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WoT If…the Glass Column Ter'angreal Lied?


Mashiara Sedai

Hello, everyone. Thanks for joining me for another week of "WoT If?". For this edition, I want to look at some of the facts surrounding the glass column ter'angreal and the visions/past lives it shows to those who enter. There will be a focus on Aviendha's trip through them, trying to determine if it's actually the future of her line, or if it's a warning of things she can change.

 

Spoiler warning! This will include content from many books in the series, including Towers of Midnight, and speculation about A Memory of Light. Please read at your own risk.

 

Many fans agree that Rand's trip through the glass column ter'angreal is one of the finest scenes in the series. It's a wonderful display of Robert Jordan's storytelling abilities. It's intriguing, captivating, and gives us a lot of information about life before the series began. Even Brandon Sanderson said, "However, as I consider it, probably my favorite sequence of scenes in the entire series is the one with Rand going through the ter'angreal at Rhuidean."

 

From Rand's trip inside the ter'angreal, we get a detailed view of what life was like for the Aiel. We see their decline from serving Aes Sedai and practicing the Way of the Leaf to being desert nomads who are constantly at war with the world and each other. This is a tragic fall for their people, losing their purpose as well as their home and native lifestyle.

 

Rand understands right away that he saw the "lost history of the Aiel's origins" (The Shadow Rising, Chapter 34, "He Who Comes With the Dawn") when he went through the ter'angreal. His assumption is correct; Rhuarc confirms it:

 

The Shadow Rising

Chapter 34, "He Who Comes With the Dawn"

 

"No two clan chiefs I have spoken with have seen through exactly the same eyes, Rand, or exactly the same things, until the sharing of water, and the meeting where the Agreement of Rhuidean was made. Whether it is the same for Wise Ones, I do not know, but I suspect it is. I think it is a matter of bloodlines. I believe I saw through the eyes of my ancestors, and you yours."

 

This is important because it shows us that the ter'angreal shows factual events. It shows actual pieces of the Pattern through the person's ancestor's thread. Rand's experiences were seen through the eyes of that ancestor, even knowing their thoughts. It's as if he was transported into their body and mind completely for the duration of the vision. That means the ter'angreal has access to weaves already woven into the Pattern. It can step outside of time and pull out the threads it needs to, in order to show the person their past.

 

It's not too surprising that a ter'angreal can do this. The one used to test novices shows "what was" (The Great Hunt, Chapter 23, "The Testing"). And it could be argued that Nynaeve's first encounter in this test was in a past life. She did have an experience fighting Aginor in The Eye of the World, but during the test, she knows things she shouldn't. She is able to sense Aginor's channeling and alters his flows of saidin; this doesn’t become possible in the main storyline until Knife of Dreams, Chapter 23, "Call to a Sitting." Nynaeve's knowledge hints that this comes from a past life, not something based off their fight during The Eye of the World.

 

So, if the glass column ter'angreal can show the factual past, can it show the factual future? I think this is the biggest concern facing our characters. Because, even if the Light wins the Last Battle, the Seanchan empire still rules over everything, eventually. Jason Denzel, in his review of Towers of Midnight, implies that if Aviendha's visions are correct, it leads to a not-so-happy-ending:

 

"The other scene that rocked me to read is one that completely embraces the spirit of the whole series. It's the epitome of what makes The Wheel of Time stand apart from all other fantasy series. To say that I was moved by it is an understatement. After reading it, I honestly began to question whether this story will actually have a happy ending or not. I mean, let's face it. Most of us assume the series will conclude with a victory at the Last Battle, with maybe a few heroic deaths along the way, right? Well this sequence I'm talking about proves that even victory can be disaster. It shows that even the most noble of intentions can have a butterfly-effect ripple across the Pattern. The sequence was beautiful to behold, and that alone makes ToM worthy of being on the shelf with your other WoT books."

 

With that in mind, I think we can see two different ways of looking at this sequence. The first way is that the ter'angreal is unbiased, showing the facts, not wanting to take any part. With this way of thinking, Aviendha's vision is true, unchangeable, the irrevocable future. The other way is that the ter'angreal is caring, showing a possible future, wanting to lead the viewer in a new direction. If this is what happens, Aviendha's vision is a warning and can be changed.

 

I think I've already established that the ter'angreal's past visions are accurate, but here's more proof. In an interview, Robert Jordan was asked about the glass columns:

 

Question: Rhuarc indicates that an Aiel in Rhuidean sees the past through the eyes of one of his ancestors. Is this true for the women as well? What would a non-Aiel see, if anything?

 

Robert Jordan: Yes, a woman would also see through the eyes of her ancestors, at least in the "forest of crystal spires" ter'angreal, and she, too, would live the history of the Aiel, in effect. Someone who wasn't Aiel could wander through those spires forever and never see a thing except the spires. He or she might think it was a monument, or maybe a work of art.

 

If Robert Jordan says they see "through the eyes" of their ancestors, then it's got to be true. The ter'angreal is accurate, showing the exact past. And because it doesn't lie about the past, why would it lie about the future? I think this is the main proof that what Aviendha sees will come to pass. She thinks so too:

 

Towers of Midnight

Chapter 49, "Court of the Sun"

 

This was not like the events she had seen when passing into the rings during her first visit to Rhuidean. Those had been possibilities. This day’s visions seemed more real. She felt almost certain that what she had experienced was not simply one of many possibilities. What she had seen would occur. Step by step, honor drained from her people. Step by step, the Aiel turned from proud to wretched.

 

Still, Aviendha decides to try to change the future, whether or not she can:

 

“Can I change it?” she asked.

 

If I can’t, she thought, will that stop me from trying?

 

The answer was simple. No. She could not live without doing something to avert that fate. She had come to Rhuidean seeking knowledge. Well, she had received it. In more abundance than she had wanted.

 

But, in her last vision, Padra remembers her mother (Aviendha) talking "often" about the challenges the Aiel would face after their part in the Last Battle was done:

 

Others nodded. But that raised a larger problem, one her mother had often spoken of. What was it to be Aiel, now that their duty to the past had been fulfilled, their toh as a people cleansed?

 

To me, this sounds like Aviendha trying to tell her children about the dangers she saw in their future. Trying to instill in them the consequences of going down a path toward war. However, it's Padra's desire to prove herself that makes her agree to the plan of war against the Seanchan. I don't think there's anything Aviendha can do to remove a child's desire to gain "great ji" like her parents.

 

That makes it seem pretty certain that events will unfold as they have been shown in the ter'angreal, but there is a counter argument. First, as Jason said, it leaves the reader with a sense of unhappiness. Obviously, Robert Jordan's story won't end with "they lived happily ever after," but I think the readers want a sense of peaceful closure. There will be war in the world's future—we know it eventually becomes our own time, which is constantly at war—but I don't think Robert Jordan would leave us with such a sour taste in our mouths.

 

So, could the ter'angreal be lying? Could it be a warning, not prophecy? It's possible. When Aviendha tries to read the ter'angreal, she senses that it is alive:

 

Towers of Midnight

Chapter 48, "Near Avendesora"

 

She sensed the powerful aura of the pillar. It was far more potent than any of the ter’angreal she had handled with Elayne. Indeed, the pillars seemed…alive, somehow. It was almost as if she could sense an awareness from them.

 

That gave her a chill. Was she touching the pillar, or was it touching her?

 

She tried to read ter’angreal as she had done before, but this one was vast. Incomprehensible, like the One Power itself. She inhaled sharply, disoriented by the weight of what she felt. It was as if she had suddenly fallen into a deep, dark pit.

 

She snapped her eyes open, pulling her hand away, palm quivering. This was beyond her. She was an insect, trying to grasp the size and mass of a mountain. She took a breath to steady herself, then shook her head. There was nothing more to be done here.

 

After she touches it and takes a step, she sees through the eyes of Malidra. This is important because she steps away from the columns, not into them. The ter'angreal, when it touched her, sensed her need for more answers. Or perhaps Aviendha accidentally flipped a switch, making it show the future rather than the past? If so, is the flip permanent? Will another Aiel see the past now, or the future? Either way, it acted on its own, not waiting for her to enter a second time.

 

This fact suggests that the ter'angreal is sentient and that the future might be changed. It has a desire to show Aviendha this for a reason. If there was nothing she could do, why would the ter'angreal bother showing her?

 

Well, one reason could be the fact that the future was difficult for her to see. The whole point of the test was to weed out people unworthy of becoming Wise Ones and Chiefs. Aviendha had no problem seeing the past; in fact, she thinks that "everything she’d seen had been expected. Almost disappointingly so" (Towers of Midnight, Chapter 48, "Near Avendesora"). There's no longer a challenge for them going into the ter'angreal. But seeing the future could kill. Aviendha really struggled with the visions. She is disgusted by what the Aiel have become, sickened that it starts with her line. If they want to continue to test their Chiefs and Wise Ones, this seems a better challenge.

 

Could the ter'angreal know its purpose? Could it know that it is supposed to test the Aiel? If so, it could understand that the past wasn't enough of a challenge now. It could have changed so its usefulness wouldn't end.

 

I don't think we will find out the answer to this question in A Memory of Light. I bet this is one of those things Robert Jordan wants left unsaid. I think more evidence points out that it's the actual future and Aviendha can't change it no matter what she does. However, my understanding of the Pattern is that it's not woven yet. So perhaps there is some wiggle room for certain threads.

 

There won't be a post next week due to Dragon*Con, so I'll keep you guessing about what the topic will be for the week after that. Thanks for reading.




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Of course children are not the biggest problem, but I could see Avi trying to avoid risk that way. Although I hope that she will be a really wise Wise One instead and will find a better solution.

 

And, like snowball, I also hope for better showdown this time. It's needed if Rand's kids are to live a good life :)

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@snowball

i found the seanchan empire with its rigid class structure,absolute ruler and

worst of all slavery very distasteful(to say the least).

because of its rigidness i dont see any middle ground between the seanchan empire and randland.

others said it before,and i agree,i do believe that the seanchan prophecies

were intentionally corrupted a long time ago,lets face it,its unthinkable from

seanchan pov that their absolute ruler will bow to anyone,but bow they will

crystal throne or not to rand!!!

we had country bumpkin rand,erratic rand,distrustful rand,dark rand,zen rand and one man army rand-its time for demi god epic rand and he will

kick tuon bonny arse back to seanchan(politely saint dwynwen lol)

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That seems more in line with 'you do what I'm telling you! Grr!' Rand than zen Rand.

 

I really don't find the Seanchan all that reprehensible. The biggest thing against them is that they turned the table on the Aes Sedai that used to dominate their lives with endless war, and turned them in to slaves to prevent them from continuing that pattern (the only perspective on this comes from one of the Sul'dam, but we have to give it weight without a countering perspective.) Unlike the lands of Randland that seem to be withering away and dying, they're strong enough to launch an invasion across an ocean, and continually win when faced with opposition. They tackle tough problems, continually work to improve strategies, and adapt when needed.

 

The rigid structure of their society begins with a ruling class that commoners can move up in to with enough dedication, and the ruling class are charged with caring for the underprivileged. Rand laments about this when he visits Ebou Dar under occupation, and is surprised to see the people so content, not all like a conquered people, as opposed to his own conquered nations that squabble behind his back. The commoners must be pretty happy with the Seanchan rule, or Besyln's (sic? no books handy) revolt might have had a chance.

 

I think there are aspects of the culture that are horrible and need to be changed, however as a whole, they seem to have their stuff together unlike most of Randland. Of course, every culture has things that are not good, and there are trade offs. I think we're all used to thinking in 21st century Earth terms, and don't consider where the nations of the WOT are coming from. In all fairness, Rand is a dictator for most of the book, with an army at his back enforcing his will. He may call himself the world's savior and all, but I think he realized in the end that what he was doing was just as wrong.

 

In either case, it'll be interesting to see what happens to them in the last book, and when Tuon meets Rand :)

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@ jack

I totally agree, one may be able to understand complexities of the Seanchan culture, but let Rand mightily kick their arse anyway! :)

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well, considering that this whole thing was started during the cold war, it had to have an evil empire. some of the similarities are striking. communism didn't work in the real world...so cheers to hoping Mr. Jordan kept it alive in Randland just to kill it violently in the end.

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"She felt almost certain that what she had experienced was not simply one of many possibilities. What she had seen would occur."

 

Ok this is pretty definitive, unless we want accept the idea that Aviendha is quite simply entirely wrong... and that this epic scene will be nullified simply by reacting to its own existence. Its a poor memory that only remembers the past... well its a poor prophecy of doom that essentially negates itself by its own existence.

 

I think we almost have to accept that this is THE future (short of the DO winning of course). I think the question of whether it can be changed is going to be a much, much more difficult one than simply stepping aside and doing things differently (ie- "The Future changes as we stand here, else we are the game pieces of the gods, not their heirs, as we have been promised."- Raistlin Majere). I think this solution will be a centerpiece of the final book, and it will be something significantly deeper and more earthshattering required, something we haven't thought of yet. Probably related to breaking the wheel, which one could argue would break the ties of determinism.

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Don't forget that multiple instances of Min's viewings show that the Creator allows free will, such as the dichotomy of the viewing of Gawen either breaking Egwene's neck or saving her, which would become invalid if the Dark One won. The Aes Sedai were comforted by the future viewings until they realized that the Dark One would unravel the pattern in his own image of chaos. If Rand wins, free will dominates and individual actions will continue to affect the pattern.

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Mashiara Sedai

Posted

I think there is evidence on both sides. As I pointed out in the blog, personally, I feel there is more evidence pointing to the visions being the factual future. But, the big counter argument is that the ter'angreal seems alive. If it has knowldge and thought, then it must be showing the visions for a reason--not just to torment Aviendha.

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@mashira i would agree... the columns are showing aviendha what would happen to her people if they do not get a new toh to meet... be it serving the aes sedai again, or otherwise.... the columns show us that the aiel cannot survive without a purpose other than living

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My respects to Mashiara Sedai I always enjoy reading 'WoT if...'

 

I see the visions as a possible future and possibly a twisted version of the future.

 

Avi's whole trip to Rhuidean and the crystal columns has been marked by several anomalies.

 

The mysterious Nakomi woman for starters should have had us all on guard for something unusual to happen.

 

Avi is, as far as we know, the first to enter the crystal columns since Rand opened Rhuidean.

 

As far as we know Aviendha still has the twisted ring with her and we know that 2 Ter'angreal closely related in purpose can affect each other.

 

Avi's first trip in the crystal columns was as expected showing her the history of the Aiel, (Not an anomaly)

 

She then tries to read the columns and has a vision as she is walking away from the Ter'angreal

 

Avi then enters the columns for a second time.

 

 

This would give Mr Sanderson several loop holes large enough to drive a cart through to get away from this being 'THE' future.

 

The visions feed on Aviendha's own fears for her people and their future, and the fact that it's her own children that take the first steps that lead the Aiel to this horror plays on her sense of ji'e'toh, her honor and obligation to her people will drive her to change what she saw,

 

Change the future where she has children,

 

Change the future where she can have children with Rand.

 

This could have been a play by one for the forsaken (as Nakomi) to hurt Rand and seed the ruin of the Aiel in one blow.

 

If she denies her love for Rand, rejects him to stop the possibility of her children leading the Aiel to destruction and in the process this would give Rand one more heart ache before the Last Battle.

 

At the time Avi left for Rhuidean Rand was entering his darkest time emotionally and before his epiphany the rejection by one of his three ladies could have tipped him over the edge.

 

 

 

As for a future for the Aiel there are several options, the red veiled Aiel need to be dealt with, international peace keepers to serve the 'Dragons Peace'?

 

But I think if anything can be taken from the visions that foreshadows their future it should be ...(chapter 49, Court of the Sun)

 

 

"If only the Seanchan Empress..." Ronam shook his head, and she knew what he was thinking. The old empress, the one who had ruled during the days of the last Battle, had been considered a woman of honor by Ronam's father. An understanding had nearly been reached with her, so it was said.

 

I hope I got my point across clearly as it's my first post.

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I just can't believe that the future is carved in stone.Wasn't Rand's epiphany in TGS about that. Remember that the columns are a device left over from the age of legends,who knows what the intended use was,maybe just to teach history to bored students. Avi used her ability to alter its function and show a possible future or maybe an alternate world. My question when I first read it was,how far in the future were the events with her children? After all barring accidents,Avi should live at least 600 years and her children likewise. In fact in the long run, I don't see any one wanting to "bind themselves like criminals" as the Forsaken put it and cut their lives in half. My own thought originally was that the one power would be consumed sealing the bore,but this vision puts paid to that.

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Mashiara Sedai

Posted

Since the ter'angreal was made specifically to show the Aiel their past, I don't think it was made in the Age of Legends. I think it's more likely the elderly Aes Sedai shown in Rhuidean were the ones who created it. The whole point of it was to show the Aiel their forgotten roots since someone who wasn't Aiel wouldn't see anything if they went inside--said Robert Jordan in the interview quoted.

 

When Rand had his epiphany, he realized he had a second chance. I don't necessarily think that means the future--especially things we know are set in stone--can be changed. He just realized there was a reason to try his hardest, to try and right the wrongs he caused in the past. Whatever happens, he has love, and that's enough to get him through the rough times.

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I think it was a possbile future "at that time" when Aviendha saw it. When the Seanchan, with Matt as the Prince of Ravens is woven in with the new Rand - the only time Tuon saw Rand he was really going off his rocker - she thought something at the time like 'not with this angery man' - with Rand changed - Matt the Prince of Ravens - and he is bound to both the Seanchan and Rand - it could change alot as far as the future Aviendha saw, including what happens with women who can channel with the Seanchan.

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I too think they are possible futures that Aviendha saw. First off the Aiel do not know that it was a battle with Perrin that put the Shaido Aiel in that situation. As for the other Wise Ones collared.... perhaps they are affected by the bleakness??? Or maybe Sevanna's visit to Cairhein just before Egwene left for Salidar in LoC was more than just a 'visit'??? Either way, I believe that Rand will put his foot down with the Aiel after talking to Perrin when they meet. It also depends on what emphasis the wheel has put on what will unfold. For example, in the Dotor Who Universe the Doctor would HATE to see these visions, as being a Timelord, he would be forced to manipulate these events EXACTLY as they were seen... hence his aversion to being told anthing about his future adventures, whether from books or seers. We saw what happened when it did not occur as in Collapsing Time, or what ever it was called lol

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Has anyone ever thought that perhaps these columns don't show the future? Perhaps it can only show the past? If that were the case, then what Avi saw was what happened the last time this age happened. By showing her this past, she can now change how the next age begins.

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let me start off by agreeing that that its a possible future, and not one that is set in stone. clearly laying out the future is a pit of trouble, which is why most writers tend to use riddles. however, i believe there is one assumption here that is being overused. we know that for MEN the pillars show the past, and this is a step to becoming a clan chief. however, no where (that i can think of) does it say it does the same thing for women. the woman's path to becoming a Wise One includes a trip through the rings, where as for men it does not. the Wise ones constantly say that they are more knowledgable than men. maybe a woman is shown the past and the future. the wise ones seem to know much about the future and prophecy, maybe this is where that knowledge comes from.

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