Silver Swan Aes Sedai

[Barid Bel Medar]

Saw this in another topic, thought I should bring it up. Cadsuane seems to be gathering Aes Sedai at the Silver Swan, an inn in Caemlyn. It is mentioned consistently throughout the series.

 

Where were they or what were/are they doing in the attack on Caemlyn?

 

We saw no evidence of their presence in the Prologue and Chapter 1, will their presence have any role to play, perhaps retaking Caemlyn?

 

Is this an oversight?

 

What do you guys think?

[wipe]

Thank you for bringing it up, I have wondered about these girls for a couple of years now. Why have they been mentioned so often without them having a purpose in the books? I just brought up the old thread again, but saw that it was in the non-spoiler section, so couldn't expect any answers.

 

So Again thank you

[Barid Bel Medar]

yeah sorry, I had to hide your post, no spoilers, so I brought it here.

[GB]

is it possible that they left for the White Tower after the reunification? though that would be a very poor development given that they have been coming and going for a fair bit as you mentioned Barid

[FarShainMael]

Here's a summary of the movements at the Silver Swan:

 

 

•ACoS,Ch7 - Bashere reports to Rand that eight to ten Aes Sedai have been staying at The Silver Swan for the past month.

•WH,Ch7 - There are ten Aes Sedai at The Silver Swan. Recently two left and three more arrived. None of them is Red Ajah.

•WH,Ch8 - Elayne warns Reene Harfor that the Aes Sedai at The Silver Swan may have spies in the Royal Palace.

•CoT,Ch12 - Birgitte reports to Elayne that two sisters, Green Ajah and Gray Ajah, arrived at The Silver Swan the same day that a Brown Ajah sister left heading east and a Yellow Ajah sister left heading south toward Far Madding.

•CoT,Ch14 - Three Brown Ajah sisters staying at The Silver Swan visit Millis Fendry at the Hoop and Arrow, the same inn that Milam Harnder frequents.

•KoD,Ch14 - Chanelle orders Renaile to go to The Silver Swan herself to question the nine Aes Sedai staying there about Talaan.

 

 

from

http://encyclopaedia-wot.org/geography/andor/caemlyn/silver_swan.html

 

If these are indeed Cadsuane's Army (and I'd bet on it myself), where is Cadsuane herself atm? She was last heard of with Rand in the meeting with the Borderlanders at Far Madding, I think.

 

The Silver Swan itself is in the New City, and the Prologue only went there briefly for Talmanes to retrieve the dragons. There is now a large hole in the New City wall, of course. If the CA is there and active, it now has a fight on its hands. I'm not sure if ten channellers would be able to hold off a massed Trolloc attack..

 

But timewise, we first hear of CA shortly after two major events - the establishment of the Black Tower, and Rand's kidnapping. Cads seems to be keeping a personal eye on Rand; so perhaps the purpose of these sisters is to watch the Black Tower.

 

(edited for awful spilling mistrake!)

[wipe]

We have thought they are part of CA for a long time, but have we any evidence of contact. The only reference I can think of is one of the sisters with Elayne saying they overheard her name.

 

I just can't imagine RJ mentioning them so many times without them having a purpose in the story line. Hopefully we will see them fight in Andor on the side of good (or do something for the other side...). On the other hand BS might have forgotten that they are there.

 

Barid: The post didn't contain any spoilers, did it? It was just the answer that would one way or the other. Thank you though for clearing it up for me, as I understand they are not mentioned in any of the newly published material.

[Barid Bel Medar]

 

 

Barid: The post didn't contain any spoilers, did it? It was just the answer that would one way or the other. Thank you though for clearing it up for me, as I understand they are not mentioned in any of the newly published material.

 

Not really, but it is hard to define. It gives away that Caemlyn attack was in the prologue and that they weren't involved in it. Some people don't want any spoilers, so it is best to be safe. Your not getting in trouble or anything, just best to be safe.

[Aulduron]

I'm thinking we'll get another PoV of the battle in another chapter. Probably from the darks side. The battle is not quite done. Elayne and Egwene are currently scouting where to bring in forces, while Perrin and Rand are also thinking of a strike on the waygqate.

[joeron bigelow]

I'm on the camp that these are black ajah. elayne will stroll into the swan, without birgitte, and maybe two Kin, expecting to overpower whoever is there with her regalness.

 

If Verin knew of the attack, then the others in her "heart" should know right? So maybe they are the ones to bring the trollocs.

 

on a side note...I get Cadsuane's Army and "friends of cadsuane" mixed up...so I kept thinking why do we care about an inn full of (fill in the blank)?

[herid]

Where does the idea that this is Cadsuane's army comes from? Because they mentioned her name? seems thin to me.

 

The first time the Aes Sedai in the Silver Swan are mentioned is in aCoS, ch 7 and some of them are reds and they show up twice. This is most likely the party that Elaida sent to deal with the Black Tower.

 

The next time is in Wh, ch 7 is much later and a different group of Aes Sedai are involved. None of them are reds and Elayne thinks they are unlikely to be Elaida's for that reason. Then in CoT, ch 14 Elayne gets another reason to think that those Aes Sedai are not Elaida's because some of them are Brown and it turns out that the palace librarian is their spy. Elayne thinks:

Reene had discovered several spies for the Red Ajah, assuredly legacies of Elaida’s time in Caemlyn, but this librarian was the first for another Ajah. Elaida would not have liked other Ajahs knowing what went on in the palace while she was advisor to the Queen.

 

Lastly, in KoD, ch 14 two Windfinders go to the Silver Swan in search of Talaan and Merilille and manage to recruit one of them (Amylia) to take Merilille's place on account of the bargain Nyn and Elayne made with Nesta. She shows up later in the scene when Logain visits Zaida. This tells us two things. First, those Aes Sedai are not only not sent by Elaida, they are actually followers of Egwene. If they were Elaida's they would tell the Windfinders to go stick their heads in a bucket when informed about the bargain Elayne and Nyn made. Secondly, this also eliminates Cadusane and any of her people IMO because they would tell the Seafolk the same exact thing. They don't consider Egwene a rightful Amyrlin at that time. Merise made that very clear when she visited Egwene's Aes Sedai in KoD. Plus, Cadsuane and her followers know that saidin has been cleansed. Amylia doesn't.

 

Also, the fact that Amylia actually agreed to go to the Seafolk suggests that those Aes Sedai are not Blacks, at least not all of them.

 

As to who they are I don't have any theories. Some plot of Egwene's Sitters, perhaps?

[joeron bigelow]

My feeling is that they are black...

 

1. Why did they not return to the Tower when Elaida issued her decree to have everyone return?

2. I'm sure Egwene did the same thing before purging the BA out. Or is there a timeline conflict?

 

Yet these "sisters" just continue to hang out in the inn. Who is to say maybe there were the same sisters in the carriage that Isam sees later in the "Town."

 

Do you think the silver swan has a white wing?

[Aulduron]

It's been...what?....3 books since we've heard about them? For all we know, they're gone.

[lsm]

could they be the ones who channeled that is mentioned in the amol prologue? iirc one the kin thinks there are black sisters in the city

[herid]

It's really strange. I reread the Amylia scene from KoD and she doesn't know how to Travel. That's mentioned explicitly. It doesn't say that she doesn't have enough strength but that she doesn't know the weaves. All of Egwene's Aes Sedai know how to Travel and all of Cadsuane's do as well. But she is not Elaida's either since she went to the Sea Folk because of Elayne's and Nynaeve's bargain. What does that make her I can not say. perhaps somebody sent on some mission from Salidar before Egwene got there like the ferrets sent to the White Tower? It's been quite a while.

[Aulduron]

could they be the ones who channeled that is mentioned in the amol prologue? iirc one the kin thinks there are black sisters in the city

 

Maybe, but there are already Black Ajah in Camelyn. Maybe the fires started while they fought the Black Ajah.

[Barid Bel Medar]

My thoughts are that the Black sisters involved are the remainder of Moghedien's bunch.

[FarShainMael]

It's interesting that there are apparently no Red sisters in the group. That would seem to speak against Elaida, at least.

[Aquarius]

My thoughts are that the Black sisters involved are the remainder of Moghedien's bunch.

I remember an big long theory from Lucker's explaining the fate of Mog's dogs. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I beleive he went on to argue that they were the ones to free Taim and that some of them will have ended up among the 13 that are currently with the Borderlanders. Sorry, I can't find a link.

[wipe]

Herid:

 

The theory of them being CA is from the original thread where Terez and Luckers shared their opinions on the matter (you can look at them in the general discussion thread I beleive). I do beleive that you make an excellent point though in your earlier post on Cadsuane not accepting Egwene as amyrlin yet. Hadn't thought about that.

 

Aulduron:

 

Of course you can be right, but why were they mentioned through som many books then - they haven't done anything to deserve their screen time... they might also be one of the loose threads we will never get an answer to...

[herid]

@wipe Actually, I reconsidered what I said. Amylia can't make gateways so she is highly unlikely to be from Egwene's camp. The mere fact that she agreed to go to the Seafolk because of the bargain Nyn and Elayne made eliminates her being Elaida's. This says that she is an independent and the only group of independents of notice are those following Cadsuane. Together with the Silver swan Ases Sedai mentioning Cadsuane this makes a pretty compelling case for them being Cadsuane's army. As I said, the trouble with that is this

1. Merise (and likely others) don't consider Egwene a rightful Amyrlin.
    
   
2. Amylia doesn't know how to Travel and Cadsuane and her people do.
    
   
3. Amylia doesn't know that saidin has been cleansed and again, Cadsuane and her people do know.
   

However, perhaps all these points can be explained away. Cadsuane was very clear about importance of keeping bargains (she told Rand as much when he wanted to get rid of the Seafolk advisers). And it's not altogether clear to me who Cadsuane personally considers to be the rightful Amyrlin. She seems to accept Nynaeve as being a sister at least in part. Her problem with that issue seemingly is not Egwene's position but rather the fact that Nynaeve has not passed the test and has not taken the oaths.

And as for Traveling, Cadsuane may not have taught it to everyone and it also may be that it's been a while the people in Caemlyn saw her. She has learned the Traveling weaves a relatively short time ago. That might also explain their unawareness that saidin has been cleansed.

 

Still, this looks like a lot of excuses so I'm not sure on this. It certainly would have been nice if Amylia answered Logain when he asked her whom she follows. That was a really nice touch by RJ which I only appreciated when I started thinking about this question.

 

I'll look up the thread you mention.

[Aulduron]

 

Aulduron:

 

Of course you can be right, but why were they mentioned through som many books then - they haven't done anything to deserve their screen time... they might also be one of the loose threads we will never get an answer to...

 

I don't really believe they left before the battle. The BA had to know they're there. Assassins went after the kin, some probably went to the Silver Swan too. That fight may have started the fires. As I said earlier, I believe we'll see another PoV of the battle, and we'll see those sisters in it. They may have fought they're way to another gate, they may still be fighting, they may have been killed/captured. Who knows?

[Ford75]

Didn't the sister from the Silver Swan that went tot he Sea Folk go because she was Brown and thought it was an opportunity to learn; not necessarily because she is in Egwene's camp and was attempting to fill the bargain?

[herid]

@Ford75. It's stated explicitly that she came to fulfill the bargain for the Bowl.

 

In addition to returning with the first of the Aes Sedai (Amylia) agreed to in the bargain for use of the Bowl of the Winds, she (Zaida) also had returned with her own bargain

--KoD, ch 22

 

 

She also wanted to study the Sea Folk of course but that was not why she came. In any case, I'm fairly sure that BS dropped this plotline altogether and we won't see any of the Silver Swan Aes Sedai including Amylia again.

[Ford75]

@herid - isn't that Zaida's POV, for why she brought the Aes Sedai - I figured Amylia's reasons for going was to study the Sea Folk (not nessesarily to fulfill the bargain).

 

A powerful Sea Folk Wilder shows up demanding for any Aes Sedai to come to the ships, and she thought "This is an interesting opportunity ..." and agreed to go. That was my take on it. That the Brown was going to study them, and the mention of a "bargain" wasn't what made her. (Though that was just my own interpretation of it)