hounds on the prowl

[Dreggs Morlock]

I am sure this has been posted, or at least MENTIONED... but I'm having problems with details, and cannot remember specifics.

 

There has been several hints made to us by RJ that there is a a pack of dark hounds on the hunt for something, or someone.  Who, we don't know, and we never seem to get enough information to keep a thread moving (if there ever was one specificially made on this subject).

 

Can anyone refresh my brain cells on this topic?  What I'm looking for is when we first head about them, who was the character that noted it (I am pretty sure it was Matrim, but I am not positive), and has it been mentioned recently (as in the last 2-3 books recently)?

 

Thanks to anyone who can fill me in...  I'm the proud father of 4 children, and to quote a great song by Rush, there are too many hands on my time.

[Luckers]

The Darkhound Pack is mentioned in Crossroads of Twilight. It circles Perrin's camp three times before continuing further south into Altara. There are about fifty Darkhounds in the Pack, which is weird (normally that many would turn on each other). Masuri says she has never encountered this pack, and she has encountered seven, which is apparently alot. She also says they feel like they have been hunting their prey for sometime, and it has been eluding them. The most commonly suggested target of the pack is Fain, though I'm not sold on that answer. Can't say I have an alternative--I wondered about it possibly being Tuon, but she wasn't missing long enough to be said to be eluding the pack for some time--but it just seems odd to me that they would send Darkhounds to hunt someone who travels by the Ways.

 

*shrug*.

[MikeRiley]

Maybe they sensed their target in Perrin's camp and it traveled away before they got there. Not Perrin or Rand but somebody else who could channel. It isn't likely there's a renegade forsaken the dark hounds are after but it could be Black Ajah or somebody with Slayer's ability to step into TAR. Of course this late in the series a second Slayer is also unlikely.

[DocBean]

Fain is the one that bounces around a lot.

he's also got some ability to hide himself from other Darkfriends, while being able to spot all darkfriends.

This makes it impossible for the Dark One or his minions to send a darkfriend after him.

 

Which is why Slayer is hunting him, and why the Darkhounds are hunting him.

 

The Title of an entire book (Crossroads of Twilight) eluded to the Darkhounds, which is probably why it was the worst book.

They did nothing. Which really sucks because that was the best title in the series.

 

That makes me think that Fain will play a huge role in bringing down the Bad Guys.

The Dark One wants him out of the picture bad.

[Dreggs Morlock]

I could have sworn we saw that pack earlier in the series, only with not so many details.  I guess I have to go a lookin'... blah.

 

Fain is the easy answer, but I have never been sold on it; after all, did Fain run three times around Perrin's camp before moving on?  If not, why would the hounds do that?

 

Personally, I think they sensed something (or someone) that was extremely similar to their prey... enough to make them circle three times, after all.

[Crael123]

yes i wonder why the DO wants Fain dead so badly

[Dreggs Morlock]

Now, I'm not going to try to state the claim that this could be the big BUT, but it has been one for me. I've always been a reader who enjoys "action off camara", so to speak, and RJ is a God when it comes to stuff like that.  He employs the Chekov's gun art to its fullest, to a point where you aren't even sure if it's a real gun or a water pistol.

 

I'll try to go and look for the other reference I'm thinking of, but it will take me a number of days; I was not "kidding" when I mentioned my kids... hehe.  I might be mixing up the Perrin discovery with a legitimate hound sighting that is completely unrelated.  I DO know that when Perrin comes across the hound tracks, my first thought was it wasn't the first time the heavies on the light side have seen such things, just as vague.

[Dreggs Morlock]

The thirteenth repository tells me they have not made an appearance since Rand's fight with them in FotH... so I might be all screwy.

[Kaznen]

Could be Mat.  He has a knock for falling off the forsakens' radar (and anyone else's) and Sammy knew he was in Altara before he died.

 

Judging by how the Gollum never sought Mat out until KoD I don't think it was what Sammy sent to take care of Mat.

[Rootbeer]

If the Forsaken sent dark hounds specifically to kill Mat, then the order should include Perrin too. It makes more sense. Unless Mat has done something new to warrant the full attention of 50+ dark hounds, I say it's a safe bet that their target was someone else.

 

As for why the DO wants Fain gone...

Remember, Fain's evil is the polar opposite of the DO's evil.

And we haven't seen him in a while. Who knows how powerful he might've gotten. I say there's a very good chance that he'll become very useful to the Light, whether he lik... Actually, he might just join Rand and friends in the Last Battle, considering how Fain's evil came about.

[Charlz Fel]

Actually, he might just join Rand and friends in the Last Battle, considering how Fain's evil came about.

Only problem is, Fain, being mad, hates Rand at least as much as he hates the Dark One.

[Duskfire]

Could be Mat.  He has a knock for falling off the forsakens' radar (and anyone else's) and Sammy knew he was in Altara before he died.

 

Judging by how the Gollum never sought Mat out until KoD I don't think it was what Sammy sent to take care of Mat.

 

The Gholams main target was Elayne; Mat was a secondary target which the Gholam followed after it had lost Elaynes scent and Mat managed to hurt it - the first time its ever felt pain. The Gholam was certainly sent by Sammael; the timing fits too perfectly.

 

These Darkhounds had been after their target for some time and were frustrated, which suggests they had been unable to find him. Not only had Mat been stuck in Ebou Dar for ages, but at the time he was travelling with Valan Luca, quite slowly to I might add. Darkhounds would easily have been able to catch up to him.

 

Its probably Rand or Fain. Maybe even Loial; I imagine the Shadow isnt a huge fan of those waygated being closed, and he has been teleporting around everywhere.

[Kaznen]

Could be Mat.  He has a knock for falling off the forsakens' radar (and anyone else's) and Sammy knew he was in Altara before he died.

 

Judging by how the Gollum never sought Mat out until KoD I don't think it was what Sammy sent to take care of Mat.

 

The Gholams main target was Elayne; Mat was a secondary target which the Gholam followed after it had lost Elaynes scent and Mat managed to hurt it - the first time its ever felt pain. The Gholam was certainly sent by Sammael; the timing fits too perfectly.

 

After Elayne left Mat spent a lot of time in bed healing up, unable to go anywhere or move a whole lot, and every one knew Tylin's pretty was healing up in the palace.  Didn't have a better opportunity to get him.

 

Then when they fought in WH the Gholam said there were others that needed killing and when he left Mat was left alone for the rest of the book.

 

After they hid in the Traveling show they were stuck there for about a month.  I'm certain the critter's tracking skills could have found him.

 

These Darkhounds had been after their target for some time and were frustrated, which suggests they had been unable to find him. Not only had Mat been stuck in Ebou Dar for ages, but at the time he was travelling with Valan Luca, quite slowly to I might add. Darkhounds would easily have been able to catch up to him.

 

Its probably Rand or Fain. Maybe even Loial; I imagine the Shadow isnt a huge fan of those waygated being closed, and he has been teleporting around everywhere.

Sammy couldn't send darkhounds through a gateway so they had to run from Illian to Altara and Sammy didn't know much about Mat being in Ebou Dar other then he was.  He just told Caridin he take care of it and left.  Then he died.

[Dida]

I am sure this has been posted, or at least MENTIONED... but I'm having problems with details, and cannot remember specifics.

 

There has been several hints made to us by RJ that there is a a pack of dark hounds on the hunt for something, or someone.  Who, we don't know, and we never seem to get enough information to keep a thread moving (if there ever was one specificially made on this subject).

 

 

  There have been multiple packs of Darkhounds, Shadowbrothers, black dogs mentioned across the whole series of books. 

 

 

  However, it sounds like your thinking of the very large pack of 50+(?) who's markings Perrin and his army came across in 'Crossroads of Twilight' Chapters 6, 7, 8.

 

 

  Other Darkhound sights include:

 

  In 'The Dragon Reborn': Rand is forced to kill a Darkhounds in the 3rd Constant. (Chapter 9)

  In 'The Dragon Reborn': Perrin smells sulphurous markings of Darkhounds at Jarra and at Remen. (Chapter 33)  Note the town of Jarra abuts the Mountains of Mist in Ghealdin, while Remen lies next to the Manetherendrelle River.

  In 'The Dragon Reborn': Sammael send a pack of ten after Moiraine, Lan, Perrin, Faile, Loial in Illian which was Balefired. (Chapters 43, 44)

 

  In 'The Fires of Heaven':  Rahvin sent a pack after Rand, Mat, Asmodean of which Rand Balefired the packs of numbering three & three which came after himself and Mat. Unknown what happened to the pack of 3 or 4 which circled Asmodean's room and left footprinting on stone.

 

  Here is part of a scene when Rand balefires the first pack of Darkhounds in Rhuidean. One odd thing I noticed is their appearance when dying by balefire, their "colors", which seems similar to what Egwene later describes seeing in Tanchico while Dreamwalking in the 3rd Constant.

 

Laughing to himself, he let the sword go, though he held on to saidin, to the raging Power, the sweetness and the taint. Contempt slid along the outside of the Void. Dogs. Shadowspawn, certainly, but still just . . . Laughter died.

 

Slowly, the dead dogs and their heads were melting, settling into pools of liquid shadow that quivered slightly, as if alive. Their blood fanned across the floor, trembled. Suddenly the smaller pools flowed across the floor in viscous streams to merge with the larger, which oozed away from the mosaic to mound higher and higher, until the three huge black dogs stood there once more, slavering and snarling as they gathered massive haunches under them.

 

He did not know why he felt surprise, dim outside the emptiness. Dogs, yes, but Shadowspawn. Whoever had sent them had not been as careless as he had thought. But they still did not know him.

Instead of reaching for the sword again, he channeled as he remembered doing once long ago. Howling, the huge dogs leaped, and a thick shaft of white light shot from his hands, like molten steel, like liquid fire. He swept it across the springing creatures; for an instant they became strange shadows of themselves, all colors reversed, and then they were made of sparkling motes that broke apart, smaller and smaller, until there was nothing.

 

He let go of the thing he had made, with a grim smile. A purple bar of light still seemed to cross his vision in afterimage.

 

 

The Fires of Heaven, Chapter 6 "Gateways" - Rand point of view, in his room in Rhuidean. Moiraine enters the scene just after this quote ends

 

 

  In 'The Shadow Rising':  Egwene spots what might be a pack of Darkhounds in Tanchico while being in the 3rd Constant. 

 

 

She set out through the empty city, walking fast, sometimes trotting. Winding, stone paved streets slanted up and down, curving every which way, all empty, except for green backed pigeons and pale gray gulls that rose in thunderclaps of wings when she came close. Why birds and not people? Flies buzzed by, and she could see roaches and beetles scurrying along in the shadows. A pack of lean dogs, all different colors, loped across the street far ahead of her. Why dogs?

 

  She pulled herself back to why she was there. What would be a sign of the Black Ajah? Or of this danger to Rand, if it existed? Most of the white buildings were plastered, the plaster chipped and cracked, often showing weathered wood or pale brown brick beneath. Only the towers and the larger structures—palaces, she supposed—were stone, if still white. Even the stone had tiny fissures, though, most of it; cracks too minute for the eye to catch, but she could feel them with the Power in her, spiderwebbing domes and towers. Perhaps that meant something. Perhaps it meant Tanchico was a city not looked after by its inhabitants. As likely that as anything else.

 

The Shadow Rising, Chapter 11 'What Lies Hidden' - Egwene point of view, while in the TAR or 3rd Constant.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Moving on to speculations:

 

For all we know Moghedien has a pack of Darkhounds on the hunt now. Why?  Because Moghedien word usage refers to packs, pack-mistress, dog whip repeatedly.  A bit vague, I understand yet its exists in the texts.

 

“So you will be the only one in this ill-ordered pack who does not need to learn who her mistress is?” Moghedien quirked an eyebrow. “I would not have thought it of you.” The glow around her vanished. “I have tasks for you. For all of you. Whatever you have been doing, you will forget. You are an inept lot, as you proved in Tanchico. With my hand on the dog whip, perhaps you will hunt more successfully.”

 

Moiraine prior deduction probably was correct about the Darkhounds after Rand during his crossing of Ghealdin in Jarra & northern Altara in Remen.  As there is a good chance those black dogs were send by Moghedien. Yes, that's only an educated guess, not solid proof. Though Moghedien seems to be connected to Masema's rise as the Prophet in Ghealdin, as well as the leadership chaos occurring in Ghealdin during the early part of WoT series.

 

 

 

An Old song about 'trust' and the sound of the grave-dog's bark:

 

Give me your trust, said the Aes Sedai.

On my shoulders I support the sky.

Trust me to know and to do what is best,

And I will take care of the rest.

    but trust is the color of a dark seed growing.

    trust is the color of a heart’s blood flowing.

    trust is the color of a soul’s last breath.

    trust is the color of death.

 

...

 

Give me your trust, said the queen on her throne,

for I must bear the burden all alone.

Trust me to lead and to judge and to rule,

and no man will think you a fool.

    but trust is the sound of the grave-dog’s bark.

    trust is the sound of betrayal in the dark.

    trust is the sound of a soul’s last breath.

    trust is the sound of death.

 

...

 

He strode on down the street to the next bonfire as much to get away from that song as anything, before it went on through “the king on high” and “the lady and lord” to “the love of your life” in his head. In that old memory he remembered writing that song, because of the love of his life. Trust is the taste of death.

 

 

Source: Lord of Chaos, Chapter 44 "The Color of Trust" - Mat Cauthon point of view

 

 

  Curiously Mat has heard distant dogs bark into the Swovan Night, then is later attacked by three darkfriend beggers in Ebou Dar.  Seems as if the old songs Mat knows have an element of truth to them.

 

 

  Night came slowly over Ebou Dar, the glow of the white buildings resisting darkness. Small knots and bunches of Swovan Night revelers with little sprigs of evergreen in their hair danced in the streets beneath a bright three-quarter moon, few carrying so much as a lantern as they gamboled to the music of flutes and drums and horns that drifted from inns and palaces, dancing their way from one set of festivities to another, but for the most part the streets lay empty. A distant dog barked, and another, closer, answered furiously until it suddenly yelped and fell silent.

 

  Balanced on his toes, Mat listened, eyes searching the moonshadows. Only a cat moved, slinking along the street. The slap of running bare feet faded. The owner of one pair should be staggering, and the other bleeding. As he bent, his foot kicked a club as long as his arm on the paving stones; heavy brass studs shone in the moonlight. That would have broken his skull for sure. Shaking his head, he wiped his knife on the ragged coat worn by the man at his feet. Open eyes stared at the night sky from a dirty, creased face. A beggar, by the look and smell of him. Mat had not heard of beggars attacking people, but maybe times were harder than he thought. A large jute sack lay near one outstretched hand. The fellows certainly had been optimistic about what they would find in his pockets. The thing could have covered him from head to knees.

 

 

Source: A Crown of Swords, Chapter 21 "Swovan Night" - Mat Cauthon point of view, in Ebou Dar at Night.

 

 

[Duskfire]

After Elayne left Mat spent a lot of time in bed healing up, unable to go anywhere or move a whole lot, and every one knew Tylin's pretty was healing up in the palace.  Didn't have a better opportunity to get him.

 

Then when they fought in WH the Gholam said there were others that needed killing and when he left Mat was left alone for the rest of the book.

 

After they hid in the Traveling show they were stuck there for about a month.  I'm certain the critter's tracking skills could have found him.

 

Mats been surrounded by people though. The Gholam hates to be seen unless neccessary. For instance, it didnt run from Mat in WH until Noal Cherin came along. Not to mention, the Gholam is tracking him; Thom tells Mat that there was a Gholam-like kill in Jurador, which suggests that the Gholam is indeed following him, and waiting for the right moment to strike when Mat doesn't have 50 people around him.

 

Sammael tells Carridin he will send someone to deal with the Aes Sedai. The Gholam shows up. He tells Mat that "he wants you dead as much as her." Then we get the Gholams POV in TPoD where he was thinking to himself how he had been commanded to take on the Aes Sedai and Mat, but was going after the women because they were an easier target.

 

In short, I dont know how anyone could argue against Sammael sending the Gholam against Mat, since it basically states it a number of times.

[Kaznen]

Elyane was the primary target.  Mat was an attack of opportunity in CoS.  Then there were others to kill before he got around to Mat.  He could have gotten into the Palace in the middle of the night and into his room with Tylin without anyone noticing (he can slide through a crack in the wall).  If there are a few others around (like in CoS) he doesn't worry but a mob could tear him apart.

 

 

[Duskfire]

Elyane was the primary target.  Mat was an attack of opportunity in CoS.  Then there were others to kill before he got around to Mat.  He could have gotten into the Palace in the middle of the night and into his room with Tylin without anyone noticing (he can slide through a crack in the wall).  If there are a few others around (like in CoS) he doesn't worry but a mob could tear him apart.

 

 

 

What? He wasnt an attack of opportunity at all. I agree that Elayne was largely the primary target, but the Gholam himself thinks: "The man who had wounded it was not with them; it had made sure of that before leaving the high vantage place. The one who commanded it wanted the man who wounded it dead perhaps as much as he did the women, but the women were a much easier target."

 

The one who commanded it was Sammael, and right there the Gholam states that Sammael wanted Mat dead. Therefore, Sammael sent the Gholam after Mat. There's no real argument here at all. Just because it had more then one target doesn't change that Mat was one such target.

[Kaznen]

I never said Sammy didn't dispatch him.  It's agreed he did.  And I'm not arguing he wasn't a target, but seeing as how the Ghollom took his sweet time to get to Mat I'm saying Mat wasn't high priority.  And Sammy sent the darkhounds to cover his bases.

[MikeRiley]

  In 'The Shadow Rising':  Egwene spots what might be a pack of Darkhounds in Tanchico while being in the 3rd Constant. 

 

 

She set out through the empty city, walking fast, sometimes trotting. Winding, stone paved streets slanted up and down, curving every which way, all empty, except for green backed pigeons and pale gray gulls that rose in thunderclaps of wings when she came close. Why birds and not people? Flies buzzed by, and she could see roaches and beetles scurrying along in the shadows. A pack of lean dogs, all different colors, loped across the street far ahead of her. Why dogs?

 

  She pulled herself back to why she was there. What would be a sign of the Black Ajah? Or of this danger to Rand, if it existed? Most of the white buildings were plastered, the plaster chipped and cracked, often showing weathered wood or pale brown brick beneath. Only the towers and the larger structures—palaces, she supposed—were stone, if still white. Even the stone had tiny fissures, though, most of it; cracks too minute for the eye to catch, but she could feel them with the Power in her, spiderwebbing domes and towers. Perhaps that meant something. Perhaps it meant Tanchico was a city not looked after by its inhabitants. As likely that as anything else.

 

The Shadow Rising, Chapter 11 'What Lies Hidden' - Egwene point of view, while in the TAR or 3rd Constant.

 

 

Those dogs she saw were not darkhounds. The quote provided about Rand balefiring the darkhound in Rhuidean does not say different colors. The colors were just reversed, so instead of being all shades of black they would become all shades of white. You see this in photo negatives. Egwene was speculating on why there would be dogs in TAR when other animals were not. The point to this was that Tanchico fell into such a bad state that the dogs were no longer domesticated and have become feral animals. Domesticated animals do not appear in TAR while wild ones do.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Moving on to speculations:

 

For all we know Moghedien has a pack of Darkhounds on the hunt now. Why?  Because Moghedien word usage refers to packs, pack-mistress, dog whip repeatedly.  A bit vague, I understand yet its exists in the texts.

 

“So you will be the only one in this ill-ordered pack who does not need to learn who her mistress is?” Moghedien quirked an eyebrow. “I would not have thought it of you.” The glow around her vanished. “I have tasks for you. For all of you. Whatever you have been doing, you will forget. You are an inept lot, as you proved in Tanchico. With my hand on the dog whip, perhaps you will hunt more successfully.”

 

Moiraine prior deduction probably was correct about the Darkhounds after Rand during his crossing of Ghealdin in Jarra & northern Altara in Remen.  As there is a good chance those black dogs were send by Moghedien. Yes, that's only an educated guess, not solid proof. Though Moghedien seems to be connected to Masema's rise as the Prophet in Ghealdin, as well as the leadership chaos occurring in Ghealdin during the early part of WoT series.

 

 

This is really shaky. By this logic Liandrin controls a pack too because she often refers to the men working under her as dogs. Fain is also referred to as the Dark One's hound, and Slayer can be considered as such too. Sometimes "dog" and all forms of it are just considered an insult meant to humiliate those around them. As is the case with Moghedien who probably was just rubbing it in with Liandrin and co for their talking that way.

 

 

 

An Old song about 'trust' and the sound of the grave-dog's bark:

 

Give me your trust, said the Aes Sedai.

On my shoulders I support the sky.

Trust me to know and to do what is best,

And I will take care of the rest.

    but trust is the color of a dark seed growing.

    trust is the color of a heart’s blood flowing.

    trust is the color of a soul’s last breath.

    trust is the color of death.

 

...

 

Give me your trust, said the queen on her throne,

for I must bear the burden all alone.

Trust me to lead and to judge and to rule,

and no man will think you a fool.

    but trust is the sound of the grave-dog’s bark.

    trust is the sound of betrayal in the dark.

    trust is the sound of a soul’s last breath.

    trust is the sound of death.

 

...

 

He strode on down the street to the next bonfire as much to get away from that song as anything, before it went on through “the king on high” and “the lady and lord” to “the love of your life” in his head. In that old memory he remembered writing that song, because of the love of his life. Trust is the taste of death.

 

 

Source: Lord of Chaos, Chapter 44 "The Color of Trust" - Mat Cauthon point of view

 

The grave-dogs probably just refer to scavengers. It's used pretty often outside the books. After a battle if the bodies are not disposed of, the scavengers will feast. Near cities there will be a number of dogs on the field.

 

 

  Curiously Mat has heard distant dogs bark into the Swovan Night, then is later attacked by three darkfriend beggers in Ebou Dar.  Seems as if the old songs Mat knows have an element of truth to them.

 

 

  Night came slowly over Ebou Dar, the glow of the white buildings resisting darkness. Small knots and bunches of Swovan Night revelers with little sprigs of evergreen in their hair danced in the streets beneath a bright three-quarter moon, few carrying so much as a lantern as they gamboled to the music of flutes and drums and horns that drifted from inns and palaces, dancing their way from one set of festivities to another, but for the most part the streets lay empty. A distant dog barked, and another, closer, answered furiously until it suddenly yelped and fell silent.

 

  Balanced on his toes, Mat listened, eyes searching the moonshadows. Only a cat moved, slinking along the street. The slap of running bare feet faded. The owner of one pair should be staggering, and the other bleeding. As he bent, his foot kicked a club as long as his arm on the paving stones; heavy brass studs shone in the moonlight. That would have broken his skull for sure. Shaking his head, he wiped his knife on the ragged coat worn by the man at his feet. Open eyes stared at the night sky from a dirty, creased face. A beggar, by the look and smell of him. Mat had not heard of beggars attacking people, but maybe times were harder than he thought. A large jute sack lay near one outstretched hand. The fellows certainly had been optimistic about what they would find in his pockets. The thing could have covered him from head to knees.

 

 

Source: A Crown of Swords, Chapter 21 "Swovan Night" - Mat Cauthon point of view, in Ebou Dar at Night.

 

Those were regular dogs. This sort of thing happens very often in cities. One dog barks then another barks furiously at it. There's nothing abnormal about Mat's hearing dogs barking. That's about all he would really hear if he was on some quiet streets. We also hear a dog barking in this manner as Moiraine's party rushes through some town on their flight from Emond's Field.

 

 

 

 

If there were a number of packs set to hunt Rand and they were chasing after him while he traveled from one location to another for a year it's possible that the packs would have melded and ended up on the same paths after a while. Was Rand in Perrin's camp at all? They would have sensed his presence and ran there then moved in the direction he traveled towards. It's possible Perrin is so similar to Rand to them that once they got close they had to keep in that direction to check out the scent further - they did run around the camp a few times so they were confused. That many would have gone right to their target otherwise.

 

The way I pictured this when I first read the series was that. Rand travels to Caemlyn so the darkhound packs all rush to Caemlyn - only by the time they get there he's traveled to Cairhien, so they rush there instead. They run into other packs and their numbers grow. If Rand didn't visit Perrin's camp (and come to think of it, he probably didn't) then Perrin's camp was probably just in the darkhounds' path and they confused him for Rand for a bit. It had a sense of "Their hunting somebody.. not me" Might actually have come from the books in other words, but it did seem a nod towards Rand. Call it the Wild Hunt since they've been chasing so long.

[Dida]

  In 'The Shadow Rising':  Egwene spots what might be a pack of Darkhounds in Tanchico while being in the 3rd Constant. 

 

 

She set out through the empty city, walking fast, sometimes trotting. Winding, stone paved streets slanted up and down, curving every which way, all empty, except for green backed pigeons and pale gray gulls that rose in thunderclaps of wings when she came close. Why birds and not people? Flies buzzed by, and she could see roaches and beetles scurrying along in the shadows. A pack of lean dogs, all different colors, loped across the street far ahead of her. Why dogs?

 

  She pulled herself back to why she was there. What would be a sign of the Black Ajah? Or of this danger to Rand, if it existed? Most of the white buildings were plastered, the plaster chipped and cracked, often showing weathered wood or pale brown brick beneath. Only the towers and the larger structures—palaces, she supposed—were stone, if still white. Even the stone had tiny fissures, though, most of it; cracks too minute for the eye to catch, but she could feel them with the Power in her, spiderwebbing domes and towers. Perhaps that meant something. Perhaps it meant Tanchico was a city not looked after by its inhabitants. As likely that as anything else.

 

The Shadow Rising, Chapter 11 'What Lies Hidden' - Egwene point of view, while in the TAR or 3rd Constant.

 

 

Those dogs she saw were not darkhounds. The quote provided about Rand balefiring the darkhound in Rhuidean does not say different colors. The colors were just reversed, so instead of being all shades of black they would become all shades of white. You see this in photo negatives. Egwene was speculating on why there would be dogs in TAR when other animals were not. The point to this was that Tanchico fell into such a bad state that the dogs were no longer domesticated and have become feral animals. Domesticated animals do not appear in TAR while wild ones do.

 

 

  Egwene has never seen Darkhounds before, so how is she to know what the hell a Darkhound looks like?  Let alone that Darkhounds can and do walk in the 3rd Constant?  Egwene was a totally untrained newbie in the TAR at that time in the story, too.  In another scene, reader see Hopper's reaction to learning there are Shadowbrothers close to Perrin, and he says flee the Shadowbrothers.

 

  Laugh, just wild dogs in the TAR in a pack roaming a city?  Sorry but that's not a common place for wild dogs to want to dream of.  More likely those were Shadowbrothers, and are one of the many causes of evil felt by Amys in the city of Tanchico.

 

 

 

 

 

Moving on to speculations:

 

For all we know Moghedien has a pack of Darkhounds on the hunt now. Why?  Because Moghedien word usage refers to packs, pack-mistress, dog whip repeatedly.  A bit vague, I understand yet its exists in the texts.

 

 

This is really shaky. By this logic Liandrin controls a pack too because she often refers to the men working under her as dogs. Fain is also referred to as the Dark One's hound, and Slayer can be considered as such too. Sometimes "dog" and all forms of it are just considered an insult meant to humiliate those around them. As is the case with Moghedien who probably was just rubbing it in with Liandrin and co for their talking that way.

 

  There is a good reason why I called Moghedien use of Darkhounds "speculations", I never claimed it was a "solid fact".  Yet to downplay the symbolic and practical uses of "dogs", "darkhounds", "wolves" in the Wheel of Time is to miss one of the themes of the story.  Just like missing "hawks", "sky" symbols connected to various characters and plot elements.  Both the Light & the Shadow sides have ties to "dogs" whether domesticated or wild; and "darkhounds" or "wolves".

 

 

  Moghedien is tied to the chaos in the nation of Ghealdin, and to the Prophet (Masema). And yes, Darkhounds were seen in Jarra which is in Ghealdin, likewise in Remen which is in Northern Altara.  It explains why Moghedien was meeting with Graendal and knew of Lanfear's general plans as Lanfear had visited Tanchico previously.  Moghedien was watching every Chosen who had an interest in the areas surrounding Ghealdin: Sammael in Illian, Rahvin in Andor, Lanfear who had visited Tanchico.  Yet Moghedien did not know that Be'lal was in Tear until Nynaeve & Elayne told Moghedien about him dying to Rand.  The Prophet only starts using Rand's name (tSR, Ch.47) after Moghedien little meeting with Nynaeve & Elayne (tSR,Ch.46).  Before that meeting the Prophet did not use Rand's name (tSR, Ch.17).   

 

  I did not claim that any Black Ajah controlled Darkhounds. A few might, however I know of no direct or implied evidence to support that as of now, after +20 re-reads over the years.   

 

 

An Old song about 'trust' and the sound of the grave-dog's bark:

 

Give me your trust, said the Aes Sedai.

On my shoulders I support the sky.

Trust me to know and to do what is best,

And I will take care of the rest.

    but trust is the color of a dark seed growing.

    trust is the color of a heart’s blood flowing.

    trust is the color of a soul’s last breath.

    trust is the color of death.

 

...

 

Give me your trust, said the queen on her throne,

for I must bear the burden all alone.

Trust me to lead and to judge and to rule,

and no man will think you a fool.

    but trust is the sound of the grave-dog’s bark.

    trust is the sound of betrayal in the dark.

    trust is the sound of a soul’s last breath.

    trust is the sound of death.

 

...

 

He strode on down the street to the next bonfire as much to get away from that song as anything, before it went on through “the king on high” and “the lady and lord” to “the love of your life” in his head. In that old memory he remembered writing that song, because of the love of his life. Trust is the taste of death.

 

 

Source: Lord of Chaos, Chapter 44 "The Color of Trust" - Mat Cauthon point of view

 

The grave-dogs probably just refer to scavengers. It's used pretty often outside the books. After a battle if the bodies are not disposed of, the scavengers will feast. Near cities there will be a number of dogs on the field.

 

 

  This particular song recollected by Mat Cauthon, I'd put more into the category of 'Omens' of which there are many set across the series. Not limited to only Darkhounds.  So I expect a one or more dogs barking into the night in the next book, as many people are going to dying soon.  'Betrayal of Trust' should be common one theme too.  Betrayal of the Shadow, Betrayal of the Light.  War, Death. Trust, Death. Love, Death.

 

  Perrin's story line is perhaps more likely to hear grave-yard dogs in the next book, considering his area is set in the middle of the two empty corridors which Shadowspawn are highly likely going to use soon:  the Mountains of Mist, and Ebou Dar up toward Manetherendrelle River at Whitebridge. 

 

 

  Curiously Mat has heard distant dogs bark into the Swovan Night, then is later attacked by three darkfriend beggers in Ebou Dar.  Seems as if the old songs Mat knows have an element of truth to them.

 

 

  Night came slowly over Ebou Dar, the glow of the white buildings resisting darkness. Small knots and bunches of Swovan Night revelers with little sprigs of evergreen in their hair danced in the streets beneath a bright three-quarter moon, few carrying so much as a lantern as they gamboled to the music of flutes and drums and horns that drifted from inns and palaces, dancing their way from one set of festivities to another, but for the most part the streets lay empty. A distant dog barked, and another, closer, answered furiously until it suddenly yelped and fell silent.

 

  Balanced on his toes, Mat listened, eyes searching the moonshadows. Only a cat moved, slinking along the street. The slap of running bare feet faded. The owner of one pair should be staggering, and the other bleeding. As he bent, his foot kicked a club as long as his arm on the paving stones; heavy brass studs shone in the moonlight. That would have broken his skull for sure. Shaking his head, he wiped his knife on the ragged coat worn by the man at his feet. Open eyes stared at the night sky from a dirty, creased face. A beggar, by the look and smell of him. Mat had not heard of beggars attacking people, but maybe times were harder than he thought. A large jute sack lay near one outstretched hand. The fellows certainly had been optimistic about what they would find in his pockets. The thing could have covered him from head to knees.

 

 

Source: A Crown of Swords, Chapter 21 "Swovan Night" - Mat Cauthon point of view, in Ebou Dar at Night.

 

 

Those were regular dogs. This sort of thing happens very often in cities. One dog barks then another barks furiously at it. There's nothing abnormal about Mat's hearing dogs barking. That's about all he would really hear if he was on some quiet streets. We also hear a dog barking in this manner as Moiraine's party rushes through some town on their flight from Emond's Field.

 

 

    When dog's bark into the night's darkness in the Wheel of Time bad things occur, it is an 'Omen'.  It does not matter if its a regular dogs, darkhounds, or even wolves.  Mat's song has embedded within it an 'Omen' or truth if you will, and that scene above is one piece of evidence supporting this. 

[MikeRiley]

   Egwene has never seen Darkhounds before, so how is she to know what the hell a Darkhound looks like?  Let alone that Darkhounds can and do walk in the 3rd Constant?  Egwene was a totally untrained newbie in the TAR at that time in the story, too.   In another scene, reader see Hopper's reaction to learning there are Shadowbrothers close to Perrin, and he says flee the Shadowbrothers.

 

   Laugh, just wild dogs in the TAR in a pack roaming a city?  Sorry but that's not a common place for wild dogs to want to dream of.   More likely those were Shadowbrothers, and are one of the many causes of evil felt by Amys in the city of Tanchico.

 

Darkhounds won't ever be mistaken for anything but what they are. They also are unlikely to be many colors like the pack was in TAR. That pack of wild dogs is in the city because that is where they live in the real world. It was a note that Tanchico has fallen so far that the dogs have become wild - they are no longer domesticated and run in packs in the city and thus are able to enter TAR. Why do the beetles dream of themselves in Tanchico? Same reason the dogs do. That is where they are.

 

As for the song being an omen, it's possible. I don't have an argument against it and wouldn't have a problem with it. I assumed your points were suggesting there were darkhounds in Ebou Dar and those were what Mat heard before the darkfriend attack. I find it more believable that they are purely coincidence, but this is something we're not likely to ever have confirmed within the books.