Ben explains everthing.... ish

[Terez]

Demandred is neither Taim nor Bashere because his alter ego has never been seen on screen.

[FarShainMael]

While I agree that Demandred is neither Taim nor Bashere, we don't know that his alter-ego has never been seen on-screen:

 

http://www.theorylan...ain.php?i=479#6

 

 

INTERVIEW: Nov 19th, 2009

 

TGS Signing Report - Matrimony Cauthon (Paraphrased)

 

QUESTION

 

Someone asked for clarification about whether we had seen Mesaana and Demandred's alter-egos on screen.

 

BRANDON SANDERSON

 

Sanderson said that we had seen Mesaana's alter-ego on screen as of Knife of Dreams, but that we had not seen Demandred's alter-ego on screen as of Knife of Dreams. Sanderson would not elaborate on whether Demandred's alter-ego had been seen in The Gathering Storm—Sanderson didn't want to narrow down the suspects for us if Demandred really had appeared in The Gathering Storm.

 

 

http://www.theorylan...ain.php?i=480#5

 

 

 

INTERVIEW: Nov 19th, 2009

 

TGS Signing Report - Samadai (Paraphrased)

 

SAMADAI

 

I then asked, has Demandred's alter ego been seen since Crossroads of Twilight?

 

BRANDON SANDERSON

 

He said that is a good question, but "I'm not going to answer it."

 

SAMADAI

 

I actually asked this next question after the signing but since it is relevant to this question I am putting it here. I asked, has Demandred's alter ego been mentioned in the books but not seen?

 

BRANDON SANDERSON

 

He gave me a very guarded look and said, "That is a very well though out question", paused for a moment, and said "there have been too few characters introduced in the last few books for me to answer that". Speculators unite.

 

I wonder what 'the last few books' are? We first heard of Roedran (prime suspect!) back in LoC7, when he was mentioned by Danelle in respect of some offer (??) made to a number of rulers by the WT.

[Terez]

Brandon confirmed he has not been seen on screen in any book with the possible exception of TGS.

[Diamondmask]

Ok - I guess I was hoping it was Taim and could look forward to him getting his ass kicked by Rand - finally. Or by Logain, more probably. BTW what do you guys mean by 'not on screen'? I'm not sure what the reference is?

[FarShainMael]

'On screen' = appeared in the narrative so that we see what he/she is doing, saying, or thinking. We've never seen Roedran like this; he's only been mentioned by other characters such as Talmanes.

[Diamondmask]

Cheers, thanks for explaining.

[XoMeltdownoX]

LTT's mistake was that he alienated the women and arrogantly thought he could succeed without them.

That was the mistake, the tainting of Saidin was a product of that mistake.

 

How is that? We know per RJ that if the women had been involved Saidar would have been tainted as well.

I thought we had an RH quote saying that if the women had been involved, Saidar might have been tainted. That the conditions had to be just right for that to happen. Does anyone have the quote handy?

[mbuehner]

I don't see how LTT gets the lionshare of the blame. Nobody else had any ideas, and hope is not a plan. At that point it was probably far more likely that the Dark would capture the ter'angreals, as opposed the light recovering them. Sudden and catastrophic defeat with no chance for a counterstroke seemed the most plausible outcome as one of the forsaken took control of the CK (recall even Asmodian knew the statues on sight, so they likely were hunting them). Moreover its hard to argue with success. As bad as the breaking of the world was its hard to credit how it would have been better to allow the Dark One to escape. If anybody had another plan they should have presented it. Waiting around for a miracle was not an option when any second could mean the end of the world anyway. LTT was right and he bought humanity centuries of relative relief from the DO.

[Suttree]

LTT's mistake was that he alienated the women and arrogantly thought he could succeed without them.

That was the mistake, the tainting of Saidin was a product of that mistake.

 

How is that? We know per RJ that if the women had been involved Saidar would have been tainted as well.

I thought we had an RH quote saying that if the women had been involved, Saidar might have been tainted. That the conditions had to be just right for that to happen. Does anyone have the quote handy?

 

Nope. You are joining two separate quotes together. RJ said it was a lucky thing Saidar was not used.

 

ROBERT JORDAN

 

 

Robert Jordan

Okay, then you know about the political struggles that were going on, and the different plans to try and end the War of the Shadow, and seal up the...and why various groups thought that one plan or the other was the best way to go. And in the end, what resulted was the so-called “Fatal Covenant” [it was actually the “Fateful Concord”], which had the female Aes Sedai swearing not to go along with Lews Therin’s plan, that they would not support it. The result of this was that Lews Therin carried out his plan with only male Aes Sedai, so there were only male Aes Sedai channeling there, which was a lucky thing, because if there’d been women as well, then both saidin and saidar would have been tainted. And his plan worked, except for that one side effect of the backblast which tainted saidin and caused him and the men there with him to go mad there and then, and other male Aes Sedai to go mad slowly as they touched the Source and began to absorb bits of the taint. But that’s why saidar was not tainted, because there were only men there channeling during this act of sealing up the Dark One’s prison.

 

LTT quite obviously had to act but his plan was flawed(as Rand clearly knows now). LPD said the plan was too dangerous and ended up being correct. I find it likely that the pattern pushed for the female AS opposition as well as a safe guard.

[XoMeltdownoX]

LTT's mistake was that he alienated the women and arrogantly thought he could succeed without them.

That was the mistake, the tainting of Saidin was a product of that mistake.

 

How is that? We know per RJ that if the women had been involved Saidar would have been tainted as well.

I thought we had an RH quote saying that if the women had been involved, Saidar might have been tainted. That the conditions had to be just right for that to happen. Does anyone have the quote handy?

 

Nope. You are joining two separate quotes together. RJ said it was a lucky thing Saidar was not used.

 

ROBERT JORDAN

 

 

Robert Jordan

Okay, then you know about the political struggles that were going on, and the different plans to try and end the War of the Shadow, and seal up the...and why various groups thought that one plan or the other was the best way to go. And in the end, what resulted was the so-called “Fatal Covenant” [it was actually the “Fateful Concord”], which had the female Aes Sedai swearing not to go along with Lews Therin’s plan, that they would not support it. The result of this was that Lews Therin carried out his plan with only male Aes Sedai, so there were only male Aes Sedai channeling there, which was a lucky thing, because if there’d been women as well, then both saidin and saidar would have been tainted. And his plan worked, except for that one side effect of the backblast which tainted saidin and caused him and the men there with him to go mad there and then, and other male Aes Sedai to go mad slowly as they touched the Source and began to absorb bits of the taint. But that’s why saidar was not tainted, because there were only men there channeling during this act of sealing up the Dark One’s prison.

 

LTT quite obviously had to act but his plan was flawed(as Rand clearly knows now). LPD said the plan was too dangerous and ended up being correct. I find it likely that the pattern pushed for the female AS opposition as well as a safe guard.

Thanks. I had not read that quote. There was a different quote I was thinking of that said the conditions had to be just right for the DO to taint Saidin. Of course it is his story and he wrote it that way for a reason, so if if the female AS had helped the conditions would have been met. I will look for it.

[FarShainMael]

Here you go:

 

QUESTION

 

Is there a reason the Dark One could not or would not re-taint saidin?

 

ROBERT JORDAN

 

The conditions would have to be exactly right. Those conditions were set up while the seals were being placed on the Bore. The chances that exactly those conditions would occur again are fairly small. And that is saying that it was a volitional act rather than a side-effect of trying to stop the seals from being placed. After all, if the Dark One could taint saidin at will, why could he not taint saidar as well, and why would he not have done so?

 

from http://www.theorylan...in.php?i=142#19

[XoMeltdownoX]

Here you go:

 

QUESTION

 

Is there a reason the Dark One could not or would not re-taint saidin?

 

ROBERT JORDAN

 

The conditions would have to be exactly right. Those conditions were set up while the seals were being placed on the Bore. The chances that exactly those conditions would occur again are fairly small. And that is saying that it was a volitional act rather than a side-effect of trying to stop the seals from being placed. After all, if the Dark One could taint saidin at will, why could he not taint saidar as well, and why would he not have done so?

 

from http://www.theorylan...in.php?i=142#19

Thans FSM. Ya, as stated it seems like I was combining the quotes.

[Diamondmask]

Can I ask about something at the end of ToM - with regards to the seals on the bore? Or is this a non-spoiler thread?

[Luckers]

Can I ask about something at the end of ToM - with regards to the seals on the bore? Or is this a non-spoiler thread?

 

Things from TofM are not considered spoilers--unless a thread states in the title 'please no spoilers from TofM' your fine.

 

And, on this board, even things from aMoL aren't considered spoilers, though they aren't allowed anywhere else on the forums.

[Diamondmask]

Cool. So Rand is going to break the remaining seals to the DO's prison. Is he going to then fight the DO or reseal it with new seals? Why is Egwene so against this? She seems to be moving against him in this after all her support previously. Why is it so important to collect them because regardless of who has them, they are disintergrating?

 

Did LTT and his 100 companions seal the bore originally with just Saidin? I get confused.

[snooze1128]

Is he going to then fight the DO or reseal it with new seals?

 

We don't really know what Rand's exact plan is, except that he intends to remove the seals that are currently in place. I think he realizes that things won't be pretty if all the seals are suddenly destroyed, and I expect he has some sort of plan to address this issue that we are not yet aware of. "Fighting the DO" seems impossible, as we really don't have any reason to believe that the DO has the ability to take the form of an individual. The best Rand can do in terms of defeating the DO's wishes would be to kill all the foresaken, Shadar Haran (spelling?), and to seal up the bore with new seals.

 

 

Why is Egwene so against this? She seems to be moving against him in this after all her support previously. Why is it so important to collect them because regardless of who has them, they are disintergrating?

 

I think Egwene is just being defiant and arrogant. She thinks she knows everything -- like that removing the seals is a bad idea. I guess I agree with her on that: removal of the seals without a contingency plan is stupid. But just because Rand has yet to reveal his plan, doesn't mean he doesn't have one! In fact, I think Rand anticipates some sort of rebellion from Egwene. He's often short-sighted, but he's not stupid. I think he's totally expecting Egwene to show up to the Fields of Mellinor fully defiant and ready to argue her case.

 

 

Did LTT and his 100 companions seal the bore originally with just Saidin? I get confused.

 

This is where the topic comes full circle. LTT and his buddies only applied Saidin in the initial boring & application of seals because the female Aes Sedai felt his plan was flawed, so they didn't help, and Saidir was not used (turns out they were right...they just didn't know in which way). I think there's a sufficient amount of foreshadowing in the series to indicate that Rand is aware of this previous mistake and that he knows that history must not be allowed to repeat itself in this manner...In other words, he knows he'll specifically need the help of female channelers in his attempt to do what LTT could not. At this point, all signs indicate that Nynave and Moraine (can't wait for the Moraine et al. reunion, by the way!) will be the ones -- in all likelihood, hand-picked by Rand -- to help Rand carry out his plan via Callandor.

[Suttree]

But just because Rand has yet to reveal his plan, doesn't mean he doesn't have one!

 

Except for the fact that he has admitted he has no plan and has asked Min to find the answers for him.

[snooze1128]

But just because Rand has yet to reveal his plan, doesn't mean he doesn't have one!

 

Except for the fact that he has admitted he has no plan and has asked Min to find the answers for him.

 

Haha, very true Sultree. I think at this point (and this has been well documented across the forum boards) Rand is so supremely confident in his Ta'Va'ren abilities (Rand is super confident in his ability to turn spoiled crates of grain into good, tasty grains) that when he asks Min to find the answers for him, he essentially knows she'll come through in accordance with his Ta'Va'ren nature. So does Rand for sure have a plan to follow after the seals are destroyed? No, probably not (at least, not a very good one). But if Rand is now at the point where events will simply occur if he wishes it (he threatened to kill Cadsune if he wished it so), and he in fact knows this to be the case, then he would be warranted in trusting Min to come up with a solution before the Fields of Mellinor debate.

 

A decent analogy: Mat has obviously figured out that he's super lucky, and thus, literally gambles on his own luck. Similarly, it's possible that Rand's discovered the potency of his will and/or ta'va'ren nature, and so, just as Mat is banking on his luck, Rand is banking on his ta'va'ren nature supplying Min with a viable solution.