Would you accept Rand returning to life?

[Mr Ares]

In WOT it is theoretically impossible to bring a dead person back to life. "Death cannot be Healed" is well known among AS.

It is both theoretically and actually possible to bring someone back from the dead, given that it has been done. AS hardly represent the limit of knowledge.

[RAND AL THOR]

In WOT it is theoretically impossible to bring a dead person back to life. "Death cannot be Healed" is well known among AS.

It is both theoretically and actually possible to bring someone back from the dead, given that it has been done. AS hardly represent the limit of knowledge.

 

Which instance are you referring to?

[Mr Ares]

In WOT it is theoretically impossible to bring a dead person back to life. "Death cannot be Healed" is well known among AS.

It is both theoretically and actually possible to bring someone back from the dead, given that it has been done. AS hardly represent the limit of knowledge.

Which instance are you referring to?

Four Chosen have returned from death. I know you previously addressed them, but I would point out that if people can come back from the dead, that means it is possible. What is needed is some way to catch the soul between leaving the body and reaching the afterlife. In the case of the Chosen this something is Shai'tan (obviously ruled out for Light-siders). If the Light wishes to use the same trick, they need something to catch the soul, and then to push it back in the body (any bodily damage would need to be Healed first). The only difficulty would be the soul-catching. What evidence is there that it is theoretically impossible for anything other than Shai'tan to catch a soul, and does the theory take into account that it is possible for Shai'tan to do it? If the AS simply say it's impossible, without any evidence, while unaware that it is possible (for a god, admittedly) then they are theorising without all the evidence, so any theory could well be flawed.

[Guest Dreadlord]

I agree with you Ares. The best example being that stilling and gentling "cant be Healed." The Aes Sedai know next to nothing.

[RAND AL THOR]

Well I have to admit that the fact that my idea is based on the AS certainty that Death cannot be healed is a loophole indeed.

 

Another point that would be against me is that cuendillar cannot break but the seals did.

 

However, all the exemptions are regarding the DO somehow. Would they count as expemtions then, since the DO is a supernatural being likely stronger than any other being, except for the Creator?

[Guest Dreadlord]

I would think so, since they aren't on the same power level as the Dark One or the Creator.

 

That being said though, it becomes more and more obvious that the Aes Sedai consider things impossible, when they simply don't know how. The best example being that a severed channeler can't be Healed.

 

Nynaeve questioned that boundary and because she was persistent she found a way. I wonder if she will achieve anything else that is "impossible" in book 12. I remember her (or someone) thinking to themselves that being severed from the True Source cannot be Healed any more than a severed hand. And then she Healed Logain. Will she replace Rands hand? Will she achieve resurrection? Its a long shot but it would no longer surprise me.

 

Don't get me wrong, I doubt Nynaeve will resurrect anyone, but the Aes Sedai considering something to be impossible doesn't hold as well as it once did, in my opinion.

[billoumm7]

i hope he's not resurcted, i hate rand, he's such an asshole... plus he told lewis therin that he was going to die at TG... i want him to stay dead!

[Bob T Dwarf]

Essentially the main question of this topic is meaningless.

 

How can anyone have read eleven volumes of this story and not accept that Rand will die and live again?  There's dreams, prophesies, portents, and the 'Finns, fer gosh sakes - all pointing to exactly that.

 

Aginor died and lived again...

Balthamel died and lives again...

Ishy died and lives again...

 

Nobody seems to have any problem with that.

 

Mat died and lives again...

Aviendha died and lives again...

Asmodean died - twice in the same day... :o :o

 

Again, no complaints.

 

Even Birgitte, who was dead when this whole mess started, lives again.

 

And, we're being asked if we would accept Rand "returning to life?"  And, some people have a problem with the idea ??? ???

[Guest Dreadlord]

Exactly. Why is it that so many people are against the main guy being brought back to life, by whatever means? I have the idea that Rand will be alive again after everything is done; not one of those situations where he is alive again at the last moment, because we all knew from very early on that he would die at Tarmon Gaidon. Ive always imagined that Rand will win Tarmon Gaidon and die doing so, and after he has won, somehow he is brought back.

 

And just for the record, imagine what it would be like if it turned out the fate of the world rested on your shoulders, that EVERYONE would die if you failed, that nobody else would be born if you didnt do what you had to. And while youre trying to work towards that, you have people denying that its you thats guna do it, people trying to pull you down, people trying to use you, and on top of all that people trying to KILL you, if all that could be said of you is that youre an asshole while youre trying to deal with it, then Id say fair play to Rand.

 

I'll explain why I want Rand to live.

 

It isn't because I want to see the happy ending or anything like that. So far, RJ gave us so many hints at whats coming up through prophecies and visions, specific yet at the same time vague, events that hint at something but could end up getting to that point in many different ways. And every time its happened it has been good enough, unlike many other stories where you are disappointed.

 

All of them so far have been good enough in my opinion. Twice and twice shall he be marked, Mat dying and living again, the guardians matching the servants, Rand throwing lightening in every direction, the fox that makes the ravens fly, all of the ones we have seen turned out well. And I still think many of them are yet to come-Cadsuane teaching Rand to laugh and cry again, Mat giving up half of the Light of the world, he who is dead yet lives.

 

As I said, everything we have had glimpses of beforehand has ended up being good enough. I think its safe to say Rand being alive after dying won't include balefire (at least I hope not) and so I just want to see how RJ pulls it off. Not just because its such a big thing to do in a story like this, but more because he has more or less told us Rand will be alive after dying from several different sources in the books, and because of that I can't accept anything less. Im pretty sure I wont be disappointed; I just want to see how RJ pulled it off.

[benr]

I want Rand to live because I remember that boy at the start of "The Eye", and I want him to get the chance to find that in himself again.

[RAND AL THOR]

Essentially the main question of this topic is meaningless.

 

How can anyone have read eleven volumes of this story and not accept that Rand will die and live again?  There's dreams, prophesies, portents, and the 'Finns, fer gosh sakes - all pointing to exactly that.

 

Not so. The entire series points more or less or Rand dying and somehow living again. lol

 

The topic in discussion is how you, as a reader, would view that. I have given reasons before already for my own views anyway.

And I have also mentioned before how RJ has neatly built up the whole Rand must die idea so that we are all practically expecting it now.

 

For people who keep stating the other deaths are re-lives, I woud like to say,

1) Would you approve of the DO bringing Rand back? Then stop talking about the Forsaken.

2) Is Rand going to be killed and the killer balefired to return him? Obviously not-so stop talking about the people who have returned via balefire.

3) Was Rand in T'A'R and ripped out? No. Is his rebirth scheme likely to involve T'A'R? Not likely. So stop comparing Birgette.

 

As I have said before, Rand's rebirth is very likely going to be on a whole different level-unlike any other instance in the book. The possibly reality of such a situation-even in Randland-is what has me skeptical.

 

But perhaps I should have waiting till after AMOL to begin this thread?

[Guest Dreadlord]

QUOTE

1) Would you approve of the DO bringing Rand back? Then stop talking about the Forsaken.

2) Is Rand going to be killed and the killer balefired to return him? Obviously not-so stop talking about the people who have returned via balefire.

3) Was Rand in T'A'R and ripped out? No. Is his rebirth scheme likely to involve T'A'R? Not likely. So stop comparing Birgette

UNQUOTE

 

Personally, if the Dark One brought Rand back to life I wouldn't be dissapointed. There are ways that could be turned around that could be satisfactory I reckon, although I wont go into detail.

 

The point is though, people werent comparing those things to Rands death, they were merely mentioning how many exceptions there already are to the theory of death being final. Another exception, in Rands case, wouldnt be pushing the boundaries any more than they have already been pushed. I want to see how RJ pulled it off with Rand is all, as like you say its not likely to be the same as any of the other instances. Maybe the Creator DOES take a hand in the end to reward the Dragon, maybe not. We can only speculate, but Im 99% sure Rand WILL live after death somehow

[RAND AL THOR]

QUOTE

1) Would you approve of the DO bringing Rand back? Then stop talking about the Forsaken.

2) Is Rand going to be killed and the killer balefired to return him? Obviously not-so stop talking about the people who have returned via balefire.

3) Was Rand in T'A'R and ripped out? No. Is his rebirth scheme likely to involve T'A'R? Not likely. So stop comparing Birgette

UNQUOTE

 

Personally, if the Dark One brought Rand back to life I wouldn't be dissapointed. There are ways that could be turned around that could be satisfactory I reckon, although I wont go into detail.

 

The point is though, people werent comparing those things to Rands death, they were merely mentioning how many exceptions there already are to the theory of death being final. Another exception, in Rands case, wouldnt be pushing the boundaries any more than they have already been pushed. I want to see how RJ pulled it off with Rand is all, as like you say its not likely to be the same as any of the other instances. Maybe the Creator DOES take a hand in the end to reward the Dragon, maybe not. We can only speculate, but Im 99% sure Rand WILL live after death somehow

 

LOL!

 

Personally, if the Dark One brought Rand back to life I wouldn't be dissapointed.

 

:o :o :o :o :o

Dreadlord, I hereby declare you a Friend of the Dark!

[Guest Dreadlord]

Hehe its taken you this long? Ever heard of a Dreadlord working for the Light? Just for randomness we should post on here what the Lights equivalent of a Dreadlord would be called lol

 

Anyway why Lol at my post? Wasnt intended to be funny...

[RAND AL THOR]

I have the habit of saying 'lol' when I happen to agree with someone. Nothing to do with being funny.

[Guest Dreadlord]

Ah ok. Any suggestions on what a Dreadlord working for the Light would be called? Please dont say Aes Sedai or Ashaman lol

[benr]

Well, traitor, I guess.

[Guest Dreadlord]

That would imply that I started out working for the Light whereas I didnt.

 

Mwa ha ha haaa kneel and swear fealty to the Great Lord of the Dimly-lit...er I mean Dark!

[Luckers]

Well, traitor, I guess.

 

Lol. That, or deeply confused.

[Guest Dreadlord]

Or just on the Dark Side coz its more fun!

 

 

[DemandredFO]

an Aes'aman

[Guest Dreadlord]

Asha'Sedai. Hehe almost sounds like Ashanadrei

[RAND AL THOR]

Any suggestions on what a Dreadlord working for the Light would be called? Please dont say Aes Sedai or Ashaman lol

 

I seem to misunderstand the question here.

How is it possible for a dreadlord to work for the light? Any channeler on the side of the light is.....Aes Sedai or Asha'man.

If they go to the dark then they are dreadlords.

Unless you are trying to come up with a cooler name for Aes Sedai/Asha'man and I must say they are most certainly cool enough.

 

 

[Guest Dreadlord]

It was a joke when someone said I was a Darkfriend, and I was like...well yeah Im a Dreadlord... It wasnt a serious question

[RAND AL THOR]

It was a joke when someone said I was a Darkfriend, and I was like...well yeah Im a Dreadlord... It wasnt a serious question

 

That was me. ;D

Obviously it was a joke, but then I saw some answers and they didn't make sense at all.....

;D