[Game Thread] Aspiring Tennis Enthusiasts, GRATS MAFIA

[Andrej]

If you didn't think he was a wolf, you should have just said that you were both town, but we should vote for you over him because reasons. It's been obvious since BFG subbed back in and AJ immediately began painting a conspiracy that he was in fact describing his/BFG's own strategy, but one of them was going to win D2 anyway, and we have AJ and 1 town left anyway, so...

Right. Because my plan all along was to put myself in the center of attention and berate everyone for 72 hours so that I could win as scum.

 

Get a better story.

[Lenlo]

 

 

 

 

@Lenlo

 

Can you explain to me how you lied, and why?  I'm really not looking to hear this from anybody else, so I'll ignore any other answer except Lenlo's.

I pushed Aquilla as wolf when I really didnt even try to read him D2. Thats how I lied.

 

The reason is simple. This isnt a parity game. Regardless of whether or not Aquilla was town, I was going to vote him, because I knew I was town and I was set against him. I knew that if I won, the game would either continue or town would win. If I lost, I had no such guarantee. So I pushed him as wolf to try to get people to vote him out over me. Its that simple.

 

 

Ok, I think I understand the motive.  But why lie when it paints you in a poor light eventually?  Wouldn't that just be a short-term fix?  And for the record, scum favor short-term fixes (i.e. just do what is needed to make it to the next phase, and then revamp as needed).

 

I'm not saying I think you're scum, but I'm trying to understand the long-term implications of this plan and how you thought it out.

 

This game never goes to longterm though. At MAX its a 3 day game. Theres no D5 or D6 longterm plans to worry about, the plan only had to work for a day, 2 max.

 

As for painting me in a poor light, im always in a poor light dude. Everything I do is wolfy, how else do you explain apathy and being lazy apparently being the towny vote D1? After that, I knew nothing I did would be towny in this game.

 

 

I don't follow - how were you lazy?

 

That was in reference to LZM apparently being the towny choice between me and him D1. He was being labeled as town for being apathetic and lazy.

[Verbal32]

BFG is the lynchpin, here.  This is partly why I was on her case early on - it helps solve her AND AJ's slot.  For example:

 

Scum!AJ never pits himself against BFG on D1 if BFG is town.  It is too risky.  If they are both scum, then fine....makes some sense.  If BFG is the symp, it doesn't matter - scum!AJ wouldn't know that for the D1 pairings unless he figured it out over N0.  But I didn't notice anything, and her spidey gif would have been aimed at me, not him.  And I'm not scum, so....I don't see BFG as the symp.  She's either town or scum.

 

If she is town, AJ is, too - he doesn't pit himself against a strong townie D1 on purpose like that.  If he did and wins as scum, kudos to him as he deserves it.

If she is scum, then I can see both as scum, because I don't see her pairing herself with a strong townie in AJ like that, either.

[Verbal32]

@AJ

 

This is not tinfoil.......but you and Nyn were pretty clear townies coming out of the D1 matches, and Nyn was permanently killed.  Why weren't you?  Why leave one of the 2 hardest working players alive when they had an opportunity to kill them both?  And why kill Ben?  I can see the Sooh kill - she's a solid townie and was clearly showing as much.....I was in doubt, so leaving me alive makes sense......but why kill Ben?

 

Let's be honest, Ben was going to be lynchbait each match - if I'm scum, I leave him alive.  I also don't see why bring town!BFG back makes sense for scum.

[Andrej]

At the end of D1 Sooh said she was tinfoiling. Nyn and I asked her to explain. She said that she was worried BFG and I were teammates and trying to pull a fast one. Ben.1 picked up the mantle and went further to say he could see one of us as the symp (me specifically) and that I was trying to signal her like crazy.

 

I refuted this like I have since D1 as soon as the thread opened. Like you said, I don’t see BFG gunning for me if she is scum and knows I’m at least not her partner.

 

D2 starts and the three players who all harped on the subject of me and BFG being scum together are all dead and we are paired again. It’s textbook. The opportunity presented itself and they went for the long con to force this inevitable situation. It’d be easier to let paranoia fester than have to straight up beat me and BFG D2 in town/scum matches.

 

Regardless of who made it to the Finals between BFG and I, the longer we remained in the tournament the more the tinfoil became plausible. They just needed to wait it out because the pairing ensured this event would happen.

[Andrej]

Verb - remember that game Clov ran where Zander and I went at it like mad for two game Days and on the second one he tried to claim a fake peek on me as Tracker? How I fought him tooth and nail because I knew he was scum and I could see what he was angling for?

 

Same situation. I saw what was unfolding as soon as D2 opened and the NKs and brackets were revealed. And I’m right, it’s unfolding exactly how I said it would.

[BFG]

Verb I'm around for any questions

[Gentled Ben]

 

If you didn't think he was a wolf, you should have just said that you were both town, but we should vote for you over him because reasons. It's been obvious since BFG subbed back in and AJ immediately began painting a conspiracy that he was in fact describing his/BFG's own strategy, but one of them was going to win D2 anyway, and we have AJ and 1 town left anyway, so...

 

Do you think BFG is also scum?

 

Yes

[BFG]

 

 

If you didn't think he was a wolf, you should have just said that you were both town, but we should vote for you over him because reasons. It's been obvious since BFG subbed back in and AJ immediately began painting a conspiracy that he was in fact describing his/BFG's own strategy, but one of them was going to win D2 anyway, and we have AJ and 1 town left anyway, so...

Do you think BFG is also scum?

Yes

Why?

[Gentled Ben]

 

If you didn't think he was a wolf, you should have just said that you were both town, but we should vote for you over him because reasons. It's been obvious since BFG subbed back in and AJ immediately began painting a conspiracy that he was in fact describing his/BFG's own strategy, but one of them was going to win D2 anyway, and we have AJ and 1 town left anyway, so...

Right. Because my plan all along was to put myself in the center of attention and berate everyone for 72 hours so that I could win as scum.

 

Get a better story.

 

Yet here you are, D3 and close to tying the trains. Well-played.

[Andrej]

Your friends chose the wrong player to pick on Ben.

[Gentled Ben]

 

 

 

If you didn't think he was a wolf, you should have just said that you were both town, but we should vote for you over him because reasons. It's been obvious since BFG subbed back in and AJ immediately began painting a conspiracy that he was in fact describing his/BFG's own strategy, but one of them was going to win D2 anyway, and we have AJ and 1 town left anyway, so...

Do you think BFG is also scum?

Yes

Why?

 

Because it makes the most sense for how this has played out, and he hard-defended you almost from the very start. You two are obviously teammates. It you're both town teammates, then Lenlo is brilliant. Do you think Lenlo is a better player than AJ? Than you?

 

@Verbal: I think I was killed specifically because I was onboard with Sooh's suspicions about BFG and AJ. Otherwise, they would have brought me back to lynch me again. The fact that AJ began spouting that very thing the minute the flips were in convinced me in the DT that he was scum and BFG was his partner. He was trying to disarm the suspicion by stating it outright and calling it tinfoil while riding it to D3. Now he is doing anything he can, name-calling, self pity, more railing against the tinfoiling, to get that short term victory that scum rely upon. He only has to last one more round, and he only needs one or two to buy in.

[BFG]

@AJ

 

This is not tinfoil.......but you and Nyn were pretty clear townies coming out of the D1 matches, and Nyn was permanently killed. Why weren't you? Why leave one of the 2 hardest working players alive when they had an opportunity to kill them both? And why kill Ben? I can see the Sooh kill - she's a solid townie and was clearly showing as much.....I was in doubt, so leaving me alive makes sense......but why kill Ben?

 

Let's be honest, Ben was going to be lynchbait each match - if I'm scum, I leave him alive. I also don't see why bring town!BFG back makes sense for scum.

[Verbal32]

At the end of D1 Sooh said she was tinfoiling. Nyn and I asked her to explain. She said that she was worried BFG and I were teammates and trying to pull a fast one. Ben.1 picked up the mantle and went further to say he could see one of us as the symp (me specifically) and that I was trying to signal her like crazy.

 

I refuted this like I have since D1 as soon as the thread opened. Like you said, I don’t see BFG gunning for me if she is scum and knows I’m at least not her partner.

 

D2 starts and the three players who all harped on the subject of me and BFG being scum together are all dead and we are paired again. It’s textbook. The opportunity presented itself and they went for the long con to force this inevitable situation. It’d be easier to let paranoia fester than have to straight up beat me and BFG D2 in town/scum matches.

 

Regardless of who made it to the Finals between BFG and I, the longer we remained in the tournament the more the tinfoil became plausible. They just needed to wait it out because the pairing ensured this event would happen.

 

Sooh mentioned it, and Nyn asked about it - I don't recall either of them "harping" on it - just mentioning it and wanting to keep it in the back of their mind.  I want to believe my D1 read of you, but this type of post is making it difficult.  This feels a little like you over-selling the conspiracy, know what I mean?

[Verbal32]

 

@AJ

 

This is not tinfoil.......but you and Nyn were pretty clear townies coming out of the D1 matches, and Nyn was permanently killed. Why weren't you? Why leave one of the 2 hardest working players alive when they had an opportunity to kill them both? And why kill Ben? I can see the Sooh kill - she's a solid townie and was clearly showing as much.....I was in doubt, so leaving me alive makes sense......but why kill Ben?

 

Let's be honest, Ben was going to be lynchbait each match - if I'm scum, I leave him alive. I also don't see why bring town!BFG back makes sense for scum.

 

 

???

[Verbal32]

For the record, this situation is why I don't approve of subbing in prior townies.  If I was scum, I'd be pissed.  No offense to Shad, he did what he had to in order to keep the game running, but from a scum POV it sucks.

[Verbal32]

Verb I'm around for any questions

 

In your opinion, did Sooh and Nyn "harp" on the tinfoil of you/AJ being scummates?

[Andrej]

You can nitpick my wording if you want but coincidences don’t really happen much in Mafia. It’s not a coincidence the conversation was had and they all died and BFG and I are matched again.

 

I’ll put it another way. I had already laid the ground work D1 to continue town reading BFG for the rest of the game if she was my partner. I could’ve paired myself with Lenlo and set her up with Aquilla and gone for the W last phase. In what world does it make sense for me as scum to intentionally put myself in the spot light by playing into people’s paranoia? So I can fall back on the too obvious to be obvious argument? I was set after D1 already. Everything that’s happened from D2 on would put an unnecessary target on my back.

[Verbal32]

@Verbal: I think I was killed specifically because I was onboard with Sooh's suspicions about BFG and AJ. Otherwise, they would have brought me back to lynch me again. The fact that AJ began spouting that very thing the minute the flips were in convinced me in the DT that he was scum and BFG was his partner. He was trying to disarm the suspicion by stating it outright and calling it tinfoil while riding it to D3. Now he is doing anything he can, name-calling, self pity, more railing against the tinfoiling, to get that short term victory that scum rely upon. He only has to last one more round, and he only needs one or two to buy in.

Ok, but then why wouldn't scum!AJ and scum!BFG just pair themselves against Lenlo/Aquilla on D2?  AJ's defending of BFG as town and his reasonable consensus as town would have put them in a very solid spot for a D2 win....so why?  This is probably the most important explanation of the game, btw.

[Verbal32]

Oops, AJ said the same thing, lol.

[Lenlo]

You can nitpick my wording if you want but coincidences don’t really happen much in Mafia. It’s not a coincidence the conversation was had and they all died and BFG and I are matched again.

 

I’ll put it another way. I had already laid the ground work D1 to continue town reading BFG for the rest of the game if she was my partner. I could’ve paired myself with Lenlo and set her up with Aquilla and gone for the W last phase. In what world does it make sense for me as scum to intentionally put myself in the spot light by playing into people’s paranoia? So I can fall back on the too obvious to be obvious argument? I was set after D1 already. Everything that’s happened from D2 on would put an unnecessary target on my back.

Would we not have the exact same argument though? Bringing BFG back and putting her against someone else? It would still cause the tinfoil argument to come up and yes it gives you a chance to win D2, but it also puts you at risk to lose D2.

 

Safe play or risky play? Which gets used more often?

[Andrej]

Is that the question you asked yourself when you set the D2 brackets?

[Andrej]

But a less snide question: what about my play has been safe lately? Forcing the issue that I would most want to avoid if I was scum and it was actually true?

[Lenlo]

Is that the question you asked yourself when you set the D2 brackets?

Its the question im asking you now.

[Andrej]

Simple answer. I go for the W.

 

My town read on BFG is covered from D1 so I auto vote Aquilla. I can carry over the things I said that bothered me about you on D1 to frame you as scum D2. The ground work was already there if I was scum.