My Relisten Summary and Questions

[NitroS]

I started listening to the audio books around september last year and finished around february and then started a relisten straight away i was so intent on the series (i work in a job which allows me to listen to my ipod for the duration).I find this to be easily the most entertaining series of all the fantasy books. (im halfway through LOT Rand i dont feel the connection to any of the characters or excitement about anything and frodo is boring i rather listen to perrin whinge about faieel) Its amazing how many things you notice on the second time through, such as all the characters mentioned in the first book that end up popping up later such as Talanvor, aram and buelen(boy in NS that finds lan in TOM.

My favourite foreshadowing of the series would have to be when moiraine says in TEOTW when travelling through the ways that if the trollocs ever found out about the waygate in caemlyn, then it would be crawling with trollocs which ofcourse is fulfilled at the end of TOM with the city burning.

 

Rather then make a new thread everytime i had a question i wrote down on my iphone things that didnt make sense to me so i could make a thread when i finished the series again, this being it.

 

First question:

 

In either TSR or TFOH the wise ones get angry at Aviendha for picking up a spear to defend herself when there was a raid on their camp. What ways do wise ones defend themselves when they cant channel? do they just sit there and wait?

 

Why do people think that Logains glory is related to the BT when min states several times through out the series that Logains glory will be that of which few men would dream of. Which means its not your everyday glory of killing a dark friend and will more then likely be something related to fighting the dark one etc?

 

During the salidar chapters a ward against eaves dropping is placed around a meeting, yet nyneave is able to listen through the window. Yet in later books It shows a ward against eaves dropping prevents people right in front from listening ( i think this is happens when egwene holds a meeting)

 

Is it ever revealed who killed that girl on the farm in TDR where a sister asks her about egwene, nyneave and elayne?

 

In alot of power meters i have seen posted around ranking the forsaken i often see lanfear as 3rd or 4th with rahvin in the middle somewhere, yet in foh either lanfear or rahvin states that rahvin is stronger then lan fear.

 

In tuons prophecy the dragon being blinded by light is that in reference to super rand? also the kereathon cycle (sp) mentions that the dragon will bind all nations to him before the last battle, yet many people on here are still in question on whether the seanchan will be with him....

 

In many of the seanchan scenes through out the books the seanchan manage to shield sisters when they are holding the power with ease it seems when its suppose to be really difficult when someone is holding the power. (im refering to the first captain in TGS when she gets shielded) Also why do the seanchan continue to just throw shields at egwene when she is holding that much power it would be obvious since everyone would be able to see the glow?

 

in TGS lews therin states that sheer power cannot beat the dark one, yet again alot of people on here say that the female plan would have worked if lews therin wasnt so reckless and many people agree, this also confirms that Callandor wont be used in fighting the dark one as the seanchan prophecy's states that the dragon will duel sight blinder,not be ina circle of 3 being fuel for a female to meld the flows.

 

Anything behind the Lews therin likes weiramon statement?

 

Do we know for definite that the letters with red wax that Rand and Galad receieved both are from verrin?

 

Why does egwene think that she can stop rand breaking the seals when she has already dreamed him doing it? like the seanchan attack.

 

In LOC at dumais wells the aes sedai stated that they had to come down to the fight so they could help due to there oathes, yet there oathes states when sisters are in peril and there was many tower aes sedai down there that had imprisoned rand. This could also be a lie would have to check the wording though.

 

We know that if the last battle is won, that the white tower will stand for atleast 10 years as min sees a girl and has a viewing that she will be raised to aes sedai in the tower.

 

Imagine if the Gollum actually went after the aes sedai or perrin or someone other then mat, how much damage it would have caused i find that plot arc quite annoying...

 

In the New spring myrelle weaves ice cubes under moiraines dress, yet it is stated that you have to be able to see to weave?

 

Min has a viewing of LAN of a baby with a sword and broken towers? i dont see how that is a viewing of the future? what could that mean? i know about his passed but min doesnt see the passed she sees the future?

 

Also when Noal dies he says tell a malkier jane farstrider died clean. (possible foreshadowing that lan will live and mat will be able to deliver the message since hes one of the few malkier that we know)

 

I didnt like egwenes dialogue in TOM of the battle scene when all hell is going down in the dream land and she stops when she sees perrin and randomly asks where is rand? when there are black ajah fighting and she has organised to see him in 2 weeks anyway....

 

Why do they continuely say that thought is faster then weaves yet in TOM in TAR perrin continuily uses his hammer and kicks, where as egwene weaves quite alot.

 

I was impressed by robert jordan's planning of the series by all of mins viewings in the earlier books such as mats eye on a scale and bearalayn with a man of white which most dont get fulfilled to the very last few books.

 

And lastly i found it random that the blue ajahs main custom is you cant marry, yet moiraine is going to marry Tom. (also that relationship seems really weird and forced, there last words to each other didnt even hint anything)

 

I still dont see why from when egwene finds out that the borderlands are under attack that she hasnt helped any of the lands when she has access to gateways and a period of atleast a couple of weeks when thousands of men are dieing each day while she worries about gawyn and tower politics.

 

Im sorry if i got a few quotes wrong or mis understood a few things, thanks to all those that reply.

[Arkane101]

During the salidar chapters a ward against eaves dropping is placed around a meeting, yet nyneave is able to listen through the window. Yet in later books It shows a ward against eaves dropping prevents people right in front from listening ( i think this is happens when egwene holds a meeting)

The Aes Sedai in the meeting didn't do a very good job positioning the ward and it went around a small distance behind the window, just enough for Nynaeve to listen in. When Aviendha was around in meetings with Elaine she was the one to do the ward as she had a higher skill level at creating the wards meaning no one would be able to find flaws in the ward.

 

Is it ever revealed who killed that girl on the farm in TDR where a sister asks her about egwene, nyneave and elayne?

Liandrin

 

In alot of power meters i have seen posted around ranking the forsaken i often see lanfear as 3rd or 4th with rahvin in the middle somewhere, yet in foh either lanfear or rahvin states that rahvin is stronger then lan fear.

Only RJ made a power meter that was completely accurate, any that people make may be flawed, it's interesting how often they are flawed like that since there is a direct quote stating Lanfear is not as strong as Rahvin.

 

In tuons prophecy the dragon being blinded by light is that in reference to super rand? also the kereathon cycle (sp) mentions that the dragon will bind all nations to him before the last battle, yet many people on here are still in question on whether the seanchan will be with him....

I'm not really sure about this one, but I believe that the Seanchan prophecies were butchered by Ishamael.

 

In many of the seanchan scenes through out the books the seanchan manage to shield sisters when they are holding the power with ease it seems when its suppose to be really difficult when someone is holding the power. (im refering to the first captain in TGS when she gets shielded) Also why do the seanchan continue to just throw shields at egwene when she is holding that much power it would be obvious since everyone would be able to see the glow?

The situation where the Seanchan shield the head of the green ajah there are 2 damane, plus the green head was exhausted from earlier fights and running up several flights of stairs, Seanchan are much more used to heated battles so their instincts are much better then Aes Sedai, who have generally a very sheltered life, even green ajah.

 

in TGS lews therin states that sheer power cannot beat the dark one, yet again alot of people on here say that the female plan would have worked if lews therin wasnt so reckless and many people agree

This can't really be answered since there are arguments for and against the choedan kal shield the female AS suggested being used. Plus since it never happened theres no way to know if it would have worked.

 

this also confirms that Callandor wont be used in fighting the dark one as the seanchan prophecy's states that the dragon will duel sight blinder,not be ina circle of 3 being fuel for a female to meld the flows.

confirms nothing *once again butchered Seanchan prophecies* Callandor will be used, according to Randland prophecy Callandor will be used.

 

Anything behind the Lews therin likes weiramon statement?

ToM spoiler

 

Weiramon turned out to be a darkfriend, it was sort of a funny dark coincidence, the one high lord he believed he could trust turned out to be the only darkfriend amongst them

 

 

Why does egwene think that she can stop rand breaking the seals when she has already dreamed him doing it? like the seanchan attack.

Dreamer dreams aren't exactly prophecy, they are like prophecy of what could be, not what will happen, RJ or BS i forget who confirmed this.

 

In the New spring myrelle weaves ice cubes under moiraines dress, yet it is stated that you have to be able to see to weave?

Not true, seeing just makes it easier, not seeing thus not being able to channel is just a common block that Male channelers have when they are wilders *non BT trained* when Elaida's AS attack the BT Logain and several other Ashaman shield AS who are lost behind trees.

 

Why do they continuely say that thought is faster then weaves yet in TOM in TAR perrin continuily uses his hammer and kicks, where as egwene weaves quite alot.

It's just a matter of habbit, AS as a habbit go to the OP because it's what they always rely on, whereas Perrin uses physical force since he is sort of a soldier/fighter.

 

And lastly i found it random that the blue ajahs main custom is you cant marry, yet moiraine is going to marry Tom. (also that relationship seems really weird and forced, there last words to each other didnt even hint anything)

It's not just blue, generally all AS custom is not to marry, due to the whole living several times as long as their partner, they would most likely live hundreds of years after their husband died, so they are discouraged from marriage, it's also only custom, so it doesn't necessarily have to be obeyed.

[Kahsm]

Arkane101 did a pretty good and balanced job answering, but I just wanted to clarify on seeing the weaves you channel. You do have to see the weaving, but not necessarily the target. So kinda like you weave the shield or ice cubes right infront of you then send it off towards whatever.

[NitroS]

thanks for your reply, whats the reason for you believeing that ishammael butchered the prophecies i dont remember much in regards to that. Does an extra damane pushing to shield you matter? i thought if your strong enough the shield just bounces off you (like what egwene said when she had the fluted wand) since damane cant link i cant see there shield spam as a quality way to capture sisters if there all holding the power. Yea i new about weiramon just thought it was weird but i suppose it was just slight foreshadowing for him being dark.

[Arkane101]

thanks for your reply, whats the reason for you believeing that ishammael butchered the prophecies i dont remember much in regards to that. Does an extra damane pushing to shield you matter? i thought if your strong enough the shield just bounces off you (like what egwene said when she had the fluted wand) since damane cant link i cant see there shield spam as a quality way to capture sisters if there all holding the power. Yea i new about weiramon just thought it was weird but i suppose it was just slight foreshadowing for him being dark.

In one of his dreams in tEotW Ishamael says "I whispered in Artur Hawkwing's ear, and the length and breadth of the land Aes Sedai died, I whisperedd again, and the High King sent his armies across the Aryth Ocean, across the world sea, and sealed two dooms. The doom of his dream of one land and one people, and a doom yet to come." etc etc

Now I realise this doesn't proove anything specifically, I believe somewhere later Tuon, or another high up Seanchan mentions that the natives of Seanchan had a different version of the prophecies to what they had as well as the Randlanders, which leads me to believe that the version they sent over was butchered, and Ishy was in the right place at the right time to do that butchering.

 

It doesn't have the same added effect as linking, but having more then 1 shield another does add up, there is something about that mentioned by one of the Ashaman in regards to the AS attacking the black tower. I think it was meant to be like a hint about Weiramon, I couldn't believe I didn't suspect him myself when I read it it's like doooy! how obvious lol.

[Arkane101]

Oh and the thing about the fluted wand is, it is the most powerful Sa angreal in the white tower, so i'm not sure the numbers, but she had to have been at least 10's of times more powerful whilst weilding it, like potentially 20x or more even. Therefore even a circle of 13 linked AS wouldn't have stood a chance of shielding her. I remember one of the angreal they found in Bander Eban made Aviendha or Elayne just over twice Nynaeve's normal strength and that was just a basic angreal, so the wand would be meeeega powerful

[DemandredFO]

Just like to add with the AS marriage thing, one of the reasons behind not marrying is if they had children they might someday have to gentle their own sons. That threat is gone now, but that maybe how the custom started. Then over the centuries the custom remained but the reason grew garbled

[Guest Captain Noble]

Why do people think that Logains glory is related to the BT when min states several times through out the series that Logains glory will be that of which few men would dream of. Which means its not your everyday glory of killing a dark friend and will more then likely be something related to fighting the dark one etc?

 

I think that Rand will sacrifice himself (faking his death basically) at the LB so that he can live again (without everyone bothering him). Somehow in all of this people will think that Logain is the one who saved the day and as such he will get glory above all others.

[KaptainKaos]

Just wanted to add a thought about the Seanchan, they are a completely different culture with the Empress held in such high regard that any prophecy that mentioned she would have to submit to anyone, especially a man who can channel would quickly be modified. The most logical conclusion would be to change it to the Dragon bowing to her, the people would certainly be able to accept that with much more enthusiasm. Almost every prophecy in Seanchan would have to be suitable to their culture, questioning the absolute power of the Imperial family would not be tolerated.

 

I also would agree Ishamael could have had a hand in shaping the prophecies to create difficulties for the Light but it really wouldn't have been that difficult in a culture that revers their leader almost as a god.

 

Also on the faking death thing, I have always looked to the time that someone referring to Nynaeve said that she wouldn't be happy at her abilities with Healing until she had raised someone from the grave who had been dead three days. I find it odd that this would have been mentioned with so many connections between Rand and Jesus Christ. As such I have always wondered if Rand would die and then somehow be revived by a stubborn Nynaeve three days later or maybe she will revive someone else in this manner (Lan?) or I could just be looking too much into things in anticipation of the last book.

[Terez]

Going to just give my responses instead of reading everyone else's, so I might repeat some things.

 

In either TSR or TFOH the wise ones get angry at Aviendha for picking up a spear to defend herself when there was a raid on their camp. What ways do wise ones defend themselves when they cant channel? do they just sit there and wait?

Before Dumai's Wells, they just took a defensive position. I think it likely has to do with honor - battle is one way to earn honor, and being a Wise One is another. Since using the Power in battle had previously been prohibited for Wise Ones, there was nothing they could do to help besides helping with the injured (not that they knew Healing). It's logical, but points like this are taken to extremes in ji'e'toh, hence the reaction to Aviendha and the spear. They also saw it as her not being willing to give up the spear to be a Wise One. They had to be strict with her to get her to leave that part of herself behind.

 

Why do people think that Logains glory is related to the BT when min states several times through out the series that Logains glory will be that of which few men would dream of. Which means its not your everyday glory of killing a dark friend and will more then likely be something related to fighting the dark one etc?

It will probably be both. Egwene's dream shows him stepping over Rand's dead body to mount a black stone which resembles the stone Taim used to address Asha'man before his palace built. It was a symbol of his power. Seeing as how the Black Tower is central to the Shadow's offensive for the Last Battle, this isn't likely to be a small victory for Logain. The situation there is extreme, and at least four of the five remaining Forsaken are likely to be involved there as the Battle of Caemlyn comes to a head.

 

During the salidar chapters a ward against eaves dropping is placed around a meeting, yet nyneave is able to listen through the window. Yet in later books It shows a ward against eaves dropping prevents people right in front from listening ( i think this is happens when egwene holds a meeting)

She steps inside the ward, IIRC.

 

Is it ever revealed who killed that girl on the farm in TDR where a sister asks her about egwene, nyneave and elayne?

Brandon hints that it was Alviarin. Some find this strange she didn't delegate, but it may be that Alviarin didn't want anyone else to have that information.

 

In alot of power meters i have seen posted around ranking the forsaken i often see lanfear as 3rd or 4th with rahvin in the middle somewhere, yet in foh either lanfear or rahvin states that rahvin is stronger then lan fear.

Lanfear is as strong as it is possible for a woman to be, but RJ has indicated in interviews that there are several levels of male strength above even her level. I think she was considered most powerful next to Ishamael because of her various Talents, such as her skill in the Dream, her ability to read the Pattern, etc.

 

In tuons prophecy the dragon being blinded by light is that in reference to super rand? also the kereathon cycle (sp) mentions that the dragon will bind all nations to him before the last battle, yet many people on here are still in question on whether the seanchan will be with him....

The prophecy is essentially 'and the blind man did see'. He was blind (about Lews Therin, about his darkening nature, etc.), and he opened his eyes to the truth on Dragonmount, and somehow warded his mind from the taint. The KC says that he shall bind the north to the east, and that the west will be bound to the south. It does not say that he will do the latter - that was Tuon, of course. It says nothing about the two being made one. Only the Aelfinn said that must be done for him to have any chance at winning - but they did not say he would be the one to do it. The prophecies say he will break the nations - they don't say anything about him binding them together, or ruling them.

 

in TGS lews therin states that sheer power cannot beat the dark one, yet again alot of people on here say that the female plan would have worked if lews therin wasnt so reckless and many people agree, this also confirms that Callandor wont be used in fighting the dark one as the seanchan prophecy's states that the dragon will duel sight blinder,not be ina circle of 3 being fuel for a female to meld the flows.

There's nothing to prevent Rand from dueling with Lighteater (Sightblinder is the Aiel term) as the head of a circle of three. Brandon has indicated that this scenario will indeed happen:

 

Towers of Midnight book tour 8 November 2010 Lincoln Triangle Barnes and Noble NY, NY - Sarayne reporting

 

Q: Can you give us a hint on who the second woman will be in Rand’s circle? (With Callandor)

Brandon: Not really, but I can give you a tiny bit of information. She has already been introduced.

 

Anything behind the Lews therin likes weiramon statement?

I'd guess that part of Rand found him entertaining, and in different circumstances he wouldn't have bothered Rand so much. Part of Rand also suspected that he was overreacting to Weiramon - hence his trying to convince himself that the man really was just stupid.

 

Do we know for definite that the letters with red wax that Rand and Galad received both are from verrin?

Brandon has essentially confirmed that indirectly in interviews, not that it's really necessary.

 

Why does egwene think that she can stop rand breaking the seals when she has already dreamed him doing it? like the seanchan attack.

1) Dreams are only possibilities - they can be prevented.

2) I don't think that dream has to do with the seals at all; I think the crystal sphere represents the Aiel, and the ropes holding it together are ji'e'toh. The 23 stars are the Council of Twenty-Two mentioned in Aviendha's visions plus the Dragon's Blood. Rand cuts the ropes holding the Aiel together with the Dragon's Peace, because their entire system of honor is based on battle.

 

In LOC at dumais wells the aes sedai stated that they had to come down to the fight so they could help due to there oathes, yet there oathes states when sisters are in peril and there was many tower aes sedai down there that had imprisoned rand. This could also be a lie would have to check the wording though.

Apparently they had to be convinced that those sisters were in danger. I doubt Kiruna is Black, though I could be wrong.

 

We know that if the last battle is won, that the white tower will stand for atleast 10 years as min sees a girl and has a viewing that she will be raised to aes sedai in the tower.

A woman, not a girl. It says she will be trained 'by the White Tower', and become Aes Sedai, but not necessarily that she will become Aes Sedai at the White Tower. (She's likely already off to do that - with about a month before the end of TOM.) Also, viewings after the Pattern starts falling apart are a little suspect. Min doesn't know that.

 

In the New spring myrelle weaves ice cubes under moiraines dress, yet it is stated that you have to be able to see to weave?

Generally, but it's a block. A blind person can weave, according to RJ. He wasn't terribly consistent with this IMO, but I could be wrong.

 

Min has a viewing of LAN of a baby with a sword and broken towers? i dont see how that is a viewing of the future? what could that mean? i know about his passed but min doesnt see the passed she sees the future?

She saw his oath, though she didn't know what it meant - the one given to him with his sword in his cradle, with the seven broken towers all around to signify what the oath meant. I'd say that viewing is being fulfilled now - or was fulfilled, when he finally accepted his title, and the responsibility to lead Malkieri in battle against the Shadow.

 

Also when Noal dies he says tell a malkier jane farstrider died clean. (possible foreshadowing that lan will live and mat will be able to deliver the message since hes one of the few malkier that we know)

Possible, but it's weak as evidence that Lan will live.

 

Why do they continuely say that thought is faster then weaves yet in TOM in TAR perrin continuily uses his hammer and kicks, where as egwene weaves quite alot.

As Egwene says, she was doing it wrong...and she's one of the best. Aes Sedai will have a tendency to depend on what they know, which is channeling. Perrin also has this tendency with his hammer.

 

And lastly i found it random that the blue ajahs main custom is you cant marry, yet moiraine is going to marry Tom. (also that relationship seems really weird and forced, there last words to each other didnt even hint anything)

The custom is one of the arcane ones that Rafela was trying to revive, and it only states that they should 'refrain' from marriage, not that it is prohibited. But it's never been an issue because so few Aes Sedai choose to marry, and when they do it's almost always (maybe with no exceptions) a Warder.

[Luckers]

In alot of power meters i have seen posted around ranking the forsaken i often see lanfear as 3rd or 4th with rahvin in the middle somewhere, yet in foh either lanfear or rahvin states that rahvin is stronger then lan fear.

 

 

You can't trust the Forsaken's assessments of each other. For instance Moghedien infers that Nynaeve would be stronger than Rahvin at a time when Nynaeve was the same strength as Moghedien--essentially Moghedien's viewing Nynaeve's strength through a lens of her own self-importance.

 

Sammael was doing the same with Rahvin and Lanfear in the scene you are referencing. It means little, in either direction.

[NitroS]

There's nothing to prevent Rand from dueling with Lighteater (Sightblinder is the Aiel term) as the head of a circle of three. Brandon has indicated that this scenario will indeed happen:

 

Towers of Midnight book tour 8 November 2010 Lincoln Triangle Barnes and Noble NY, NY - Sarayne reporting

 

Q: Can you give us a hint on who the second woman will be in Rand’s circle? (With Callandor)

Brandon: Not really, but I can give you a tiny bit of information. She has already been introduced.

 

 

Thanks for the answers, like i said i thought i might have butchered a few quotes as i wrote small notations in my iphone. I thought Rand cant be at a head of a circle of 3 when using callandor? Doesnt the head mean melding the flows? and since its tainted without a woman directing the flows, wouldnt that mean that rand would have to sit and watch while 1 other melds? which is why i thought that that would be a weird situation for the prophecies fight with the dragon vs the dark one.

[NitroS]

In alot of power meters i have seen posted around ranking the forsaken i often see lanfear as 3rd or 4th with rahvin in the middle somewhere, yet in foh either lanfear or rahvin states that rahvin is stronger then lan fear.

 

 

You can't trust the Forsaken's assessments of each other. For instance Moghedien infers that Nynaeve would be stronger than Rahvin at a time when Nynaeve was the same strength as Moghedien--essentially Moghedien's viewing Nynaeve's strength through a lens of her own self-importance.

 

Sammael was doing the same with Rahvin and Lanfear in the scene you are referencing. It means little, in either direction.

hmmm didnt really think of that, i guess we will have to wait for the encyclopedia, then again strength int eh power doesnt even mean much since aginor said he matched lews therin in the hall of the servants and he was pretty useless in his 2 lives.

[Luckers]

Mmm. I should have mentioned that my point above was stated by RJ--the Forsaken are unreliable in their assessment of each others strengths and weaknesses.

[Terez]

There's nothing to prevent Rand from dueling with Lighteater (Sightblinder is the Aiel term) as the head of a circle of three. Brandon has indicated that this scenario will indeed happen:

 

Towers of Midnight book tour 8 November 2010 Lincoln Triangle Barnes and Noble NY, NY - Sarayne reporting

 

Q: Can you give us a hint on who the second woman will be in Rand’s circle? (With Callandor)

Brandon: Not really, but I can give you a tiny bit of information. She has already been introduced.

 

 

Thanks for the answers, like i said i thought i might have butchered a few quotes as i wrote small notations in my iphone. I thought Rand cant be at a head of a circle of 3 when using callandor? Doesnt the head mean melding the flows? and since its tainted without a woman directing the flows, wouldnt that mean that rand would have to sit and watch while 1 other melds? which is why i thought that that would be a weird situation for the prophecies fight with the dragon vs the dark one.

This is my assessment of the situation so far:

 

There is a big deal being made of Callandor's flaw. Min thinks it will open Rand to attack if he uses it. Nevertheless, the prophecy seems to indicate that he has to use it. Supposedly, it's only safe to use in a circle with two women, with one of them in control. However, it's not necessary for a woman to lead such a circle of three, so it's possible for Rand to lead it.

 

Back to the Cleansing. Remember how Eben Hopwil died? He was in a circle, and vulnerable to whatever because he wasn't in control of it. This reminds me of something Aviendha said to Egwene: "Men always believe they are in control of everything around them. When they find out they are not, they think they have failed, instead of learning a simple truth women already know."

 

Anyway. I think Rand will decide that Callandor can make him vulnerable because of the restrictions put on it by Cadsuane, whom he has decided not to bother with any more. Since the main dangers were 1) that it has no buffer to prevent overdose, and 2) it magnifies the taint, then obviously the second bit is no longer a problem, and the lack of a buffer is solved by the circle itself. Presumably the need for a woman in control was because of the magnification of the taint. Callandor itself is not tainted, unless it still 'induces wildness of the mind' without the taint. But I'm betting Rand will take that risk rather than risk Hopwil's 'failure'.

[DemandredFO]

Yes but Rand trusts Nyneave and Moraine, and Ebin was a slightly different situation in that a woman chanelled Saidin. On the other hand, I just recalled that both of them are under the blasted oaths. I don't see there being much chance of a mistake at Shayol Ghul, but Rand might want control anyway. If I were him, I'd get myself a binder and make them remove the oaths first. I also believe that the True Power will need to be used, why else would the pattern give Rand access. Also why mention it with the borderlanders.

[KaptainKaos]

Ah but would the "new" Rand even think to use the True Power even the Forsaken fear using it because of its negative effects on the mind, body and soul. When considering this question my mind goes right to his confrontation in Towers of Midnight with the Borderland kings and queens. He seems ashamed and fearful of what he would have done had he met with them before his epiphany on Dragonmount. As if now since he has become enlightened not only does he have the patience to endure their foolish approach to the Dragon Reborn but the sense to not draw on the True Power even if it was available to him. Just how I viewed events myself, plus I like the idea of the Dark One's True Power against the Creator's One Power but I would still like to see Moridin attack Rand with the True Power only to have his weaves cut with Rand's own channeling of the True Power. Then them having a crazy battle that no one can really follow but Rand and Moridin.

[DemandredFO]

I think one of the four monarchs why he met them in Far Madding and he said the guardian only blocks access to the one power. Also there is his journey to the tower. I think he was so calm shielded was because he could've used the True Power to break it if necessary.

[Terez]

Yes but Rand trusts Nyneave and Moraine, and Ebin was a slightly different situation in that a woman chanelled Saidin.

Don't you think Eben trusted Daighan?

 

On the other hand, I just recalled that both of them are under the blasted oaths.

That doesn't make much difference.

[Finnssss22]

 

In alot of power meters i have seen posted around ranking the forsaken i often see lanfear as 3rd or 4th with rahvin in the middle somewhere, yet in foh either lanfear or rahvin states that rahvin is stronger then lan fear.

 

Just to add to what Terez mentioned about RJ's quotes on the subject. He explained it that just like strength of arm, men are generally stronger than women in the power. That the strongest men are stronger than the strongest women as well. What he added though, was that women are far more dexterousness with their weaving than men and that they can make up a few levels of strength with it.

(I believe this has to do with how each sex controls the power. Women surrender and guide Saidar, while men have to aggressively take hold of and fight with Saidin, just my personal theory though.)

 

 

In tuons prophecy the dragon being blinded by light is that in reference to super rand? also the kereathon cycle (sp) mentions that the dragon will bind all nations to him before the last battle, yet many people on here are still in question on whether the seanchan will be with him....

 

Again, just adding here but it should be mentioned that some of the Seanchan prophecies come from the Essanik Cycle which differs from the KC.

As you already put forth, most believe it is the Seanchan copy of the KC that was corrupted by Ishy.

The Essanik cycle, with what little we know and according to BS, is apparently a collection of only damane foretellings and should be relatively pure.

Although, I do wonder what would happen if a damane foretelling contradicts something in their KC. Which would/did they give precedence to...we may never know I guess.