Christmas Mafia

[Myndrunner]

and as I stated earlier, I think that it makes sense for us to lynch the player who will yield us the most information.  I'm casting my vote on [glow=green,2,300]Thorum[/glow] at this time. 

 

*He led the lynch on Cosmic Panda on Day 2, in light of Vemy's death at the hands of the mafia.

 

*His mafia tell is on the fritz, but he has recinded after being called out on it.

 

*He continues to mess up his unvote, not something a vet like him would do by accident.

 

*Who votes him with us will tell us quite a bit when the coroner report is revealed.

 

Also, I will now cast my vigilante vote for [glow=yellow,2,300]Liathiana[/glow] unless she can convince me otherwise.

 

I know you are a busy man, Thorum, and it's been a while since we've had a vote recap; however, if you notice I did vote you and Liathiana for the Vig kill.  I'll go back and do a new vote count and I apologize for the diarreah of the keyboard there earlier....I was trying to do a post by post recap, but it turned into a monster of a post that even I think is too much. 

 

Anyways, voter recap coming up....  ;D

[Myndrunner]

Welcome to Day 2 VOTER UPDATE!!!!!  :o

 

Here are the voting actions in chronological order, including Vig kill votes, starting with the beginning of Day 2:

 

Thorum votes [glow=green,2,300]Cosmic Panda[/glow]

Verbal votes [glow=red,2,300]Liathiana[/glow]

Mynd votes [glow=green,2,300]Liathiana[/glow]

Tigs votes [glow=red,2,300]Thorum[/glow]

Loreina votes [glow=green,2,300]Mynd[/glow]

Without unvoting for Cosmic Panda, Thorum votes Mynd

Hybrid votes [glow=red,2,300]Loreina[/glow]

Loreina [glow=green,2,300]unvotes[/glow]

Without unvoting Thorum, Tigs tries to vote Loreina

Liathiana votes [glow=red,2,300]Tigara[/glow]

Mynd [glow=green,2,300]unvotes[/glow] and votes [glow=green,2,300]Loreina[/glow]

Tigara corrects his [glow=red,2,300]unvote[/glow] and votes [glow=red,2,300]Loreina[/glow]

Loreina votes [glow=green,2,300]Mynd[/glow]

Cosmic Panda votes [glow=red,2,300]Loreina[/glow] and then votes vig lynch for [glow=yellow,2,300]Tigara[/glow]

Danya votes [glow=green,2,300]Tigara[/glow]

Thormum [glow=red,2,300]unvotes[/glow] and then votes for [glow=red,2,300]vote[/glow]

Thorum then forgets how to glow his votes, but tries to vote Mynd for the lynch and Verbal for me to kill after I am lynched....perhaps from the grave?

Verbal votes vig lynch for [glow=yellow,2,300]Tigara[/glow] and [glow=green,2,300]unvotes[/glow] Liathiana

Tigara votes vig lynch for [glow=yellow,2,300]Thorum[/glow]

Hybrid [glow=red,2,300]unvotes[/glow] and then votes [glow=red,2,300]Thorum[/glow]

Myndrunner votes [glow=green,2,300]Thorum[/glow] and then votes vig lynch for [glow=yellow,2,300]Liathiana[/glow]

Thorum [glow=red,2,300]unvotes[/glow] and then votes [glow=red,2,300]Myndrunner[/glow]

Danya [glow=green,2,300]unvotes[/glow] Tigara for lynch and vig votes [glow=yellow,2,300]Tigara[/glow]

Verbal votes [glow=red,2,300]Thorum[/glow]

Lorenia [glow=green,2,300]unvotes[/glow]

 

So then, by this gambit, this is where we stand....

 

Lynch Votes:

[glow=red,2,300]Thorum [/glow] (4) - Verbal, Mynd, Tigara, Hybrid

[glow=green,2,300]Tigara[/glow] (1) - Liathiana

[glow=red,2,300]Loreina[/glow] (1) - Cosmic Panda

[glow=green,2,300]Mynd[/glow] (1) - Thorum

 

Vig Kill Votes:

[glow=yellow,2,300]Tigara[/glow] (3) - Cosmic Panda, Verbal, Danya

[glow=yellow,2,300]Thorum[/glow] (1) - Tigara

[glow=yellow,2,300]Mynd[/glow] (1) - Liathiana

 

[Liathiana]

Sorry, I haven't been around much but I slept...woke up to massive 2 hour shouting match with family, and then went to work for 14 hours and now I'm going to bed. So anyone can bitch and moan about me being mafia if they want because I'm not going to write much, just post my votes.

 

[glow=red,2,300]unvote[/glow]

 

[glow=red,2,300]Thorum[/glow] (Barm said we could vote red or green today)

 

[glow=yellow,2,300]Tigara[/glow]

 

Shortly said, they both seem scummy to me and this looks more like getting majority votes this way. (If that makes sense? I'm not even sure anymore >.<)

 

Goodnight y'all.

[cosmicpanda]

wait, it seems I'm behind the times

 

Barm said the deadline was 22.5 hours away a day ago? It's 1 pm Wednesday here and this is NZT, not EST, and the deadline is Thursday EST. I think we have a way to go yet... I will catch up.

[Myndrunner]

Deadline is around 1am EST Thursday morning, thats about 22.5 hours from now.

 

Yeah, I think we still have a bit of time left to go CP.  I hope you feel better, but we really need to hear your thoughts after your reread.  Right now, Thorum looks like the one going today and Tigara will be my Vig target tonight.  What are your thoughts, CP?

 

Hybrid, I would like to hear your thoughts on who I should VIG kill tonight.

[cosmicpanda]

Ok, so some things jump out at me. I will say at this point that I have almost no meta on you chaps, so what I see in the thread goes:

 

* There was a debate as to whether Mynd is aligned with the town or not. If he is, he's a vig. If he isn't, he's a serial killer or scum trying to pretend that he has a nightkill. Discussion on this point has stopped, as far as I can see; has everyone decided what their point of view is?

 

I know that there's an awful lot of 'but there's no proof' going on in this debate - the only real evidence about the kills is that Vemy's toys were sabotaged - but that doesn't stop the fact that voting for Mynd because he might be a serial killer is silly. It's something to bear in mind for later, (especially if we've lynched a lot of scum and the game continues and Mynd is mysteriously still alive) but right now there's scummier people to lynch.

 

* Thorum; he made a spectacularly wonderful post that said that he refused to kill an innocent on Day one. He said later that what he really meant was that Mynd was eliminating people from suspicion improperly, but I still wonder if he meant that he knew that Catina was innocent. Now, he's losing his logic; the afore-mentioned voting for a player and voting for them to vig kill somebody is really strange, because he's voting for them to die, but also wanting them to live to do his vig kill. Could be scum under pressure.

 

* Tigs: after some thought, I still think that Tigs is very suspicious. I don't like the way he tried to hide in plain sight; by saying he's not interested merely because he hasn't got a power role, he's saying that he's not even going to try to play the game, and he's therefore useless anyway. If it comes down to it, say we have a town, a scum, and tigs... do we want a player who's not interested in playing, in this situation?

 

* Lor: [glow=red,2,300]unvote[/glow]

 

In this post, she seems pro-town to me, if misguided:

 

But I don't think he should do a Vig kill. Why?

Assuming three Evils and Five Innocents, the assassin has almost a 2-1 chance of killing an innocent instead of an evil at this point, especially since we have so little to go on and all three Evils are still alive and influencing the voting. This game could get very short very quickly if he successfully kills tonight (I'll get back to this in a moment). I don't like the odds, or the fact that the three evils have so much say in a Vig vote.

 

But some questions:

 

1) How is voting for a vig kill different from voting for a lynch, assuming a democratic process?

 

1b) If voting for a lynch is the same as voting for a democratic vig kill, would you not support voting for a lynch?

 

2) If the town didn't get a say, would you still support a vig kill?

 

3) Do you not think that giving the town more opportunities to kill scum is a good thing?

 

 

* Lia; I'm inclined to think she's just frustrated town that managed to accidentally act scummy. This is a gut reaction mainly caused by her last post - I can't very well take a small leave of absence due to sickness and then lynch her because she's had bad external circumstances as well.

 

Anyhow, I will continue with my vig kill vote on Tigs and [glow=red,2,300]Thorum[/glow].

[cosmicpanda]

In case it needs clarifying, I'm still voting to vig kill Tigs, and now voting to lynch Thorum.

[Loreina]

But some questions:

 

1) How is voting for a vig kill different from voting for a lynch, assuming a democratic process?

 

1b) If voting for a lynch is the same as voting for a democratic vig kill, would you not support voting for a lynch?

 

2) If the town didn't get a say, would you still support a vig kill?

 

3) Do you not think that giving the town more opportunities to kill scum is a good thing?

 

Panda, are you asking me?  If so, 1a)I never said it was different. I know the Evils are also voting in the lynch. There's no difference in the process, just a big difference in the outcome.  1b)Huh? This makes me think you didn't really read what I wrote. Of course I support voting for a lynch. I haven't voted yet because I'm having a hard time making up my mind, mainly because of all the vig discussion. 2) no, because there's no guarantee that the vig kill would be an Evil. And if our lynch vote turns out to be an innocent, vig killing another innocent would be a disaster.  3) It's only a good thing if we are indeed killing scum. There's a big difference between an opportunity and an accomplishment.  Are you that sure of your picks? Because I'm not that sure about mine.

 

Why do you say I'm misguided?  Is my math wrong?  I'm not good with the probability stuff. 

 

It's really just the difference between having another day to gather more info and maybe win this game from the Evils, or risking everything on a gamble that our hunches are right and we'll get an evil. What would it hurt to put off the Vig kill until the next night?  If we lynch an Evil, we'll be in a much better position to vote a Vig kill for an Evil. 

 

And yes, I suck at games of chance too.  ::)

[Myndrunner]

Loreina, this is Mafia not a tea party.  If you are that afraid of us accidentally killing an innocent then don't vote for a lynch either.  The only ones that are 100% sure of who is innocent and who is mafia are the mafia.  I have my doubts of everyone right now, but I am going on the most educated guess so far. 

 

The vote for the vig kill is a second thread of information for us to go on. Should Tigara turn up innocent then we have a pretty good idea who to look at on Day 3.  Voting for the vig kill is the best option for the town. Otherwise, I'm gonna take a chance and plug the person I feel is most scummish. 

 

If you don't feel like I should kill anyone, then vote in yellow for [glow=yellow,2,300]No Kill[/glow].  At least then its a vote.  :-\

 

 

[Loreina]

You know you don't have to be so extreme. It's rather insulting.  I know it's a Mafia game. Are you trying to imply that I'm squeamish or cowardly or something?

I'm not talking about proof. I'm not talking about being 100% sure. I am talking about survival. I want the innocents to survive the night, to play another day. Educated guess? Based on what?

Fact #1 - Voting patterns are inconclusive, yielding no useful info

Fact 2# - Inactivity levels are inconclusive, yielding no useful info

All we have to go on are our hunches, based on some posting anomalies. That's fine for one lynch.  If we're wrong, we're only down one innocent, and we have gained valuable info to use to decide the next lynch. But it's pretty flimsy stuff on which to base a double lynch. It's almost a shot in the dark. And for what? What is the advantage to doing this? Is it worth losing the game? Because that's the worst case scenario.

If we Vig kill tonight:

Best case scenario - We are extremely lucky (or clever if you prefer), and we hit two Evils, one lynched, one Vig killed. The Evils NK one innocent. - Day 3 begins with one Evil left, and five innocents. We will win.

OR

Liveable scenario - We are cleverly lucky and kill one Evil with either our lynch or our Vig kill. But either our lynch or our Vig kill hits one of us. Then Evils NK an innocent. - Day 3 begins with Two Evils left, and four innocents. This scenario is surviveable, if we can learn enough from it.

OR

Worst case scenario - We are not as clever as we think we are, and we end up lynching and Vig killing two innocents. Then the Evils NK one of us. END GAME.

BUT

If we do not Vig kill tonight:

Day 2 - We lynch an Evil, at night Evils NK an innocent - Day 3 begins with 2 Evils, 5 Innocents; we lynch an Evil, Evils NK an innocent, Vig kills an Evil - WE WIN

or

Day 2 - We mistakenly lynch an innocent, that night Evils NK an innocent - Day 3 begins with 3 Evils, 4 innocents; older but wiser, we lynch an Evil, then the Evils NK an innocent, the Vig kills an Evil - Day 4 begins with one Evil and 3 innocents, and we most likely will overpower the remaining Evil and win.

 

I am voting [glow=yellow,2,300]no[/glow] on the Vig [glow=yellow,2,300]kill[/glow] for tonight.

 

As for the lynch, you have six already, but I guess I can add mine. I know he posted something that made no sense, but that doesn't make him evil.  And I can't rid myself of the feeling that Mynd is playing with us.  :-\  [glow=red,2,300]Thorum[/glow] 

 

Lynch Votes:

Thorum  (7) - Verbal, Mynd, Tigara, Hybrid, Liathiana, Cosmic Panda, Lorei

Mynd  (1) - Thorum

 

Vig Kill Votes:

Tigara  (4) - Cosmic Panda, Verbal, Danya, Liathiana

Thorum  (1) - Tigara

Lia    (1) - Mynd

 

NOT VOTING FOR THE LYNCH - Danya

 

NOT VOTING FOR THE VIG KILL - Lorei, Hybrid, Thorum

 

[Loreina]

I copied those Vig votes from Mynd's post, and updated them, but they don't look right. I know that it was Mynd who voted Lia, not the other way 'round, but was it Thorum who voted Tig or Tig who voted Thorum? Otherwise we have Tig voting to both lynch and Vig kill Thorum.  :-\

 

 

 

 

[MsDanya]

I didnt really find anything on Hybrid, so i'm letting him go atm. As of now, I do find [glow=red,2,300]Thorum[/glow] as being the most suspicious. Too much weird stuff going on with him. i'll explain more later, now I have to run and buy gas for the car or I wont get to work  :P

[Myndrunner]

Loreina, I wasn't trying to be mean, but I was trying to make a point.  This is mafia and if you don't recommend that we go off of voting strategies or who is active and who isn't, how DO you suggest we go about figuring out who is mafia?  It seems like you are suggesting that we go with our hunches.....  :-\

 

Here is the thing though, you bring up a point that I was hoping the Mafia wouldn't realise.  If Thorum turns out innocent, then we could lose the game tonight.  If the Healer fails to heal the right player AND my vig kill does not take out a mafia, then it would be endgame. 

 

Hmmm....8 out of 9 remaining players are gunning for Thorum.  There are obviously some Mafia votes there (ya think?) Danya joined us at the last minute just in time to vote before looking scummish for not doing so.  Anyways, that's majority....let's see what the results are, shall we?

[Thorum]

Also, mynd, why haven't you still voted for me yet? You're using about 5 pages already on saying how evil I am, and if I remember correctly your vote still is on someone else...

 

How on Earth can you be saying things like this when you voted for Mynd for a lynch, and then voted me in yellow for a vig kill.........from Mynd??

 

Because I wanted to give him the chance to proof he is what he says he is. Like I said before, I'm not 100% sure he is mafia, so I give him a way to prove his non-mafianess. Not that I personally would vote less for him (unless someone confesses to being mafia - which won't happen), but for the rest of you this seems to make a lot of difference.

 

The reason I chose you was your inactivity: it wouldn't make much difference with or without you (though that seems to be changing - if it weren't night yet I may have changed it).

 

As I asked you before' date=' on what world is this logical?[/quote'] Mine. It's called ADHD: having another kind of logic. Not less logic, nor more, but different. Read the quote in my siggy.

 

I know you are a busy man' date=' Thorum, and it's been a while since we've had a vote recap; however, if you notice I did vote you and Liathiana for the Vig kill.  I'll go back and do a new vote count and I apologize for the diarreah of the keyboard there earlier....I was trying to do a post by post recap, but it turned into a monster of a post that even I think is too much.  [/quote'] Sorry. Missed that post.

 

Page 24.

 

I see I'm dead meat.

 

See you. Too bad I really was inocent.

[Loreina]

Loreina, I wasn't trying to be mean, but I was trying to make a point.  This is mafia and if you don't recommend that we go off of voting strategies or who is active and who isn't, how DO you suggest we go about figuring out who is mafia?  It seems like you are suggesting that we go with our hunches.....  :-\

 

Here is the thing though, you bring up a point that I was hoping the Mafia wouldn't realise.  If Thorum turns out innocent, then we could lose the game tonight.  If the Healer fails to heal the right player AND my vig kill does not take out a mafia, then it would be endgame. 

 

Hmmm....8 out of 9 remaining players are gunning for Thorum.  There are obviously some Mafia votes there (ya think?) Danya joined us at the last minute just in time to vote before looking scummish for not doing so.  Anyways, that's majority....let's see what the results are, shall we?

 

WTH? I'm not recommendingor suggesting any such thing; I'm stating facts. What part of that did you not understand?  The sad fact is that the lynch has been made based on nothing but hunches! We have no finder. We have at least four players whose level of activity has been suspicious, but they've all provided reasons for that. We have WIFOM'd the voting til it too is useless.

The chance of error is high. If we err, best to err on only one lynch at a time!

 

Fail to realize it? How could they not realize it? Heck, they're counting on it!  You can't really expect me to believe that you think they're that unobservant. And why are you restating what I've already said?

So you can get in one last plug to the Healer? Why are you so anxious to get the Healer to protect you?  We can still win the game whether the Evils nk you or some other innocent, as long as we only lose one. Unless you're not an innocent after all. If you were an Evil, what better way to ensure your survival.  You claim the assassin role, knowing that the real assassin will not counter claim, and turn it into a vig role. The only danger is that the real assassin will target you during night. How best to avoid this? PLay with the innocents. Pretend to be their vigilante friend. Play on the Healer's pity and get him or her to protect you, while you kill off more innocents. Yes, a quick and easy game.

 

It makes as much sense as anything else in this mess.  [glow=red,2,300]unvote[/glow]  [glow=red,2,300]Mynd[/glow]

 

I'm going to bed. g'night.

 

 

[Barmacral]

I'm gonna end day now, I'll count up the votes and tally things up when I wake up in the morning, as I'm fading fast on you all.

[Barmacral]

Sorry about the wait there folks, here's the game thusfar.

 

Vote Count:

 

Myndrunner (2): Thorum, Loreina

Loreina (1): Tigara

Thorum (6): Hybrid, Myndrunner, Verbal, Liathiana, cosmicpanda, Danya

 

A few notes on the glowing: The type of glow needed is either red or green, it only changes if I specify. Please only use the red or green glows to vote or unvote *glares at mynd* and not for your personal vote counts or anything else. You can unvote if you choose, it makes it easier for me to count votes, however, it is not required. Any other coloured votes or bolding you are welcome to use.

 

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

You are working on a toy when suddenly you hear a snap and you look up. Thorum, who was working on a train has snapped off a wheel accidentally. The door opens and two reindeer you haven't seen before enter, and prodding Thorum with their antlers, escort him out of the room. The door slams shut and locks.

 

Thorum, a roleless innocent, is dead. Night started last night when I locked this thread, and ends as soon as I get a chance to end it on Friday. Get your night actions in ASAP.

[Barmacral]

Its morning. You walk over to your table to do some work to find your latest toy sabotaged, and Lia's tools on your work table. Looking around you see that Liathiana is no longer amongst you. Apparently the reindeer had been quick to remove her.

 

Liathiana, a roleless innocent, is now dead. It is Day 3, Day ends on Monday Evening. With 7 alive, it takes 4 to lynch.

 

You may not vote in the same colour as the person before you. If they voted with a red glow, you must use a green glow, and vice versa. Any votes that do not follow this pattern will be ignored.

[Myndrunner]

Interesting...very interesting choice....right, first an explanation:

 

After reading Lore's last post, I realized that she was quite right about the danger of killing Tigara and him turning out innocent.  We only had three VIGGIE Votes on him and I didn't feel comfortable taking the chance.  If he turned up innocent, then it would have been ENDGAME and after seeing Thorum come up as innocent, I decided to submit "No Kill" instead. 

 

Problem was, I couldn't post to tell anyone that was what I had decided to do.....until now.

 

Now then, going forward, I will night kill anyone that we get a majority on the [glow=yellow,2,300]yellow[/glow] viggie votes, but only if we get a majority.  It would be likely for the mafia to place three votes on an innocent Tigara. 

 

Hmmmm, based on what I have read, I have my eyes on three players in particular, but I would like to hear from everyone else on their thoughts about Liathiana.  Why her?  Why not me?  Why not Tigara to try and discredit me? .... and why did Loreina unvote Thorum at the last minute?

[Tigara]

HOLY CRAP I'M ALIVE!!!

 

I really expected to die. >.>

 

[glow=red,2,300]Danya[/glow] since she was pushing for me really hard yesterday.

[cosmicpanda]

HOLY CRAP I'M ALIVE!!!

 

I really expected to die. >.>

 

[glow=red,2,300]Danya[/glow] since she was pushing for me really hard yesterday.

 

Are you serious? That's your only reasoning? That's an OMGUS vote. I used one on Mynd in the early game, which was fine as it wasn't serious. This appears to be serious, though....

[Liathiana]

HAH! I TOLD YOU GUYS I WAS INNOCENT.

 

So much for my super scumminess Mynd. VINDICATION IN DEATH. Sadness though :(

 

[Verbal32]

Mynd, I would have placed money on you getting NKed last night.  If you really are the assassin, which is how it appears, then you would be the prime target for the mafia.

 

Actually, I was hoping they would target you, along with the Healer, resulting in a no kill for the mafia.  I was also assuming you were going to kill Tigara, but your logic for not doing so seems sound enough.  Honestly, I only voted Tigs because Thorum had voted me, and Tig was the only other yellow vote, so I voted him for self-preservation.

 

On why Lor unvoted you right before the deadline, I think that is quite obvious.  She posted a long paragraph about you and was quite adamant about thinking you were evil, and trying to manipulate us.  I don't totally disagree with her either, as I wouldn't put it past you to be devising some elaborate scheme to stay alive once we kill the mafia and the game isn't over yet.  I think that's the crux of the issue with you, Mynd.  Are you solo or town?  I know you say town, but Lor doesn't agree......and I'm not sure either.  But you haven't done anything truly anti-town, so I don't have any glaring suspicions of you.

[Thorum]

Scooby Dooby Doo

 

Where are you?

 

*Feels alone*

[Myndrunner]

*tosses the Ghost of Thorum a Scooby Snack*

 

Fair enough, Verba, but I can go on and on about how pro-town I am.  Only my actions can truly speak for me.  We all know what Lor claims is her reason for unvoting Thorum and voting me; however, her actions also speak louder than her post.  But first....about me.

 

Here is another thing to consider...the win condition of the mafia.  They either win when all of us are elimenated, or more traditional, they win when there is an equal number of us to them.  So then, even if I were a solo-win player, my only prayer of winning would be to align myself with team innocent.  Like I said before, let's elimenate all the mafia and if the game doesn't end, then you know my true alignment.

 

Alrighty, on Loreina.  Why bother unvoting at the last minute? Although her reasons have been a bit scattered and vague, she has made it abundantly clear that she think me to be scum. So why did she change her vote? We had already run out of time and we had already reached a majority.  It was as if she already knew what the outcome would be and was preparing to look innocent for it.  

 

I thought part of her last minute post was to attempt to sway the Healer not to target me last night, but apparently, they decided to off Lia instead.  I think I have an idea who the Healer is based on previous posts of that person, but I am pretty sure that a reveal at this time would be fatal for us.

 

Now then, there are seven of us elves left and three of us are scumish mafia.  Tigara's reasons for voting Danya are pretty weak sause, but I am not inclined to think her necessarily to be innocent either.  Lore has been off the charts for me and since Thorum and Liathiana both turned up innocent, I'm really leaning towards a lynch on her.  

 

I think we need to hear from everyone, especially Hybrid and Cosmic Panda.  If we lynch an innocent, then its game over man....its GAME OVER!