[Standard] 11/10 Top Tier Vanilla+ Game Thread

[Thane Vakarian]

SIli, i'm here now... so, if you got a Q, shoot! .... no.. wait.... umm... ask if you like!

[Andrej]

 

Sili I'll chuckle to myself if I nailed you for your OP.

 

How are your reads shaping up? Spit some truth ITT if you're a villager

 

Unfortunately not.

 

If it helps town, always. I think cass, desp, wombat, and various others like darthe and thane are town mostly. i need thane to be more active to settle on him however.

 

your recent gameplay has been methodical and straight laced. i would be a little surprised if you flipped wolfpack.

 

ragnarok seems cautious. seems like the way he nudged my wagon with omgus vibes is a set up for town cred when i flip.

 

barm is rusty, perhaps. i'll leave it at that since i have't gotten a feel for him yet.

 

pirate is edgy. if he's town i imagine the wolfpack will start testing the water for a mislynch come day 3 or 4.

 

i don't know what's up with arsis, so i'd feel guilty if we lynch pral day 1.

 

Thane is like #2 in the post count brochacho.

 

And cool, I guess. I agree with your town reads.

[Thane Vakarian]

So, AJ.... you town here bro? I got a townish feel for ya, but...yeah... i never am quite sure with you

[Sili Quirrels]

SIli, i'm here now... so, if you got a Q, shoot! .... no.. wait.... umm... ask if you like!

not like that. i need to see you engage with the game more and post fleshed out reads on people. when i look at your iso i see a lot of one or two sentence posts.

[Andrej]

So, AJ.... you town here bro? I got a townish feel for ya, but...yeah... i never am quite sure with you

 

I will soon blossom into the gorgeous and radiant villager that I am.

 

It just takes time. Only time, my friend.

[Andrej]

Reading Arsis's ISO atm and yeah, I don't really like the idea of lynching him so much anymore. It's unfortunate that he's no longer here to question/interact with and was replaced with basically the lowest volume player possible, but meh. I'll just have to assess for myself and roll with that until I can get some catch-up posts Pral is famous for.

[Thane Vakarian]

ok Sili, cool... then let me start with you then. Usually, i can quite quickly clear you as town in my head. I just don't seem to manage this time. I'd like to be able to... The seer cover thing has been mentioned often enough, so i'll call it beer cover from now on. Your beer cover reaction didn't seem natural on me. It was like 'oh, right, I could do that too'. You also sound a lot more defensive than what i'm used of you. No joking, shennanigans.... that worries me a lot.

 

@AJ: time? well, ok, you didn't post that much yet, and i appreciated your input in every game we were in so far. 

[Andrej]

These are some of the posts from Arsis's ISO that I think are pretty good. Input would be appreciated seeing as how he's one of the viable lynches for tomorrow.

 

 

 

@yates,why are you trying to manipulate how people read you this game? Wouldn't that have been better in the sign-up thread? Seems like you're trying to establish cover as to why you won't behave a way you normally would.

 

I don't completely agree with this post but I understand the thought process behind it and I think it's a positive sign for Arsis/Pral's slot.

 

I'm pretty sure Leelou told me Verb posting spideymemes is a scumtell.

[v]## Verbal [/v]

 

This is villagery for Arsis imo, although the reasoning was kind of disproven and wasn't that great to begin with. I've seen him use a lot of linear type logic early on as a villager to push others.

 

 

 

 

Why are we talking about this? I'm not going to base my read on Thane on what he rolled in recent games and the fact that he got mislynched. Either we need to learn to read him better or he needs to adjust his play to be more readable. Or both. So lets put previous games aside cause they have no bearing on what he rolled this game.

I'm basically gonna try and understand where you're coming from, Thane, and make my own conclusions. But yeah, drop the previous games commentary.

How do you make meta reads on someone without the actual meta?

 

 

 

 

Why are we talking about this? I'm not going to base my read on Thane on what he rolled in recent games and the fact that he got mislynched. Either we need to learn to read him better or he needs to adjust his play to be more readable. Or both. So lets put previous games aside cause they have no bearing on what he rolled this game.

I'm basically gonna try and understand where you're coming from, Thane, and make my own conclusions. But yeah, drop the previous games commentary.

How do you make meta reads on someone without the actual meta?

I'm not saying you can't use meta. I'm saying I don't like him reiterating his past mislynces as if it's any indication on his current alignment. Yes, people were wrong about him in the past. So what do you do? You correct yourself accordingly to be more readable, you don't sit on your butt and whinge about it. The sympathy card doesn't fly with me... and he did coast as scum in his last scumgame because he has a name of being lynchbait.

He commented on other people talking about it though. I think I'm the one who brought it up and verbal agreed with me then Thane commented on it. Unless I missed him mentioning it before. This looks to me like scum coming down super hard on something silly for no reason to look town. Taking a hard stance on something like that to try to look good without actually having to scum hunt.

 

 

I just don't understand why it was brought up. The fact that he got mislynched a lot isn't meta. No one is referring to anything he usually does as town/scum. It's just being said that people often misread him.... so what? Am I supposed to try to read him and then choose the opposite alignment? No. I'm gonna do my best to read him based on his content and hope that his actions reflect his alignment. And if he keeps playing in a way that comes off as sketchy... then he's gonna continue being mislynched. But that's neither here nor there.

The fact that he's an easy day 1 mislynch isn't relevant? That maybe some scum would pressure him because they know he'll look bad? How isn't that relevant?

 

 

 

Overall not a bad series of posts. I think he was raising good points against Nyn here and this lines up further down in his ISO.

 

[unvote] [v] ##nyn[/v]


My biggest scum read so far.

 

Initially I thought this vote was opportunistic because he voted Nyn after Wombat did, followed by Sili iirc but after reviewing his ISO I see that he's showing a lot of consistency with his reads which I generally find a good thing.

 

Alright, I'm caught up.

Dpr is either lock town or the best player I've ever seen.

Des looks like his normal self which is slightly townie for him.

Yates looks bad. If it's said in thread it's relevant.

Darthe still looks bad to me.

Nyn still isn't actually playing. She is posting but I don't see any actual gameplay.

I'm happy with my vote.

 

More consistency.

 

 

[Sili Quirrels]

ok Sili, cool... then let me start with you then. Usually, i can quite quickly clear you as town in my head. I just don't seem to manage this time. I'd like to be able to... The seer cover thing has been mentioned often enough, so i'll call it beer cover from now on. Your beer cover reaction didn't seem natural on me. It was like 'oh, right, I could do that too'. You also sound a lot more defensive than what i'm used of you. No joking, shennanigans.... that worries me a lot.

 

@AJ: time? well, ok, you didn't post that much yet, and i appreciated your input in every game we were in so far. 

Yes, I agree with your read.

 

But despot broke me.

 

It's public knowledge. I'm extra paranoid of wagons on me right now because of the recent something that happened.

 

The beer cover was indeed reactionary too. I wasn't sure how to approach it in lieu of someone else bringing it up.

[Andrej]

@AJ: time? well, ok, you didn't post that much yet, and i appreciated your input in every game we were in so far. 

 

Yeah I realize I have been somewhat absent this phase but I have tried to make my posts heavy on content when I was around. Like I said earlier I was busy at the beginning of the week with work and Veteran's Day, but now I'll have more time as we proceed into the weekend.

[Sili Quirrels]

@aj, in my opinion the last post was terrible. that's exactly how i imagine scum!arsis playing.

[Thane Vakarian]

tbh, Arsis didn't strike me as being that scummy. I know Pral doesn't post much, but he could be just waiting untill the pressure goes down. Pral makes the slot more scummy than Arsis ftm

[Sili Quirrels]

arsis probably isn't blatantly scum until end game. in my opinion, even though i've never seen it, his wolfpack meta would involve tiptoeing, sheeping, and misdirection. i would also expect him to joke and be flamboyant in his pocketing and reads-list. in general his posts should be energized and coy.

[Barmacral]

I've had Sili near the bottom of my list for almost the entire day so far for many of the same reasons as Kivam, plus some of his emo posts have actually made me angry when I read them. I am comfortable with lynching him and Darthe, who is the other person I would consider lynching today. I will need to re-read before I commit to a vote on anyone else. That'll be my day today.

 

[v]##Sili[/v]

[Sili Quirrels]

It's insulting that you find me insulting.

 

I'm actually a little pissed that you included that as a reason to lynch me.

[dicetosser1]

Despo in our QT is funny.

 

"OMG Salami help me am i stuck in a DPR tunnel?"

 

I told him he isn't. Hopefully we see the light before a train coming hits us.

 

 

 

 

sorry couldnt resist :D  there was a better one but he had bare buttocks so i wasnt sure i could get away with it lol

[Sili Quirrels]

For the record, thane, I'm appealing for a second chance due to extenuating circumstances.

[Thane Vakarian]

ok, explain the circumstances then and who would be your player to lynch and why.

[Sili Quirrels]

Two games ago, on tmf, i fake claimed a bodyguard role because tom targeted me with a claimed day shot. I was a gladiator, had no idea why his supposed shot didn't work, but if people thought i was a bodyguard then having been shot they would think i was vanilla, more or less.

 

It made sense.

 

Tinfoiling ensued though, and when i tried to simplify the situation by revealing my real role, people pointed fingers and accused me of being scum for lying. There was no deeper substance to the argument, so I gave up and used gladiator.

 

A couple days later Despot tunneled me for a cycle because of confirmation bias and inane logic. Whenever I made a point that was village-like people discounted it, which left me essentially powerless and forced to endure constant ridicule for bad play. I wasn't given a second chance, and the stress built up until I vented a couple times and floated through the rest of the day.

 

Point is I'm still learning how to deal with being a lead wagon, and having been bigoted to death, lynched by a ventriloquist, and tunneled by despot and dm, I've learned little except paranoia and knee jerk reactions.

[dicetosser1]

throws computer

 

 

right try this for the THIRD time

 

 

@ cass   bedtimes 930 actually unless im chatting to you.

 

@cass and AJ  activity is sufferingbecause work is kicking my butt and making me be in constant catch up.

[dicetosser1]

throws computer

 

 

right try this for the THIRD time

 

 

@ cass   bedtimes 930 actually unless im chatting to you.

 

@cass and AJ  activity is sufferingbecause work is kicking my butt and making me be in constant catch up.

[dicetosser1]

 

So, AJ.... you town here bro? I got a townish feel for ya, but...yeah... i never am quite sure with you

 

I will soon blossom into the gorgeous and radiant villager that I am.

 

It just takes time. Only time, my friend.

 

 

laffed for real. SO much better then last time bro!

[Cass]

*Has read to page 59, post #1179*

 

Ok guys, have been reading on and off where I can throughout the day. Have some direct replies to make and then I'll do a quick read of what I've missed (omg if only this game had pause!) and then I have some stuff I want to float about Kiv and DPR. They're not sitting well with me after my re-reads - I'll be interested to see how this has developed for everyone else when I get to my catchup... 

 

'Easy' direct replies first:

 

@WOMBAT 

 

Cass, 837 was a Thane post.

Wombat, I'm sorry, can you help me out with where this is from? I'm assuming I've made a mistake somewhere and I'd like to address it. If you can link me some context I'll   you forever for saving me the precious time.

 

 

@DES 

 

@Cass: Dont have time to respond to all of your stuff just now, but the Yates thing:

I think you still don't quite understand the concept of "Seer Cover". On the surface it can definitely be seen as a protown thing to do- if a bunch of people all claim Seer and give their "viewings" then it allows the real Seer to easily breadcrumb his or her viewings into the thread without worrying about the scum finding him or her.

Then, if the Seer dies at some point, town just has to look through their posts and see who the real viewings were

That's not why I have Yates as town tho, the main reason I have him as town now is associative- the people that have pushed him look scummy to me, and that I don't think he would have willingly attracted this much attention as scum

Des, I assure you I understand seer cover. Pretty much exactly as you just described it to me  . Moving on, I have to say that having anyone as town because people are pushing them is a little bit flimsy IMO. What if people are thinking DPR is Town because of the same thing? I don't think DPR would willingly have attracted this much attention as scum either, but... there you go. Food for thought? Also, any chance you've had time to respond to the questions you didn't have time to respond to?

 

@KRAK 

 

 

Oh, and @ Krak

 

Oh, and ##Sili

 

Why???

 

 

Sili has spent a hell of a time fumbling over himself.  His lack of care where he puts his vote wouldn't really bother me except that he's being blatantly casual with it, overselling it.  His post here puts it in perspective **Can see what you mean, but I don't actually mind his tone*.  How does he expect his vote to put pressure on people if he's flinging it around and admitting that it doesn't matter where he puts it?  Answer: it doesn't and he contradicted himself on the issue  **Good point** Considered**.  This might be a bit of wifom, but Sili's post makes me think that he knows Despo is barking up the wrong tree with his reads  **Potentially valid but could this just be due to wording? I personally am confused with DPRs actions there too - they don't make sense to me from a Town OR a Scum perspective, they just seem... Scummy?**.  Don't like Sili's interactions here or here.  He's playing a weird combination of "better than" and "less knowledgeable than" the rest of the players.  Like he's split on how to approach the game because he's trying to compensate for being a wolf.  He's right about Des misrepping him in the earlier quote, and tbh I misread that part from him too, but his explanation attempts to put the blame on the town for Sili's play rather than being accountable for his own play. Ok, agree. Think he needs to try better to explain.  Kind of a hypocritical post from Sili here, Sili voted much quicker than AJ and for a joke reason, and the first bit makes it seem like Sili thinks there was a reason for AJ to vote him.  Here Sili contradicts himself on his Kivam read.  Vote on Arsis looks like a wolf floating with the current.  Good observations. See previous comment.

 

 

Taken from one of my very few worthwhile posts this game.  **Yes. I liked this when I saw it. (Y'know, except the part where you don't really have me as town   ). But it (the post) was one of the things that has me putting you on a town lean, and one of the reasons I asked for the explanation on your vote against Sili. Thanks for replying so comprehensively. You earned another +1 (although I'm still wary in case you're a very clever wolf too   . Hopefully this will come out in the wash, both sides).

 

 

Thanks for the info. Comments to each of your points in spoiler, in blue. I have put Sili on my watch list, and will be interested to see if and how he may have responded to this, if he didn't, I hope someone asked him why!!
What's your thoughts on DPR?

[Cass]

^ *Or quotes in black. Wtf, I'm delirious they were def in blue on previous screen

[csarmi]

Sorry for not being around. Work is busy as hell. I'm gonna catchup this evening (afternoon in TommyTime).