[Advanced] The Dresden Files Mafia - Game Over - Ed loses, Verbal wins

Hybrid · April 4, 2013

So, we are lynching AVM tomorrow right?

Thought you had a town read on him. What changed your mind?

Been wrong about everything else. Plus, I doubt both him and Ishy are town.

I was hoping someone would suggest lynching AVM tomorrow based on Ishy flipping town . . . didn't think it would be you.

John McClane · April 4, 2013

Oh, and what I called a moot point was my case on JIF. I didn't tell you to drop it, use the JIF situation however you want. All I was saying is that I no longer need to repeat my case on him, since he's revealed as a main character and not been countered.

Don't change the meaning of what I called moot to make it sound like I'm interfering with your scum hunting... .the scum hunting you aren't actually doing, but giving lip service to that is.

BooBoo · April 4, 2013

The Ape is the most disgusting creature on the face of planet.

///ssppppit tooey!!!!

BooBoo · April 4, 2013

Gross gross gross

puke puke puke

disgusting!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

John McClane · April 4, 2013

Gross gross gross

puke puke puke

disgusting!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Best poem yet, Edgar Allen Poop.

RandA lThor · April 4, 2013

Rand, most of your post is garbage because it's all evasive and re-directing accusation. Transparent.

1. The #1 bullet, your response on that though is worth fixating on for a second. You say I've been doing the "same thing" all game, referring to my accusation that you built a case about how I could be scum, but then voted for the person I was casing at the time. Essentially contributing to a townie lynch train, while establishing a basis for coming after me the next day.

2. This is the type of thing only scum can do. You know I'm town. You knew Ishy was town. You contributed to making sure my loud mouth got Ishy lynched, but then hedged your vote on Ishy with the groudwork to call me scum the next day. Essentially, it's a frame-job. I do it as scum, recently I've caught Lily do it twice, y'all know Lily. It is a common, universal scum tell.

3. Of course I come away from the Ishy lynch looking bad, but that's becasue I waffled. Scum only waffles when they are doing it for show. Scum never has to "figure out" who they think is scum more than the other. They know who the townies are, so they can do things like vote one townie, while framing another. The give-away on what you did is that you were essentially moving on past the Ishy lynch an onto making a case on me before we ever even saw Ishy's coroner report.

4. Oh, and you aren't scum hunting. Scum hunting involves inquisition. You drifted in after I established a case on JIF, he revealed, and then moved to Ishy, you voted Ishy and set up a future case on me. That's not scum hunting. That's opportunism.

1 & 2. No I didn't know Ishy was town, and I don't know you are town, nor do I think you are town. What you are saying is not scumhunting, it is a possibility of what would happen if I was scum. You did absolutely nothing on saying why you do the exact same thing. FMPOV, because I think you're mafia, I can say the exact same thing, that you know Verb, Ishy, and I were/are town, and you are trying to push for us and our lynches. This is a really bad point, and you also dodge my question. And you say I don't scumhunt properly.

3. I didn't move past the Ishy lynch, I contributed to it. Then after he has been lynched, obviously I move onto my next suspect. I don't believe in waiting, because from my experience on DM, what happens a lot is we wait until day to argue, and then we run out of time, and we move to a speed lynch. Most times, unless I have a really good reason to wait until night is done, I try to get this done with. So the first time I cased you I minicased and voted Ishy (not moving on from the lynch) and the second time, Ishy was already dead. Talking about dead things, this point.

4. Nope, I replaced in later, and thats when JiF was getting interrogated. We both started with similar thoughts on who was scum/who you thought was the best person to get rid of, as did more than half of the game, so we started looking after that person. You simply got a head start on me in casing. I wasn't drifting after you, I was scumhunting seperately. And I am being inquisitive. For example, let me ask this again. You blame me for setting up multiple lynches, but don't you do the exact same thing when you said lets lynch AVM tomorrow and giving us a list of who you think is scum?

John McClane · April 4, 2013

I was hoping someone would suggest lynching AVM tomorrow based on Ishy flipping town . . . didn't think it would be you.

I have many great talents. None of which include meeting expectations in these games.

RandA lThor · April 4, 2013

I was hoping someone would suggest lynching AVM tomorrow based on Ishy flipping town . . . didn't think it would be you.

I have many great talents. None of which include meeting expectations in these games.

I originally expected you to be town, I guess that explains a lot. :wink:

Nolder · April 4, 2013

I'm gonna go with my friends cousin on a quick trip I guess I'll be back in ~ 2 hours or so

Been back for awhile but busy. Just got a chance to check in. Gonna have to leave again though really soon.

Nolder · April 4, 2013

I won't concede to your point that I'm intentionally pushing Ishy further from priority #1? Bullspit.
Your posts say it all so I really don't have to. All anyone needs to do is reread.
Maybe like you said it isn't intentional but look at it FMPOV. All I see is what you're doing and I have to interpret the why as best I can.

>1. I moved jif up, by doing it of course I acknowledge I did shifted my ranks.

2. I explained specifically why, so in doing that i also acknowledged it. Scum tell ranks higher than hunch.

Fair enough but it wouldn't explain why you went after Jif and baited him to drop metatells for you in the first place.
3. What if this was all a ruse to draw out scum? You've seen me do it before, its not, but could be... Why are acting like you are trying to blow it up? Or like you are scared to get caught in it.?
Why waste time pondering if it was if it wasn't?
And do I look like I'm scared to get caught in anything?

The best thing anyone can do when scum is stay miles away from you because you're a whirlwind of destruction.

And that's not meant to be a compliment. You eff up town just as often as scum when you get caught up in the moment.

Just because you keep saying I'm not acknowledging it, doesn't make it true. You are also dodging the questions I'm asking in return, and one could EASILY make the accusation that you are trying to buy jif time just like you are accusing me of doing for Ishy.
You know what that's a fair point to throw my way so fine. I just wouldn't play this way myself so I'm at a loss with what I see you doing.
If I think I have scum (Ishy) with a solid chance of lynching them I don't waste my time on another potential scum (Jif) and try to build their case. I get the first scum lynched first and then I move on to the next one.

How about answering some of my questions now?
Which ones?

You are going to have to get over the fact that you don't understand how I play, and that doesn't make me scum.

What questions did you not answer of mine? All the ones that ended with question marks, how about that? It's one thing to be a doosh, it's another to be purposefully evasive when asked questions. You are pissing me off, but I've still taken the time to try to address your concerns about my play. You have not done the same in kind.

Well you're not going to get any answers with that attitude. I don't know what you're talking about so you can either tell me or forget it.

John McClane · April 4, 2013

Rand, most of your post is garbage because it's all evasive and re-directing accusation. Transparent.

1. The #1 bullet, your response on that though is worth fixating on for a second. You say I've been doing the "same thing" all game, referring to my accusation that you built a case about how I could be scum, but then voted for the person I was casing at the time. Essentially contributing to a townie lynch train, while establishing a basis for coming after me the next day.

2. This is the type of thing only scum can do. You know I'm town. You knew Ishy was town. You contributed to making sure my loud mouth got Ishy lynched, but then hedged your vote on Ishy with the groudwork to call me scum the next day. Essentially, it's a frame-job. I do it as scum, recently I've caught Lily do it twice, y'all know Lily. It is a common, universal scum tell.

3. Of course I come away from the Ishy lynch looking bad, but that's becasue I waffled. Scum only waffles when they are doing it for show. Scum never has to "figure out" who they think is scum more than the other. They know who the townies are, so they can do things like vote one townie, while framing another. The give-away on what you did is that you were essentially moving on past the Ishy lynch an onto making a case on me before we ever even saw Ishy's coroner report.

4. Oh, and you aren't scum hunting. Scum hunting involves inquisition. You drifted in after I established a case on JIF, he revealed, and then moved to Ishy, you voted Ishy and set up a future case on me. That's not scum hunting. That's opportunism.

1 & 2. No I didn't know Ishy was town, and I don't know you are town, nor do I think you are town. What you are saying is not scumhunting, it is a possibility of what would happen if I was scum. You did absolutely nothing on saying why you do the exact same thing. FMPOV, because I think you're mafia, I can say the exact same thing, that you know Verb, Ishy, and I were/are town, and you are trying to push for us and our lynches. This is a really bad point, and you also dodge my question. And you say I don't scumhunt properly.

3. I didn't move past the Ishy lynch, I contributed to it. Then after he has been lynched, obviously I move onto my next suspect. I don't believe in waiting, because from my experience on DM, what happens a lot is we wait until day to argue, and then we run out of time, and we move to a speed lynch. Most times, unless I have a really good reason to wait until night is done, I try to get this done with. So the first time I cased you I minicased and voted Ishy (not moving on from the lynch) and the second time, Ishy was already dead. Talking about dead things, this point.

4. Nope, I replaced in later, and thats when JiF was getting interrogated. We both started with similar thoughts on who was scum/who you thought was the best person to get rid of, as did more than half of the game, so we started looking after that person. You simply got a head start on me in casing. I wasn't drifting after you, I was scumhunting seperately. And I am being inquisitive. For example, let me ask this again. You blame me for setting up multiple lynches, but don't you do the exact same thing when you said lets lynch AVM tomorrow and giving us a list of who you think is scum?

1. You didn't scum hunt. You jump on an established case out of nowhere. You can say you did this, that and the other thing. But everyone but Song was here to watch you helicopter in from out of nowhere, burn up a paragraph casing me as scum, then vote the same guy I was voting/casing most of the day and move on. That reeks like a frame-job, as I said.

2. How is it a "bad point". It is FACT that the scenario I explained can only be carried out by scum as agenda, because they know who town is. Sure it could be done by town, but it's typically considered bad town play. I should know, I suggest crap like it all the time when I'm town, to see who jumps on it. It's great bait for scum, they can't resist encouraging townies to lynch townies. In this case, maybe you aren't scum, in which case I wonder if you trying to set me up caught Verbal who seems to have latched on to pushing your idea now.

3. Technically, you voted for Ishy. But you put zero effort into the Ishy lynch, so in effect, you looked right past it. You voted him thoughtlessly and spent your energy laying out a case on me, and I'm accusing you of doing it specifically for after Ishy flipped town.

4. You replaced Crusher on D1. The things we are discussing are D2. ??? Putting out a FOS list and saying "let's lynch so-and-so" in night phase is meaningless, it's not setting up anything. Nothing like what you did. Like I said, your energy was put into casing me, but you voted Ishy the guy I was casing. Not you. You didn't do any casing on Ishy, nor did you do any scum hunting or anything inquisitive. Just because you say you did doesn't make it true. You blatantly cased me and voted for teh same person as me, as if you were just trying to get Ishy's lynch over with so that you had the premise in place that "ape led a lynch on a townie" as follow-through on the actual casing you did on me.

You need to defend better. I'm going to effing annihilate you.

John McClane · April 4, 2013

I won't concede to your point that I'm intentionally pushing Ishy further from priority #1? Bullspit.
Your posts say it all so I really don't have to. All anyone needs to do is reread.
Maybe like you said it isn't intentional but look at it FMPOV. All I see is what you're doing and I have to interpret the why as best I can.

>>1. I moved jif up, by doing it of course I acknowledge I did shifted my ranks.

2. I explained specifically why, so in doing that i also acknowledged it. Scum tell ranks higher than hunch.
lockquote>Fair enough but it wouldn't explain why you went after Jif and baited him to drop metatells for you in the first place.

>3. What if this was all a ruse to draw out scum? You've seen me do it before, its not, but could be... Why are acting like you are trying to blow it up? Or like you are scared to get caught in it.?
lockquote>Why waste time pondering if it was if it wasn't?
And do I look like I'm scared to get caught in anything?

The best thing anyone can do when scum is stay miles away from you because you're a whirlwind of destruction.

And that's not meant to be a compliment. You eff up town just as often as scum when you get caught up in the moment.

>Just because you keep saying I'm not acknowledging it, doesn't make it true. You are also dodging the questions I'm asking in return, and one could EASILY make the accusation that you are trying to buy jif time just like you are accusing me of doing for Ishy.
You know what that's a fair point to throw my way so fine. I just wouldn't play this way myself so I'm at a loss with what I see you doing.
If I think I have scum (Ishy) with a solid chance of lynching them I don't waste my time on another potential scum (Jif) and try to build their case. I get the first scum lynched first and then I move on to the next one.

How about answering some of my questions now?
Which ones?

You are going to have to get over the fact that you don't understand how I play, and that doesn't make me scum.

What questions did you not answer of mine? All the ones that ended with question marks, how about that? It's one thing to be a doosh, it's another to be purposefully evasive when asked questions. You are pissing me off, but I've still taken the time to try to address your concerns about my play. You have not done the same in kind.

Well you're not going to get any answers with that attitude. I don't know what you're talking about so you can either tell me or forget it.

Your evasion of my questions is now dually noted.

John McClane · April 4, 2013

Can't decide what Nolder's agenda is... he's cratering on me, almost exclusively. He goaded me about unvoting Ishy. Not sure it makes sense for him to single me out if he's scum. Props to Nolderp, this is the first time in a while I've not had a read on you by the end of D1. You have improved your play substantially. I'm confused.

I want to punch your face! LOL

RandA lThor · April 4, 2013

Rand, most of your post is garbage because it's all evasive and re-directing accusation. Transparent.

1. The #1 bullet, your response on that though is worth fixating on for a second. You say I've been doing the "same thing" all game, referring to my accusation that you built a case about how I could be scum, but then voted for the person I was casing at the time. Essentially contributing to a townie lynch train, while establishing a basis for coming after me the next day.

2. This is the type of thing only scum can do. You know I'm town. You knew Ishy was town. You contributed to making sure my loud mouth got Ishy lynched, but then hedged your vote on Ishy with the groudwork to call me scum the next day. Essentially, it's a frame-job. I do it as scum, recently I've caught Lily do it twice, y'all know Lily. It is a common, universal scum tell.

3. Of course I come away from the Ishy lynch looking bad, but that's becasue I waffled. Scum only waffles when they are doing it for show. Scum never has to "figure out" who they think is scum more than the other. They know who the townies are, so they can do things like vote one townie, while framing another. The give-away on what you did is that you were essentially moving on past the Ishy lynch an onto making a case on me before we ever even saw Ishy's coroner report.

4. Oh, and you aren't scum hunting. Scum hunting involves inquisition. You drifted in after I established a case on JIF, he revealed, and then moved to Ishy, you voted Ishy and set up a future case on me. That's not scum hunting. That's opportunism.

1 & 2. No I didn't know Ishy was town, and I don't know you are town, nor do I think you are town. What you are saying is not scumhunting, it is a possibility of what would happen if I was scum. You did absolutely nothing on saying why you do the exact same thing. FMPOV, because I think you're mafia, I can say the exact same thing, that you know Verb, Ishy, and I were/are town, and you are trying to push for us and our lynches. This is a really bad point, and you also dodge my question. And you say I don't scumhunt properly.

3. I didn't move past the Ishy lynch, I contributed to it. Then after he has been lynched, obviously I move onto my next suspect. I don't believe in waiting, because from my experience on DM, what happens a lot is we wait until day to argue, and then we run out of time, and we move to a speed lynch. Most times, unless I have a really good reason to wait until night is done, I try to get this done with. So the first time I cased you I minicased and voted Ishy (not moving on from the lynch) and the second time, Ishy was already dead. Talking about dead things, this point.

4. Nope, I replaced in later, and thats when JiF was getting interrogated. We both started with similar thoughts on who was scum/who you thought was the best person to get rid of, as did more than half of the game, so we started looking after that person. You simply got a head start on me in casing. I wasn't drifting after you, I was scumhunting seperately. And I am being inquisitive. For example, let me ask this again. You blame me for setting up multiple lynches, but don't you do the exact same thing when you said lets lynch AVM tomorrow and giving us a list of who you think is scum?

1. You didn't scum hunt. You jump on an established case out of nowhere. You can say you did this, that and the other thing. But everyone but Song was here to watch you helicopter in from out of nowhere, burn up a paragraph casing me as scum, then vote the same guy I was voting/casing most of the day and move on. That reeks like a frame-job, as I said.

2. How is it a "bad point". It is FACT that the scenario I explained can only be carried out by scum as agenda, because they know who town is. Sure it could be done by town, but it's typically considered bad town play. I should know, I suggest crap like it all the time when I'm town, to see who jumps on it. It's great bait for scum, they can't resist encouraging townies to lynch townies. In this case, maybe you aren't scum, in which case I wonder if you trying to set me up caught Verbal who seems to have latched on to pushing your idea now.

3. Technically, you voted for Ishy. But you put zero effort into the Ishy lynch, so in effect, you looked right past it. You voted him thoughtlessly and spent your energy laying out a case on me, and I'm accusing you of doing it specifically for after Ishy flipped town.

4. You replaced Crusher on D1. The things we are discussing are D2. ??? Putting out a FOS list and saying "let's lynch so-and-so" in night phase is meaningless, it's not setting up anything. Nothing like what you did. Like I said, your energy was put into casing me, but you voted Ishy the guy I was casing. Not you. You didn't do any casing on Ishy, nor did you do any scum hunting or anything inquisitive. Just because you say you did doesn't make it true. You blatantly cased me and voted for teh same person as me, as if you were just trying to get Ishy's lynch over with so that you had the premise in place that "ape led a lynch on a townie" as follow-through on the actual casing you did on me.

You need to defend better. I'm going to effing annihilate you.

1. Just because I'm casing you doesn't mean that the person you are voting can't be scum. I was the first person to case you with those points specifically, bringing up something valid against you isn't a scum tell or reek of a frame job. All I did was put Ishy as priority 1, and since no one had cased you with the same points I made, I cased you and then put you as priority 2.

2. The reason it was a bad scenario because FMPOV you are scum and the same thing applies to you. It is not mutually exclusive.

3. That was one of my first posts, the Ishy casing had already been done, there wasn't really anything else for me to do besides restate what had already been said. I put as much effort as I could which was my vote.

4. Same thing over and over again, maybe I need to clarify my statement. No I did not case Ishy that much, and no I didn't put as much effort as others onto his train. The problem was that by the time I caught up on the thread, most of the effort possible had already been done. Making a case would have just restated what others had said. There was no point to doing that so I put my vote on Ishy. You were already my second runner up on my lists (btw you have made lists during daytime) but the reason I cased you is that no one else had done a case like mine on you. Thats why I cased you and not Ishy. If Ishy didn't already have a case that I agreed with, then I would have cased him first, voted him, and then cased you and put an FoS on you. What you're saying right now is only a scenario, and not a very likely one either. This is literally the only thing you have against me right now. And to address you saying that posting lists at night is different, it is not that different at all. While I was casing you, I still paid attention to what was happening to Ishy. Go back and read my posts, you'll see that I pointed out things about Ishy as well.

And yeah, you're definitely going to annihalate me.

John McClane · April 4, 2013

Meh, you are intentionally muddling now.

When you actually do acknowledge what I'm saying, you have no choice but to concede that I'm right. Otherwise, you are trying to talk circles around it.

I'm FOSing you for what you DID. Your arguments are garbage, you are leaning on the promise of what you would have done had there not been a case on Ishy, but the reality is, there was... and there's absolutely no way to back up what you are saying you would have done. It's empty re-assurance.

You said, "what you are saying is only a scenario and not a very likely one". Well, by my math 25% of the game was scum in the beginning, so 5 players? We're down to 16 players, so now we're at like 33% of the game is scum. So, my scenario has a 33% chance of being likely. I check my math again and realize your scenario of me being scum has the same chance of being likely. So the math says, you aren't helping your point with this defense. Try again. Reality is, your defense is part conceding my points and part reeling because there's nothing I'm hypothesizing that isn't informed by logic, while your retort is almost completely baseless.

You are using statements like "this is the only thing you have on me" which, to me, is sounds scum bent out of shape because they are defending what they think is an empty case, or a case of blind squirreling.

ed2funy · April 4, 2013

Booboo, Ape, Noldy.

Or Ape, Booboo, Noldy.

Was too damn busy today to properly read this thread, but I am leaning scum on those.

Going to try and actually read the last two pages and post some more thoughts, but I might not be coherent for very much longer.

John McClane · April 4, 2013

Oh look, "I'm gonna catch up and comment" and no followup. How nice of you ed.

Is now the time where all the crappy players here start lynching people who have been participating because "they said something scummy" exposing the generally shallow understanding if the games logic on DM as a whole?

ed2funy · April 4, 2013

Shush. No follow up was promised last night.

Unfortunately, I do get busy at work, occasionally.

John McClane · April 4, 2013

Shush. No follow up was promised last night.

Unfortunately, I do get busy at work, occasionally.

At 12:30 am? And you've got time to hover and immediaty defend yourself, but super busy at work... You are not playing, just giving persistent excuses for what is keeping you from contributing.

John McClane · April 4, 2013

Obviously online and no followup this morning. Nobody cares that people haven't read and don't have anything to say, why post the "stay tuned" type remarks?

It's fluff and and a.form of deferring until you are again forgotten about.

Verbal32 · April 4, 2013

Also, look at Verbal. That mofo was sitting there egging on the JIF train the whole time, and when Nolder started distracting me from my case on JIF, there was Verbal to chime in "Ape you are getting sidetracked, reel it in".

He made sure I stayed the course and ran up JIF. Doing scum's work for them.

Verbal, you have played an awful clean game.

So has TGlems and Rand, the same Rand that tried to frame me for a lynch tomorrow based on the outcome of Ishy's lynch, while he voted Ishy and before Ishy was even dead.

Verb, TGlems, Rand and AVM. No particular order.

How many directions do you plan on firing at? Scum Ape = case & fire from the hip at as many people as possible until people latch on to one of them, and then ride it all the way. You don't care who is lynched of the people you case, as long as it isn't you. I'm sure you've bussed a partner or two along the way, but you are acting teh scum.

Obviously online and no followup this morning. Nobody cares that people haven't read and don't have anything to say, why post the "stay tuned" type remarks?

It's fluff and and a.form of deferring until you are again forgotten about.

^ This. While I think you're scum, you are 1000000% correct about this.

ed2funy · April 4, 2013

No, it is a way to let you know I will be contributing again. I have just been busy.

And I always check on my phone. I am now going to provide nice articulate thoughts while driving. Especially after pt.

ed2funy · April 4, 2013

But if you would like, I will just wait until I can provide thought out posts

Verbal32 · April 4, 2013

I think you meant to say "not" instead of "now". ;-)

Nolder · April 4, 2013

I won't concede to your point that I'm intentionally pushing Ishy further from priority #1? Bullspit.
Your posts say it all so I really don't have to. All anyone needs to do is reread.
Maybe like you said it isn't intentional but look at it FMPOV. All I see is what you're doing and I have to interpret the why as best I can.

>>1. I moved jif up, by doing it of course I acknowledge I did shifted my ranks.

2. I explained specifically why, so in doing that i also acknowledged it. Scum tell ranks higher than hunch.

lockquote> Fair enough but it wouldn't explain why you went after Jif and baited him to drop metatells for you in the first place.

>3. What if this was all a ruse to draw out scum? You've seen me do it before, its not, but could be... Why are acting like you are trying to blow it up? Or like you are scared to get caught in it.?

lockquote> Why waste time pondering if it was if it wasn't?

And do I look like I'm scared to get caught in anything?

The best thing anyone can do when scum is stay miles away from you because you're a whirlwind of destruction.

And that's not meant to be a compliment. You eff up town just as often as scum when you get caught up in the moment.

>Just because you keep saying I'm not acknowledging it, doesn't make it true. You are also dodging the questions I'm asking in return, and one could EASILY make the accusation that you are trying to buy jif time just like you are accusing me of doing for Ishy.
You know what that's a fair point to throw my way so fine. I just wouldn't play this way myself so I'm at a loss with what I see you doing.
If I think I have scum (Ishy) with a solid chance of lynching them I don't waste my time on another potential scum (Jif) and try to build their case. I get the first scum lynched first and then I move on to the next one.

How about answering some of my questions now?
Which ones?

You are going to have to get over the fact that you don't understand how I play, and that doesn't make me scum.

What questions did you not answer of mine? All the ones that ended with question marks, how about that? It's one thing to be a doosh, it's another to be purposefully evasive when asked questions. You are pissing me off, but I've still taken the time to try to address your concerns about my play. You have not done the same in kind.

Well you're not going to get any answers with that attitude. I don't know what you're talking about so you can either tell me or forget it.

Your evasion of my questions is now dually noted.

If you can quote all that you could have quoted those questions wherever they are. You have no one but yourself to blame for them not being answered.

[Advanced] The Dresden Files Mafia - Game Over - Ed loses, Verbal wins

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