[Red's Stnd Mafia] Saw Mafia - GAME OVER CONGRADS MAFIA!!

[DPR]

I'm on the hook here, no doubt about it, and I'm doing the best I can with what I've been given. But, one thing that always makes me think someone is mafia is when they cry, and scream, and carry on that they're not, and go on about why you should believe them. I ain't asking you to do that - I've explained my circumstance, and if you don't believe me, you'll vote for me and lynch me, simple as that. We've all been there...

 

But, I won't just hand the game over to the mafia, so I'm going ask a few questions of everybody:

 

1. Do you think I was the most likely player to be investigated last night? (We know we have a Cop because we had an SK.)

2. If that answer was yes, and no one has revealed to name me mafia, then I'm innocent, right? (Again, Torrie is the only player that has not posted - but she did log on today, and anybody who "found" a mafia would post that kind of info right away.)

 

If you are still unsure:

 

3. Why does Verbal refuse to answer my questions? Why does Torrie? i have made every effort  to answer every question asked of me - I know my rep and I'm trying to gain trust by being open. Verb and Torrie keep ducking and dodging.

 

The Verb / Torrie connection is my theory - I know - but it's not like I'm getting it from nowhere. But let's keep going, because...

 

Most importantly:

 

4. Why would any mod ever require a mafioso to reveal themselves?  The code was given to me as a freaking night action, with instructions to post it. This would be way to obvious - and what purpose would that serve? Whoever posted it would be a garaunteed mafia. Why even bother playing? From what I've seen so far, Red is going to be a hellacious mod, and that just doesn't fit.

 

Now, to be clear, the tan color was my idea, as was setting up the trap. For all the good that it did me...

 

I've also thought a lot about the code, and have some ideas, but I'll wait to discuss them until we sort this out - i don't want to "confuse" things any more than they have been.

 

So, in summary, I'm saying that the code was sent to me to frame me. I believe that Verby and Torrie are mafia, along with a third I have not yet identified. I was half expecting them to fake reveal as Cop and name me as mafia just to bump me off (and it would have been a great move - give up one mafia to insure that Pandy, Nae, and DPR are out of the game? A priceless trade that would set the mafia up for an N4 win. But they didn't do it...). And, sadly, I was hoping that somebody was going to notice that Torrie logged on at 11:40 this morning, didn't post, and that Verby made his "discovery" post at 12:08 - if that isn't a mafia waiting for a team member to pull ff a stunt, I don't know what is...but no one else caught it. And now I look like the crazy guy. Oh well...

 

There it is. No muss, no fuss. Do what you have to do...

 

 

[Tigraine]

For now I believe you DPR....because like I said I don't think Red would make it that easy for the town or mafia. 

 

I agree that Red is an awesome mod....I love playing her games! ;)

[DPR]

 

Don't believe me  - believe the evidence.

 

Why aren't people playing this game???

[Red2111]

Mod Speak:  thanks DPR and Tigs :)  it means alot.  

 

 

Deadline

Friday Feb 26, 2010 @ 8pm CST; 10 alive, 6 to lynch.  

 

[glow=grey,2,300]Clock: 09:28:32[/glow]

 

Vote Count

Verbal(1): DPR

DPR(3): Aemon, Verbal, player

 

No Vote(6): Pete, Ed, Tigs, Torrie, Aust, Jeran

 

 

[Torrie]

Are you stalking me DPR?  :P I feel eyes on me. **Shiver**

 

***But, like I said, it is good when you are Town, and for the record, I think everyone but Torrie has posted during Day 2 (and Torrie has logged on to DM today - I looked because she is on my suspect list)

 

Yes, I was on yesterday. I am having some RL issues, I’m depressed and wondering if I need to bow out of this game. I am going to try to push on but I just really did not feel like posting yesterday.

 

4. Torrie votes for me, then accuses me of trying to mislead the game by confusing people because I mixed her and Tigs up.

***Torrie also mentions that she has used the "confusion" technique to win as mafia before. She mentions it, and it happens...anyone seeing a trend here?

 

It happened because you were doing it not because I mentioned it.  I mentioned it after you had done it. And for the record, the Mafia did not win in that game. It was used as a last ditch effort to pull suspicion from myself. Do you see that trend?

 

Be warned, entering the wrong code will also trigger this gas, as will any escape attempts.  Good Luck.”

 

The only reason I wonder about the code DPR posted is because of this line. I believe Red may be throwing some fake codes out there. The other option is the Mafia throwing fake codes around. It would kill us all but it would prevent the Town from winning.

Which brings me back to DPR. Is he throwing a code out there that is false in order to trap us? I'll wait for a response before I vote.

[Verbal32]

I'm going to ignore the comment Wes is going to make about me posting after Torrie here.  I'm not working with her (unless she's town, in which case I am).

 

Wes, what "questions" are you referring to that I'm not answering?  Why I mentioned big game hunting?  Because it looked like that was happening?  Did I vote for you yesterday?  No.

 

And don't think that you're the auto-selection for a Finder viewing on Night 1.  You might have been, but to think you're the most likely is folly.  There are plenty of people in this game that simply don't know you well enough, or have buddies that they're just as likely to check.  For example, in a game with Lily and Pete, if Lily is the Finder, who do you think she's going to view?  Even if you and Kiv are in there, I bet Pete is her first viewing.....you get my point.

 

So, any other questions for me, Wes?  I noticed your code hidden in your post.  Your defense of "I'm trying to lay a trap" is about as strong as a piece of wet toilet paper.  You would lay a MUCH better trap than that, so it makes me think of a mafia PR.  Yes, townies can have PRs as well.  But the OP talks about the mafia having the codes, and all of a sudden I see a code in your post.  Do you see how I would logically make the next step to being suspicious of you?

 

In summary, I voted for DPR when I noticed the code that only mafia are supposed to have (noted in the OP).  He comes back and says it's a PR and he made it hardly noticable to trap mafia.  I say that's a plausible explanation, but the counterattack he launched at me is too flimsy to justify a townie.  I'm leaning more towards mafia, and his teammate(s) would likely have been in on the Day 1 voters for him.  Great way to hide is right in plain sight.

[Jeran]

Hi guys...I'm off sick today and won't be playing for the rest of the day.

[Red2111]

Mod Speak:  kay Jeran,  get well :)

[DPR]

In reply:

 

Torrie - your speculation about the codes is similar to what I was thinking, and keep in mind: I am not suggesting that we use the code. I'm much more interested to see what kind of code information we get after a mafia lynch, or if we don't get a code and we know that the mafia can "pass" their codes along. Either way, we need a lot more info about them.

 

Verbal - I figured that I would be the top choicee to be investigated because I was the first lead vote, because I asked to be investigated, and because of all of the metagame talk about my rep, so don't try to use that against me. And while we're onthe topic, why don't you go ahead and tell the game who you think that the most likely person to be investigated was. Because if it was me, then that speaks for itself.

 

But instead of agreeing ith simple logic, you decide to beat the "code" drum again. Thankfully, you kind-of prove my point by doing it - I would lay a much better trap than that, if I had been given any other option.

 

And what is all of this talk about mafia PR's vs townie PR's? What's the damn difference? And why talk about PR's at all - no one else seems to have one, so I'm figuring that this is a mafia play, just like I said. You yourself say that the OP talks about codes, then one appears in my post, so you think I'm mafia? This is screaming SETUP- SETUP-SETUP! Talk about wet toilet paper...

 

Then, and this is my favorite - you begin your post by pointing out that you didn't vote for me on day 1. You end your post by suggestion that the mafia did vote for me on day 1. How convenient for you...methinks you are scum, sir.

 

***Game Unrelated Post***

 

Torrie and Jeran, feel better!

 

 

 

 

[Verbal32]

And what is all of this talk about mafia PR's vs townie PR's? What's the damn difference? And why talk about PR's at all - no one else seems to have one, so I'm figuring that this is a mafia play, just like I said. You yourself say that the OP talks about codes, then one appears in my post, so you think I'm mafia? This is screaming SETUP- SETUP-SETUP! Talk about wet toilet paper...

 

Huh?  I mentioned at first that it appeared perhaps the code is part of a PR the mafia might have (having to post it somehow).  I repeated my point about it being a mafia PR one time.  You then said this:

 

Nice of you to phrase it as a "mafia pr", like nobody ever had a townie pr.  :P

 

YOU are the one that started talking about townie PRs, not me.  I acknowledged your point by stating that yes, townies can have PRs as well (see my post below).  But you are the one harping about townie vs. mafia PRs....I'm just saying that it's possible that you, as mafia, have a PR regarding the codes, seeing that the OP talks about the mafia being the ones with the codes.  Reasonable conclusion for me to come to, right?

 

But instead of agreeing ith simple logic, you decide to beat the "code" drum again. Thankfully, you kind-of prove my point by doing it - I would lay a much better trap than that, if I had been given any other option.

 

Ummm....are you saying that the point I just made above is not simple logic?  According the the Mod, the mafia have the codes.  They won't obviously just give them to the town.  You have a code hidden in your post.  The mafia have the codes.  You didn't just come out and say it....somebody noticed (me).  You say you're being framed.  But the mafia have the codes.  Are you seeing the pattern here?  Simple logic.

 

 

Then, and this is my favorite - you begin your post by pointing out that you didn't vote for me on day 1. You end your post by suggestion that the mafia did vote for me on day 1. How convenient for you...methinks you are scum, sir.

 

Convenient, sure.  I'm saying that if you are mafia, your teammates (at least 1) was likely in on your Day 1 wagon.  You weren't in too much danger, so it was safe to hide a vote on you.  So therefore I'm saying a teammate voted for you.  I'm then saying I didn't vote for you.  Put 2 and 2 together and that makes me town.  Like you once said to me, your logic is as smooth as a corkscrew.  ;)

 

 

And while we're onthe topic, why don't you go ahead and tell the game who you think that the most likely person to be investigated was. Because if it was me, then that speaks for itself.

 

I can't say that, as I'm not the Finder.  My example of Lily and Pete was to show that even though you made a good case to be viewed, we can't rely on that as a forgone conclusion and just assume you're innocent......because your actions do not match your claimed innocence.

 

 

 

While we're talking about favorites, here's my favorite post from you thus far:

 

Why don't we do this: if everybody will have a look at the code and post whether or not they can see it, we may well narrow down our suspect list.

 

It was my intention to hide it so that only someone looking for it would mention it, thus trapping the person who is trying to frame me. 

 

If folks look at it and everyone agrees that they would have missed it, that will go a long way towards pointing to scum. If half of the players did spot it, then my plan didn't work out so well and I'll have blown a chance to catch my framer.

 

Damage.  Control.  :-*

[Guest dragonsworn1991]

I'm looking at the game and I can't shake the feeling verb and torrie are a team. I know that some twists are acceptable in standard games as long as the mod has had some experience. So there maybe masons, millers, or some other group that can talk off thread, or verb and torrie could be scum together.

 

Verb and dpr could be trying for a gambit also. Their back and forth seems to me that it could be rehersed. Also verb always looks scummy to me and if you can name me one game where dpr looked innocent I'll eat my shoe. I'll have more tonight but I have to go.

[aemonkristen]

You know after, all these arguements by DOR and Verbal, I've gat a bad feeling about both of them. I'm leaving my vote on DPR because he was the one that started this mess with that code, but Verbal is running a close second on my radar with his arguements. Doesn't this sound scripted to you guys? Like one person arguing both sides? I don't know. They're both leaving me with a bad taste in my mouth.

[Verbal32]

I'm looking at the game and I can't shake the feeling verb and torrie are a team. I know that some twists are acceptable in standard games as long as the mod has had some experience. So there maybe masons, millers, or some other group that can talk off thread, or verb and torrie could be scum together.

 

Verb and dpr could be trying for a gambit also. Their back and forth seems to me that it could be rehersed. Also verb always looks scummy to me and if you can name me one game where dpr looked innocent I'll eat my shoe. I'll have more tonight but I have to go.

 

That was a great post there.  You basically said nothing.  DPR says I'm on a team with Torrie.  So you just come in and say you "can't shake the feeling"?  Ooookay.

 

And a gambit?  Instead of suggesting gambits (like everybody always does), why not weigh in on what he and I are saying?  Who makes sense?  Who looks like they're trying to twist logic?  Something other than "you both look scummy".

 

And before you ask, I'm not saying the same to Aemon because while he says many of the same things you just did, at least he's voting.

[DPR]

 

1. It would help if everybody was playing, so I can't complain about people that do post.

 

2. Play by the evidence and not the players!!! Look at what I have presented and either agree or disagree. Then look at what Verbal is saying, and disagree. heh

[Guest dragonsworn1991]

Verbal that's just it, IMO dpr has some information that we as the town may need. He posted a code, and they may make a rownie victorie easier. You hav offered nothing but basically saying dpr is scum, and he has done the same for you. Both just long winded posts about each other. You want a vote [glow=red,2,300]verb[/glow] well you got it. I still think how offhandedly you posted trying to dismiss the gambit theory is mid level scummyness

[Red2111]

Mod Speak: Just a friendly reminder, but if no majority is reached by the deadline then a radnom lynch will be choosen from among the non-voters.

 

Deadline

Friday Feb 26, 2010 @ 8pm CST; 10 alive, 6 to lynch.  

 

[glow=grey,2,300]Clock: 09:25:12[/glow]

 

Vote Count

Verbal(2): DPR, Pete

DPR(3): Aemon, Verbal, player

 

No Vote(5): Ed, Tigs, Torrie, Aust, Jeran

 

 

[Aust]

The evidence is hard to untangle, but I can agree on a few points - that we probably do have a finder, and that the finder probably would have viewed DPR, that it is unlikely that the mafia would be forced to reveal so readily with the code.

 

I have to take some more time to review everything though before I make a vote - I breezed through some of those longer posts and I want to go back and take a thorough read.

[Tigraine]

Once again I agree that a requirement for the mafia would not be to put the codes in their posts as this would be to simple since Red already mentioned it.  The first one or two arguement posts I just read through and found the logic.  After that it got repetitive.  I think that it is possible that DPR thought well if I post this code then they would never believe I'm mafia but I'm not leaning towards that theory.  Verbal is staying on this code theory and seems completely unable to be budged on the subject.  I don't think as of now that Torrie is in on something with Verbal but I do think that something is being hid behind this arguement by one or both of them so I'm going for [glow=red,2,300]Verbal[/glow].  It would be easier to find logic in both of your arguements if your posts didn't say the same things over and over, and no, I know it's not been word for word but it's the same concept.  Verbal I do think that you have good reasoning behind assuming that since the code was given to mafia and it was in DPR's post that he is mafia.  However, like I said....something is going on with one or both of you.

[Aust]

 

If the mafia has codes, why would they give them out (post them) if they didn't have to?  In short, they wouldn't.

 

But if they had to option to make an innocent player post it, that would be damning.

 

So, I posted, as I was told I had to - but tried to throw a curveball to catch the mafioso who sent it to me in the act - and you pop up like you were looking for it.

 

As I asked before, care to explain that?

 

And I'm still all about people telling me whether or not they think they would have noticed it - that would help here!

 

Hey DPR, just a question to clarify for me - are we absolutely certain that the code would have come from mafia? Is it possible the code came from some other player? It might be a stupid question, but it had me wondering. And if it were true that the mafia had sent the code,would that then mean that we are certain on the code's authenticity? I think I recall reading that using the wrong code would have some kind of negative consequence.

[DPR]

 

The only thing I know for sure is that Red pm'd me with the code and instructions to include it in my first post of the day. She did not tell me where it came from or whether it was real or fake. She also did not say anything about how to use it, or what exactly it was for.

 

To be fair, and to keep things factual, it is only my theory that the mafia sent it and the instructions to me to frame me.

[ed2funy]

So....have to read the last few pages, but is it possible the mafia can give PR's and just threw out a random number at you?

[DPR]

 

 

Sure. We have to consider everything until we learn something for certain.

[ed2funy]

Ok. Good for you. I am off to do hmk. Will try and reread and make a good post before I leave tomorrow. Most likely won't be doing anything on the plane.

[Aust]

Alright - that was a lot to re-read  :P

 

[glow=red,2,300]Vote Verbal[/glow]

[Torrie]

The only reason I am not voting for DPR is because of the question on the authenticity of the code. I really think it could be a false code.

 

At this point I wonder if verbal and DPR are in together. I will vote [glow=red,2,300]Verbal[/glow] and keep an eye on DPR.