[ADVANCED/KITCHEN SINK] The Axe or the Hammer - GAME OVER

[Nolder]

@Nol--First of all, I'd ask why but I don't think there would be any satisfactory answer, there--not reading things in a mafia game is scummy, regardless of circumstance. You never know what you might miss.

fair enough

all I can say is I'm budgeting my time

your argument with BG seems irrelevant to the game at large to me

if a situation arises in which I'll need to know who said what I'll be more than happy to double check at that time

 

Secondly, the timing was weird because as I said, your post was totally irrelevant--we weren't attacking each other, the posts being made at that time were calm and rational, but you made it out to be like we were in the middle of a war, which we weren't.

well I wouldn't know if it was winding down and getting more reasonable

all I saw was WoT battles

one WoT looks much like another you know

 

Thirdly, if you didn't read my posts or BG's about each other, did you read Boyo's, at least? He had no stake in the discussion like myself and BG.

are you referring to all of his posts, a specific post, or a series of posts?

whatever the case I'm not sure so I'll just say maybe but probably not since if I had I assume I'd be aware of whatever misgiving you seem to have since you mentioned it

either that or it didn't stand out to me I dunno

[SBoydW]

 

Thirdly, if you didn't read my posts or BG's about each other, did you read Boyo's, at least? He had no stake in the discussion like myself and BG.[/color]

are you referring to all of his posts, a specific post, or a series of posts?

whatever the case I'm not sure so I'll just say maybe but probably not since if I had I assume I'd be aware of whatever misgiving you seem to have since you mentioned it

either that or it didn't stand out to me I dunno

 

Okay that is the second time that nolder has deflected instead of answering a simple question. Also, is it just me or did he just essentially admit to intentionally skimming?

[Nolder]

 

Thirdly, if you didn't read my posts or BG's about each other, did you read Boyo's, at least? He had no stake in the discussion like myself and BG.[/color]

are you referring to all of his posts, a specific post, or a series of posts?

whatever the case I'm not sure so I'll just say maybe but probably not since if I had I assume I'd be aware of whatever misgiving you seem to have since you mentioned it

either that or it didn't stand out to me I dunno

 

Okay that is the second time that nolder has deflected instead of answering a simple question. Also, is it just me or did he just essentially admit to intentionally skimming?

????

how am I deflecting?

I don't know what she's talking about so I asked her to clarify

 

I wouldn't call it skimming but you can if you want

I'm at a friends house right now and I can't always be online

I got the feeling that neither Meesh nor BG really have a case and neither one is striking me as scummy so I am more or less ignoring their argument (or I was, I'm finding it to be distracting now so I've asked if they could end it) because I don't feel it's that important

as I said before if it should come up later I'll reread and look into it but right now I don't have the time nor inclination to read their WoTs

[Amadine]

Will recheck it now :)

[SBoydW]

 

Thirdly, if you didn't read my posts or BG's about each other, did you read Boyo's, at least? He had no stake in the discussion like myself and BG.[/color]

are you referring to all of his posts, a specific post, or a series of posts?

whatever the case I'm not sure so I'll just say maybe but probably not since if I had I assume I'd be aware of whatever misgiving you seem to have since you mentioned it

either that or it didn't stand out to me I dunno

 

Okay that is the second time that nolder has deflected instead of answering a simple question. Also, is it just me or did he just essentially admit to intentionally skimming?

????

how am I deflecting?

I don't know what she's talking about so I asked her to clarify

I wouldn't call it skimming but you can if you want

I'm at a friends house right now and I can't always be online

I got the feeling that neither Meesh nor BG really have a case and neither one is striking me as scummy so I am more or less ignoring their argument (or I was, I'm finding it to be distracting now so I've asked if they could end it) because I don't feel it's that important

as I said before if it should come up later I'll reread and look into it but right now I don't have the time nor inclination to read their WoTs

 

Well if you had been reading instead of skimming, then you would have seen that she specifically quoted one of my quotes pointing out some flaws with BG.

 

Also, I find it INCREDIBLY scummy when you want people to stop having a discussion of any kind, unless it was devolving into insult flinging, which in this case it wasn't. If you had been reading the conversation, instead of admittedly skimming past their posts, you might have seen some very valid points that were being raised. Or maybe that was the problem. It seems more like maybe someone was striking a little to close to something and maybe you wanted to give BG an out?

 

To the italicized: Not sure what that has to do with anything I'm not questioning your activity. I'm questioning your conscious decision to intentionally ignore somethings and not others.

 

Top three Suspicious:

1. BG/Nol

2. Ledinna

3. Des

[Nolder]

It seems more like maybe someone was striking a little to close to something and maybe you wanted to give BG an out?

okay

 

To the italicized: Not sure what that has to do with anything I'm not questioning your activity. I'm questioning your conscious decision to intentionally ignore somethings and not others.

the decision was made because my time is limited

I do not have the time to read all the Walls of Text being thrown around let alone the WoTs AND the rest of the game

it makes much more sense to me to ignore what appears to me to be a useless debate between two townies and concentrate on the rest of the game

[Nolder]

wait now that I'm thinking about it

that makes even less sense than I thought it did at first

why are you claiming I'm giving BG "an out" when I'd be giving Meesh the same thing? why are you drawing a (non existent) connection to BG?

[Amadine]

Correct Vote Count:

Ed (2) - Amega, Key

 

Leelou (1) - Nolder

 

Ley (1) - Maw

Ledinna (5) - Nyn, Leelou, Ed, Ishy, Kae

Levity (1) - Corrosive

Amega (1) - Spirit

Soyo (2) - Womby, Des

Pandy (1) - Verb

Nolder (2) - Pandy, Turin

Meesh (2) - BG, Hoof

BG (3) - Meesh, Ley, Soy

Not Voting: Red, Levity, Ledinna

24 players = 13 to lynch

[Leyrann]

Day one for me is all about instinct and feelings. I think this Day 1 discussion of appropriate ways to play is all blah blah blah and I don't really care. Everyone plays their own way. Some like to joke vote, some don't. Some like trains, some don't... yadda yadda. If we all agreed on the same way to play it, then nothing would ever get done on Day 1. So I'm perfectly happy having everyone play it the way they want to play it.

 

That being said, rarely will you find anything substantial or conclusive on Day 1. Occasionally there will be a rare slip or something, but chances are no. Who FoS'd who, who trained when, how and why? It all blends together town and mafia.... therefore it comes back to feelings to me.

 

Therefore Levity and yourself have given me the most weary feelings.

 

You were in a discussion with Red and didn't want to inturrupt that, so I'd thought I'd put my say on Lev.

 

If you want, I can move to you and we can go from there.

 

 

This is what bothers me the most, held off saying anything until I could go back and read... Not once have you mentioned any suspicions about Ley in this game then you vote Ley citing no reason (claiming you didn't want to interrupt an ongoing discussion ). Then meesh calls you on that and asks for some reasoning, and you give the above response all of the sudden finding meesh suspicious as well. Also note you haven't made any FoS's, or any kind of comment hinting at suspicion of meesh, either. But all the sudden she's suspicious, right after she questions you on your non-reasoned vote?

 

Upgrading my FoS to a vote. Unvote. Vote BG.

 

I guess you meant Lev? Maw is the only one who has voted me so far.

[Leyrann]

And isn't Maw voting Key? Or is that in the other game?

[Amadine]

FYI Someone neglected to unvote so their next vote was not counted...

[SBoydW]

It seems more like maybe someone was striking a little to close to something and maybe you wanted to give BG an out?

okay

 

To the italicized: Not sure what that has to do with anything I'm not questioning your activity. I'm questioning your conscious decision to intentionally ignore somethings and not others.

the decision was made because my time is limited

I do not have the time to read all the Walls of Text being thrown around let alone the WoTs AND the rest of the game

it makes much more sense to me to ignore what appears to me to be a useless debate between two townies and concentrate on the rest of the game

 

So wait until you do have time. It never makes sense to ignore any part of a mafia game. Especially an advanced one. And you say that you wanted to focus on the rest of the game. What else was going on? The Meesh/BG debate was all that was happening in the last page or so. Now, would it be nice if other players chimed in? Yeah, but the fact is at the moment nothing else is going on, so you essentially asked the game to stop, which is odd since you're such a proponent of getting games started.

[Amadine]

And isn't Maw voting Key? Or is that in the other game?

 

I have to go to work... check it for me and i will edit again if necessary but i believe the above count is correct.

[SBoydW]

Day one for me is all about instinct and feelings. I think this Day 1 discussion of appropriate ways to play is all blah blah blah and I don't really care. Everyone plays their own way. Some like to joke vote, some don't. Some like trains, some don't... yadda yadda. If we all agreed on the same way to play it, then nothing would ever get done on Day 1. So I'm perfectly happy having everyone play it the way they want to play it.

 

That being said, rarely will you find anything substantial or conclusive on Day 1. Occasionally there will be a rare slip or something, but chances are no. Who FoS'd who, who trained when, how and why? It all blends together town and mafia.... therefore it comes back to feelings to me.

 

Therefore Levity and yourself have given me the most weary feelings.

 

You were in a discussion with Red and didn't want to inturrupt that, so I'd thought I'd put my say on Lev.

 

If you want, I can move to you and we can go from there.

 

 

This is what bothers me the most, held off saying anything until I could go back and read... Not once have you mentioned any suspicions about Ley in this game then you vote Ley citing no reason (claiming you didn't want to interrupt an ongoing discussion ). Then meesh calls you on that and asks for some reasoning, and you give the above response all of the sudden finding meesh suspicious as well. Also note you haven't made any FoS's, or any kind of comment hinting at suspicion of meesh, either. But all the sudden she's suspicious, right after she questions you on your non-reasoned vote?

 

Upgrading my FoS to a vote. Unvote. Vote BG.

 

I guess you meant Lev? Maw is the only one who has voted me so far.

 

Yes. Got your names switched.

[SBoydW]

wait now that I'm thinking about it

that makes even less sense than I thought it did at first

why are you claiming I'm giving BG "an out" when I'd be giving Meesh the same thing? why are you drawing a (non existent) connection to BG?

 

Because BG was the one that jumped at the opportunity to stop the discussion.

[Nolder]

So wait until you do have time. It never makes sense to ignore any part of a mafia game. Especially an advanced one. And you say that you wanted to focus on the rest of the game. What else was going on? The Meesh/BG debate was all that was happening in the last page or so. Now, would it be nice if other players chimed in? Yeah, but the fact is at the moment nothing else is going on, so you essentially asked the game to stop, which is odd since you're such a proponent of getting games started.

you're completely missing the point

 

first of all I have two reasons for ignoring the debate

1. Limited Time

2. It appears to me to be Townie vs Townie

 

I'm ignoring it because there is no reason imo to be paying close attention

in addition to that I don't have the time even if I wanted to

it makes sense to me to ignore it if you don't agree, that's cool I guess

we're different people with different playstyles and different priorities

 

moving on

yes I'd like the Meesh/BG debate to stop

you're twisting it to seem like if it stops then the entire game stops but I'd argue the entire game already stopped which is what bothers me

the game devolved until Meesh/BG were the only topics of discussion and only a few people were even discussing

add that to the fact that, again, the debate seems Townie vs Townie to me and we have a big problem

namely scum letting townies tear into each other while they just sit idly by and wait for day to end

you don't see any problem with that?

[Nolder]

wait now that I'm thinking about it

that makes even less sense than I thought it did at first

why are you claiming I'm giving BG "an out" when I'd be giving Meesh the same thing? why are you drawing a (non existent) connection to BG?

 

Because BG was the one that jumped at the opportunity to stop the discussion.

that's a lie

 

Fair enough. I will wait and see what future days hold. Now i should go back and find what bugged me about levity. Don't remember exactly where it was Exactly. Right, meesh, truce for a bit?

this post doesn't give me the impression of "jumping at the opportunity" but even if you want to spin it that way...

 

I made all the points I wanted to make. Didn't do it nearly well enough, but I have nothing more to say anyway.

Meesh agreed mere minutes after

 

definitely gonna FoS you at this point Soy

what you're saying is just plain wrong

[Netbattler11]

Oh, shoot.

 

Shhhh.

 

 

I totally did not forget I was in this game.

 

Well, to re-read, i suppose.

 

And ley, that was the other game.

[SBoydW]

Can we end this whole argument please? I'm pretty sure this is just townie on townie violence and it's getting emotional IMO. I think several players are being allowed to slip under the radar because of this. IIRC we haven't heard anything from Ed or Levity in awhile. Nyn and Verbal too.

 

 

Fair enough. I will wait and see what future days hold. Now i should go back and find what bugged me about levity. Don't remember exactly where it was Exactly. Right, meesh, truce for a bit?

 

 

wait now that I'm thinking about it

that makes even less sense than I thought it did at first

why are you claiming I'm giving BG "an out" when I'd be giving Meesh the same thing? why are you drawing a (non existent) connection to BG?

 

Because BG was the one that jumped at the opportunity to stop the discussion.

that's a lie

Fair enough. I will wait and see what future days hold. Now i should go back and find what bugged me about levity. Don't remember exactly where it was Exactly. Right, meesh, truce for a bit?

this post doesn't give me the impression of "jumping at the opportunity" but even if you want to spin it that way...

 

I made all the points I wanted to make. Didn't do it nearly well enough, but I have nothing more to say anyway.

Meesh agreed mere minutes after

 

definitely gonna FoS you at this point Soy

what you're saying is just plain wrong

 

But BG is the only one to go completely silent, I guess in the hopes of everyone forgetting what was pointed out about him. Which you seem to be wanting to push under the rug as well. Meesh on the other hand as actually continued to reference that debate. While you on the other hand are doing everything you can do stop the discussion of it and deflect attention else where.

 

Unvote. Vote Nol.

[SBoydW]

So wait until you do have time. It never makes sense to ignore any part of a mafia game. Especially an advanced one. And you say that you wanted to focus on the rest of the game. What else was going on? The Meesh/BG debate was all that was happening in the last page or so. Now, would it be nice if other players chimed in? Yeah, but the fact is at the moment nothing else is going on, so you essentially asked the game to stop, which is odd since you're such a proponent of getting games started.

you're completely missing the point

 

first of all I have two reasons for ignoring the debate

1. Limited Time

2. It appears to me to be Townie vs Townie

 

I'm ignoring it because there is no reason imo to be paying close attention

in addition to that I don't have the time even if I wanted to

it makes sense to me to ignore it if you don't agree, that's cool I guess

we're different people with different playstyles and different priorities

 

moving on

yes I'd like the Meesh/BG debate to stop

you're twisting it to seem like if it stops then the entire game stops but I'd argue the entire game already stopped which is what bothers me

the game devolved until Meesh/BG were the only topics of discussion and only a few people were even discussing

add that to the fact that, again, the debate seems Townie vs Townie to me and we have a big problem

namely scum letting townies tear into each other while they just sit idly by and wait for day to end

you don't see any problem with that?

 

You're the only one saying that. Meesh and I feel BG is exhibiting scummy traits, and BG feels the same about Meesh. I would love some further input on this but I can't make people weigh in. And until there is something else to be discussed, I will talk about this. Unless you would like for all activity to cease so that a deadline will be set and we have to make a desperation vote?

[ed2funy]

Also, unvote.

 

ED. Thoughts on the game?

 

 

The fug? If I wasn't slightly skimming instead of skimming, I wouldn't have read this.

 

IIRC we haven't heard anything from Ed or Levity in awhile.

 

 

Hold the hell up. I slept last night. Woke up at 6, then got ready and went to duty from 0800 to about 2000 (0700-2030 in actuality because of having to draw a weapon).

Now I am on CQ.

 

It can't have been more than 24 hours since I last read the thread. I don't think I replied to the last one, the hell?

 

 

[Nolder]

But BG is the only one to go completely silent, I guess in the hopes of everyone forgetting what was pointed out about him.

this happened about 15 hours ago

"completely silent" is a gross exaggeration

 

Which you seem to be wanting to push under the rug as well.

if I was trying to push this aside I'd be trying to placate you

perhaps by agreeing that BG is scummy or that the discussion between/about Meesh and BG should still be taking place or apologizing for my perceived scummy behavior

I am doing none of these things and am willing to discuss these matters at length if necessary

 

Meesh on the other hand as actually continued to reference that debate. While you on the other hand are doing everything you can do stop the discussion of it and deflect attention else where.

1. She has, which is exactly the opposite of what she said she would do

2. "doing everything I can to stop discussion or deflect attention elsewhere" is again gross exaggeration and just plain wrong

[ed2funy]

Now, I'll reread the thread later, because I am on CQ until 0900 (it is 2217).

You can wait.

[Nolder]

IIRC we haven't heard anything from Ed or Levity in awhile.

Hold the hell up. I slept last night. Woke up at 6, then got ready and went to duty from 0800 to about 2000 (0700-2030 in actuality because of having to draw a weapon).

Now I am on CQ.

 

It can't have been more than 24 hours since I last read the thread. I don't think I replied to the last one, the hell?

unless I'm mistaken your last post was that you currently had no opinion on anything

which is fine I guess but I'm going to note that you haven't really had an opinion in awhile

 

it could be I'm getting games mixed up though

[Nolder]

add that to the fact that, again, the debate seems Townie vs Townie to me and we have a big problem

You're the only one saying that. Meesh and I feel BG is exhibiting scummy traits, and BG feels the same about Meesh. I would love some further input on this but I can't make people weigh in. And until there is something else to be discussed, I will talk about this.

yeah and again I'll note this was said about 15 hours ago

it could very well be the rest of the people in the game agree with me

why don't you give the people some time to go through their daily routines and check up on the thread before making me out to be some kind of lone wolf with an agenda

 

Unless you would like for all activity to cease so that a deadline will be set and we have to make a desperation vote?

you're again twisting the situation

you're acting as if it's either the BG/Meesh discussion or nothing

as we're currently talking about me, you, and the discussion of that discussion that is obviously not the case

in fact if we had some input from others on other matters (Red made an attempt at this but YOU and MEESH promptly went on the offensive and drowned her out) we could easily be talking about something different and far more productive right now