Talene breached her commitment to DO

[jsbrads]

During the investigation for Black ajah, they found Talene, who refused to "retake" oath and they put her on the Chair and basically tortured her, until she decided to forgo her oath to DO, but her life wasn't threatened, so she betrayed DO without reaching the day of her death.

[rand4747]

removing the oathes is not forbidden so once they are removed she can do whatever she wants

[jsbrads]

yeah i thought of that, thats why Galina's oath to Sevanna et al was not a breach, because she wasn't exposing herself to non-black ajah

But Talene knew that immediately after releasing her vows she would betray DO, so the act of releasing was an act of betrayal

 

If a Black Ajah wanted out, and she found a binder and used it to release her vows while alone that would not be a betrayal

[rand4747]

intending to betray is not betraying. It will stop you doing the betrayal itself if you have the oaths still but not want you intend to do after.

[Barid Bel Medar]

Yeah. It is a matter of technicalities. Like we saw with Verin and we see with the lying oath.

 

Release from the oaths is not an act of betrayal, thus, it can be done.

 

Even though Talene knew it would lead to betrayal, the act itself was not a betrayal, and thus doesn't count.

 

It just meant she COULD betray, which is not forbidden on the Oaths.

[Darksmoon]

I believe that Verin mentions she tried to find the Oath Rod so that she wouldn't have to poison herself to convey the info to Egwene.

[Mulk]

even if you think Talene's oath should have held her against foreswearing (not sure I do, though I'm not against the idea entirely), the exact phrasing given by Verin leaves some leeway so that if she feels bad enough that she thinks she is dying or will die shortly, she could do it. Given how long she holds out against the the Chair, that might be the case.

[jsbrads]

Even Verin is different than Talene, Verin wasn't captured, forced to betray DO, she could have removed oaths and not betray

[Maleshub]

The BA trinity is just as loopholed as the AS 3 oaths. They are far from foolproof methods to ensure loyalty or whatever. Liandrin was bound by the Shadow's oaths; but that didn't stop her from disobeying and working against Moghedien. The trick is in justifying the action to suit the oaths, pretty much what Verin did to Elza and other BA sworn to Rand.

[jsbrads]

Black Ajah doesn't have any oaths to protect chosen. They are supposed to be selfish, serve DO (very loopholy) and don't betray darkfriends to light, every meeting between chosen is a potential murder and they know it

Elza's oath in that context wasn't violation because she thought DO would like to fight Dragon at last battle...