why wasn't lanfear spared?

[Gentled Ben]

I cant quote this exactly right now but I will try to find it later.

 

There's no need; I'm aware of the passage (Birgitte reveals that info to Nynaeve), but I wasn't trying to imply that Lanfear is supreme in TAR, just that she has enough ability there in order to be considered "powerful" based soley upon that. Moghedien having greater skill in TAR doesn't render Lanfear feeble in the realm (although, I had a long argument on here once with someone who insisted that since Alivia and Sharina are stronger than Nynaeve, Nynaeve is weak :? ).

 

It says that Aginor is the second most powerful man which implies that there may be a woman in the middle of Ishy and Aginor but not necessarily.

 

Oh. :oops:

 

Post your thoughts on this.

 

We've already wandered a bit off topic. :lol:

 

Oh and don't get upset...

 

We're cool. 8)

 

I was just trying to help, as it was a thread I was more interested in reading than participating in, and I was afraid that the thread might stall at an interesting point if I didn't help push it along. The chart's just a push, and I dont mean to be pushy about the chart.

[kobra_khan69]

too true but we are in essence still talking about what the subject started off as or at least a facet of it.

[RobertAlexWillis]

There's an interesting one here:

 

I meant an authoritative one from RJ (and I know you weren't claiming the one you cited is). He does have one he keeps in his notes so he can keep his Aes Sedai interactions in line, but nobody else has access to it.

 

GRRRRR

 

although, I had a long argument on here once with someone who insisted that since Alivia and Sharina are stronger than Nynaeve, Nynaeve is weak

 

LOL ... I remember reading that one ... it was amusing.

[kobra_khan69]

I really wish that RJ would release the power grid. That sounds funny but it would help to put a lot of things in perspective.

[RobertAlexWillis]

I really wish that RJ would release the power grid. That sounds funny but it would help to put a lot of things in perspective.

 

Actually, I'm torn between wanting to know, and liking the fact that we don't know everything. I think I'd like to see it after AMoL is published, though.

[kobra_khan69]

I really wish that RJ would release the power grid. That sounds funny but it would help to put a lot of things in perspective.

 

Actually' date=' I'm torn between wanting to know, and liking the fact that we don't know everything. I think I'd like to see it after AMoL is published, though.[/quote']

 

True. I cant help but agree with you on this one. After AMoL RJ should make another new BWB for after the first 7. I think thats when this one stops.

[RobertAlexWillis]

True. I cant help but agree with you on this one. After AMoL RJ should make another new BWB for after the first 7. I think thats when this one stops.

 

There are plans for a sort of reference library. Its rumored that it would come on a CD sold with the book. I can't give you a reliable source on that though. It's something I just recall out of the misty realms of "things I heard". It would be cool if it were true though!

[Luckers]

On the issue of Lanfear's decrease in strength, and being healed by someone of the same gender, certain things must be concidered.

 

1. We do not know that the decrease is a percentage relative to the original strength, or a set amount. For instance, we dont know if a woman loses 10% of HER strength, or 10% of the total strength a woman can be.

 

2. Aes Sedai only allow women above a certain strength into their order, and their lax recruiting means that the highest strength is again only at a certain level of strength. Moreover the degree to which one strength defers or commands another strength becomes much more exacting.

 

3. We know that after Suine and Leane's decrease left them above the cut off strength for an Aes Sedai.

 

Suine and Leanes loss of strength resulted in a fairly massive loss of social rank, but this does not nessasarily indicate a massive loss of actual strength. Say, for theory's sake, that the cut off strength for becoming an Aes Sedai is 20%. Say Suine's strength as one of the strongest Aes Sedai was 40%.

 

Now, we know from her scene with Elayne and Nynaeve that the majority of women in Salidar are stronger then her. If we can assume that the average Aes Sedai strength is 30% (which is unsafe, it may be 38%... we simply dont know the degree of deference to strength) then a loss of 11% would account for the decline in social standing.

 

My point is that people misread the degree of loss with Suine and Leane in relation to the Aes Sedai hierarchy, which is no scale to read by. Oh, and to those that claim evidence can be found in Suines inability to lift Gareth, she states in that scene that lifting things with the power is one of the hardest things to achieve. So basically all that proves is that Suine can no longer achieve one of the hardest things to achieve, and that being by Aes Sedai, whose strength is limited anyway.

 

Meanwhile, there is Lanfear, who theoretically was at 100%. A loss of 11% still leaves her at 89%.

 

I'm sorry, i see no evidence for this 'drastic loss' that everyone claims.

[kobra_khan69]

On the issue of Lanfear's decrease in strength' date=' and being healed by someone of the same gender, certain things must be concidered.

 

1. We do not know that the decrease is a percentage relative to the original strength, or a set amount. For instance, we dont know if a woman loses 10% of HER strength, or 10% of the total strength a woman can be.

 

2. Aes Sedai only allow women above a certain strength into their order, and their lax recruiting means that the highest strength is again only at a certain level of strength. Moreover the degree to which one strength defers or commands another strength becomes much more exacting.

 

3. We know that after Suine and Leane's decrease left them above the cut off strength for an Aes Sedai.

 

Suine and Leanes loss of strength resulted in a fairly massive loss of social rank, but this does not nessasarily indicate a massive loss of actual strength. Say, for theory's sake, that the cut off strength for becoming an Aes Sedai is 20%. Say Suine's strength as one of the strongest Aes Sedai was 40%.

 

Now, we know from her scene with Elayne and Nynaeve that the majority of women in Salidar are stronger then her. If we can assume that the average Aes Sedai strength is 30% (which is unsafe, it may be 38%... we simply dont know the degree of deference to strength) then a loss of 11% would account for the decline in social standing.

 

My point is that people misread the degree of loss with Suine and Leane in relation to the Aes Sedai hierarchy, which is no scale to read by. Oh, and to those that claim evidence can be found in Suines inability to lift Gareth, she states in that scene that lifting things with the power is one of the hardest things to achieve. So basically all that proves is that Suine can no longer achieve one of the hardest things to achieve, and that being by Aes Sedai, whose strength is limited anyway.

 

Meanwhile, there is Lanfear, who theoretically was at 100%. A loss of 11% still leaves her at 89%.

 

I'm sorry, i see no evidence for this 'drastic loss' that everyone claims.[/quote']

 

 

 

I already accounted for why it was a dramatic loss of stregnth. They say they are less than 1/2 of what their original strengths used to be.

 

Heres exactly what I wrote:

 

I know that Lanfear is Cyndane you provided the proof that she was weaker now though.

 

Anyway I still say that she couldnt have been healed by a woman because that would have reduced her down to much less than 2/3 of her previous strength because of my previous quote.

 

Paperback - Lord of Chaos: To Heal Again Page 603

Leane shook her head. "Noone has ever been Healed from stilling before. Maybe the others would see it' date=' say like being wilders. That puts you a little lower than your strength. Maybe having been weaker will count something. [b']If Nynaeve couldn't Heal us all the way the first time, maybe she'll only take us to two-thirds what we were, or half. Even that would be better than now[/b], but still most here would be as strong, and a good many stronger." Elayne stared, more confused than before. Nynaeve looked as if she had been hit between the eyes.

 

There could be some other reason as to why the Aes Sedai were reduced so drastically of course. Maybe the length of their being stilled has something to do with it.

 

 

1) They group the loss together meaning that it the loss is relative to their individual strengths not the total strength of what a woman could be.

 

2) There is no set maximum strength for males or females that I know of but if you can find a quote saying that it is so I'll admit that I am wrong. I'm almost positive about this considering that it is a relative thing that can change at almost any time when someone more powerful is born.

 

 

3) Before their stilling Siuan and Leane were two of the strongest women in the tower. Of course the cut off limit was well below what would have allowed them to become aes sedai.

[Luckers]

Those comments were restorative... they were relative to the difference between their old strengths and their current strengths. 1/2 or a 1/3 of what they WERE. Meaning their desire to recover some part of the strength they lost.

 

Aside from which, if they lost half their strength they would more then probably be outside the Aes Sedai cut off strength, which we know they arnt.

 

1) They group the loss together meaning that it the loss is relative to their individual strengths not the total strength of what a woman could be.

 

Umm... no, it doesn't. All that it shows is that they both lost strength. And that the degree of social loss between them is similar. Given that Leane is weaker then Suine this supports my comment that the loss of social standing is due more to the limited difference in Aes Sedai strength in relation to the required deference to the degree at which those that are stronger.

 

2) There is no set maximum strength for males or females that I know of but if you can find a quote saying that it is so I'll admit that I am wrong. I'm almost positive about this considering that it is a relative thing that can change at almost any time when someone more powerful is born.

 

References to the top strength.

 

1. Cyndane states that Alivia's strength is stronger then her strength as Lanfear, and that this is impossible. This shows that a) there is a total strength, and that b) lanfear was that strength.

 

For those who think Lanfear merely arrogant, this is unfeasible. Lanfear lived in an age were all men and women who had the ability were trained. Lying to oneself about their ability relative to another is understandable, lying to onself about being the strongest, especially when one is judging anothers strength, is impossible. If Cyndane is honest enough to admit Alivia's strength, then she is honest enough to know if such a strength is possible without artificial enhancement, which is isn't.

 

2. Sharina. Several Aes Sedai make comments refering to Sharina being the strongest a woman can be. Modern Aes Sedai have no reason to make such a claim, especially given the recent surge in increasingly stronger women, unless they have documented evidence that there IS a cut off strength.

 

3) Before their stilling Siuan and Leane were two of the strongest women in the tower. Of course the cut off limit was well below what would have allowed them to become aes sedai.

 

I'm sorry... what?

 

The cut off limit is the strength at which you are allowed to test for the shawl. We know that Suine and Leane are beyond that limit. Their comment that the MAJORITY are stronger then they (implying that there exists those that arn't) shows this.

 

This means that their decline in strength covered only the range of strengths included within the Aes Sedai hierarchy, which we know to be limited, both in the lowest possible strength, and the highest possible strength.

 

This means that despite the dramatic decrease in social standing, Suine and Leane did not actuall dramatically decrease in strength.

 

Finally, Leane's display in CoT, during which she disguised her ability, inverted her flows, and turned the chain to heartstone, show that whilst weakened (Moiraine states that she could devide her flows four ways, Leane manages three) she is not innefectual.

 

I'm sorry, but the 'dramatic loss of power' Lanfear should have suffered is no argument against her being severed.

[kobra_khan69]

Those comments were restorative... they were relative to the difference between their old strengths and their current strengths. 1/2 or a 1/3 of what they WERE. Meaning their desire to recover some part of the strength they lost.

 

Aside from which' date=' if they lost half their strength they would more then probably be outside the Aes Sedai cut off strength, which we know they arnt.[/quote']

 

 

They are less than 1/2 of what they were that is evident in that they wish to be 1/2 as powerful as they were. You can't argue that particular point because it is clear when they say it.

 

1) They group the loss together meaning that it the loss is relative to their individual strengths not the total strength of what a woman could be.

 

Umm... no' date=' it doesn't. All that it shows is that they both lost strength. And that the degree of social loss between them is similar. Given that Leane is weaker then Suine this supports my comment that the loss of social standing is due more to the limited difference in Aes Sedai strength in relation to the required deference to the degree at which those that are stronger.[/quote']

 

Mind explaining that one a little better? I'm having just a slight problem understanding exactly what your trying to say. It seems like your saying that they both lost social standing and because they lost social status they have to defer to those that are now stronger than them even though there is a limited range of Aes Sedai strength. Which I don't think could be right because you seem to be refuting your own argument in that statement by saying that they judge social standing by the power and that the loss of power in them both was similar because they lost the same amount of strength.

 

 

 

Also from the quote I gave it is implied that they discussed what their relative loss in strength was and that they were both below 1/2 what they used to be

 

2) There is no set maximum strength for males or females that I know of but if you can find a quote saying that it is so I'll admit that I am wrong. I'm almost positive about this considering that it is a relative thing that can change at almost any time when someone more powerful is born.

 

References to the top strength.

 

1. Cyndane states that Alivia's strength is stronger then her strength as Lanfear' date=' and that this is impossible. This shows that a) there is a total strength, and that b) lanfear was that strength.

 

For those who think Lanfear merely arrogant, this is unfeasible. Lanfear lived in an age were all men and women who had the ability were trained. Lying to oneself about their ability relative to another is understandable, lying to onself about being the strongest, especially when one is judging anothers strength, is impossible. If Cyndane is honest enough to admit Alivia's strength, then she is honest enough to know if such a strength is possible without artificial enhancement, which is isn't.

 

2. Sharina. Several Aes Sedai make comments refering to Sharina being the strongest a woman can be. Modern Aes Sedai have no reason to make such a claim, especially given the recent surge in increasingly stronger women, unless they have documented evidence that there IS a cut off strength.[/quote']

 

 

1)You cannot say someone is "as strong as they can get" There is always the chance that someone will be born stronger than that person. So it is only assumption that someone believes that a person is the strongest there can be there can be no definite proof. They may be the strongest known but not the strongest that can be. Lanfear says this because she has been the strongest born during her lifetime not because she thinks she is the strongest she can be. Your reading too much into it she's shocked that someone is stronger than what she used to be that's it and your trying to build up an argument that there is a maximum amount of the OP that someone can channel.

 

2) Aes Sedai make alot of claims that fail to be substantiated. They do not necessarily have to lie it is just what they believe to be the truth. I'm suprised you didn't see the flaw in that argument before you put it out there.

 

 

 

 

 

3) Before their stilling Siuan and Leane were two of the strongest women in the tower. Of course the cut off limit was well below what would have allowed them to become aes sedai.

 

I'm sorry... what?

 

The cut off limit is the strength at which you are allowed to test for the shawl. We know that Suine and Leane are beyond that limit. Their comment that the MAJORITY are stronger then they (implying that there exists those that arn't) shows this.

 

This means that their decline in strength covered only the range of strengths included within the Aes Sedai hierarchy' date=' which we know to be limited, both in the lowest possible strength, and the highest possible strength.

 

This means that despite the dramatic decrease in social standing, Suine and Leane did not actuall dramatically decrease in strength.[/quote']

 

As it is the quote I provided that says even at 1/2 of what their original strengths were there would still be a lot of people stronger than them and most at least their equals. That implies that they are less than half what they used to be which is a dramatic loss of strength.

 

Finally' date=' Leane's display in CoT, during which she disguised her ability, inverted her flows, and turned the chain to heartstone, show that whilst weakened (Moiraine states that she could devide her flows four ways, Leane manages three) she is not innefectual.

 

I'm sorry, but the 'dramatic loss of power' Lanfear should have suffered is no argument against her being severed.[/quote']

 

 

 

Please tell me your joking about the her "dividing her flows argument". Egwene can barely channel and she can split her flows over 12 different ways, I think it was 14 in KoD which shows that it is not your strength that allows you to divide your flows but skill in the OP.

 

 

 

I'm not saying she wasn't severed I am just saying that IF she were severed she wouldn't most likely have been healed by a woman.

[Simple Gleeman]

Please tell me your joking about the her "dividing her flows argument". Egwene can barely channel and she can split her flows over 12 different ways' date=' I think it was 14 in KoD which shows that it is not your strength that allows you to divide your flows but skill in the OP.[/quote']

 

Actually Egwene is one of the strongest in the OP. She and Elayne are not much weaker than Nynaeve and Nynaeve is on Forsaken level.

[libertine]

Actually Egwene is one of the strongest in the OP. She and Elayne are not much weaker than Nynaeve and Nynaeve is on Forsaken level.

 

Wait. Hold up. I argue that one. Moiraine was able to judge their power levels while they were still in novice white, and specifically said to Siuan that Egwene and Elayne were *candles* next to the bonfire of potential that was Nynaeve.

 

Egwene and Elayne have more *skill*, but not power. This is not saying that Eg and El are wimps,

 

I've got problems with Nyn being on Forsaken level of power. If she is, she's towards the very low *edge* of it.

[Simple Gleeman]

I've got problems with Nyn being on Forsaken level of power. If she is' date=' she's towards the very low *edge* of it.[/quote']

 

She did match Moghedien in book 4. And that was 7 books ago. Assuming she didn't grow at all, she is still on Forsaken level.

 

Egwene and Elayne are still well above most non-Forsaken female channelers. There are a few a exceptions, but they are few. Egwene is far from being barely able to channel.

[Beowolf]

Going back to Lanfear :x .... this is what happened:

 

1) She and Moiraine went in.

2) Something happened between them and the Finn.

3) She died.

4) She was ressurected by the DO, weaker in power than she was before she entered Finnland.

5) Moiraine remains imprissoned, Lanfear remains free as Cydane.

 

That is all. We do not have any more evience than that. Not even to say something is "extremely likely". The only thing we can do is throw out ideas and play guessing games about this. The Finn are the Finn. Their motto is(or should be) RAFO. :D

[kobra_khan69]

I've got problems with Nyn being on Forsaken level of power. If she is' date=' she's towards the very low *edge* of it.[/i']

 

She did match Moghedien in book 4. And that was 7 books ago. Assuming she didn't grow at all, she is still on Forsaken level.

 

Egwene and Elayne are still well above most non-Forsaken female channelers. There are a few a exceptions, but they are few. Egwene is far from being barely able to channel.

 

Please tell me your joking about the her "dividing her flows argument". Egwene can barely channel and she can split her flows over 12 different ways' date=' I think it was 14 in KoD which shows that it is not your strength that allows you to divide your flows but skill in the OP.[/i']

 

Actually Egwene is one of the strongest in the OP. She and Elayne are not much weaker than Nynaeve and Nynaeve is on Forsaken level.

 

Please tell me you are joking. If you haven't actually read the books then it's okay I guess. Well heres for the people who haven't actually read the book but want to comment anyway.

 

She's given forkroot tea which is diluted to allow her to channel just a little so that she can take novice classes in the beginning.

 

I agree with Beo on this one all of this is supposition and cannot be proven right or wrong until the next book is released, if then.

[richglennon]

Because RJ wanted to rewrite Moiraine back into the story for plot reasons and Lanfear was done?

[RobertAlexWillis]

That is all. We do not have any more evience than that. Not even to say something is "extremely likely".

 

I disagree. We can say something is extremely likely, because we have a couple things that fit one and only one known scenario.

 

1. Moiraine's bond with Lan is broken in a way that he thinks she is dead. Only one thing besides death causes the same effect. Being burnt out.

 

2. Lanfear has her ability in the power weakened. Only one thing has caused that: being Healed by someone of the same sex after losing the ability.

 

Plus, there are supporting facts.

 

1. They were both in very close proximity to a massively malfunctioning ter'angreal. Jordan hammers home again and again how dangerous that is, and yet we haven't seen any character burned out by it ... unless Moiraine and Lanfear were. (And yes, I know about Setalle Anan, but that didn't happen during the course of the story.)

 

2. Moiraine appears to be completely helpless. Lanfear was killed. That is not a likely outcome for either of those highly skilled channelers ... unless they are unable to channel.

 

Some of those points individually would not make a strong case, but all of them together do. It is extrememly likely that both Moiraine and Lanfear were burnt out by the melting ter'angreal doorway.

 

I have to say again, it occurs to me that the reason people don't like to buy into this is that it virtually eliminates both Lanfear and Moiraine from the "Who killed Asmodean?" hunt. If someone else in the story got burnt out by a ter'angreal malfunctioning to the point of melting into slag, none of us would find that strange.

 

As for this:

 

I'm not saying she wasn't severed I am just saying that IF she were severed she wouldn't most likely have been healed by a woman.

 

If she were Healed by a man, assuming the Shadow knew about the male weaves for Healing (which is a big assumption, there is no reason to believe they do) then she would be back to FULL power. Therefore, we know that didn't happen. Which means if she was Healed, it was done by a woman (which the Shadow has no problem knowing, since both Delana and Moghedien were in Salidar when Nynaeve discovered it).

[kobra_khan69]

I just thought of something. Lanfear inverted a weave and tied off a sort of block on Asmodean right? what if Ishy did the same to her? I don't see what would be the reasoning behind it but it is a possibility.

 

Or maybe the mindtrap weakens the channeler slightly.

 

Also being killed and being brought back may have weakened her we do not know the full effects of that process as of yet.

 

I am not arguing that she was killed or even stilled I never was just the fact that she healed by a woman until something is provided by Robert Jordan as to the increments of which being healed by a woman will decrease your strength and what the variables are.

[Albert]

I just thought of something. Lanfear inverted a weave and tied off a sort of block on Asmodean right? what if Ishy did the same to her? I don't see what would be the reasoning behind it but it is a possibility.

 

A shield would not hide a channelers strength' date=' and it's pointless anyway since they are being held by a mindtrap.

 

Or maybe the mindtrap weakens the channeler slightly.

 

We have heard nothing of Moghedien being weaker, and we've had several POVs from other Forsaken when in the same room as her and they should know.

 

Also being killed and being brought back may have weakened her we do not know the full effects of that process as of yet.

 

Several of the Forsaken have been brought back' date=' [i']noone[/i] but Lanfear/Cyndane is weaker. Therefore something else must have happened before death. Like, if she were stilled and then Healed by a women...

[kobra_khan69]

You don't seem to be getting it and tbh I am tired of arguing the point.

 

Siuan - Less than 1/2 their old strength

 

Leane - Less than 1/2 their old strength

 

Lanfear - NOT less than 1/2 her old strength.

 

Now Siuan was one of the strongest women in the tower before Egwene Nynaeve and Elayne came along so it is a dramatic loss of power.

 

It may be a fixed variable I guess to be reduced when a woman is healed by a woman, but I don't see it happening especially with Robert Jordan.

 

Hmm the forsaken also have the ability,and or knowledge, to partially mask their power or at least the males do because Dashiva does when he goes to study with Rand, otherwise he would have been discovered right off the bat. Perhaps Lanfear is doing this to lull the other Chosen into thinking she is weaker than they are so she can strike when she needs to. Thats probably just another far fetched idea but its an idea.

[Gentled Ben]

You're (just barely) missing the point, Kobra. The loss in strength isn't necessarily a percentage, although it can certainly be expressed as a percentage. The loss in strength from being Healed of stilling by the same gender isn't necessarily always greater than 50%, as it could simply be a set amount of strength that is reduced. That's why a chart like the one I offered, however flawed it might be, is useful, because it shows strength as set numbers. What we're saying is, "What if being Healed by the same gender reduces your strength by a set amount? A number on a scale, if you will?" In such an instance, if the number, say, is 10, and if Siuan and Leane previously had been at 18 and 19 in strength, then a loss of 10 in strength would indeed reduce them each to less than half of what they had been, but it wouldn't seem dramatic in Lanfear's case, at all. Just because THEY lost more than 50% of their strength, it doesn't mean that Lanfear did, even having had the same experience!

 

Perhaps if we looked at it this way, it would be more useful: Let's say that there's a price for Healing, and it's $5. Siuan only has $7 in her account, so that $5 Healing fee is quite a chunk of change to her. Lanfear, however, is richer than Bill Gates. "Phaw," she says and hands over a ten, telling the Healer to keep the change. Same financial loss for each of them, yet incredibly different percentages of their net worth.

 

Also, as to whether or not Lanfear was at the limit of ability or merely thought she was, she was a researcher of the One Power, so her thoughts in that regard were likely pretty insightfull. We can certainly test and determine what the skeletal and muscular limits are to the human body as far as running speed might be, with things like aerodynamics, etc factored in, so why couldn't an OP scientist determine the same thing concerning the Power? We know that no human can outrun the average cheetah, and not simply because to date, it hasn't been accomplished.

[Graendals favourite]

Adding to that, I remember Moridin ruminating in PoD about the new discoveries, and mentions in his thoughts healing severing, however imperfectly. It is possible even the Yellow Ajah might have come up with improvements to Nynaeve's first tries, but if noting else, Moridin could have called for Semirhage to try to improve the Healing.

[kobra_khan69]

You're (just barely) missing the point' date=' Kobra. The loss in strength isn't necessarily a percentage, although it can certainly be expressed as a percentage. The loss in strength from being Healed of stilling by the same gender isn't necessarily always greater than 50%, as it could simply be a set amount of strength that is reduced. That's why a chart like the one I offered, however flawed it might be, is useful, because it shows strength as set numbers. What we're saying is, "What if being Healed by the same gender reduces your strength by a set amount? A number on a scale, if you will?" In such an instance, if the number, say, is 10, and if Siuan and Leane previously had been at 18 and 19 in strength, then a loss of 10 in strength would indeed reduce them each to less than half of what they had been, but it wouldn't seem dramatic in Lanfear's case, at all. Just because THEY lost more than 50% of their strength, it doesn't mean that Lanfear did, even having had the same experience!

 

Perhaps if we looked at it this way, it would be more useful: Let's say that there's a price for Healing, and it's $5. Siuan only has $7 in her account, so that $5 Healing fee is quite a chunk of change to her. Lanfear, however, is richer than Bill Gates. "Phaw," she says and hands over a ten, telling the Healer to keep the change. Same financial loss for each of them, yet incredibly different percentages of their net worth.

 

Also, as to whether or not Lanfear was at the limit of ability or merely thought she was, she was a researcher of the One Power, so her thoughts in that regard were likely pretty insightfull. We can certainly test and determine what the skeletal and muscular limits are to the human body as far as running speed might be, with things like aerodynamics, etc factored in, so why couldn't an OP scientist determine the same thing concerning the Power? We [b']know[/b] that no human can outrun the average cheetah, and not simply because to date, it hasn't been accomplished.

 

 

I just said that lol. The price being a fixed variable but its RJ come on everyone.

 

 

I can't explain it any better than what it has been explained.

 

As for your explanation it is comparing two different species whereas that would be like comparing a channeler and normal man. There are some cheetah's that can run faster than others and some that are slower and you can look at that as you would the ability to channel the OP. Even though one cheetah has ran the fastest for as long as you can remember doesn't mean it will be the fastest cheetah to ever be born.

 

 

That makes almost no sense but you see what I am saying right?

[Gentled Ben]

I see what you're saying, but you're splitting an irrelevant hair. It doesn't matter that the two animals in my example are from different species; it matters that there are physical limits. There is a ceiling to how fast a cheetah, any cheetah, can ever run, due to the design of it's body. I'm suggesting that it may well be the same with the Power also, and the books have given every indication that it's so.

 

Why wouldn't RJ let it be a set amount? You're previous argument indicated a set percentage (Siuan and Leane > 50% / Lanfear < 50%= not the same thing happening)...what's the difference?