Setalle Anan

[mnwhiterose]

I just re-read KOD after reading a theory here regarding her identity. I had read (here) that her identity in WT was revealed as an AS who studied ter'angreal and had been burned out, but I cannot find that passage anywhere in KOD.

[JenLenaMom]

I think it's more implied than anything else. You could check the WOTFAQ, I think they usually have passage references but it's been a long time since I browsed through. Or maybe it was the character list here :-\

[Mr Ares]

http://www.siliconcerebrate.com/faqs/wotfaq/2_nondark/2.2_rest-chars/2.2.4_s-anan.html WOTFAQ's page on Setalle.

[mnwhiterose]

Thanks. So it isn't actually written in the books, just us putting 2 and 2 together.

 

Wasn't some form of Seanchan punishment to have a damane's a'dam be held by a "norm". Or was that an a'dam being held by a man?

[Phariah]

that was a game the Seachan queen had she would choose a man in her court and have them try on the bracelet

[Mr Ares]

that was a game the Seachan queen had she would choose a man in her court and have them try on the bracelet

And if the man could learn to channel, the consequences were...unpleasant.

[mnwhiterose]

I really need to read the books again. I could probably do a good read-though before November.

[ErikTheBald]

In KoD chapter 9, Mat and Satelle have a conversation where she admits having been Aes Sedai.  She was fascinated with foxhead medallion, which ties back to her being the AS mentioned in the books who made the study of Ter Angreal.

[mnwhiterose]

I don't think she actually admitted to it, but implied it. She says something like, "They don't believe I was ever at the Tower. They think I was a servant" or something like that. I remember the scene.

[ErikTheBald]

Mat asks her "You were Aes Sedai"

 

Her reply that they don't believe her is admission enough.

[mnwhiterose]

I believe she was an Aes Sedai. Just don't know if she was this Martine who used to study ter'angreal.

[madoc comadrin]

Could Setalle Anan be Tamra?

[Hybrid]

Could Setalle Anan be Tamra?

Tamra is dead.  She was tortured then killed by Black Ajah.

[lordofsoup]

that would be a good trust, but they found her body

[dholm]

I believe she was an Aes Sedai. Just don't know if she was this Martine who used to study ter'angreal.

There's no question whether she's an Aes Sedai or not -- as Erik said, her lack of denial is admission to the fact.

 

Whether she's Martine... who knows? But the timeline sure seems to suggest it.

[a5m]

Setalle Anan is the one that is no longer and was the key to finding the bowl of the winds. As Rand stated when the Wise Ones told him that dream, "the one that is no longer what?" It seems pretty clear to me that the what is Aes Sedai.

[Mandragoran]

Setalle Anan is the one that is no longer and was the key to finding the bowl of the winds. As Rand stated when the Wise Ones told him that dream, "the one that is no longer what?" It seems pretty clear to me that the what is Aes Sedai.

I think it's Mat. The interpretation being, "the one who is no longer... one". Mat is one man but has the memories of many men. It was his ta'veren twisting that led to the finding of the Bowl. Setalle only led Nynaeve and Elayne to the Kin but played no further part. Going to Mat led to Setalle in the first place and later he discovered the location of the angreal cache by himself, before Elayne did iirc.

 

 

[Padraic_Seebrr]

Well Setalle led them to the Kin, and really Elayne and Nynaeve went to the Kin with the other Aes Sedai and pretty much told them to tell where it is. And if I remember right, right after the Kin told them, Mat came in all cocky and told em he had found it. Now THAT was funny.

[a5m]

And when Mat met Setalle, the dice in his head stopped rolling. She is the one that needed to be found so that she could bring the girls to the kin. If Mat hadn't stayed at her inn, it would not have happened. She was the key to finding the bowl.

 

I also believe she has more to contribute in the story. Possibly as the Aes Sedai advisor for Tuan.

[Mandragoran]

The dice stopped rolling because that's where Mat had to be for more than just the bowl. The Wandering Woman was the place to be for many reasons. That's where he had his things stored for his escape, that's where he agreed to help Joline (one of the Aes Sedai Mat weighs on a scale in Egwene's dreams?) and that's where he got in touch with Egeanin and Domon, among other fateful occurrences. And Setalle Anan being there when the dice stopped doesn't mean it wasn't Mat who was meant to find it. Mat chose to stay at that inn. Setalle was one link in the chain just like Reanne(and the Kin) but Mat was the key to the chain and the finding.

 

The Kin were about to tell Elayne the location of the Bowl but didn't because Mat interrupted, and he'd been to the Rahad and found the place much earlier. Elayne knew Aviendha was right to suggest using Mat because he was Ta'veren and all those threads(Setalle being one of them) had already twisted around him to lead them to the bowl. After discovering the Kin, Elayne had to admit to Nynaeve albeit reluctantly, that they owed it all to Mat's altering of chance.

 

 

[dholm]

Setalle Anan is the one that is no longer and was the key to finding the bowl of the winds. As Rand stated when the Wise Ones told him that dream, "the one that is no longer what?" It seems pretty clear to me that the what is Aes Sedai.

I think it's Mat. The interpretation being, "the one who is no longer... one". Mat is one man but has the memories of many men. It was his ta'veren twisting that led to the finding of the Bowl. Setalle only led Nynaeve and Elayne to the Kin but played no further part. Going to Mat led to Setalle in the first place and later he discovered the location of the angreal cache by himself, before Elayne did iirc.

 

You're adding words. They say, "The key to finding the Bowl of Winds is to find the one who is no longer." Not "no longer one". Just "no longer".

 

Given that we know Setalle Anan was an Aes Sedai, and given that she led Elayne and Nynaeve to the Kin, it is obvious she is the one talked about.

[Mandragoran]

You're adding words. They say, "The key to finding the Bowl of Winds is to find the one who is no longer." Not "no longer one". Just "no longer".

You might want to read what I'd added in the context of what I quoted. It was a response Rand's question of 'the one that is no longer what'. I disagreed with the answer being "no longer Aes Sedai" because that would be adding words. I was suggesting the answer is inherent in the statement without the necessity of adding anything.

 

Given that we know Setalle Anan was an Aes Sedai, and given that she led Elayne and Nynaeve to the Kin, it is obvious she is the one talked about.

Being a former Aes Sedai has no relevance to the Dream at all, unless you want to add words. Given that Mat is repeatedly credited with leading Elayne and Nynaeve to the bowl and given that he actually does find it in the end, it is obviously a reference to him and not Setalle who has nothing to do with the bowl apart from introducing them to the kin. Might as well credit Reanne who "is no longer" + "a White Tower novice".

 

 

[Luckers]

I'm afraid that's incorrect. Elayne had the Kin agreeing to lead her to the bowl prior to Mat telling her were it was, and the key to the kin was Setalle--she is indeed the one who is no longer.

 

And what do you mean about adding words? One who is no longer applies to Setalle without any additions.

[dholm]

You're adding words. They say, "The key to finding the Bowl of Winds is to find the one who is no longer." Not "no longer one". Just "no longer".

You might want to read what I'd added in the context of what I quoted. It was a response Rand's question of 'the one that is no longer what'. I disagreed with the answer being "no longer Aes Sedai" because that would be adding words. I was suggesting the answer is inherent in the statement without the necessity of adding anything.

There's no way you could apply the sentence "one who is no longer" to Mat without adding that he's no longer alone in his head... and that idea is in itself ludicrous; the memories are a part of him, they are not a seperate identity. The sentence structure implies that whatever they were before was integral to their identity. If Mat stopped being a gambler or a general, then you could apply the sentence to him. As it stands, not at all.

 

Setalle Anan, however, was an Aes Sedai -- which very definitely is an intergral part of her identity.

 

 

Given that we know Setalle Anan was an Aes Sedai, and given that she led Elayne and Nynaeve to the Kin, it is obvious she is the one talked about.

Being a former Aes Sedai has no relevance to the Dream at all, unless you want to add words. Given that Mat is repeatedly credited with leading Elayne and Nynaeve to the bowl and given that he actually does find it in the end, it is obviously a reference to him and not Setalle who has nothing to do with the bowl apart from introducing them to the kin. Might as well credit Reanne who "is no longer" + "a White Tower novice".

 

Sorry but that just doesn't fly. Mat was not the key to finding the Bowl of Winds; when he finally found it, they had already discovered its location through the Kin. Which, by the way, is also the way Mat found out. Who led them to the Kin? Setalle Anan.

[Mandragoran]

There's no way you could apply the sentence "one who is no longer" to Mat without adding that he's no longer alone in his head... and that idea is in itself ludicrous; the memories are a part of him, they are not a seperate identity. The sentence structure implies that whatever they were before was integral to their identity. If Mat stopped being a gambler or a general, then you could apply the sentence to him. As it stands, not at all.

 

Setalle Anan, however, was an Aes Sedai -- which very definitely is an intergral part of her identity.

"One who is no longer" can be applied to Mat without implying he has multiple active personalities. Memories belonging to numerous other men are contained within him, and he can fall back on their experiences. For example, another general aiming to beat Mat would have to first accept that he is facing the thinking of not one but many great soldiers.

 

And the sentence structure implies little by itself. The predicate seems incomplete, unless "no longer" implies the subject is dead (or has stopped growing in length). If the missing object is in reference to the "one", then it certainly applies to Mat. Otherwise, it could apply to just about anything, not just former Aes Sedai. Like Reanne for instance, since she was no longer in the tower as novice but joined the kin and kept their secrets.

 

Sorry but that just doesn't fly. Mat was not the key to finding the Bowl of Winds; when he finally found it, they had already discovered its location through the Kin. Which, by the way, is also the way Mat found out. Who led them to the Kin? Setalle Anan.

Incorrect, the kin never got around to revealing the location to Elayne. Mat found out and was the first and only one to declare this. Setalle didn't know where the bowl was and was nowhere involved in taking the bowl. And let's not forget that Mat led to Setalle in the first place. He was at the beginning, middle and end of the entire chain of events. Reanne would be a likelier candidate over Setalle since it was she who knew the actual location and had actually gone to the Rahad.

 

Rain, coming from a bowl. There are snares and pitfalls around the bowl. If the right hands pick it up, they will find a treasure perhaps as great as the bowl. If the wrong hands, the world is doomed. The key to finding the bowl is to find the one who is no longer.

 

Mat was critical to getting the bowl since the dream warned of snares and pitfalls around it and the consequences of success or failure. There aren't many people who could take on the gholam which proved their greatest obstacle. No other soldier or channeler would have stood a chance against it, unless maybe if Cadsuane had jumped in and started whipping her hair around, ornaments and all.