Hangar 18 [BASIC GAME] Game over! Scum win. Nolder & WBK.

[Nolder]

 

Your never-ending disbelief of my claim is one of the things that made me choose to vote you in the first place.

 

The fact that you continually imply there is absolutely any reason to believe your claim is the biggest reason why I don't believe your claim.

 

Out of the six possibly set-ups we have, there's a Doc in four of them.

 

And, as mafia, you'd want to get rid of the doctor at all costs. That includes putting one of your own on the line to fish for a counter claim. As there has been no doc claim either I think we got a 100% vanilla game. I wonder if perhaps that was Peace's intention all along and all the other setups were not actual possibilities of happening. Whatever the case may be the fact there is 4/6 chance to have a doc doesn't prove you are the doc. Again, it's acting like these things should clear you is exactly why I don't believe you.

 

 

You discredited my claim from the get-go.

 

I didn't discredit it. I simply called you out on a terrible reveal. I was still operating under the assumption that you were town at the time although I admit your claim made me extremely wary from that point on.

 

 

If it was a fakeclaim, it would have been suicide to claim when I did; if I were mafia I wouldn't have any idea if there was a doc out there or not, the odds weren't good.

 

It's a high risk high reward gambit for sure but it's not clear cut suicide. You claimed and didn't get a counter. Your gamble payed off. 

 

 

You were also awfully quick to discredit the possibility that mafia had only even-night kills,

 

That's because it would be bastard modding. This is a basic game. If Peace kept something like that hidden from players during sign ups, especially when he was presenting open setups, that would not be right. Either Peace is a bastard mod or your idea holds no weight and is just plain wrong. The latter seems more likely by a landslide to me.

 

 

and you've been pushing cases all over the place,

 

Meanwhile everyone else is just sitting back. Great game, lots of fun.

Sarcasm about everyone else's lack of activity aside I thought you wanted to hear my cases?

 

 

but most notably pushing way hard on Darthe all the way since D1.

 

Because he's been scummy since day 1. He pushed on Hallia for no reason and has been flipping his story and his "suspicions" around ever since. You can't honestly tell me you think he's town after reading everything I've pointed out. Did you even read my case?

 

 

Right now I sit with the feeling that it's because you knew he would be your biggest threat.

 

I've always felt Red is my "biggest" threat in games regardless of alignment because of the way we always butt heads but whatever. You feel what you feel I guess. If I was mafia and I thought Darthe was a threat I'd just NK him and call frame job if anyone accused me. It's pretty standard mafia.

 

 

 

I might be horribly wrong; but you are even more wrong; I am not mafia, I am town Doc.

 

Your actions tell me otherwise.

 

 

Also Kronos, your following of Nol is noted, and will be brought back if he flips scum.

I agree. He didn't even say anything which is extremely troubling. Makes me nervous that I'm just dead wrong about everything and it's really two lurkers that have been scum all game. If that's true though I wont even feel very bad. Darthe has played a terrible game IMO regardless of alignment and deserves the vote on him. If we lose to lurkers I blame everyone else who got mad at the idea of policy lynching and basically shouted me down. That's on you guys not me. 

[_CLOUD]

I'm still here. I'll catch up when I get home this evening. 

[michellem]

Beleive what you want. I know what my role PM says, and you will eat those words when I die/game ends.

[Nolder]

That very well may be but your arguments are still bad. Do you not see how it looks to someone else when you try to present yourself as clear...when you aren't?

[michellem]

I'm trying to argue my side, because you do not seem willing to listen to me at all. It gets extremely frustrating for me when you're not even inclined to listen. I'm not expecting you to treat me like a confirmed townie, but at least give me the respect like treating me like I'm a person who can think for myself and not be led by anyone; and to at least pretend like you're willing to consider that I'm telling the truth.

 

 

 

And look how you've conveniently turned the attention off yourself and onto me again.

[Nolder]

1. There is no reason to consider you're telling the truth because we can't prove it either way. I could tell you I'm a trillionaire, do you believe me? Same thing. You claimed doctor (for no reason) and when I questioned why you claimed and the claim itself you got extremely defensive over it. Sure maybe you're telling the truth. But how am I supposed to know that? You aren't the worst offender but you weren't exactly the most active player either. And as we haven't lynched scum yet I can't actually tie you to any scum hunting. So in my eyes you look just as innocent/guilty as anyone else. Your claim does NOTHING to clear you. Nothing at all. So acting like it should is going to get you no where. You can say I have my mind already made up and other such things all you want but what it comes down to is you feel like your claim should give you some kind of standing and it just doesn't.

 

2. Turned attention off myself? How so? I addressed everything you said both about me and yourself.

[Darthe]

1 Mafia Goon, 1 Mafia Roleblocker, 1 Sane Cop, 1 Sane Doctor, 5 Townies

1 Mafia Goon, 1 Mafia Roleblocker, 7 Townies

2 Mafia Goons, 1 Sane Cop, 6 Townies

2 Mafia Goons, 1 Sane Doctor, 6 Townies

2 mafia Goons, 1 Sane cop, 1 Sane Doc, 5 townies

1 mafia goon, 1 mafia roleblocker, 1 sane cop or doc, 6 townies.

 

Possible setups here.  Nobody has claimed cop to this point.  Any idiot claiming cop is lying at this point because it serves no advantage to not do so yesterday or at daybreak.  It is Lylo after all.  Wbk, that was a disgusting play on your part with no evidenciary support or backing statement.  You essentially said screw it and just threw in with Nolder, so when he dies you're probably too linked to excape that.

[Nolder]

Did you have a point with all that setup talk just now?

[Darthe]

Actually yes.  You state that there is a fake doctor in this game and that is your justification for practically everything to do with Mish or I at this point.  

 

You also have avoided my questions but that is for later.  

 

Out of the six setups available only one has no cop or doctor.  Just one.  And it happens to have a mafia roleblocker.  Why would it need one of those if there were no power roles?  The answer is that it wouldn't, it is a false setup intended to keep us from knowing the real setup of the game, as are several of the others.  

 

If you think mish is lying then why are you not encouraging a case on her or justifying your reasoning?  

 

The answer is that you cannot validate it.  Your theory is built on shambles and the idea that you can convince the clueless newbies into following you through sheer force of personality over logic.  

 

Answer me this new guys, do you really know why you're voting?  Have you honestly considered this?  If the two mafia weren't already on me cloud would hammer right now.  I am actually impressed that he hasn't.  

 

Nolder didn't need to make a case on Hally.  Nolder intends to NK her because she is the least telling and because almost everyone has a town read on her now.

 

Nolder didn't want to draw more attention to WBK, just wanted to link himself and hope that with 3 votes on me they could convince cloud or mish to vote me through pressure to see this finished.

 

Nolder has mentioned three people today, and one of them is the only claimed power role in the game.  He has cased the hell out of the other two and seeing that you are not fighting him he is growing more bold. He has grown too bold and told WBK to vote me.  This is the mafia's final play, their big push.  This was their mistake, and how I know the truth now.  

 

Hallia, Cloud.  Will you fall, or are you going to rise to the challenge?

[_CLOUD]

Nonetheless we aren't going to lynch me because of two things.  One, I heartily know my alignment.  The only two people truly pushing for my lynch are you and Nol but you aren't biting Cloud.  Why not?  Your play seems rather rushed and unfocused here, as if you're waiting for another 1 or 2 to vote me.  

 

I don't much care how you answer that, we knew that not having a cop was a crux.  Hell, if I was scum I would have claimed cop a day ago and finished this game with a merry sweep.  

 

More importantly than the thousand things I could have done if I had been intentionally doing all of this crappy town play (or good scum play), I am currently voting for no lynch.  None of you have commented on that for more than an instant.  

 

Why?  It is pretty pivotal.  Can nobody come up with a negative reason for me to do so?  Probably not, because there is no town disadvantage.  So instead feel free to bury it in walls upon walls of text.

 

But Nolder doesn't want to go through all of that effort for a win.  He is begging you guys to vote me now and save him from having to work for it, and you have to give itt to him.  He has worked very hard.  Honestly, if Cloud and WBK were the mafia I would have been ticked at their lack of effort.  Not that it isn't possible but I am seeing a large last second push from Cloud and Nol, openly linking themselves now.

 

Oh, and lets remember that since this day has started Cloud has added almost half of his post count. (11 of 41, which was 30 before).

 

 

Yeah.  Read that last line again.

 

Oh, and when we do go no lynch the only safe mafia kill is Hally.  Would anyone care to know why?  Mish is protected, I am walking WIFOM and protection for Nol, WBK and Cloud are protection for one another (strongly leaning that WBK is protection for cloud now).  Mafia will put is back in this position with 3 to lynch instead of 4.  But we get a day to think things through.  

 

If not we vote cloud and use that to bury Nol.  I will not be sad to lose to him this time.  I only regret hammering Red instead.

 

I don't find my play to be rushed or unfocused. I wanted to give everyone the chance to present their cases, instead of just speedlynching someone. I already gave my own reasons why I'm voting against you. 

 

 

Nonetheless we aren't going to lynch me because of two things.  One, I heartily know my alignment.  The only two people truly pushing for my lynch are you and Nol but you aren't biting Cloud.  Why not?  Your play seems rather rushed and unfocused here, as if you're waiting for another 1 or 2 to vote me.  

 

I don't much care how you answer that, we knew that not having a cop was a crux.  Hell, if I was scum I would have claimed cop a day ago and finished this game with a merry sweep.  

 

More importantly than the thousand things I could have done if I had been intentionally doing all of this crappy town play (or good scum play), I am currently voting for no lynch.  None of you have commented on that for more than an instant.  

 

Why?  It is pretty pivotal.  Can nobody come up with a negative reason for me to do so?  Probably not, because there is no town disadvantage.  So instead feel free to bury it in walls upon walls of text.

It seems pretty pointless to me. First of all because I am utterly convinced you are mafia but I'll put that aside and humor you. We no lynch and then what? Let's say the mafia doesn't kill again. Ok...so...we no lynch again? We could keep doing that hoping they'd give in and make a kill but there is no guarantee that would ever happen, thus wasting our time. Your big plan is IF that somehow happens we...win? No. It gets a little bit easier because a suspect is eliminated leaving us in 5 man lylo instead of 6 but that is no guarantee of a win either. Or maybe that doesn't happen and they keep no killing (which seems much more likely to me since you seem infatuated by this scenario). In that case Peace steps in. You seem to be pushing the idea that he will just end the game in a draw. I find it much more likely that he'll either force the town to lynch or the mafia to kill in which case we're back to being either in the exact same situation we are right now or one that is slightly better but still no guaranteed win. But let's say he does just end the game. Is that really how we want to end it? On a draw? Maybe that's what you want since you see your chances of winning after my case are extremely low (tooting my own horn? aww yeah) but I for one see victory in our grasp and I want it. Otherwise I see this game as a load of wasted time. Even if beyond all reason you've just played the worst game of your life and you're town and we lose. I'm ok with that. I'll applaud the mafia on their victory and move on. A "draw" would leave a sour taste in my mouth though and I hope everyone else agrees.

 

This. 

 

@Nolder's case against me: My response against Kronos was indeed excessive. I thought that his post was very scummy when I responded to it, but when I read it back the next day I came to the conclusion that it wasn't really that big of a deal. I believe that I also made this clear in a previous post where I said that it wasn't really a big slip up. Me defending Hallia didn't really have much to do with her gameplay, I was just against Darthe for pushing her around. 

[_CLOUD]

Actually yes.  You state that there is a fake doctor in this game and that is your justification for practically everything to do with Mish or I at this point.  

 

You also have avoided my questions but that is for later.  

 

Out of the six setups available only one has no cop or doctor.  Just one.  And it happens to have a mafia roleblocker.  Why would it need one of those if there were no power roles?  The answer is that it wouldn't, it is a false setup intended to keep us from knowing the real setup of the game, as are several of the others.  

 

If you think mish is lying then why are you not encouraging a case on her or justifying your reasoning?  

 

The answer is that you cannot validate it.  Your theory is built on shambles and the idea that you can convince the clueless newbies into following you through sheer force of personality over logic.  

 

Answer me this new guys, do you really know why you're voting?  Have you honestly considered this?  If the two mafia weren't already on me cloud would hammer right now.  I am actually impressed that he hasn't.  

 

Nolder didn't need to make a case on Hally.  Nolder intends to NK her because she is the least telling and because almost everyone has a town read on her now.

 

Nolder didn't want to draw more attention to WBK, just wanted to link himself and hope that with 3 votes on me they could convince cloud or mish to vote me through pressure to see this finished.

 

Nolder has mentioned three people today, and one of them is the only claimed power role in the game.  He has cased the hell out of the other two and seeing that you are not fighting him he is growing more bold. He has grown too bold and told WBK to vote me.  This is the mafia's final play, their big push.  This was their mistake, and how I know the truth now.  

 

Hallia, Cloud.  Will you fall, or are you going to rise to the challenge?

 

Vote Darthe

 

[_CLOUD]

The two mafia players aren't on your case because you are mafia. 

[_CLOUD]

Ok I'm really excited to hear the results of this lynch.. Cause I could have just ruined the whole game with my last vote.. 

[Darthe]

You did.  I'm town.  I sucked this early game but dear god you newbies screwed this last one. (No knocks on the mafia, I know you both did pretty well, especially towards the end).

[_CLOUD]

-_- 

 

Sorry dude. 

[Darthe]

No prob.

 

Well done WBK and Nol (pretty sure).

 

Nol, that was played on a knife edge man, I did not expect that but it worked!

[WolfbrotherKronos]

That's a hammer so I might as well say it. Darthe's on the money. With the game being over I had a few things I wanted to say.

 

I've played several games and have come to the conclusion that mafia isn't really for me. One of two things happens every game.

 

1. It's slow and I don't know what to comment on.

2. It's too fast and I can't keep up, so I get confused.

 

Either way I tend to be lurky. This I am not an asset to my team. Nol and Darthe both have commented on the slowness of games and I've realized I'm a part of the problem not a part of the solution. I also I find I enjoy reading the games, but as I said before, posting is hard sometimes, because I can't separate my thoughts and make sense of it. This I've decided to take a pretty big break from playing games. This isn't on any of you. It's on me. With that - a few more words

 

1. @peace - I'm sorry if I've made your game unenjoyable for any of the players here

2. @nol - I was a terrible teammate and I apologize. I take no credit for this win.

3. @everyone - I'm sorry if I made this game unenjoyable for you. You guys deserve to have fun games.

 

With that in mind, I'm taking a break from playing. I don't know if this is permanent or temporary, but I've already got a mafia game I'm running in que. since I like following along with games, I'm still going to mod it and see I that's something I really enjoy.

 

Thanks for listening and good luck in your future scum hunting,

 

Kronos

[Nolder]

No prob.

 

Well done WBK and Nol (pretty sure).

 

Nol, that was played on a knife edge man, I did not expect that but it worked!

Good game. It was definitely a tight win. Honestly I didn't think we were going to pull it off because your idea with no lynching was perfectly logical (unlike a lot of your other plays but I'll get to that) and we were at a disadvantage I felt. If we killed ANYONE it would lead to either me or WBK on the chopping block. Fun fact we didn't no kill last night we shot at Mish thinking that if she wasn't self protecting she was the only safe kill and if she was self protecting it was essentially a no kill which was fine with us.

 

Anyway as for your play. A lot of what I pointed out was true if put harshly. I thought your push on Hallia was extremely illogical and I still don't understand it tbh, That said you had me nailed several times but then you flipped it and called me town. Not sure why but either way it had me scrambling the whole game. Next time trust your instincts more. Even if you're second guessing yourself try to stick with pressure on someone unless you have a good reason to switch. By switching on and off me all game you hurt your credibility a lot. If your play was a little tighter I don't know what I would have done this game.

[_CLOUD]

Well Mish could have still gotten lucky with a protect this Night, so technically it wasn't really over. 

 

And don't worry about it Kronos! 

[WolfbrotherKronos]

Oops..

[Nolder]

FYI though game isn't technically over and we could still lose

We have to outguess Mish but either way I am done playing so if we get blocked...I am ok with losing lol

Getting Darthe lynched was all the victory I wanted this game.

[Nolder]

Mish: What I said before still stands. Your reveal didn't help the town. That said I was harsher on then necessary because I had to cast a lot of doubt and paint you as Darthes partner which was a hard sell.

[WolfbrotherKronos]

Yeah. This is the kinda thing I'm talking about

[Darthe]

I have to agree man, you guys did a grand job of making me second guess myself.  WBK, no need to leave man just put yourself out there more.

 

Honestly, if he had been more vocal I wouldn't have had as much self doubt so in this case I thought that it was planned and it worked well.  Lol Nol you must have panic'd when it was me, you, or red.

[michellem]

I knew it.