

 

At this point he feels more null than anything, maybe leaning scum, on to part 2.

[Cory Caboose]

So, yeah. Finally caught up with the entire game. Cory and Leelou voting me is not new :)

 

Has been said before. I don't play on weekend and I read the entire game before commenting on it. If the game goes 40-50 pages during the weekend, it is going to take a day or so to read the entire game. Yes, I did post when the game started but that was an inside joke. After that the weekend started.

 

Anyway, now I have caught up and will give my reads soon.

 

[Pralaya]

Songstress - MOstly town vibe from her. Her catch up was straight forward and and I agree with some of her reads

Sili -I think his vote hopping thing in the beginning is a good indication that he is town. This is the Sili who figures out things and looks for reactions. The scum sili has some set things in mind and meanders with unfocused posts. I kinda agree with his reads too.

Keyboose [keyholder/cory hydra] - Cory started off with how he has been scum the last few games and since then his posts has been figuring out things - especially figuring out the towniness of players. This looks like town Cory to me. He is wrong about me but I can see where he is coming from (will address later). Key's posts have also seemed good so far.

Lenlo - Feeling a good vibe from him. I would want to see his votes and some flip before getting a read on him. Usually in D1 it is difficult to read Lenlo. Leaning town now.

Jon Snow - He seems to be as aggressive as the British Monarchy game. In the Usual Suspects game on D1, I could see a difference in his game style and I thought he was playing a bit scummy there. Which turned out to be true (everyone was scum but D1 nobody knew that). In this game, he is playing more like BM. Leaning town.

Leelou - Her usual schitck of "gunning for inactives" makes me feel she is town. She is more into finding mistakes and turning it back to accuse town when she is wolf. As in she puts more effort than this. I don't see anything much with the Verbal-Leelou-Cory thing early in the day

Verbal - NOt a lot to go with. Just that minor argument with Cory early in the game. Like me, he is not a weekend player and I can see that here as the main reason for his posts or lack of it.

Dicetosser - Other than his vote on Ocicat, I don't see anything substantial in his posts. Seems to me he is just there. At the same time, a wolfy dice would be more opportunistic which I don't see here. Null.
 

TinaHel - Few posts from her (more than me though !). Her opening post seems a bit hurried but I think it is more of a lack of time rather than anything. Null for now.

 

Eldrick - I have played one game with Eldrick where he was town. I am getting a similar vibe here. There was an theory that he could be Loki but that is irrelevant as of now. I think we can get more from him based on his votes and see how he goes. He voted for Sili  for vote hop thing, but that is a weak reason for a vote, but I can see where he is coming from if he is playing with Sili for the first time. Leaning town.

Taborline (mentored by Yates) - Not played with her before. So, don't have much experience on her meta. The thing that stands out is that she has some reads but has not voted anyone. Playing safe or unsure of what to do? Null.

Ocicat - Playing for the first time with him. He has some posts but since I don't know his meta, I don't see much in that. His vote on me though is interesting. But, as a new player, I can understand why he voted me. 

Wishleste [wishtree/celeste hydra] - Have played only one game with them. Frankly, I can't say much without seeing some flips and voting patterns. Null.

Sooh - Sooh has been just there. A minor conversation with Cory. Still has some good posts here and there. Null.

Talya - Her posts during the Leelou-Verbal-Cory conversation felt as if she was hedging and trying to look townie. I did not like her vote on Wish, which seems a bit sudden and not organic. Not sure but I am seeing something between Mish-Talya here - coincidences in reads, out-of-the blue conversations etc. I am leaning scum.

Mish - I don't feel really good about Mish, based on the handful of posts from her. Her vote on Len seems a bit forced and this was when Len was getting heat. Her conversation with Len looked like she was subtly nudging him as she was defending. My best bet for scum on D1.

[Taborline]

 

So, yeah. Finally caught up with the entire game. Cory and Leelou voting me is not new :)

 

Has been said before. I don't play on weekend and I read the entire game before commenting on it. If the game goes 40-50 pages during the weekend, it is going to take a day or so to read the entire game. Yes, I did post when the game started but that was an inside joke. After that the weekend started.

 

Anyway, now I have caught up and will give my reads soon.

 

 

 

[michellem]

Why do I keep having this feeling that no-one actually reads my posts?

 

 

 

 

 

The more I think about it, the worse I feel about Oci and Wisheste. In hindsight Celeste randomly calling me out feels weird... It wouldn't have bothered me if it was a player that was used to playing with me. But I'd already reminded people in the thread I wasn't gonna be on my normal activity this weekend. Makes it seem like she didn't really read my post. It was weird. That combined with she trying to make it seem like I said something I didn't... I feel very uncomfortable about her now.

 

Then with Oci several times linking me and Celeste, and him defending them, it makes it seem to me like they are mafia together, and he's setting me up to look bad if they get lynched.

 

I will refer you to the post Tina's already made instead of pulling the same quotes: http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/95348-ragnarok-game-thread-d1/?p=3538339

 

This does not read like town and town to me. It's either mafia buddies, or one mafia one Loki. But I'm thinking buddies.

 

Oci is the one that makes me feel most iffy for trying to tie me and Celeste together like that, so that's where my vote will go atm. But I'm more than willing to switch to Wisheste too.

 

[v] Oci[/v]

???

If we're scum buddies <3 (Oci and Celeste/moi), then why would you look bad if we get lynched? Wouldn't it give you town credit if you flip us and we're scum?

 

Also, hola. First day of classes over. I got some blisters from wearing slightly uncomfortable shoes. :/

 

Celeste has mod duties elsewhere, so it's my job to post atm. Sorry for being MIA. RL, etc.

 

 

If you are scum buddies, and one of you get lynched, it might look like I'm a team member with you. It won't now, because I've called you out on it. But if Tina hadn't drawn my attention to it, it would've looked quite bad.

 

Why aren't you worried about the fact that Oci is trying very hard to link us?

 

 

*snipped*

 

Also Celeste: I would prefer if you went back and figured out wich post you tried to say it was me who had made. I don't like that you don't double check your facts before stating someone said something. It doesn't sit well with me that you tried to shove an opinion on me I never made.

I thought it was you and with no post quote system here it makes it harder to look for facts. I will try and find it but it's going to take me a while. 

 

 

Why aren't you worried about the fact that Oci is trying to link us? In fact, why aren't you aknowledging my post at all?

 

Lynching wolves > Lynching villagers for "information"

I mean Ocicat COULD be a wolf and I am in no way saying he is a villager but I think he's = rand at worst and we'd mostly be lynching him because we don't understand him.

I want to lynch Pral or Verbal today.

 

I read your post, and I agree with parts, although not when it comes to Pral (i make a point about that later in my post). But I'm honestly more concerned with those people who actually do things badly than those that do nothing today.

 

Eyy btw, I'm going to go with my (paint) color theory for doing the mafia/town/3P sliding scale thingy.

 

Town----------------------------------------------------------------------Null-------------------------------------------------Mafia------------------------------------------------------Loki

 

Moi/Celeste, Lenlo, Key/Cory, Sooh, Tress, Sili, Leelou, Tina, Dice, Talya, Verbal, Mish, Pral, Tabor, Jon Snow, Ocicat, Eldrick, ??? (possibly Jon Snow, Pral, Mish, Talya? suspect lurkers of being Loki.)

 

I too wish you would have marked where each group ended. I would like to know why I'm suddenly in your bottom pile when I don't think you've even mentioned a read on me so far.

 

 

I have literally no idea how to hunt 3P besides hoping they are somehow generically wolfy in the same way wolves are

 

Just going to sort of hope we luck into killing him at some point or the wolves do it for us

I would think that the 3P would lurk. It looks like Mafia and town would be best served to get rid of him, which still (imo) is more advantageous for Mafia, because it takes the attention off of them.

 

 

A page or two before this you said you thought it was a bad idea to lurk inactives, and yet here you are planting the seed that Loki is amongst the inactives. Very handy considering the fact that you've now spammed enough to not be considered an inactive anymore.

 

 

Vote Pral with me.

I was coming to that anyway, although I hope this doesn't just stay as a tie. Vote: Pralya

​​​​​

​  

And to summarize what I was trying to post, Sooh, yes, that was a polished and crafted post, it was a defense against a valid point, not a free-flowing thought. Eldrick, I don't know any more than anyone else. Everyone knows their alignment. My point was that I couldn't defend my careless slip, but going after me would be an error.

 

 

And you neither aknowledge my post...

 

FYI: Ignoring me is just gonna make me all the more determined to shake answers out of you.

 

 

 

 

My issue with him is I have trouble not seeing him as town alot of the time. 

 

This doesn't sound like an issue to me

 

Tip to reading Cory: read him town, he's earned it

 

(I am 100% a villager this game for all you paranoid patricias, but tinfoil on so I can put you on my dartboard of people who've lost faith)

 

 

Im sold that cory is not MAFIA.  He does have Loki possibilities but I still think he is town

 

 

Vote Pral with me.

I was coming to that anyway, although I hope this doesn't just stay as a tie. Vote: Pralya

​​​​​

​  

And to summarize what I was trying to post, Sooh, yes, that was a polished and crafted post, it was a defense against a valid point, not a free-flowing thought. Eldrick, I don't know any more than anyone else. Everyone knows their alignment. My point was that I couldn't defend my careless slip, but going after me would be an error.

 

 

WHY ?

 

 

Why? Because a lynch is better than none. We could wait for a damning case and lose phases while the scum kill, or we could lynch someone that has suspicion on them. Pral has suspicion on him, it's a wagon I can see getting traction before the phase ends, and someone I actually townread is in favor of lynching him.  And now, his lack of response to being called out for being inactive hurt his case further. There was no attempt to show he'd be around when he might be needed later.

 

 

I don't understand those saying that Pral being here to read the thread but not answering is scummy... If he read the thread, he'd know he was getting heat. If he's not worried about looking bad, he won't be rushing to post. I say it's more a +town point in his favour that he wasn't rushing in to post.

 

Time to shower and go to class. Byeee

 

You answer several other posts, but refuse to do as Talya asked and define where your nulls ended and your scum reads began.

 

 

 

 

If no-one else can see how it's scummy that neither Wish or Celeste is worried about Oci's linking, Celeste's refusal to even aknowledge it, Wish' "lynching inactives are bad" turning into "we should look into inactives for Loki" after she's posted like crazy so that she couldn't be considered in inactive...

 

Cory said he wanted it answered who did anything. Wisheste has not done anything. Their reads are vague and contradictory, and the "my hydra partner is not being cooperate"-line is thin (and I used that exact one in TUS even though it wasn't true, to garner sympathy for my slot, so I do not trust it at all).

 

[unvote] [v]Wisheste[/v]

[Cory Caboose]

I read your posts Mish :(

[Verbal32]

 i actually had no problem with leelou poking at cory cause thats exactly what i thought she was doing. Im leaning town on leelou.

 

I didnt mind cory bringing the idea up once he explained why. Before that I was scratching my head and wondering about him. But the explanation made sense.

 

This is essentially what I did, but I'm taking crap for it.

 

 

 

 

 

@ Verb - I already explained it. She put it on record that she did not believe the mafia were able to talk for the four days between the role PM's going out and the game starting. I don't get why it would be logical to assume someone else is mafia because they did think that.

 

As for the teaming up as scum, it's true that you don't typically do that. In fact, your on-thread interactions are usually incredibly awkward when you're both mafia, and you're both well aware of it. Leelou seems to be quite sensitive about people using your on-thread interactions to read the two of you, so it's probably best if you don't try to appeal to that meta.

 

I'm not saying I am sold on you guys both being mafia, or even either of you. As I said, I need to finish rereading, and I wanted to put what I had so far out there so people can see what my current thought process looks like.

 

I assume this is about Celeste. She assumes things all the time (no parallel structure intended).

 

Interesting. We're looking at Leelou and Verb interaction to figure out who is scum?

 

Meta reads, I suppose. I think I'll stay away from this ship until one of the pair is flipped. Going to read some more posts.

 

 

 

@ Verb - I already explained it. She put it on record that she did not believe the mafia were able to talk for the four days between the role PM's going out and the game starting. I don't get why it would be logical to assume someone else is mafia because they did think that.

 

As for the teaming up as scum, it's true that you don't typically do that. In fact, your on-thread interactions are usually incredibly awkward when you're both mafia, and you're both well aware of it. Leelou seems to be quite sensitive about people using your on-thread interactions to read the two of you, so it's probably best if you don't try to appeal to that meta.

 

I'm not saying I am sold on you guys both being mafia, or even either of you. As I said, I need to finish rereading, and I wanted to put what I had so far out there so people can see what my current thought process looks like.

 

I'm not appealing to meta - I did say we are either both town or one of us is scum.  It is highly unlikely, due to that meta, that we would be this good in pulling off the Verbal/Leelou scum partners interaction.  We're both pretty ok at this game, but by god do we royally suck at being scum teammates, heh.

 

I'm leaving in the option that one of us could be scum.  It ain't me, but I don't see anything yet from Leelou to think it is her, either.  So that leaves the most likely scenario of us both being town (I'll go with that for now).

 

 

Sorry, don't understand why this isn't an appeal to meta, especially the part I underlined for you.

 

Besides that, I'll buy what you and Tress and the others say about the meta (but don't deny that it isn't meta if it is?).

 

 

I just feel that appealing to meta would be me saying I'm not scum - but I'm saying I'm not scum with Leelou.  I have not done enough by myself in this game yet to clear myself (obviously).  But I have done enough with Leelou to clearly show we aren't scummates.  That's essentially all I'm saying.

 

 

 

 

I can make sense of Talya being town now, so that's good, I guess... from a certain perspective.

 

[v]Verbal[/v]

 

Horrible horrible horrible outrageously bad posts, I saw. My current best guess for scum.

 

Loki candidates:

Eldrick, Talya, Ocicat.

 

Dude, I haven't even begun playing.  The only thing I really did was give an assist to poking Cory early on.  That's literally it.  And then I've had to defend myself a bit, but that stops now.

[Pralaya]

And here we go with Pral, whom pretty much nobody really wants to lynch because he is "inactive".

 

Here's the thing: Pral was here day 1. He knows this game exists, he posted in it; I'm not listening to the "Pral is always inactive Day 1 bit" because a lot of the time he's not on DM and never even knew the game started. Wherever he is at this moment, he knows the game is underway and it's not that hard to get on a computer for five minutes once every four days. Inactivity is something extremely easy for him to hide behind because it's "what he's known for", but Pral is not an apathetic villager. I know how the guy plays; I saw him in the Wind in the Door dead thread lamenting that his reads weren't great because he's typically a very strong thread reader; speaking of that game, he also was early in that game and had a notable lapse of absence; yet in his first arrival he already dropped 1-2 light reads on players (that were, IIRC, correct) because he cares about trying to figure things out. Here he didn't bother before dipping out for four days and now he's being giving invulnerability for ~being inactive and I would guess he's a wolf who is playing all of you for fools who won't lynch someone for "no information".

 

And let's say he is a villager. What happens on Day 4 when the game is on the line and he doesn't bother to show up? What happens when you are at must lynch and he doesn't bother to place a vote? How much are we losing in comparative value toward lynch a player that is active and involved and will be there in the game's crucial moments?

 

And I will say it outright: we have NO IDEA who the PRs are, so what if we lynch a village PR instead of Pral that would have used their actions and lucked into something good? If Pral can not show up for four days, how can we depend on him to actually send in NAs as a villager?

 

Statements like these are clearly stupid. Everyone knows that I have not missed a single NA during my entire time in DM. So, I have no idea what you are talking about or what you are trying to imply here. 

[Taborline]

 

 

Cory, you were misreading my post, not me, in that you said I was looking to "support" you. As to why I'm rushing, there's been a deadlock string of single votes for a while, it's finally been broken, the phase does have a deadline planned for tomorrow, and I'll be busy and will almost certainly miss it, so I'm doing what I can to contribute now.

 

Kivam is setting a deadline tomorrow, the deadline is not tomorrow. Usually deadlines that are set are 3+ days from when they are set around here by DM "everything takes forever" standards.

 

And I wasn't saying I was looking for your support. I'm saying that if I decided it's time to make the tides move I'm going with or without you.

 

I'd love to see what you've concluded from the thread besides "x made a good case" or "why don't you make a case on x?"

 

 

Ok, understood.

And I'm saying that when you make the tides move, I might go with you, but not before. My point essentially was, if you're not ready to move on anything else, can you tell me why I really shouldn't have voted Talya, thinking that's what I had the time to do? And btw, even if the deadline tomorrow gives plenty of time, this phase is dragging on without showing much. The low-content players can come and talk whenever,​ but I think I see scum, and just as, if not more, importantly, I want the info that'll come out of acting on it. That way, I have more material to make more conclusions.

 

 

The level of eagerness to obviously be on a wagon still could be Town, or a scum double bluff, but not strong enough for me to know for certain.

 

Can someone tell me why I'm the only one who this forum seemingly doesn't want to let post? I'm busy most of the day, finally put together a post of everything I want to reply to and what I have to add myself, when the forum glitches and eats it, and the Autosave just taunts me by doing nothing. Just lynch me.

 

I understand your frustration, Oci, I've had a hell of a time getting multiquotes to work properly, but it would still be nice to see more actual content from you, even if it's without the multi quotes.

 

 

Vote Pral with me.

I was coming to that anyway, although I hope this doesn't just stay as a tie. Vote: Pralya

​​​​​

​  

And to summarize what I was trying to post, Sooh, yes, that was a polished and crafted post, it was a defense against a valid point, not a free-flowing thought. Eldrick, I don't know any more than anyone else. Everyone knows their alignment. My point was that I couldn't defend my careless slip, but going after me would be an error.

 

 

Again, wagoning without specific reasons.

 

...No, I don't care if I seem to be flip-flopping, Pral's here. Unvote​

 

Confident, jokey? Pral IS here, you gave him a little bit of time to post, and then this:

 

 

 

...No, I don't care if I seem to be flip-flopping, Pral's here. Unvote​

???

Where, lol

 

 

I went to check the main page for a second, and Pral was on and looking at the thread. They left without posting, however. Vote: Pralya​ and this one sticks

 

 

Even after Pral posts, if he does?

 

 

 

 

My issue with him is I have trouble not seeing him as town alot of the time. 

 

This doesn't sound like an issue to me

 

Tip to reading Cory: read him town, he's earned it

 

(I am 100% a villager this game for all you paranoid patricias, but tinfoil on so I can put you on my dartboard of people who've lost faith)

 

 

Im sold that cory is not MAFIA.  He does have Loki possibilities but I still think he is town

 

 

Vote Pral with me.

I was coming to that anyway, although I hope this doesn't just stay as a tie. Vote: Pralya

​​​​​

​  

And to summarize what I was trying to post, Sooh, yes, that was a polished and crafted post, it was a defense against a valid point, not a free-flowing thought. Eldrick, I don't know any more than anyone else. Everyone knows their alignment. My point was that I couldn't defend my careless slip, but going after me would be an error.

 

 

WHY ?

 

 

Why? Because a lynch is better than none. We could wait for a damning case and lose phases while the scum kill, or we could lynch someone that has suspicion on them. Pral has suspicion on him, it's a wagon I can see getting traction before the phase ends, and someone I actually townread is in favor of lynching him.  And now, his lack of response to being called out for being inactive hurt his case further. There was no attempt to show he'd be around when he might be needed later.

 

 

And these posts leave me nowhere new from my first part of ISO on you. I don't think I'm ready to vote for you yet as you might be drawing too much attention to yourself to be Scum, and I'll be keen to see what you do tomorrow.

[Cory Caboose]

My wolves are probably correct.

 

I get at this point that nobody cares about actually listening to my reads until post-game or after I die or whatever

 

But I'm here now and telling you I think I'm 2/2

 

So, uh, keep ignoring them and voting other people instead

[michellem]

Talya - Her posts during the Leelou-Verbal-Cory conversation felt as if she was hedging and trying to look townie. I did not like her vote on Wish, which seems a bit sudden and not organic. Not sure but I am seeing something between Mish-Talya here - coincidences in reads, out-of-the blue conversations etc. I am leaning scum.

 

Mish - I don't feel really good about Mish, based on the handful of posts from her. Her vote on Len seems a bit forced and this was when Len was getting heat. Her conversation with Len looked like she was subtly nudging him as she was defending. My best bet for scum on D1.

Red: So if someone ever has roughly the same reads they are mafia together? I didn't know that, I feel so enlightened now.

Bolded: explain plz

 

Green: Defending who ?

I'd also like you to comment on the rest of my play, I have more than those 2-3 posts you know.

 

I read your posts Mish :(

 

Yet you do not comment on them or take them into consideration :( I dunno. I feel like the Oci/Wisheste situation was pretty important but not a single soul has commented on it.

[Cory Caboose]

Statements like these are clearly stupid. Everyone knows that I have not missed a single NA during my entire time in DM. So, I have no idea what you are talking about or what you are trying to imply here. 

 

If we have a 48 hour night phase on Saturday/Sunday would you get your NA in?

 

Serious question