Mat and Perrin's...skills...

[Chel Vanin]

Perrin seems to ahve developed different skills of a wolfbrother over time. In the beginning he recieved the golden eyes, the increased senses, and the ability to talk with wolves but in book 6 he is able to smell emotions. There were hints of him being able to to this a little bit prior to book 6 but not much. Is he developing other skills? He also seems to be very handy with that axe but I could attribute some of that to training (however casually) with Lan, and just generally ahving to use it for the last couple years.

 

Also Mat. He defeated Galad with a shortstaff...luck? Or is he really that good? This is before he got all those memories. He is also (as of book 11) one of the better fighters IMHO in the entire series. Help from the memories? Also he doesn't hear dice in his head until either late in book 6 or early in book 7. Developing skills? If so how? he's been referred to as "son of battles" but he doesn't really have an inborn skills he got it from the aelfin/eelfin (sp? idk which is which btw are aelfin the foxes or snakes?).

 

So, will they be developing any other sweet skills? I don't really think they will with only one book remaining, but why did it take so long for Mat's dice and Perrin's smelling to "manifest" as it were.

[krelianzg]

Perrin smelling emotions is, I think, just a matter of pheromones.

 

Mat's skills with a quarterstaff are natural. He's been training with one since he was a little kid. His luck certainly helps him in actual combat, but the moves he has are all his own. They were all there before he received his other memories. The memories from the Finns are more of a benefit from a leadership point of view anyway, though I'm sure they still help in personal combat.

[Vidarr]

Mat developed the dice thing in book three, he didn't know what it was but, during his POV's it described the occurance of the dice but hadn't realized what it was till later. It was a matter of getting used to the ability the same with Perrin's sense of smell, he could "smell

' emotions but he didn't know what he was smelling. In the later books his descriptions of emotions he smells get more and more detailed.

[Majsju]

Mat does have quite a bit of help from his memories when it comes to fighting with the ashanderai. It is a bit different from the quarterstaff which he has naturally.

[krelianzg]

Good point. Do they ever specifically reference that though?

[Majsju]

Yes. Can't recall exactly where right now though. (just got back from the pub, memory ain't working at 100%...*g*)

[Vidarr]

In the big knife fight in KoD it talks about how Mat was striking for the parts that bleed the best, then it says something along the line of some of his memories had come from people who weren't very nice at all. If memory serves.

[Gorthal]

Good point. Do they ever specifically reference that though?

Yes.  In Rhuidean right after Matt gets his weapon:

Mat used his spear like a quarterstaff, a spinning blur, but bringing the sword blade into it as if he had always used the weapon. The creatures died or at least returned to dust but they were many, and quick.

This is the first time he's held it, so it pretty much has to be the memories. 

[Cabriana]

I don't think it's all that big a suprise that Mat could beat Galad. Didn't Thom at one point tell him that he has the fastest hands he's ever seen? (Sorry, can't remember which book)

 

Mat is a natural when it comes to the quarterstaff and ashanderai just like he is with his knives. It all has to do with the quickness of his hands. His skill with the ashanderai is a natural extension of his skill with the staff. I don't think it has anything to do with his new memories and everything to do with his own skill.

[Majsju]

I don't think it's all that big a suprise that Mat could beat Galad. Didn't Thom at one point tell him that he has the fastest hands he's ever seen? (Sorry, can't remember which book)

 

Mat is a natural when it comes to the quarterstaff and ashanderai just like he is with his knives. It all has to do with the quickness of his hands. His skill with the ashanderai is a natural extension of his skill with the staff. I don't think it has anything to do with his new memories and everything to do with his own skill.

 

It has to be the memories. The ashanderai is not a quarterstaff, it requires a different fighting style, and Mat mastered it from the moment he picked it up. Of course his natural skills helped him, especially the quickness of his hands. But knowing how to use the blade is something that would require a bit of training no matter how good he is with the quarterstaff. Training he got for free.

[aevogt]

Mat's father taught his the quarterstaff.  Sticking a two foot sword blade on the end will change how you use a staff but not by that much.

[Gorthal]

Mat's father taught his the quarterstaff.  Sticking a two foot sword blade on the end will change how you use a staff but not by that much.

Right, but someone who's used to fighting with a quarterstaff would almost certainly use an ashanderai like a normal quarterstaff when under pressure.  Not only does Matt attempt to use it differently than a normal quarterstaff, but he does so with great skill.  This indicates that he had more experience with an ashanderai than with a regular quarterstaff, something that could only come from the memories. 

[algspkr]

Mat's father taught his the quarterstaff.  Sticking a two foot sword blade on the end will change how you use a staff but not by that much.

Right, but someone who's used to fighting with a quarterstaff would almost certainly use an ashanderai like a normal quarterstaff when under pressure.  Not only does Matt attempt to use it differently than a normal quarterstaff, but he does so with great skill.  This indicates that he had more experience with an ashanderai than with a regular quarterstaff, something that could only come from the memories. 

It was in a Mat PoV either right after or during the fight with the Shaido at Charaine that Mat thinks something like: The old memories help a lot with the ashanderai and he had needed every bit of skill they offered.

[WatcherofTime]

Look up the different levels of psychic that are about.  Mat was a Diviner/Seer.  He could sense future events, he also had awareness that allowed him to sense people around him and their intent.  to answer Mat's bowstaff fighting skill.  He was that good, the two rivers boys learned long bow and were scary accruate.. when you have Rands father and Mats father teaching..  you better be good at focus, and they taught all the boys of two river fighting skills as they still had random encounters with trollocs. Why do you think in a battle against thousands of trollocs, two rivers held.  They are taught skills by empire trained soldiers who retired young.  In the short story about ravens when they were young teens.  sword fighting and pole fighting. its mentioned in the story.  Its once he died the first time and gained memories of all battles that his skills improved to the point where it didnt matter how much of a sword master you were, you were not going to take down Mat.  Master of strategy.  Rand has full psychic abilities, Perrin had my favorite. Astral Travel, and teleport. He could shift in and out of this plane.  that is a very difficult skill and he did it naturally.  

 

by the end of the series all 3 could think of either of the other and know what they were doing, and could know which direction they were.  psychic telepathic connection.  Alot of people have it today.  

 

Also if you ever tried the Wheel of Time RPG game, or dungeons and dragons, it goes into more detail about their abilities.  I think Wizards of the Coasts continued the story after Robert Jordan died when starting 5th edition, as the names have changed but the races and stories are very similar.   Just look at the show Critical Role. if you watch from ep1 of campaign 2 and listen to the story closely you can spot Eye of the World being told.  Mercer is a story teller equal to Mr Jordan.  

Edited October 19, 2021 by WatcherofTime
forgot something.

[SinisterDeath]

1 hour ago, WatcherofTime said:

I think Wizards of the Coasts continued the story after Robert Jordan died when starting 5th edition

Nope.

 

1 hour ago, WatcherofTime said:

as the names have changed but the races and stories are very similar. 

Not even close. D&D 5e isn't a "story". The Adventure modules have nothing in common with the WoT series.
D&D 5e is the 5th edition of Dungeons & Dragons which originally came out in the 1970s. D&D 3.0 launched in 2002, and the Wheel of Time RPG was based on that ruleset.

The worldbuilding, Lore, Races, and Monsters in D&D aren't something they "continued" off of Jordan's work.

 

1 hour ago, WatcherofTime said:

Just look at the show Critical Role. if you watch from ep1 of campaign 2 and listen to the story closely you can spot Eye of the World being told.  Mercer is a story teller equal to Mr Jordan

It's definitely not a retelling of Eye of the World, but Mercer is a good story teller, I'll give you that.

The first episode of campaign 2, Basically starts with half the group working for a Circus, and ends in a circus tent, fighting monsters.
Below is the segment in the tent.

 

[Dedicated]

On 2/1/2008 at 7:05 PM, Chel Vanin said:

Also Mat. He defeated Galad with a shortstaff...luck? Or is he really that good? This is before he got all those memories. He is also (as of book 11) one of the better fighters IMHO in the entire series. Help from the memories? Also he doesn't hear dice in his head until either late in book 6 or early in book 7. Developing skills? If so how? he's been referred to as "son of battles" but he doesn't really have an inborn skills he got it from the aelfin/eelfin (sp? idk which is which btw are aelfin the foxes or snakes?).

 

Well the warder trainer (Hammer? I think) points out that the staff is a tactically better weapon by referencing history's greatest swordsman's only defeat, which was to a farmer wielding a staff. But it's also established that Mat learned to use the staff from his "da" who often won the Bel Tine competitions (only sometimes being bested by Rand's dad Tam). His memories of past battles certainly helped him here too. Just think about how AI's can learn chess by playing thousands of games in a matter of seconds compared to how long it would take a human to experience just a 100. Mat has the collective experience of many lives (most of which were military). So in short, ya Mat is simply that good with a staff, but if he were to try with a sword he'd wouldn't have had a chance against Galad. 

[DojoToad]

ZOMBIE!!!