Moiraine will kill Rand.

[Balefire to da face!]

Reading some recent theories, I am really liking some of the ideas that Moiraine will kill Rand. It would be a great twist in the story that the one woman who we've all been waiting for so long to return, and who Rand feels so guilty about killing, comes back to a nice big welcome....and toasts Rand.

 

I had been considering it as a good theory, but not airtight. I read something recently to top things off that convinces me it's almost 100% Moiraine is going to be the one to pull the trigger on Rand.

 

But before I get to that, there are some well established reasons for thinking Moiraine will kill Rand. Terez's theory on the twice dawning day sums them up very well. The parts specific to the Fisher King connection and Balefire aren't important here, as I dunno how likely they are. Just the clues that Moiraine will kill Rand.

 

Anyway, to sum it up....

 

- Moiraine is foreshadowed as early as tEotW to be willing to kill Rand herself to keep the Shadow from taking him.

 

- Moiraine's three questions are still unknown, and at least two out of the three things she asked for are still unknown. As if we needed it, Brandon himself has said this is a big RAFO. Her questions and wishes will have a huge impact on the last book. Both as a plot device and in universe logic pretty much demands one of her questions to have been how to win the Last Battle, or at least how to keep Rand from going Dark. Either of which could have led to her learning she must kill Rand.

 

- Min had a viewing that Rand would fail with a woman dead and gone. This may be because Moiraine is the only one who is both willing and able to do what must be done. Egwene, Nyn, and the girls don't have what it takes to kill Rand, but Moiraine certainly does.

 

Like I said, I don't mean to get into the specifics of Rand being balefired. It seems in conflict with the three on a boat theory, and things get even muddier if the body swap is true. But the point is, Rand is slated to die and we have some indication in some way it will come in the form of friendly fire(Alivia helping him die, the ambiguous language would make sense if she's in a circle with Moiraine). So it would make sense if it were from Moiraine.

 

What tips it into almost certain territory for me is something I haven't seen anyone else mention. Moiraine is a huuuuuge parrallel to the Moirai. The three Fates that spin, measure, and cut the life threads of all humans.

 

Why does this make me so sure Moiraine will kill Rand? Because Moiraine doesn't just parrallell the Fates a little. When rereading the series with this parrallel in mind, it sheds a whole new layer on the relationship between Moiraine and Rand, Moiraine herself, and possibily the very fact that Jordan chose a looming wheel to visualize the great pattern, how lives are woven into it, and everything that followed.  Moiraine is said countless times to be pulling Rand's strings, directing him. In fact, up until Moiraine relents in tFoH, nearly their entire relationship can be summed up with Rand thinking of her trying to pull his strings. That Moiraine is a personification of the Fates adds a whole new layer to Rand struggling against her. Needless to say it would be very poetic that now that Rand has submitted to his fate, that Moiraine, the thread cutter, shows back up to do the deed.

 

My favorite parrallel here, though, is how Moiraine mirrors the Fates in how the whole story got started. In a plot sense, she could have found out about Rand in any number of ways. But how did she find out? She was set on the path to controlling the Dragon Reborn the second he was born on Dragonmount thanks to Gisaro's Foretelling. Just like the Fates, there right at the beginning. That Moiraine has been there from the beginning, and how central to the whole series this parrallel is, I think it's very likely Moiraine is going to be the one to kill Rand, to cut his thread. Though exactly how is up for debate.

[Viperswhip]

Ummm, I am not going to make a bet with you because those go badly for me, but let's just say I will be surprised and dismayed if she kills him for any reason other than he has been taken over by Moridin or something.

[bigdoug1971]

I've seen this around lately too.  I don't think it will happen.  Of course, I don't think the body swap theory will happen either. 

 

Man, I cannot stand the wait for 1/8/13.  If the world ends on December 21st like the Mayan calendar says, I'm gonna be pissed!!!

[herid]

@Balefire The Moiraine Moirai parallel is definitely very interesting if somewhat tenuous when speaking of her possible role in Rand's death. The role of killing Rand is split between a number a number of characters, all with mythological underpinnings and I wouldn't try to decide who will land the final blow based on mythology, particularly on Greek mythology, which RJ used less than other mythologies. I do agree that Moiraine is on a short list of possible suspects. But there are other possibilities too. I like Galad in particular because he is a very strong Mordred parallel and he will also not hesitate to finish off Rand if he thinks it's the right thing to do. Moiraine is also a Mordred parallel btw.

Ummm, I am not going to make a bet with you because those go badly for me, but let's just say I will be surprised and dismayed if she kills him for any reason other than he has been taken over by Moridin or something.

That (or something similar)  is exactly what I think will happen which is why it will be necessary for Rand to die.

[Shauna]

@bigdoug: I highly doubt the world is going to end on December 21st.

[KrisAnton]

This assumes that Rand's plan goes wrong, right? Is it really a self sacrifice if he has to have someone kill him? And did Moiraine really die? I've always assumed that the woman dead and gone is Lanfear, as she's the only female revolving around Rand who has died and been resurrected. Moiraine basically went on an extended holiday after TSR, she never died. She will be an important part at the LB, but with her diminished channeling ability, what good would she be in a circle? If its a matter of trust, Light Rand's ability to sense Darkfriends should eliminate the need for trust. Unless one of the things that Moiraine asked for was a particular weave that was necessary to fight the DO...

 

 

[Amandera]

I think it's possible Egwene might kill Rand as well. There is foreshadowing in the earlier books, mostly in the form of Egwene musing how to help Rand avoid taint and usually comes to the realization that only way to help him is kill him or to gentle him which is then clarified as "as well kill him". There is also Egwene's Accepted test. And on the other hand, as Rand goes down the spiral he begins to think Egwene is more likely to gentle him than help him until post-VoG.

 

Some examples:

 

tGH, Ch8

A man who could channel. She could marry him. And watch him go mad, watch him die. The only way to stop it would be to have him gentled. I can’t do that to him. I can’t!

 

tGH, Ch8

“The next time you see me, you will likely want to gentle me.”

 

tDR, Ch27

She took another long breath to calm herself. “The only way to help him is to gentle him,” she muttered. “As well go ahead and kill him.” Her stomach twisted and knotted. “I’ll never do that. Never!”

 

tGS, Ch1

"Egwene might just let Semirhage go and take me captive instead. Force me to kneel before the White Tower’s justice and gentle me just to give her another notch in her belt."

And there is the Accepted test.

[KrisAnton]

What good would come of gentling him when his entire essence is literally keeping the world intact? Egwene won't come within 1,000 miles of SG, she will simultaneously be trying to fight the Seanchen and scheming to undermine Rand's plan to break the seals.

[Amandera]

Severing is pretty much a death sentence. I am saying Egwene may be forced to kill Rand not that he's going to get severed. I am also not saying that Rand's death will necessarily be at Shayol Ghul.

 

Btw, I'm pretty sure they won't be fighting both the Shadow and the Seanchan throughout all the book for the simple reason there is no way they can win both wars. And breaking the Seals thing will get solved in FoM.

[KrisAnton]

Heh. I just found a cool part in TDR. It's when Moiraine and her crew arrive near Illian after Faile has sworn to obey and not ask questions but is allowed to remain with the group. Moiraine then touches her forehead after Faile swears and Moiraine says:

 

“It seems you have found Min’s falcon, ta’veren. I have tried to discourage her, but it appears she will perch on your shoulder whatever I do. The Pattern weaves a future for you, it seems. Yet remember this. If I must, I will snip your thread from the Pattern. And if the girl endangers what must be, you will share her fate.”

 

[KrisAnton]

Hmmm. Now that I'm thinking about it, Moiraine threw herself into Lanfear and got them both stuck in Finnland to protect Aviendha. Moiraine would have known what was important to the future and if she knew she had to be there, she would not have sacrificed herself. Now, if she knew that Avi HAD to be there, then she would have done everything she could to protect that thread. Obviously Moiraine doesn't know all, but she's been able to piece together a lot through research and her time with the snake and foxes. If she knew that Avi was a crucial part of that triad at SG, she would have moved heaven and earth to make sure she was safe. Likewise, if Moiraine had known that she herself was supposed to be at SG, then she would not have made such a reckless move..won't know more until I get to the TSR part of my reread.

[Amandera]

tFoH, Ch53

There were three branches from the docks, but if you are reading this, I am gone, and so is Lanfear . . .

The other two paths were much worse. Down one, Lanfear killed you. Down the other, she carried you away, and when next we saw you, you called yourself Lews Therin Telamon and were her devoted lover.

Moiraine doesn't care about Aviendha. She certainly did not sacrifice herself to save her. It was for Rand.

[FarShainMael]

How does Alivia 'helping Rand die' come into this?

 

[michellem]

This assumes that Rand's plan goes wrong, right? Is it really a self sacrifice if he has to have someone kill him? And did Moiraine really die? I've always assumed that the woman dead and gone is Lanfear, as she's the only female revolving around Rand who has died and been resurrected. Moiraine basically went on an extended holiday after TSR, she never died. She will be an important part at the LB, but with her diminished channeling ability, what good would she be in a circle? If its a matter of trust, Light Rand's ability to sense Darkfriends should eliminate the need for trust. Unless one of the things that Moiraine asked for was a particular weave that was necessary to fight the DO...

 

 

Remember that the sentence about needing a woman dead and gone comes from Min thinking to her self; she doesn't know that Moiraine is alive. Neither does the reader at that point. So to Min, Moiraine is dead. Moir went through the doorway, her bond with Lan ceased to exist. To everyone, including the readers until we saw her letter to Tom, this ment that she was dead. 

[herid]

I think it's possible Egwene might kill Rand as well.

This would be a possibility but there are no mythological parallels for Egwene killing Rand so far as I know. Something as important as Rand's death will definitely have a mythological parallel. That's why I don't think she'll do it directly.

 

I've never thought of stilling Rand but it actually might be useful in healing his madness which has to happen one way or another before the final showdown. What happened to men who were gentled? Is it ever mentioned if that affected their madness? If it did, perhaps Rand needs to be gentled and then Healed back. Nyn can do that.

Heh. I just found a cool part in TDR. It's when Moiraine and her crew arrive near Illian after Faile has sworn to obey and not ask questions but is allowed to remain with the group. Moiraine then touches her forehead after Faile swears and Moiraine says:

 

“It seems you have found Min’s falcon, ta’veren. I have tried to discourage her, but it appears she will perch on your shoulder whatever I do. The Pattern weaves a future for you, it seems. Yet remember this. If I must, I will snip your thread from the Pattern. And if the girl endangers what must be, you will share her fate.”

 

 

That's a very cool quote supporting the Moirai link that Balefire was advocating!

 

 

[michellem]

But herid, he's protected from the madness; Nynaeve checked him in ToM when she figured out how to heal the madness, and there was a layer of Light all around the dark madness-strings, protecting him from the madness. Not just hindering him go more mad; but he's literally got an armor of Light between himself and the madness that had settled on him.

[herid]

@Misheru I don't think the whiteness Nyn saw insulates Rand completely. At best there is a balance and it holds Rand's madness at bay. The madness is still there and Nyn thinks that healing Rand from it might be the most important thing she could do for him. I wouldn't trust Rand's thinking completely until that's done. His thought process at the end of chapter 1 of AMOL looks particularly suspicious to me. I mean all the stuff about his madness saving him. I'm sure he'll have to be cured somehow before it's all over. I thought that this will happen after he dies and comes back to life. Dying should remove both the madness and most likely the link to Moridin too. But the idea that the same might be accomplished by gentling and Healing the channeling ability back might have merit too.

[driedraspberry]

I'm not so sure about gentling having a positive effect on madness. When Rand is first told by that DF AM how Taim deals with the mad trainees they discuss how it's preferable to being gentled and yet still afflicted.

 

As for Rand's death Heracles is an option, less likely but there are a few interesting points of resemblance. Heracles becoming mad by the hand of a vengeful god and slaying his wife and kids wasn't so different than LTT's death. And for Heracles that was the start of his epic 12 tasks, and his quest for redemption. And he also had 3 wives, though not at once. He even had a brother sans super powers.

 

Heracles' death is interesting because he diseapears at funeral pyre, where his body, overcome by agonizing pain, was put to die. The sequence of events that led to it starts with his second wife, who had been tricked by a dying enemy. He was "helped" to die to be free of pain.

[herid]

@driedraspberry yes, Hercules (I'm more used to the Roman name for him) is definitely a parallel to Rand/LTT and I'm sure Rand's death will also have some parallels to Hercules' death as you suggest but I have a hard time guessing which exact details will be paralleled and how.
The general theme of Rand having to die to be cured of his injuries fits well enough with that legend. The funeral pyre fits too. As for other stuff in it, I don't know. I can't see parallels between the other characters in that myth and WoT. Who, if anybody, is Deianira's parallel for example? None of Rand's girls seem to fit and neither does Egwene.
The fact that Hydra's blood was instrumental in Hercules' death is certainly interesting. There are lots of blood related references tied to Rand's death and rebirth. But what, if anything, should correspond to the tunic of Nessus soaked in Hydra's blood?

 

as for stilling healing the taint induced madness, yeh, I wasn't sure on it. Good point about that reference to  Taim dealing with the Asha'man who went mad. It's from tPoD, ch 14 btw. I just thought it was an interesting idea after seeing Cem's post.