Because we don't know how you killed SD. But if you aren't the Vig then we have no explanation of how Teph died, so it isn't just a case of your lying or your not, if you were lying another game point would need an explanation.

Remember Turin also was sussing DPR.

And we are 100% certain that Ed didn't NK Sinister? Seems unlikely yes, but am I pushing for Ed's elimination? No I'm saying he is to all intents and purposes lock clear. I don't like this misrep. One elimination, one Vig shot, one NK, and one assassination like Gud had on Hamilton so she could kill DPR and Key in one night. So that would be Ed, Tigs, Dice and me dead in that scenario. I'm simply trying to cover all the bases. Kill me first if you like and see my flip, but as I'm town that will already put town at a disadvantage. But if town is sure that it is me or Dice then fine we have already won. You are sounding an awful lot like Darthe now. I'm just sussing you because I'm a bad player. Are you going to offer to hydra with me too? I don't how likely it is you are this mastermind, but even you can see how deeply you are involved at every point in your "obvious" conclusion.

4 dead townies in one D/N cycle I mean.

Ed - semi-cleared by Tephs death. Turin - if lying would have to have holstered or tried to kill me. Tigs - if lying would have to have holstered or tried to kill me or Turin. DPR - if lying holstered to pretend he had blocked NK from me or Dice, or tried to kill Turin. If he has double vote that could convince people he is lock clear. If he has an assassination that can be 4 townies dead in one night and he knows Turin is the commuter. Dice - if lying was blocked. Don't really think he is mafia, but I didn't really think Sinister was either, definitely a candidate, really not sure if him hammering Darthe should clear or implicate him. I think clear as why not let the goon go to the wall for town cred? Feel very uncertain of my thoughts on him thanks to my 0% chance of the wolf team being SD and Dice prediction.

I had it in my mind as that is what the role was and therefore obviously inserted it into my memory of the mail. As I say if you guys are sure that it is me or Dice, no worries, you can get us both and town wins. I'm just trying to stress to you why you might think it is either Dice or me. It seems unlikely to be Ed unless we can account for Teph. Tigs and Turin both seem more unlikely on average but are not outwith suspicion and DPR is worryingly involved in all aspects of this show down. Please keep this in mind. Or disagree, whatever. If DPR is telling the truth and right in his interpretation, we've won.

I am not changing my story. I gained the ability I used. I misremembered what the mail said. Personally I don't see why this would be AI - obviously I made a mistake, but would I not be more likely if I was looking up an ability I didn't have to get it right rather than a mail I received three days before? Especially as if I was a wolf I'd have assistance? I don't like how DPR has brought this up only after he has received heat. But whatever, if you really think it must be me and Dice, then town has won, no probs. Kill us both Dice will flip mafia. But think of who has created the narrative that it is me or Dice. Who could have an ability to end the game, or have the double vote to "prove" his case. Though not sure that is much of a point it is really convenient that he could not do it today, only block two players he thought were vanilla. It seems to me taking out DPR would guarantee he isn't lying, then you have a 50% chance still of catching Dice. If you can resist killing me. But if you don't trust me, there is nothing I can do about it and I'm not going to sweat it either. DPR should be making you uneasy, cos he is me. And totally I could be wrong. But neither Dice or me is masterminding what is going on, DPR has set all this up and is pouring scorn over anyone "WIFOMing" over any possibility that isn't what he is setting out as the obvious truth. Or you can eliminate me, see I'm telling the truth and then choose if Dice was blocked or DPR is a mastermind. His claim about his role just seems too weird and too convenient, but maybe it makes sense when you know the other mafia role, idk. So kill me by all means, just don't forget there are more people under suspicion than me and Dice.

So we are skipping logic and concentrating on a mistake that has no effect on the game? Checking my PMs I see it says I only gained an ability 1x investigate and that is all. This makes me like DPR even less.

@DPR I don't remember seeing if you answered this question?

Why does Turin say this if he is a commuter? I mean I know it is not totally serious, but it does seem a little too serious. Just too many things to get suspicious about.

Hairy

I was just trying to run through the implications of each of us being mafia.

Does your double vote, should we live to see it, prove you are town or only that your role gives you a double vote?

If Turin is lying, then he must have holstered or tried to kill me. Seems pretty unlikely. Not impossible. His role claim seems a bit OP but could also limit towns information. Slight concern that he was on board with SD elimination (goon) but not Darthe (PR). Think on balance, Turin is likely town. So I think my PoE is Dice and DPR.

Yes there was lol How am I freaking out, lol. I think you guys should know when I'm freaking out.

I feel bad about DPR. So much feels wrong, especially his role claim. I'd say it isn't a worry as even if we lose three this D/N cycle he then has to show his double vote. Unless he has a mafia double vote or an assassination like Gud had. Then either he will appear lock clear on the last day or we'll likely lose 4 townies and not make it to the last day. Because the last mafia role must something. Maybe not hugely overpowered, but constant commuter and constant Vig are pretty powerful even if they can get in the way of Town as well. So maybe DPR is worth clearing first, maybe that will resolve things quicker

Such a forced smiley! So it was you in the Ballroom with the Candlestick! I knew it!

Not at EoD. By flipping Darthe it made it look like SD had the better role so was more likely to be blocked/whatever at night. I'm trying to look at all the possibilities. We can say mafia must have tried to kill DPR or Ed, so they must be one or the two blocked players. But that is making an assumption and if that assumption is wrong it gets very close to the end of the game.

If DPR is lying. He was pushing for people to claim roles so he would know who to "block". I'd still get no result. DPR holsters or tries to kill Turin. He doesn't kill Ed as as long as DPR is core town Ed just helps thin the herd out quicker. He choses Turin as he is the one most after Dice. Is the interaction with Darthe "no Wes doesn't make those mistakes" distancing. It felt a bit forced to me. But again, no way of resolving outside of checking the pockets of a dead pirate. Sighs. It really looks like anyone lying has no impact on anything else. Except for Ed where we need another explanation of Teph's death.

If it really is me or Dice then we've won. We can afford to off two players. But there are other possibilities.

If you are telling the truth and if the mafia didn't holster or try to kill me or Turin.

No wait, not me, lol. Dice isn't mafia if I am.

If Sinister had flipped goon, would not make it much more likely that he had "misunderstood the rules" to save a better role? So Dice getting Darthe to flip increases the WIFOM and makes it more likely SD would be blocked. Which may be why the other mafia handed in the NK. Which aligns with Dice. Or me, but in that case you can eliminate one and shoot the other.

I'm just trying to cover all the angles. Hopefully something will shakes loose logically. If the only thing is one of us is mafia and lying, and the only way to tell is to eliminate them, we have nothing but hunches to go on. There is no reason for the last wolf to do anything that would stand out any more. Maybe this was the wolf endgame all along, but it seems odd to rely on luck. Meh, a game of WIFOM except with 6 goblets of wine. But which is not poisoned?

Good luck, dude 🙂 Hope you have the endurance of Bela escaping the Two Rivers