TFOH: Rand vs Rahvin: How Nynaeve can hit Rahvin with a firewall in Tel'aran'rhiod? I thought you could only channel spirit there.

[Khosann]

OK this is confusing to me.

 

In TFOH we see that Nynaeve cannot channel fire in Tel'aran'rhiod, only spirit.

 

In fact she captures Moghedien in Tel'aran'rhiod by imagining an a'dam around her neck, not by using one power. And she subdues Moghedien by keeping this image of her being captured in her mind firmly --despite Moghedien's attempts to imagine herself being released. She practically defeats Moghedien in a contest of wills!

 

But then Nynaeve uses Moghedien's power to weave a wall of fire and send it to Rahvin. And Rahvin burns!

 

Now I thought you can only channel spirit in Tel'aran'rhiod, even if you are a Forsaken. How this could be?

 

PS: I know that Rahvin and Rand were in Tel'aran'rhiod in flesh, so I suppose they can channel fire, earth and air by being there in flesh but how Nynaeve can channel fire to burn Rahvin? In fact if Nynaeve could channel anything other than spirit why did she not use these to defeat Moghedien without resorting to an imaginary a'dam in the first place?

[Ananta]

I don't think there's any limits to what you can channel in TAR...

 

I mean, they use balefire there, too, and I doubt it's spirit alone...?

[murf2011]

OK this is confusing to me.

 

In TFOH we see that Nynaeve cannot channel fire in Tel'aran'rhiod, only spirit.

 

In fact she captures Moghedien in Tel'aran'rhiod by imagining an a'dam around her neck, not by using one power. And she subdues Moghedien by keeping this image of her being captured in her mind firmly --despite Moghedien's attempts to imagine herself being released. She practically defeats Moghedien in a contest of wills!

 

But then Nynaeve uses Moghedien's power to weave a wall of fire and send it to Rahvin. And Rahvin burns!

 

Now I thought you can only channel spirit in Tel'aran'rhiod, even if you are a Forsaken. How this could be?

 

PS: I know that Rahvin and Rand were in Tel'aran'rhiod in flesh, so I suppose they can channel fire, earth and air by being there in flesh but how Nynaeve can channel fire to burn Rahvin? In fact if Nynaeve could channel anything other than spirit why did she not use these to defeat Moghedien without resorting to an imaginary a'dam in the first place?

 

 

I just went and grabbed my copy of tFoH to find it, and before Nynaeve captured Moghedien, and Moghedien was weaving the One Power to do something to Nynaeve, so I'm assuming that they can use all five elements.

She filled the corridor around him with fire from wall to wall, floor to ceiling, pouring into it all of saidar she held, fire so hot the stone itself smoked.

[Arani Lepenque Aes Sedai]

You are confused. When you are asleep, you can only channel Spirit in the Real World. But you can channel anything in The World of Dreams.

[murf2011]

I don't think there's any limits to what you can channel in TAR...

 

I mean, they use balefire there, too, and I doubt it's spirit alone...?

 

There are limits, as Moghedien let slip while trying to escape.

 

The other woman claimed that being in the World of Dreams physically limited your control of the Dream.

 

P.S sorry guys, i don't know how to reply to both of you in the same post.

[Khosann]

Ok it seems I was confused. Read this quote from the Encyclopedia WOT.

 

"TFoH,Ch54 - Nynaeve uses the amber plaque to enter Tel'aran'rhiod with Siuan who uses the twisted ring. Because the amber plaque brings one only faintly into Tel'aran'rhiod Nynaeve can barely channel."

[Evoke]

While sleeping, Spirit is the only element that can be channeled from your body. All strands of power can be channeled in the dream world.

 

While using the plaque Nynaeve is not as strongly in the World of Dreams as for instance Egwene or in this case Moghedien. Nynaeve draws on Moghedien's strength and presence in TaR in order to channel at Rahvin.

[moratcorlm]

You are confused. When you are asleep, you can only channel Spirit in the Real World. But you can channel anything in The World of Dreams.

This is correct, though whether what happens in TAR is actually "channeling" in the sense of reaching out to the True Source or simply imagining that they do is debatable. I tend to come down on the imaginary side. Rand and Rahvin probably were actually channeling, though, since they were there in the flesh.