The Magic System in WOT

[RAND AL THOR]

Hiya, me again.

 

What do people think about the magic system in WOT? Myself: F-A-N-T-A-S-T-I-C.

 

After reading WOT, the word 'magic' suddenly seems really childish because of how RJ created his magic system. It is very unique, mainly due to the lack of spells/incantations/objects of power (exclude angreal which are not ESSENTIAL)/wands/and other complicated rituals. RJ's magic system is very simple and really really brilliant.

 

There is one thing though. I would have loved it if there had been some other magic in Randland too. We have channelers drawing on the Power that drives the universe. How cool would it be to have a few rare necromancer-type guys who do use blood/spells etc? It would have added some additional spice but then again WOT already has enough complications as it is.

 

Other people's views?

[Asmo]

The OP system is designed so anything of the sort would be brutally out-of-context in the books. The way WoT is built, I wouldn't enjoy some other magic system mixed in, and I don't really see any need to.

[Guest Dreadlord]

QUOTE

After reading WOT, the word 'magic' suddenly seems really childish because of how RJ created his magic system. It is very unique, mainly due to the lack of spells/incantations/objects of power (exclude angreal which are not ESSENTIAL)/wands/and other complicated rituals. RJ's magic system is very simple and really really brilliant

UNQUOTE

 

I mentioned this on another thread. The magic system is excellent, you can almost guess what flows are required for what. And I agree 100% with how spells, casting, etc all seem like fairytale words after reading Wheel of Time. Im an aspiring writer myself and since reading Wheel of Time I MUST think of different words to use. Magic will still be what its called I think, but there will be no "casting spells" as such. Seems too "Harry Potter" for my liking now hehe

[MatrixM]

I think the whole necromancer thing would ruin the effect. And there are different types of magic, The Ogier Singing and the myddraal's powers.

But i agree with the rest of you said whole-heartedly.

[Lord Onep]

There is one thing though. I would have loved it if there had been some other magic in Randland too. We have channelers drawing on the Power that drives the universe. How cool would it be to have a few rare necromancer-type guys who do use blood/spells etc? It would have added some additional spice but then again WOT already has enough complications as it is.

 

There actually is a form of power which I would consider dark magic. The "True Power" as reffered to by the Chosen. It is Shaitan's version of the One Power. Like necromancery and blood magic,(in most cases)it too comes with a price. The a user gains the Saa (black speckles in their eyes) after too much use. Also the "True Power" is extremely addictive. I believe there were several other side effects as well, but I cannot remember. It also had its advantage by being undetectable by anyone else. Allowing for a large amount of surprise.

[CUBAREY]

I believe there were several other side effects as well, but I cannot remember.

 

You go insane from its continued use. That's how we know Ishy got reincarnated into Modriden.

[RAND AL THOR]

yapyap but the true power is somewhat like the one power. But I forgot to mention the other stuff like myrdraal powers and also that peculiar cage that Moridin holds on Moggy. Those were nice additions.The Dark Side has a lot of interesting magic-related stuff but we don't really get to see much of it do we?

 

Min's ability has nothing to do with the power. I wished there were other stuff like that that are not linked to the power. That's what I meant about the necromancy thing. IT was just an example. Min is really weird in that aspect isn't she? I mean, she is the only one in the whole of Randland that we are aware of who has some sort of supernatural ability that is not linked to the One Power. I hope to get some sort of explanation in AMOL (though I likely wont so I hope for a nice appendix giving answers)

[MatrixM]

Apart from the Wolfbrothers and Sniffers or whatever.

[Guest Dreadlord]

One thing that I dont like is the explanation of Shadar Logoth. It has its part and it comes across well, and its effect on Padan Fain is great, yet the explanation of its evil entity type powers disappoints me. The city had to become as evil as the Shadow to fight it, fine. But where did the powers it has come from? That explanation seems like it has a big hole in it, a hole that leaves me asking why there arent more of these cities that became so evil that dark sinister powers appeared out of thin air. It cant be explained by ANYTHING that I can think of. The Shadow, no, because its purpose was to oppose the Shadow. The Pattern? I doubt it very much. The One Power? Definitely not, Shadar Logoth has no links to the Power that I can think of, and it definitely has nothing to do with the Taint.

[MatrixM]

Somehow, vast amounts of Hatred, suspicion and jealousy created a new evil.

[Ashaman Kovan]

Well there are other "Powers" having nothing to do with the OP. We have the Wolfbrothers, we have the Ogier singing, we have mins ability, we have mats luck ability, Myrdraal powers, fains special powers, The green man. Remember also theres still one more book. Plenty of room for things we don't know about from the AOL to come back into style.

[MatrixM]

The green man was created by the power, i think.

[RAND AL THOR]

The green man was created by the power, i think.

 

I don't think it is possible for the Power to be used to create a self-sufficient living entity.

If so, the Tower could have created a vast army that way. :o

 

The Nyms were a unique race actually though their origin is still clouded. The Green Man was the last remaining one thats all.

 

I agree with Dreadlord. The Shadar Logoth powers are very fishy. Especially the Mashadar thingy. I want more explanations. WOT has the habit of not explaining several phenomena satisfactorily. When I came across Mat's luck, I really wanted a logical reason for it. Even the colours that appear when the taveren think of each other. If an author doesn't need to explain why certain things happen in the book, he can write whatever he likes!!

 

I hope most of my Qs will be answered in AMOL.

[Lord Nik]

The green man was created by the power, i think.

 

I don't think it is possible for the Power to be used to create a self-sufficient living entity.

If so, the Tower could have created a vast army that way. :o

 

The Nyms were a unique race actually though their origin is still clouded. The Green Man was the last remaining one thats all.

 

Nyms were made with the one power during the Age of Legends. They worked with ogier and humans growing and singing crops to make perfect harvest. (not only crops but just an example). Chora trees (avendesora) were made with the power as well. And trollocs were made with the power as well, and halfmen were their strange infrequently occurring offspring. Ogier are the only known natural sentient beings known in WoT(besides humans). (as Nyms, Trollocs, and Halfmen were artificially created)

 

[Guest Dreadlord]

QUOTE

I agree with Dreadlord. The Shadar Logoth powers are very fishy. Especially the Mashadar thingy. I want more explanations. WOT has the habit of not explaining several phenomena satisfactorily. When I came across Mat's luck, I really wanted a logical reason for it. Even the colours that appear when the taveren think of each other. If an author doesn't need to explain why certain things happen in the book, he can write whatever he likes!!

UNQUOTE

 

For me, the only thing is Shadar Logoths power. The fact that it became really evil doesnt seem like a good enough reason for it to gain the powers. Dont get me wrong, I like Shadar Logoths role and everything, just not the explanation for how it got its powers.

 

The Ta'veren swirling colors and Mats luck are brilliant I think.

[Lord Onep]

When I came across Mat's luck, I really wanted a logical reason for it. Even the colours that appear when the taveren think of each other.

 

Mat's luck comes from the fact he is so frick'n cool.

Naw, well the fact that Matt is known as a gambler throughout all his lives is an explanation. Also, while his luck comes from being Ta'averan er something or other (Can't remember spelling), his power to bend the weave of time around him doesn't seem to effect much besides random events. I.E. others such as Hawking and Rand will make others speak/do things they normally would not do.  Another point about him being a gambler is also the dice in his head. The luck thing is really just his persona.  8)

 

The colors that appear in the Three's head when ever they think of each other is from being so closely woven to each other into the pattern. I suppose it is more of a side effect than an actual ability. Proof of this is how everytime Moraine gets the chance she mentions how if even one of them falls before The Final Battle, the world is surely doomed.

[Mr Ares]

When I came across Mat's luck, I really wanted a logical reason for it. Even the colours that appear when the taveren think of each other.

Mat's luck comes from the fact he is so frick'n cool.

Naw, well the fact that Matt is known as a gambler throughout all his lives is an explanation. Also, while his luck comes from being Ta'averan er something or other (Can't remember spelling), his power to bend the weave of time around him doesn't seem to effect much besides random events. I.E. others such as Hawking and Rand will make others speak/do things they normally would not do.  Another point about him being a gambler is also the dice in his head. The luck thing is really just his persona.  8)

The luck thing is more likely to do with the Shadar Logoth blade. It's stated after his Healing that it is unknown what the effects will be. Mat's luck is unique to him. Ta'veren isn't. It affects Mat in the same way it affects Rand or Perrin or anyone else who has ever been ta'veren (although to a lesser extent than Rand). Also, the "fact" that Mat is "known as a gambler throughout all his lives" is no such thing.

[42Bonzo88]

    What I really like about the magic system is you have boundaries. Alot of the magic you see in other books is it's almost limitless. Sure, you can't always bring someone back from the dead (in some books you can, others can't) but like two men can't link without a woman, most "great" magics need both sides to make it work. The circles, and how "new" magics are found (Nynaeve's healing, Elayne rediscovering heartstone) make it flexible, but you have limits.

 

    It gets kind of boring when you read "Oh, I see what you need is the super-dee-duper potion of limitless limits, ok, give me some frog legs and the eye of a newt and I'll wave my magic wand and...

[RAND AL THOR]

Agreed Bonzo. The limits are cool. RJ's magic system was very well planned. It doesnt have a single flaw.

 

I like the way the sa'angreal are designed. Without buffers, the user may suffer intense damage and stuff like that. Even with the Choden Kal, which allows you to stretch the magic system to the maximum, I liked the way Rand and Nynaeve couldn't tolerate such a high flow for an extended period of time.

[Lord Nik]

i also agree with rand adnd bronzo

the magic system is very well placed and when i try to describe the "magic" in WoT it feels so weak to call it magic. And there always like i understand they get there powers from the earth hence the 5 powers you mentioned... and im like... no... it saidin and saidar ect ect...

and there like.. magic "yes, but no, just read i cant explain it :p

great!

[Ashaman Kovan]

Ok I think starting now everyone should agree on pain of death to stop using the word "Magic" to in any way refer to any entity, ability Etc having anything to do with WoT. :-X

[Lord Nik]

agreed wot doesnt have magic it has something more!

[benr]

TAR fits in here somehow, too.

[RAND AL THOR]

Ok I think starting now everyone should agree on pain of death to stop using the word "Magic" to in any way refer to any entity, ability Etc having anything to do with WoT. :-X

 

True but I can't think of any other word! ::)

[Lille]

The Wheel of Time IS Magic