A Theory to Answer Two Old Questions

[algspkr]

But he's old and will likely pass on while Moiraine is in the prime of her life - the idea of what will happen in 10 - 15 years makes me sad :(

 

That's the one thing I never understood about wedded Aes Sedai and Warders (a la Nynaeve and Lan) or even Rand and Min.

 

Except that there's an extremely good chance that Moraine will sadly be burned out from her adventures in Finnland, and she will not live a ridiculously long lifetime.  Sure, Thom's still older, but Moraine is probably 40-ish, Thom 65-ish (at the most), happy marriages have been arranged with larger age disparities than that.

 

Moraine is the same age as Suian, and after stilling Suian seemed to be 30 at the oldest.  I believe that had Suian lived a normal non-channeling life afterwards she would have lived an additional 40-50 years.

 

You're right, she's the same age as Siuan.  Keep in mind, that it has been 20 years since New Spring, in which Moraine and Siuan were raised to Aes Sedai.  Before that, the general amount of time a woman spent in training as novice and Accepted was 10 - 15 years.  Now given, I believe it's been mentioned that S&M (yeah, I went there) "graduated" much quicker than others, but considering that most women spark when they're 16-ish, to put them in your age range, they would have had to have "graduated" within three years.  And I'm pretty sure that didn't happen.

 

All that being said as subjectively-gathered evidence, I also present you the fact that in the back of Lord of Chaos, it mentions that Moraine was born in 956 NE.  The current year is 999 NE.  That means she is 43 years old.

 

By the way, the reason Siuan "seemed to be 30-ish" is because she slowed, as does any woman who can channel.  Therefore, even without the oath rod, she still looks younger than her actual age.

 

Chronologically I would say that they are around 42, 20 years as AS, 6 years in training (we know this) and 16ish when they arrived at the Tower, but as you and I pointed out they slowed, so I would say that biologically they are around 30, if not younger as Elayne points out Elin Warrel's (the oldest Accepted) younger sister was at least 40, and yet Nyneave believed Elin to be about her own age.  Assuming that Moiraine remains stilled, and lives to old age she has at least 40 years ahead of her.

[Duskfire]

I think it is past 1000 NE by now...

 

Siuan and Moiraine spent 3 years Novices and 3 more accepted IIRC. sparking at 16 -17, they would have been 22 - 23 when becoming Aes Sedai. And remember Rand's birth in the beginning of New Spring. That is a good scale gor calculation how much time passed between then and now.

 

Why wouldn't have Min recognize Mat in Thom's aura? Remember she also saw seven ruined tower with Lan. If something past will influence future, I think she could see it. Lan is obvious, because of his endless war and his current trip to Tarwin Gap and Malkier and his "Kinginess".

 

And the same apply to Thom. Owayn's fate has been a turn in Thom's destiny

It will probably influence his future action regarding the other Aura, i.e. the White Tower. Moiraine has to give him the name of the sister causing the after-the-aiel-war-vileness.

 

I maintain it is Owayn. I think it is the meaning of the Aura that is related to the future

 

Its actually late spring, early summer in 1000. Which suggests the Final Battle is basically around the corner. A couple of months away.

 

Min doesnt always recognise everyone involved in an aura. For instance, she never saw who the corpse was that Nynaeve was crying over. As for the past influencing the future, its possible I suppose, but RJ was repeatedly asked about the Thom and Lan vision, and he stresses time and time again Min sees only the future. After all, how often does Min see peoples motivations? The only times people argue she does is because of what she saw around Thom and Lan, which suggests to me we just dont know enough about their future to know what they actually mean.

 

And another, Owyn barely channeled. He controlled it for three years, yet he was still found. Him juggling balls of fire doesn't really seem to fit what we know of the character. Yet it does fit Mat. Perfectly actually, considering how often juggling has been linked with Mat constantly. He is the only character, except for Thom, who can be said to juggle heaps.

[Demiandre]

and he stresses time and time again Min sees only the future

 

Let's have a short look at a quote :

 

Zaela: Are Min's visions about the past or the future?

RJ: They are about the future

 

They are not the future, they are about the future.

 

And that's true. Thom and Mat are known for jugglers. But why fire? And why Mat? Why not ALudra, who used fireworks for gunpowder, who discovered matches, and so on?

 

All of it seems weird for me...

[Sharaman]

Why not the Third Man (whoever that is) juggling fire?

Min wouldn't recognise him and he is presumably connected to Thom's thread.

Thom taught Mat to juggle. If required, he could teach whoever else is going into ToG to juggle as well.

The fire presumably because the Finns are scared of it. 

[Duskfire]

Why not the Third Man (whoever that is) juggling fire?

Min wouldn't recognise him and he is presumably connected to Thom's thread.

Thom taught Mat to juggle. If required, he could teach whoever else is going into ToG to juggle as well.

The fire presumably because the Finns are scared of it. 

 

Well it wouldnt be a huge stretch to suggest that Noal probably knows how to juggle already, with how quick his hands are and his general skill level  :P

 

And that's true. Thom and Mat are known for jugglers. But why fire? And why Mat? Why not ALudra, who used fireworks for gunpowder, who discovered matches, and so on?

 

Well fire will be used to some extent in the Tower of Ghenjei. Then we have Egwenes dream of Mat

 

...Mat watches Illuminator's fireworks. He grabs one out of the air and arrows of fire shoot from his fist. Men will die because of this...

 

So thats another link between Mat and fire.

[Demiandre]

I thought this dream refered to Mat's use of Aludra's knowledhe to create the Dragons...

 

Noal is a good possibily, and I see that fire make sense for the link with the ToG and the Finns restrictions. But then we are not sure the Viewing is related to ToG...

[Dragon40k]

To prevent Thom from dying of old age Moraine could bond him.  It seems to have worked for some of the older warders. I've always gotten the impression a warder will not die of old age. 

She will be in need of a warder since her bond with Lan was broken.  He is handy in a fight and is just as well versed in the Great Game as she is.  They'd be a perfect match.

[Duskfire]

To prevent Thom from dying of old age Moraine could bond him.  It seems to have worked for some of the older warders. I've always gotten the impression a warder will not die of old age. 

She will be in need of a warder since her bond with Lan was broken.  He is handy in a fight and is just as well versed in the Great Game as she is.  They'd be a perfect match.

 

Welcome to Dragonmount!

 

Anyhow, Warders have the same lifespan as everyone else, they don't get the slowed process like Aes Sedai. However, Warders are more likely to be healthier in old age due to their increased endurance and strength and whatnot.

[DocBean]

all this talk about Mat juggling makes me picture their rescue of Moraine.

 

Thom will be playing some music to dazzle them.

{circus music in my head}

 

Mat will be using Aludra's fire sticks and juggling them. Fire to blind maybe?

so at this point they're like dancing Cobras coming out of a basket in India.

and Mat and Thom are realling putting on a nice show.

The Aelfinn are dancing back and forth to the music, but too blind to do anything about it, like the Cobras in the baskets.

 

Meanwhile that old geezer is sneeking Moiraine out the back (and some other captives! why not?!)

They keep running through doorways in a hallway, popping out of another one in the same hallway every time.

meanwhile throwing the Foxes off who are making the same mistakes.

This goes on for a good 10 minutes or so.

then they lock the Tower door behind themselves with an Iron dagger.

Iron to bind, because the Bronze one will only open the Tower. Turns out you need Iron to close it.

 

 

just sounds like a really bad 3-Stooges comedy scene.

 

 

[algspkr]

all this talk about Mat juggling makes me picture their rescue of Moraine.

 

Thom will be playing some music to dazzle them.

{circus music in my head}

 

Mat will be using Aludra's fire sticks and juggling them. Fire to blind maybe?

so at this point they're like dancing Cobras coming out of a basket in India.

and Mat and Thom are realling putting on a nice show.

The Aelfinn are dancing back and forth to the music, but too blind to do anything about it, like the Cobras in the baskets.

 

Meanwhile that old geezer is sneeking Moiraine out the back (and some other captives! why not?!)

They keep running through doorways in a hallway, popping out of another one in the same hallway every time.

meanwhile throwing the Foxes off who are making the same mistakes.

This goes on for a good 10 minutes or so.

then they lock the Tower door behind themselves with an Iron dagger.

Iron to bind, because the Bronze one will only open the Tower. Turns out you need Iron to close it.

 

 

just sounds like a really bad 3-Stooges comedy scene.

 

 

 

Especially that part where Mat is juggling matches.