Abilities and Usefullness

[Shaidar_Rannow]

Studing a stilled or gentled person is NOT trying to heal them. Thats what I was saying, of course they studied the changes in behavior and all, but did not try to heal them. Now I obviously cannot say that about the AOL so unfortunately we must agree to disagree there(Since neither of us can gather proof about an age we know so little about) Stilling or Gentling is the Purposefull cutting of the source. Now being burnt out is different and that has been studied. As I said I will gladliy apologize on the subject but I am gonna need valid proof that I am wrong first.

[Leopoled Boothe]

Studing a stilled or gentled person is NOT trying to heal them. Thats what I was saying, of course they studied the changes in behavior and all, but did not try to heal them. Now I obviously cannot say that about the AOL so unfortunately we must agree to disagree there(Since neither of us can gather proof about an age we know so little about) Stilling or Gentling is the Purposefull cutting of the source. Now being burnt out is different and that has been studied. As I said I will gladliy apologize on the subject but I am gonna need valid proof that I am wrong first.

 

Stilling and Genteling are commonly used as punishments they are not exclusivly used for the purpose.  Channelers are sometimes severed in battle either intentionally or unintenitonally by rival channelers.  One of the Black Ajah was accidentally stilled by the Wonder Girls in Tear, and Moggy attempted to still Nyneave during one of their battles.  I'm sure that such malicious severings were performed duing the AOL condidering that there were powerfull channeler serving both the Light and the Shadow.  I would think the if an AS had been severed by an enemy they would have tried to find a way to heal them.  At any rate, in Randland the commonly accepted belief is that severing CANNOT be healed.  Given the dire nature of severing I don't think any channeler would so readily accept this belief if healing had never even been attempted.  Don't you think that if Suian and Leane believed that there was even a chance that stilling could be healed that they would have begged the Salidar sisters to at least attempt it or tried to bully Nyn and Elayne into finding the cure?  But they did not do this because the belief that stilling cannot be healed is so ingrained that they didn't even question it.  I don't bleieve that a belief could be that ingrained if no one had ever tried to disprove it.

 

At any rate, you are kind of missing the point.  Nyn's special ability is not the power to heal severing but rather her extraordinary tallent for healing in general.  Yes, she definitly did stumble onto the cure for genetling by accident, but the fact that she could heal the unhealabe without even trying is further testament to her extraordinary tallent for healing. 

[Shaidar_Rannow]

Good to see you around again Leo. Now Nyneave is not the best healer available so her talent is lackluster there. How good is one woman amongst thousands dying in TG. Now to your points on stilling/gentling we cannot make any assumptions about stilling/gentling in the AOL because this is conjecture. Now if there were some proof aside from that then okay. If only we could get into the 12th depository, then we'd get some answers.

[Leopoled Boothe]

Good to see you around again Leo.

 

Well what can I say, I try to get one here whenever I can.  Unfortunatly life doesn't afford me much time for blogging these days.

 

Now Nyneave is not the best healer available so her talent is lackluster there.

 

Says who?  What is your basis for this statement.  She was using the power to heal people in the two rivers before she ever knew she could channel.  And again she, healed a gentled man without even trying.  Seems pretty tallented to me.

 

How good is one woman amongst thousands dying in TG.

 

What?

 

Now to your points on stilling/gentling we cannot make any assumptions about stilling/gentling in the AOL because this is conjecture.

 

Well, we do know that at least one woman from the AOL used severing as a battle technique because Moggy tried it on Nyn.  I supose it is possible that Moggy is the one and only person who would and/or could do such a thing but I find it very unlikely.  Therefore, we do have evidence that severing was used as a battle technique in the AOL, at least by some of the evil channelers.  I know it is just conjecture but it seems very unreasonalbe to believe that the good guys of the AOL would just abandon an unjustly severed person to his/her fate.  Seems they would have at least attemped to heal them.

 

At any rate in the test Jordan emphasized many times that genteling/stilling was irreversable.  I really think he really meant to imply that it is infact all but irreversable and it is not as simple as no one ever attempting to reverse it.  I believe he heavily implied that Nyn and Flinn each accomplished a very extraordinary feat.   

 

[aussie_ashaman123]

maybe healing is too structured in the AoL like in the white tower, those who learn to heal away are more feral in a way, not knowing the correct weaves, they do it the "wrong" way instead. finding out all these new waves that can perform the impossible

[Bazzles]

I don't think that Perrin has told Rand about the "wovles". 

 

Well, he may have an inkling. In TEotW the green man calls Perrin "A wolfbrother" in front of the whole party. Although he also started blabbin on about Rand being a child of the dragon, so they may have labelled him as crazy and forgotten these happenings.

 

Elayas said it takes a pack to take down a fade, how many wolves do you think live in Randland?

 

Well... how many normal humans does it take to bring down a fade? He also said that they lost HALF the pack in the same breath, the entire pack did not die with the fade. And wolves may have other uses too, they don't specifically have to go fade hunting, I'm pretty sure a wolf is as much a match for a trolloc as a human is, or close enough.

[Shaidar_Rannow]

 

Now Nyneave is not the best healer available so her talent is lackluster there.

 

Says who?  What is your basis for this statement.  She was using the power to heal people in the two rivers before she ever knew she could channel.  And again she, healed a gentled man without even trying.  Seems pretty tallented to me.

 

 

Sumeko has shown a greater ability in healing. She is a wilder so thats how she healed others. She didnt know what she was doing was source related then. Actually she did work on Logain for a while, and I will grant that it is a fine accomplishment, but she did it almost in passing. I am not saying that she is not talented but shes a bit bloated(as are all the wondergirls) since she got some forgotten weaves from Moggy.

 

I dont know about your stilling weapon theory. I must again reitorate that we cannot simply assume things were done in the AOL. Also in all I have read, mind you if RJ answered this in a QOW or something I will be quite abashed,(I havent read many of them)I have not seen anything that points to ANYONE but Nyneave try to actually heal stilling or gentling and I think Egwene tried too. She only used Logain since it was too hard for Suian and Leane to sit through. Blast away

[aussie_ashaman123]

 

Well... how many normal humans does it take to bring down a fade? He also said that they lost HALF the pack in the same breath, the entire pack did not die with the fade. And wolves may have other uses too, they don't specifically have to go fade hunting, I'm pretty sure a wolf is as much a match for a trolloc as a human is, or close enough.

 

trollocs fear wolves, theyll kill a lone wolf, but will never try and avoid them if possible. In the Stone the trollocs shied away from perrins eyes

[Luckers]

Quote

Now Nyneave is not the best healer available so her talent is lackluster there.

 

Says who?  What is your basis for this statement.  She was using the power to heal people in the two rivers before she ever knew she could channel.  And again she, healed a gentled man without even trying.  Seems pretty tallented to me.

 

She's damn talented. Sumeko is just MORE talented. Nynaeve herself states this.

 

I dont know about your stilling weapon theory. I must again reitorate that we cannot simply assume things were done in the AOL. Also in all I have read, mind you if RJ answered this in a QOW or something I will be quite abashed,(I havent read many of them)I have not seen anything that points to ANYONE but Nyneave try to actually heal stilling or gentling and I think Egwene tried too. She only used Logain since it was too hard for Suian and Leane to sit through. Blast away

 

Indeed. You're quite correct, its never suggested that it was studied in the AOL. Furthermore based on the reactions of the Forsaken we have a basis for suggesting that indeed it was never studied.

[Shaidar_Rannow]

Ha HA! To think now you are my ally in this particular thing Luckers. Ususally your the one destroing my theories! lol

 

Now that is finished perhaps we can switch gears here.

 

I think one of the most usefull things for AMOL would be for Faile to die. Just think, it would strengthen Perrin for TG(that is if the darkfriends killed her) Also, I see this as win win, Faile dies!!!!!! The light rechoice that it is so! She is the worst character in the game, however, her secretary is quite the useful guy. Personal assistant to Pedron Niall. He can be used to gather intel, but Faile should still die.

[Guest Dreadlord]

QUOTE

Nynaeve - channeler. No other skills apparent at present. I'm waiting though

UNQUOTE

 

Are you kidding? Nynaeve was the first to Heal somebody who was gentled/stilled! She is the only one who seems to question what is possible or not with the Power, she pushes the boundaries of possibilty. It was her who said "Being stilled cant be Healed any more than a severed hand." And then she Healed Logain. Now, tell me if I'm reading between the lines too much, but Im sure RJ dropped us a hint that Nynaeve will push the boundaries even further? Another Nynaeve quote is "I won't be satisfied until I Healed sombody three days dead." Nynaeve has some more good stuff to do yet, I can feel it

[wvlr]

QUOTE

Nynaeve - channeler. No other skills apparent at present. I'm waiting though

UNQUOTE

 

Are you kidding? Nynaeve was the first to Heal somebody who was gentled/stilled! She is the only one who seems to question what is possible or not with the Power, she pushes the boundaries of possibilty. It was her who said "Being stilled cant be Healed any more than a severed hand." And then she Healed Logain. Now, tell me if I'm reading between the lines too much, but Im sure RJ dropped us a hint that Nynaeve will push the boundaries even further? Another Nynaeve quote is "I won't be satisfied until I Healed sombody three days dead." Nynaeve has some more good stuff to do yet, I can feel it

 

No argument with any of that.    I just wonder when she will put the old saying "in the AoL the best things were accomplished using BOTH Sides" and healing together to see what she can do when linked with a man.

[aevogt]

"I dont know about your stilling weapon theory. I must again reitorate that we cannot simply assume things were done in the AOL. "

 

Rand also stills three women in combat.  He does not use the slicing (blade) weave, he uses the crushing (Hammer) weave.  Either way you're just as severed.

[Magicana]

"I dont know about your stilling weapon theory. I must again reitorate that we cannot simply assume things were done in the AOL. "

 

Rand also stills three women in combat.  He does not use the slicing (blade) weave, he uses the crushing (Hammer) weave.  Either way you're just as severed.

 

Under the influence of Therin at the time, so that adds weight to it being used as a weapon.

 

Anyway, its a damn effective weapon. Why wouldn't they anyway, it permanently knocks out a channeler.

[Tigara]

Quote

Now Nyneave is not the best healer available so her talent is lackluster there.

 

Says who?  What is your basis for this statement.  She was using the power to heal people in the two rivers before she ever knew she could channel.  And again she, healed a gentled man without even trying.  Seems pretty tallented to me.

 

She's damn talented. Sumeko is just MORE talented. Nynaeve herself states this.

 

 

Semirhage surpasses them both in that area.

[Shaidar_Rannow]

I personally dont believe that Rand wanted to still the Aes Sedai at Dumani Wells. He was tring to break the shield they had on hime and the stillings were an after effect.

[trakand_01]

I agree. I remember that he likened loosening their hold on him like 'untying a knot'. He was pushing tiny threads of saidin inside the saidar 'knot' or 'softer spots' in his shield, and trying to prise them open. The result happened to be that the force of having their weave 'exploded' or 'untied' rather than sliced, was that it stilled the sisters holding him. I dont know how it did it, maybe the rebounding weaves shook the ability to channel from them, or maybe it was the way in which saidin took their weave apart, or something to do with the taint touching their weave. I think Rand was a little surprised to learn he'd stilled them, actually, wasnt he?

 

I would imagine if i was trying to untie a knot from the inside with the power, i would push tiny threads into all the gaps, all the routes through the knot and either somehow grease it, so the weaves slipped apart, or simply blow it up from the inside. I imagine, Rand being Rand and his mental state at the time, he took the latter. who knows what that could do to the woman's ability to channel when she is drawing as much of the power as she can, and is linked to many other women doing the same?

[Emily_Sedai]

 

Hmm, another possible ability? 

 

I'm currently re-reading TPoD, and in the very beginning, Aviendha discusses the feeling about danger being near as she walks through the Tarasin Palace.  Later on, while holding Saidar and creating a gateway, the feeling returns and she pinpoints where the gholam is standing watching them.  Does she possible have the ability to sense when danger is near in addition to determining what objects of the Power do, or was this just an itching between the shoulder blades?  Any thoughts? 

[trakand_01]

It's possible, but my personal opinion is that she's Aiel. She's used to being 'on her guard' and at detecting things which arent quite normal. She's also increasingly paranoid as she is in an unfamiliar place, wearing dresses where she is used to her (when she was a maiden) cadin'sor.

 

I think we see Lan do similar things; he becomes more wary in certain situations. In his case i think it comes from experience, but as a former Maiden I think Aviendha is also quite experienced, if not old enough to have experienced the last major Aiel-involved war.

 

I could be completely wrong though, you could have uncovered a new skill. Perhaps if she is able to 'read' 'angreal, she is also able to 'read' danger, tell when it is there.

[Guest Dreadlord]

At Salidar in books 5/6 Nynaeve states that her weather sense told her that a storm was coming. A big storm. And when taht "storm" gets there the weather is the same as it was when she first felt it coming.

 

In other words she can sense when something bad or major is about to happen, and she can feel it while its happening.

[aevogt]

I personally dont believe that Rand wanted to still the Aes Sedai at Dumani Wells. He was tring to break the shield they had on hime and the stillings were an after effect.

 

"It gave as he pressed, bending under his pressure, bending, bending.  Siuddenly it tore apart before him like rotted cloth.  The Power filled him, and as it did, he seized at those three soft points, crushing them in fists of Spirit."

 

That reads an awful lot like a deliberate attack to me. 

[cheyjade]

"It gave as he pressed, bending under his pressure, bending, bending.  Siuddenly it tore apart before him like rotted cloth.  The Power filled him, and as it did, he seized at those three soft points, crushing them in fists of Spirit."

 

That reads an awful lot like a deliberate attack to me. 

 

But did he realize what those soft points were?

[trakand_01]

I think  he did, I think he had reasoned out that there were x number of soft points and x women holding him. I think he had a fairly good idea that each soft point was one of the women.

 

But my point is that i dont think he intended to still them. He was fully intending to break their shield (deliberately attack it, yes) and be able to once more draw the power, but I dont think he considered that breaking their shield might still them. Its a difference in his intentions; he wasnt trying to still them, he was trying to break their shield.

[Bazzles]

Siuddenly it tore apart before him like rotted cloth.  The Power filled him, and as it did, he seized at those three soft points, crushing them in fists of Spirit

 

But surely he knew he had already broken the shield if the power filled him and THEN he used a weave to crush the 3 "soft points." I'm pretty sure he meant to harm the 3 Aes Sedai.

[trakand_01]

Perhaps, or maybe he could draw Saidin, but not as much as he wanted / needed. I also imagine that if I were held by say, 6 women and although i could now channel, 3 still held me, I'd want those 3 to let go also.

 

He was in a severely reduced mental state though, so it's entirely possible he meant to hurt them.