What characters does Brandon Sanderson write the best?

[safwd]

I agree that Brandon did not write Mat as well as RJ. I have stated that it is my opinion that RJs favorite character was Mat. Brandon's was clearly not.

But i never read any of the dialog as awkward and contrived, perhaps i'm just a dumb redneck but whatever the reason I have greatly enjoyed the last few books.

[Luckers]

I agree that Brandon did not write Mat as well as RJ. I have stated that it is my opinion that RJs favorite character was Mat. Brandon's was clearly not.

But i never read any of the dialog as awkward and contrived, perhaps i'm just a dumb redneck but whatever the reason I have greatly enjoyed the last few books.

 

I actually think Brandon loved Mat--as he dreamt him up. He thought he was the perfect outlet for some writer-wit--which its very clear that Brandon LOVES doing. Alloy of Law is nothing but contrived witty banter debates in between matrix style action scenes.

 

That being said, safwd, have you re-read them? I barely noticed a lot of the awkward and clunky writing or dialogue in my first read because I was so caught up in plot-revelation. Going back, though, I struggle.

[safwd]

I agree that Brandon did not write Mat as well as RJ. I have stated that it is my opinion that RJs favorite character was Mat. Brandon's was clearly not.

But i never read any of the dialog as awkward and contrived, perhaps i'm just a dumb redneck but whatever the reason I have greatly enjoyed the last few books.

 

I actually think Brandon loved Mat--as he dreamt him up. He thought he was the perfect outlet for some writer-wit--which its very clear that Brandon LOVES doing. Alloy of Law is nothing but contrived witty banter debates in between matrix style action scenes.

 

That being said, safwd, have you re-read them? I barely noticed a lot of the awkward and clunky writing or dialogue in my first read because I was so caught up in plot-revelation. Going back, though, I struggle.

I have read TGS 3 times and ToM twice.

I reread them to see if i could see the things posters on here were discussing as "un WOT like"

And i did see alot of them on the reread, but they still didnt affect me much.

Brandon is just a different kind of writer than RJ. After reading his books i really dont know why they picked him for the job.

The style of the last 2 books is quite a bit different but the feel of them is the same for me. I recognize all the characters from when RJ was writing them so i dont really care if a few things are different. Like Mat losing some of the maturity he gained.

I guess i just didnt expect them to read like they would have if RJ wrote them so it didnt bother me when they didnt.

I am just glad that we will have the final book in 7 months or so. It has been a long journey for me with these books. I was reading them during the multi years waits between books.

I will hate for the story to be finished but i cant wait to see how it all pans out.

[TheAngryDruid]

I liked Perrin in ToM a lot. And think Eggy in tGS was wonderful as well. Also thought Galad and Faile were really well done. As were the Avi chapters.

 

I didn't like the Mat chapters at all. Too silly. Agree about his bias affecting Cadsuane.

 

Haven't seen enough of Rand post VoG to tell.

[safwd]

So was Mat with the "bag o badger" RJ or BS.

I loved it because it brought it all back to the beginning.

[TristanWebb]

The badger read as fan fiction to me, like someone picking out a specific detail and putting it in to try for authenticity, whereas most original authors tend to have big pictures floating around.

 

Though it was amusing.

[Vardar]

The badger read as fan fiction to me, like someone picking out a specific detail and putting it in to try for authenticity, whereas most original authors tend to have big pictures floating around.

 

Though it was amusing.

 

But Perrin wasn't even in the original badger scene right? Wasn't that Dav? I liked that part, but I didn't get it.

[Luckers]

I agree that Brandon did not write Mat as well as RJ. I have stated that it is my opinion that RJs favorite character was Mat. Brandon's was clearly not.

But i never read any of the dialog as awkward and contrived, perhaps i'm just a dumb redneck but whatever the reason I have greatly enjoyed the last few books.

 

I actually think Brandon loved Mat--as he dreamt him up. He thought he was the perfect outlet for some writer-wit--which its very clear that Brandon LOVES doing. Alloy of Law is nothing but contrived witty banter debates in between matrix style action scenes.

 

That being said, safwd, have you re-read them? I barely noticed a lot of the awkward and clunky writing or dialogue in my first read because I was so caught up in plot-revelation. Going back, though, I struggle.

I have read TGS 3 times and ToM twice.

I reread them to see if i could see the things posters on here were discussing as "un WOT like"

And i did see alot of them on the reread, but they still didnt affect me much.

Brandon is just a different kind of writer than RJ. After reading his books i really dont know why they picked him for the job.

The style of the last 2 books is quite a bit different but the feel of them is the same for me. I recognize all the characters from when RJ was writing them so i dont really care if a few things are different. Like Mat losing some of the maturity he gained.

I guess i just didnt expect them to read like they would have if RJ wrote them so it didnt bother me when they didnt.

I am just glad that we will have the final book in 7 months or so. It has been a long journey for me with these books. I was reading them during the multi years waits between books.

I will hate for the story to be finished but i cant wait to see how it all pans out.

 

Fair enough. For me its not just that he's a different sort of writer--i see the same unpolished, awkward and clunky prose in his own work. But meh.

[TristanWebb]

The badger read as fan fiction to me, like someone picking out a specific detail and putting it in to try for authenticity, whereas most original authors tend to have big pictures floating around.

 

Though it was amusing.

 

But Perrin wasn't even in the original badger scene right? Wasn't that Dav? I liked that part, but I didn't get it.

Yeah, Dav and Mat caught the badger, Mat told Rand about it and then things got busy. It is possible Mat told Perrin after Rand left, or at any time during the escape until they were seperated, but it still feels like fan fiction, putting undue attention on points that are really just off the cuff remarks. It is especially apparent with Perrin easing the badger at the end of the scene.. But then again, isn't that what the fandom is really all about? It might of been a jab at obsessive fans, but we are who landed him the job so it doesn't really seem right.

[Vardar]

The badger read as fan fiction to me, like someone picking out a specific detail and putting it in to try for authenticity, whereas most original authors tend to have big pictures floating around.

 

Though it was amusing.

 

But Perrin wasn't even in the original badger scene right? Wasn't that Dav? I liked that part, but I didn't get it.

Yeah, Dav and Mat caught the badger, Mat told Rand about it and then things got busy. It is possible Mat told Perrin after Rand left, or at any time during the escape until they were seperated, but it still feels like fan fiction, putting undue attention on points that are really just off the cuff remarks. It is especially apparent with Perrin easing the badger at the end of the scene.. But then again, isn't that what the fandom is really all about? It might of been a jab at obsessive fans, but we are who landed him the job so it doesn't really seem right.

 

I just took it as a nice reunion scene. Like hey, just like old times, causing trouble. But I suppose fandom works.

[Luckers]

I agree that scene was a wink at the fandom.

[Sid]

Some of my favorite scenes in books 1-11 involved Mat and Elayne or Mat and Nyneave sharing scenes. It didn't much matter which PoV it was from, because as a reader you know what each character's motivations are and how whomever's thoughts you can see at the time were almost invariably wrong (or hillariously right) about the other. RJ didn't need to explain it as if we weren't paying attention. He expected the reader to be able to remember stuff from previous chapters/scenes, and it's absolutely hillarious when you do.

 

Luckers hit the nail on the head a page or two back about why Mat doesn't work anymore. The subtlety of writing the character is something I daresay is out of almost anyone's league to emulate well enough. There's too much of RJ's brand of humor in Mat for him to properly show up again in the series until the last bit that RJ wrote and hopefully put his usual level of polish into before he passed on.

 

The ones I thought Brandon did well were Perrin and surprisingly Avi. Morgase and Lan were awful. Mat was catastrophic, though it got less so after my initial shock at how terrible it was going to be wore off and some acceptance set in. Elayne's suffered from the same malady that Mat's did, but not quite as blinding. The rest were pretty decent.

[Suttree]

I agree that scene was a wink at the fandom.

 

Most certainly. I cringed when I read it to be honest.

[safwd]

I agree that scene was a wink at the fandom.

 

Most certainly. I cringed when I read it to be honest.

 

This is the stuff i dont get.

Why cringe?

Was it horrible writing, no not really.

Was it silly nostalgia, of course.

But who hasnt seen a friend that they have not seen in a long time and started out the conversation with something that happened in the past.

It was a nice reunion of old friends, and it was certainly Mat 2 Rivers version, which is what he was going for.

Corny, yes, but cringe worthy.

[safwd]

I agree that Brandon did not write Mat as well as RJ. I have stated that it is my opinion that RJs favorite character was Mat. Brandon's was clearly not.

But i never read any of the dialog as awkward and contrived, perhaps i'm just a dumb redneck but whatever the reason I have greatly enjoyed the last few books.

 

I actually think Brandon loved Mat--as he dreamt him up. He thought he was the perfect outlet for some writer-wit--which its very clear that Brandon LOVES doing. Alloy of Law is nothing but contrived witty banter debates in between matrix style action scenes.

 

That being said, safwd, have you re-read them? I barely noticed a lot of the awkward and clunky writing or dialogue in my first read because I was so caught up in plot-revelation. Going back, though, I struggle.

I have read TGS 3 times and ToM twice.

I reread them to see if i could see the things posters on here were discussing as "un WOT like"

And i did see alot of them on the reread, but they still didnt affect me much.

Brandon is just a different kind of writer than RJ. After reading his books i really dont know why they picked him for the job.

The style of the last 2 books is quite a bit different but the feel of them is the same for me. I recognize all the characters from when RJ was writing them so i dont really care if a few things are different. Like Mat losing some of the maturity he gained.

I guess i just didnt expect them to read like they would have if RJ wrote them so it didnt bother me when they didnt.

I am just glad that we will have the final book in 7 months or so. It has been a long journey for me with these books. I was reading them during the multi years waits between books.

I will hate for the story to be finished but i cant wait to see how it all pans out.

 

Fair enough. For me its not just that he's a different sort of writer--i see the same unpolished, awkward and clunky prose in his own work. But meh.

 

You are probably right, i am sure it is there. Perhaps he will get better in those areas as he matures as a writer, perhaps not, he seems to be doing well as he is so he may not worry about it.

 

It is without question (though someone will) that RJ got alot of his style from Tolkien. That is a different kind of writing than we have now days. Just like everything else writing has become a business to make money. We are in the instant gratification society so many dont want to put the work in that others did to perfect their trade.

I like Tolkien, i like RJ, but i also like Feist, Salvatore, Sanderson, Wies and a few other fantasy writers. I certainly would not say any of them have the same writing skill as RJ did but i enjoy them non the less. Sanderson is much more Salvatore than Jordan in writing style i think.

I guess i just read a book to enjoy the story, if i dont enjoy the story i stop reading the book. I dont read it to critique the level of writing skill the author has. If i think the skill is terrible i just dont bother reading them.

[yoniy0]

I agree that scene was a wink at the fandom.

Most certainly. I cringed when I read it to be honest.

This is the stuff i dont get.

Why cringe?

Because it wasn't so much Mat reminiscing with Perrin as the writer reminiscing with us (as in, "remember back in the day? Oh, and that hilariously-clever dirty joke?"). For what it's worth, though, I laughed. It was obviously directly aimed at the readers, but that doesn't automatically makes it a bad thing (no point pretending RJ is finishing the series, is there?)

[safwd]

Why not throw in some reminiscing with the readers, some of us have been reading this story for 15-20 years.

And do we really know if Brandon or RJ wrote that little bit? Or if Brandon did write it there was not notes from RJ about writing it?

[Suttree]

Why not throw in some reminiscing with the readers, some of us have been reading this story for 15-20 years.

And do we really know if Brandon or RJ wrote that little bit? Or if Brandon did write it there was not notes from RJ about writing it?

 

Oh Brandon wrote it, of that there is no doubt. As for notes there were many scenes such as this very vaguely outlined in which Brandon had to fill in the "details". I cringe because it is a cheap thrill aimed at the audience as Yoniy0 mentioned. What's worse is it reads like fan fic.

[DaoineSidhe]

I think the Brandon's writing of Rand is probably his best character. RJ's later Rand became crazy, true, but also too "tortured" all of the time. I understand he hates to see women die, and it is a huge load stone on his back, but at times, I got tired of reading about it. Brandon's Dark Rand was truly scary. Some of that could have just been where in the series Brandon took over, but I really liked Brandon's Dark Rand. The post-epiphany Rand is too new for me to judge thought.

 

The same is somewhat true of Perrin. I am unsure how much of my improved liking of Perrin is due to Brandon writing him now, and how much is due to his character development in the series finally reaching the point where I feel I can like him again. Of course, the fact that I can't tell is probably a decent indicator that he wrote these characters well.

 

As for Mat: Brandon was clueless to his voice in tGS, but he seems to have found it, or at least is much closer to it, in ToM. In my first read of tGS, with Mat walking down the road and talking to Talmanes, I immediately felt something was wrong. Mat worrying like that was just terrible. I put down the book for an hour or two (something I've NEVER done when reading a WoT book for the first time) because I felt like there was some stranger impersonating my favorite character. It was invasion of the body snatchers! Thankfully, in ToM, I began to see snatches of the Old Mat with whom I knew so well. The badger scene was a tad contrived I thought, but given the general lack of fan nods like this, it didn't seem too terrible. It was one sentence, done and over with. Gave a quick chuckle, and moved on.

[Maleshub]

- When Brandon admits that he didn't get Mat "right," why are we arguing whether he got him 100% right or not?

- Why aren't we arguing that Mat in CoT or KoD didn't feel "right?" Is it because we have followed his progression from TEotW to the end of KoD without seeing the "strangeness?"

[safwd]

I dont think anyone is saying that Brandon got Mat 100 % right, i know i am not.

Some have said they like Mat better now and many have said they dont like him as much.

I am saying that "I dont care if he is different".

 

Here is why.

When i first read that RJ was not going to be able to finish WoT i was upset, selfishly upset.

My favorite fantasy author had died and what would happen to my favorite fantasy story.

Then they announced that Brandon would be finishing the series and my thought was "Who the hell is Brandon Sanderson?" and "What the hell is he going to do to Mat?"

So i went and picked up Elantris. I liked it alright, not a bad stand alone book. But man it was nothing like WoT.

So then i picked up and read the Mistborn trilogy, and i became a fan. But still nothing like WoT.

So i excepted that things were going to be different about these last few books and as long as he didnt straight up butcher them i was going to be fine with it.

He didnt straight up butcher them in my opinion.

Mat is a bit different but i still recognize the character. It helps that Mat's life was in transition when Brandon picked up the story so i can talk myself into that being why Mat lost some maturity and was a bit over the top talking about how he will still drink, gamble and look at he ladies.

Brandon actually got pretty lucky because many of the main characters were going through a transition. Perrins chasing faile arc was nearing the end. Egwene was about to have a big change, Rand was near having a big change.

I think that made it easier for him because the characters could be altered a bit and some of that could be accounted for with their change of situation.

 

Is it the same as RJ would have done it, of course not, it would be foolish to think it would be, especially if you read Brandons books.

But his books hold their own in the series as a whole so that is an accomplishment. They arent the best books of the series, though i though ToM was up there, but they are not the worst either.

[Suttree]

Is it the same as RJ would have done it, of course not, it would be foolish to think it would be, especially if you read Brandons books.

But his books hold their own in the series as a whole so that is an accomplishment. They arent the best books of the series, though i though ToM was up there, but they are not the worst either.

 

As others have noted many times it is not the differences that matter necessarily it is the drop off in writing quality and totally missing the mark on one of the central characters.

 

When you say TGS and ToM are "up there", I can only assume you mean from a plot and fan gratification standpoint(which quite frequently is accomplished in the cheapest way possible). By no other measure do they event stand close to any of the books with the exception of CoT. Unfortunately that only holds up for the short term and falls apart under subsequent re-reads. Similar to Mat, Team Jordan has admitted the mistakes with TGS and ToM, while Brandon has even changed his writing process in an attempt to fix it for AMoL. As was said by Team Jordan they "need to get it right" in what is the final work upon which RJ's life's work will be judged.

[safwd]

I actually only said ToM was towards the top, i stand by that statement and not just based off fan gratification.

I liked the book.

 

RJ published his first book in 1980, Brandon was 5.

Brandon published his first book in 2005. 11 Wheel of Time books were published by the time Brandon has his first book.

So we have 25 years of writing experience seperating these two guys. Again, no surprise to me that Brandon's writing quality isnt as good or polished. I didnt think it would be.

 

And as i stated in another thread, this is the instant gratification society, and this is the time that Brandon starting publishing.

I have tried to get numerous younger fantasy fans (20 somethings) to read WoT and many just cant handle the early books because RJ can write a bit overly descriptive.

Perhaps it is good quality writing to take an entire page to describe a room and what those in the room were wearing but many think it is just unnecessary.

 

I am not extremely well read on a large amount of authors in the genre but i cannot think of 1 person that would have been able to come in and have a seamless transition.

Team Jordan picked a young writer who was a fan. Perhaps that wasnt the best choice but who am i to question what they wanted.

They could have picked Martin and by the end of TGS half the main characters would have been dead.

Tad Williams or Steven Erikson maybe but they dont write like Jordan did either.

 

Perhaps you have a couple names that you feel would have worked better. And would have done it.

 

Let us remember that while we here all love RJ it is difficult to do a websearch on WoT and not find people basically saying RJ was self-indulgent and long winded. I have looked up quite a few "Greatest fantasy series" lists searching for something new to read and WoT is pretty much always on the list. But more times than not the person writing the list didnt care for the series, couldnt get past the first 3 or 4 books, but adds it due to its popularity.

 

Perhaps Brandon's writing style isnt meeting expectations because that is impossible. RJ was my favorite author, i dont think anyone would have been able to finish the series even close to how he would have.

I dont base that on writing ability because i am not a writer, i just can base it on what and who i like.

[Sid]

I've been checking Linda's blog over at 13th Depository ( http://13depository.blogspot.com/ ) with her chapter by chapter reread of ToM, and she has a number of insights into specific things that don't really fit into the WoT universe sprinkled throughout her blog entries. I kind of hope Team Jordan reads it as well, since it would help avoid similar misteps with AMoL.

[Sid]

Just a thought out of left field...

It would be utterly fascinating to see the end product from a half-dozen other possible candidates (Williams, Erickon, etc) if they'd taken up this challenge, and compare them to Brandon's work and each other's. God, I could spend months (or years) doing that.