[Standard] - Hitchhiker's Game to the Galaxy - Game Over

[Leelou]

Des, since you are so keen on my meta - when have I ever not posted just fluffy spam at the beginning of a game? And you are also using my meta involving Verbal, this is getting old. We are two different players. 

[Cory Caboose]

I'm specifically saying I tend to meet a lot more resistance when I'm closer to being right, at least early in a game.

 

The amount of resistance to my AJ!Town read remains mostly baffling to me. Especially considering I got FOSed in heaps for it.

[Verbal32]

OMG I read an entire WoT from Des.

 

 

 

 

FML

[Verbal32]

I'm specifically saying I tend to meet a lot more resistance when I'm closer to being right, at least early in a game.

 

The amount of resistance to my AJ!Town read remains mostly baffling to me. Especially considering I got FOSed in heaps for it.

 

I resisted the town read on AJ initially because I didn't see it.  AJ's subsequent posts have made me feel a bit better, and his reasons for the slight "off" feeling I had on him were understandable.  So I'm ok with him right now.....which means I'm no longer questioning you on the AJ-read.

[Verbal32]

Did anybody else disagree with your AJ read, Cory?  Also, what do you think about my comment re: what constitutes anti-consensus?  Am I grasping at straws there? (serious question, no snark)

[Cory Caboose]

You should have paid more attention to my metaphors, Verb

 

They were basically perfect

[hazelkrs1]

 

lol First of all, you really need to stop using the word waffling. I'm on a diet and it's making me drool :P

 

Secondly, you're saying it's not a tude but you going all "Well I'm obviously right and Cory is obviously wrong, neener neener" then it comes across silly (SCORE, finally managed to use neener in a sentence \m/).

 

So bottom line is.... what bugs you is that Cory is on the fence in regards to his read on YOU? Cause I got the impression that it bugged you that you weren't on the same page in regards to general reads.

 

 

 

Nyn

 

 

Bold:

 

Italics: Ahhh I see lol. That's just normal banter for me, especially when dealing with a bro like Cory. He knows that's me just posturswagging.

 

Underlined: Oh no, that doesn't bug me at all. I'm completely open to other town reads not agreeing with all of my reads. It's good to have differing opinions even, as this can help hash out any irregularities. I don't like people who use non-committal language about me too much (especially if it's not someone who can normally clear me fairly easily)

 

Slot01 - Cory - slightly leery for his reasons of clearing people, but since he's expanded on his reads a bit getting a town lean

Slot02 - BFG - Getting a null townie lean right now on BFG, I'd like her to comment on a few more players to see her reads. 

Slot03 - Clov - actively tried to get the game in gear, questioning reads, calling out what he sees, answering questions directed to him. town lean

Slot04 - Despo - too worried about what Cory thinks of him. Dragged in a personal conversation for his case against me, only looking at my posts in a scum light, feels like he's not fully scum hunting. Relying too much on meta null to slight scum lean

Slot05 - Tina - All of her posts have read as town to me. She's asking questions and getting involved. town lean

Slot06 - Thane - Not enough game play yet. Solid null 

Slot07 - RTE - I have a tendency to read him as scum, I'm going to need more info and voting records to get a better read on him. null 

Slot08 - Andrej - AJ started off slow and more going with the flow, now he is starting to look better. Right now slight town lean. null to town

Slot09 - Lazy - actively posting, not taking a stance in any situation. Has a reads list, but doesn't want to post it because: Day 1. Awesome scum hunting can be done on day 1, so if you have something you'd be better off sharing it. null 

Slot10 - Nynaeve - actively taking part in all issues that come up, her posts are coming off with a town feel to them. If she's scum it will start to show in a couple days, but I doubt it at this point. town lean

Slot11 - Pralaya - has made no game content posts at all. Null to scum lean

Slot12 - Hallia - After going through Hallia's posts, I'm getting a town lean from her right now. She is actually jumping into the game and giving some leans. I know she sometimes was a bit confusing with her last couple of posts, but I get what she was saying. 

Slot13 - Dice - Horrible bandwagon post with bad reasoning for his voting. His further posting hasn't helped him. scum lean

Slot14 - Mish - over reactive, currently voting her. Had some weird reasoning about me trying to accuse her while she was asleep. I'm still not really sure how she is coming to the conclusion what I did about mentioning she might have a PR equals me FoSing her null to scum. Very well could be town since she has a tendency to get huffy, but I'd actually like to hear from her before I move her. 

Slot15 - Verbal - town

Slot16 - Leelou - town

 

Not sure how this reads list makes me feel about you. Some parts look meh, some make me go "hrmmmm...". Starting to think a thunderdome between you and Dice would be best for town.

 

 

Seen enough from Cory to make me more comfortable with him being town, but I'm not a big fan of his opinion of me this game. He says we're not on the same page so that doesn't look good- and yet the stuff that we're not on the same page on... well he's the one that's wrong, not me. For instance we're not on the same page regarding Leelou. Well, his reasoning for thinking Leelou town (that she was interested in figuring things out) was already poked at and prodded by players other than me, and shown to pretty much not be true.

 

Cory, I'm town. I will also often have an unpopular opinion- but also I have a bit more experience with some of these players still so if we're not on the same page, you should maybe consider what that means for YOUR reads instead of thinking that I could be scum. If you ARE town as well Cory, stop trying to waffle or hedge on your read on me and friggin see me for the awesome townie I am. Or else don't, and try and come @ me. Leaving the door open to fos me later will only keep me from trusting you more this game, which means if you are town then we won't be able to accomplish as much together.

Bro.

 

First, I mean, I know what I read. Just because other people don't think Leelou is "interested in figuring things out" doesn't mean it's not what I saw following her logic. If you are saying I LIED, then call me a liar. I'm glad you have the resolve to say I am just wrong but let's not pretend either of us has the game solved. I have given a list I think is pretty good with a good concentration of townies and good concentration of null-to-mafia. Fine if you disagree, but this is my process and I have been exceedingly transparent and the fact that I am anticonsensus on several reads has always been a bigger indicator I'm on the right track, at least from past experience.

 

Take your own advice on the waffling/hedging bit. I gave you townie points when you earned them and you've been in my green pile - I've also stated that us not agreeing isn't something I consider alignment-indicative. I have given you room to operate - threats from you and Verb that I "am not in the power town pile" or whatever isn't going to change my process. I am here to eradicate Mafia, not make arbitrary stances so I can be considered by YOU to be a power townie.

 

My alliance rules anyway.

 

 

Bold: I wasn't insinuating that you were lying, more that you were seeing something you wanted to see after earlier "clearing" Leelou as town (incidentally, she was one of your first clears, along with Tina iirc).

 

Italics: You've been transparent in just about everything... except your read on me. That has been slightly more opaque

 

Underlined: And who said the stances should be arbitrary? This was really strange to hear from you... you sure you meant to say arbitrary? Why would I want an arbitrary stance out of anyone?

 

 

It behooves everyone if he chooses how he wants to go about treating me, instead of sitting on the fence about it. If he chooses that I'm >rand to be scum, then he can case me, and I can use that to try and determine his alignment better AND help broadcast my own towniness by responding to his case. If he chooses that I'm >rand to be town, or even LOCK CLEAR, and it looks genuine, well then we can start #wrecking. Using all the non-committal language he's been using however, will just kinda lead to more confusion and working harder to clear stuff up that mebbe should have been more clear from the start.

 

 

 

You've been in my green pile since you cased Leelou. Look at the game from my perspective - do you think I should be lock clearing you at this point? I have you as > rand to be town and out of my Day 1 POE. We actually agree on plenty of things, and I have been pretty vocal on how I feel.

 

And I do understand that as a villager you would probably want me to lock clear you.

 

Exercise some patience.

 

 

Okay.

 

Des - if you are saying that I'm discounting you or whatever, I would probably be throwing Leelou in my blue pile for her reads post because they make a great deal of sense to me but you've said enough to make me feel like I need to handle her extra carefully as a suspect

 

With that said, and for all this weird discussion about Mish (and what Leelou said in her reads is pretty dead-on), I don't think anyone has any reason to have her as anything but null. She said she'll get her thoughts out there and deserves the benefit of the doubt, but anyone reading into her grumpiness and saying it means anything alignment wise is fooling themselves or Mafia - Mish is LOCK GRUMPY. That's, you know, Mish, in her wonderful splendor

 

Actually, Mish is more likely to get reactive and huffy when town tbh. As scum she tends to be more reasonable and goes with the consensus more.

 

 

Des - if you are saying that I'm discounting you or whatever, I would probably be throwing Leelou in my blue pile for her reads post because they make a great deal of sense to me but you've said enough to make me feel like I need to handle her extra carefully as a suspect

 

With that said, and for all this weird discussion about Mish (and what Leelou said in her reads is pretty dead-on), I don't think anyone has any reason to have her as anything but null. She said she'll get her thoughts out there and deserves the benefit of the doubt, but anyone reading into her grumpiness and saying it means anything alignment wise is fooling themselves or Mafia - Mish is LOCK GRUMPY. That's, you know, Mish, in her wonderful splendor

 

I LOL'ed.

 

 

I see Des and Cory going back and forth here, and then Nyn jumping in to defend her new BFF.  I actually side with Des on this (can't believe I just said that)......he isn't saying Cory is scum for being wrong, just that he knows people's meta here better and wants Cory to realize he could be wrong and Des could be right.  I seems like a reasonable statement, and I wasn't getting the impression Des was using it to accuse.

 

This type of conversation is inevitable with 2 people that have large egos.  I get it - mine is pretty huge, too.

 

 

 

 

 

That's what she said.  >_>

 

 

 

 

 

Joking aside, this strong stance by Des is a towntell.  I did much the same thing in questioning Cory's methods early on.  I don't know why you'd equate this to us "threatening" you, though.

 

 

[Verbal32]

You should have paid more attention to my metaphors, Verb

 

They were basically perfect

 

I'm having a dumb moment (I get those a lot).  Can you explain it to me like the dumb@$$ that I am?

[hazelkrs1]

Des, since you are so keen on my meta - when have I ever not posted just fluffy spam at the beginning of a game? And you are also using my meta involving Verbal, this is getting old. We are two different players. 

 

Aaaaaarrrrggggghhhh @ this post so much.

 

Leelou. I already pointed out how you're spammy at the beginning of games as town or scum. You spamming a lot at the start was NOT a major point in my case against you, whatsoever. You choose to respond to one of the tiniest points. Harumph.

 

My point was that out of your first posts in the game, what few gameplay oriented ones you DID have often mentioned post restrictions, which according to you aren't alignment indicative... so why focus on them at all?

 

And my read on you has SO LITTLE to do with Verbal btw. My read on both of you are pretty much independent this game, believe it or not. But hey, when I make a case, I like being comprehensive, and well, you not immediately responding to your best bud in mafia seemed peculiar to me.

 

OMG I read an entire WoT from Des.

 

 

 

 

FML

 

[Cory Caboose]

Did anybody else disagree with your AJ read, Cory? Also, what do you think about my comment re: what constitutes anti-consensus? Am I grasping at straws there? (serious question, no snark)

When I do my epic reread (not yet, need moar) I will get to the first thoroughly.

 

Imo Mafia tend to follow the thread narrative and hold relatively consensus reads. They rarely stick their necks our for potential mislynches, at least.

 

Depends on the player tho, so yeah, I'm not taking that part too seriously. Just a feeling I can look into on reread.

[Leelou]

 

Des, since you are so keen on my meta - when have I ever not posted just fluffy spam at the beginning of a game? And you are also using my meta involving Verbal, this is getting old. We are two different players. 

 

Aaaaaarrrrggggghhhh @ this post so much.

 

Leelou. I already pointed out how you're spammy at the beginning of games as town or scum. You spamming a lot at the start was NOT a major point in my case against you, whatsoever. You choose to respond to one of the tiniest points. Harumph.

 

My point was that out of your first posts in the game, what few gameplay oriented ones you DID have often mentioned post restrictions, which according to you aren't alignment indicative... so why focus on them at all?

 

And my read on you has SO LITTLE to do with Verbal btw. My read on both of you are pretty much independent this game, believe it or not. But hey, when I make a case, I like being comprehensive, and well, you not immediately responding to your best bud in mafia seemed peculiar to me.

 

I wasn't even making the biggest deal out of the PR's. I made a comment that Mish might have one when others were being discussed and I gave my view that Tina loves Marvin. Yes, that is inside knowledge from us being friends. Dice made a big deal out of it and then Mish over reacted. I didn't dissect them or say if they were good or bad. It's called an observation.  

[Cory Caboose]

Des - By arbitrary I'm saying I'm not going to say I arrived to a conclusion without actually arriving to it because you'd like me to.

 

One of the reasons I ask you to show your work. We'll get there when we get there.

[Verbal32]

 

Did anybody else disagree with your AJ read, Cory? Also, what do you think about my comment re: what constitutes anti-consensus? Am I grasping at straws there? (serious question, no snark)

When I do my epic reread (not yet, need moar) I will get to the first thoroughly.

 

Imo Mafia tend to follow the thread narrative and hold relatively consensus reads. They rarely stick their necks our for potential mislynches, at least.

 

Depends on the player tho, so yeah, I'm not taking that part too seriously. Just a feeling I can look into on reread.

 

 

Ok.

 

I guess my point was that you saying it was anti-consensus could be construed as you attempting to make it look like you're "sticking your neck out for potential mislynches" by making yourself appear to be your normal town-Cory of building the core of cleared townies.

 

I agree with the concept, and employ it myself.  I might be just harping on about how I disagreed with somebody on your initial list (AJ), but now that I'm cool with him, I'll drop this line of questioning for now.  I just have that nagging feeling in the back of my head that I admittedly can't support with much evidence yet.

[Hallia]

 

 

 

Nyn you've earned my due diligence (because ) and I read over Day of Arkham (the last game you were Mafia according to your list) and you were basically invisible that game

 

With that said, things are probably a little different for you with players like me in the game who try to drag out invisible players kicking and screaming :P

So, in your opinion, how do you think you would approach the game as Mafia with the sort of player's list we have now?

What makes you think I alter my style because of who's playing? Besides, I don't remember who were the players back in the Arkham game, but I'm sure they were equally competent to the ones in this game.

 

Generally speaking, In the times I rolled scum I tried to play as I do as town (not sure if I actually managed to, but that's what I was going for). I'm generally rather nervous and try to hide it.

 

I like rolling town better. I'm more comfortable in my own skin, so to speak.

 

 

 

Nyn

I don't know that I've ever seen you as scum, but this game you read as pretty town! (And pretty town too )

 

 

Uh oh, Pral/Hallia not clear yet

 

Looks like I'm mafia again

You can be town for now. Your entire tone was different last game, it was like playing with a Cory-Doppelganger, I didn't like it ; . ;

 

Suspicious of Mish right now, the whole sleep/time thing was a strange statement. There are people from tons of different time zones, and if that were true, how come she never defends me when I'm being attacked while at work? It works both ways.

 

Vote Mish

If there is any post I couldn't get out of my head yesterday it's this one

 

Was sweating all night tbh

 

 

 

I approve.

 

 

 Of making you sweat that is  

 

[Verbal32]

^ if I am wrong on that very early suspicion, then I'll be very happy - clearing townies with you will be much easier than doing so despite you.

[Verbal32]

^ was to Cory

[Cory Caboose]

^ if I am wrong on that very early suspicion, then I'll be very happy - clearing townies with you will be much easier than doing so despite you.

 

I'm glad you're actually doing some #werk on Day 1 tbh

 

I am very good at recognizing a townie thought process. This isn't the first time I've cleared two townies and gotten flack for it only for those two players to become more obvious and consensus townreads as the day went on. My best Mafia strength, IMO, is my ability to recognize town. It's why I use POE so early when most use it as a lategame strategy - it has worked well for me.

The whole point of my alliance stuff is to create a town power base where problitownies get a voice and I do what I do to nurture that. I have a lot of players I feel pretty good about

 

My biggest towntell is that i make my thought process hilariously transparent

[hazelkrs1]

 

 

Des, since you are so keen on my meta - when have I ever not posted just fluffy spam at the beginning of a game? And you are also using my meta involving Verbal, this is getting old. We are two different players. 

 

Aaaaaarrrrggggghhhh @ this post so much.

 

Leelou. I already pointed out how you're spammy at the beginning of games as town or scum. You spamming a lot at the start was NOT a major point in my case against you, whatsoever. You choose to respond to one of the tiniest points. Harumph.

 

My point was that out of your first posts in the game, what few gameplay oriented ones you DID have often mentioned post restrictions, which according to you aren't alignment indicative... so why focus on them at all?

 

And my read on you has SO LITTLE to do with Verbal btw. My read on both of you are pretty much independent this game, believe it or not. But hey, when I make a case, I like being comprehensive, and well, you not immediately responding to your best bud in mafia seemed peculiar to me.

 

I wasn't even making the biggest deal out of the PR's. I made a comment that Mish might have one when others were being discussed and I gave my view that Tina loves Marvin. Yes, that is inside knowledge from us being friends. Dice made a big deal out of it and then Mish over reacted. I didn't dissect them or say if they were good or bad. It's called an observation.  

 

 

How about when you brought up the PR's when Clov asked you who you would shoot? You made it seem like your decision could be affected by the potential post restrictions out there.... yet you later maintain that PR's aren't alignment indicative.

 

What's up with that?

 

Des - By arbitrary I'm saying I'm not going to say I arrived to a conclusion without actually arriving to it because you'd like me to.

 

One of the reasons I ask you to show your work. We'll get there when we get there.

 

Fair enough.

 

*pays BG*

[Verbal32]

 

^ if I am wrong on that very early suspicion, then I'll be very happy - clearing townies with you will be much easier than doing so despite you.

 

I'm glad you're actually doing some #werk on Day 1 tbh

 

I am very good at recognizing a townie thought process. This isn't the first time I've cleared two townies and gotten flack for it only for those two players to become more obvious and consensus townreads as the day went on. My best Mafia strength, IMO, is my ability to recognize town. It's why I use POE so early when most use it as a lategame strategy - it has worked well for me.

The whole point of my alliance stuff is to create a town power base where problitownies get a voice and I do what I do to nurture that. I have a lot of players I feel pretty good about

 

My biggest towntell is that i make my thought process hilariously transparent

 

 

Yeah, I don't always do this, heh.  I've been coming across 2 different scenarios for my town game, and neither is much fun:

 

1.  get killed early before I can ramp up

 

2.  stay alive in a hyper-active game and find it difficult to be always catching up

 

 

So hitting the ground running on D1 with jokes AND gameplay is my way to solve both those problems.  If I'm killed early, I leave solid info behind.  If the game gets hyper, I'm already dug in and have the flow of the game in my head.

[Verbal32]

And I still get to post spidey.  Win-win.

[Verbal32]

But yeah, I solve with POE in late game - I respect the your ability to do it early game.  But it also can make you hard to spot as scum, which does have my attention.

[hazelkrs1]

Active D1 Verbal is the SEXIEST kind of Verbal

 

 

 

^top google img search for "sexy ewok"

 

[hazelkrs1]

They had one with Kate Beckinsale in a costume, but I figured eh, Verbal wouldn't care about that, he already demoted her. The fool.

[Leelou]

 

 

 

Des, since you are so keen on my meta - when have I ever not posted just fluffy spam at the beginning of a game? And you are also using my meta involving Verbal, this is getting old. We are two different players. 

 

Aaaaaarrrrggggghhhh @ this post so much.

 

Leelou. I already pointed out how you're spammy at the beginning of games as town or scum. You spamming a lot at the start was NOT a major point in my case against you, whatsoever. You choose to respond to one of the tiniest points. Harumph.

 

My point was that out of your first posts in the game, what few gameplay oriented ones you DID have often mentioned post restrictions, which according to you aren't alignment indicative... so why focus on them at all?

 

And my read on you has SO LITTLE to do with Verbal btw. My read on both of you are pretty much independent this game, believe it or not. But hey, when I make a case, I like being comprehensive, and well, you not immediately responding to your best bud in mafia seemed peculiar to me.

 

I wasn't even making the biggest deal out of the PR's. I made a comment that Mish might have one when others were being discussed and I gave my view that Tina loves Marvin. Yes, that is inside knowledge from us being friends. Dice made a big deal out of it and then Mish over reacted. I didn't dissect them or say if they were good or bad. It's called an observation.  

 

 

How about when you brought up the PR's when Clov asked you who you would shoot? You made it seem like your decision could be affected by the potential post restrictions out there.... yet you later maintain that PR's aren't alignment indicative.

 

What's up with that?

 

 

Leelou, if you could shoot somebody based off their first post (and first post ONLY), who would you pick and why?

 

Thane - seemed too chipper or Des - jumped right in and declared someone won the thread already. It's a bit hard to say for sure though, because a few people either seem to be having too much fun with the theme or have a post restriction. 

 

It meant I couldn't read people off their first post because they were either playing with the theme or had a post restriction. They are not alignment indicative. I've given them to town and scum before. 

[Verbal32]

Active D1 Verbal is the SEXIEST kind of Verbal

 

 

 

^top google img search for "sexy ewok"

 

 

Wow.

 

 

 

They had one with Kate Beckinsale in a costume, but I figured eh, Verbal wouldn't care about that, he already demoted her. The fool.

 

Post it dammit.  She's #2, not #2000000000000 for cryin' out loud!