Would someone mind summing up Elayne's part of KoD for me?

[Arkelias]

I'm nearly done with Knife of Dreams, but I'd rather stab myself in the eye with a pen than suffer through one more chapter with Elayne in it.  Even though she is surrounded by people who can delve her they all treat her like porcelain, and every other paragraph is about her pregnancy.  Correct me if I'm wrong but based on the timeline she's in her first trimester.  Why all the fuss?

 

Anyway, my point is that I can't handle reading these chapters.  Would someone who has read them recently either mind summing up for me what happens for her by the end of the book or point me in the direction of an online resource that can?

 

Thanks!  You guys rock!

[Red Hand Man]

To sum up Elayne in KoD very briefly:

 

She's having Charlz watched and followed.

The Kin are used for troop movements within and around the city and the Windfinders to transport grain from Tear to Andor.

They finally figure out where Charlz goes at night, two Black Ajah sisters are there.  She links with Sareitha and Vandene links with Careane and they attempt to surprise the two BA sisters.  There are other BA sisters there that they didn't know about.  Careane is exposed as BA, Vandene stabs the crap out of her and the BA sisters kill Vandene and Sareitha.  All of the warders that came with them (except Brigitte) go nuts and move in (they are all killed).  Brigitte essentially forces the Windfinders to help out in a fight to get Elayne back as she is leaving the city.  This all happens as Caemelyn gets an all out attack from the her opponent for the throne (don't remember the name).  She grants the Lords and Ladies of the high houses safe entrance to Caemelyn and convinces them to submit to her as queen.  Elayne is recognized as the queen.

 

As an aside, if she has been pregnant for about 3 months in book time this would equate to more time in our timescale (1 week = 10 days, I think).

 

Hope this helps.

 

[Arkelias]

Thanks!  That was perfect =)

[mb]

Here is how the Encyclopaedia site summarizes her Knife of Dreams involvement::

# Elayne, Birgitte and Aviendha lead the defense against one of Arymilla's sorties against the New City wall. (KoD,Ch13)

# Elayne, Birgitte and Aviendha return to the Royal Palace. On the way to her apartments Elayne deals with the captured sul'dam and damane and the Windfinders. (KoD,Ch14)

# In Elayne's rooms, Aviendha demonstrates a Talent of identifying ter'angreal. Dorindha and Nadere arrive with orders for Aviendha to come with them; the Aiel are leaving Caemlyn. Elayne gives Aviendha the amber turtle and the twisted ring to take with her. (KoD,Ch15)

# Elayne and Birgitte meet with the mercenaries. Elayne turns down their demand for more money. (KoD,Ch16)

# Elayne and Birgitte meet with Dyelin in the Map Room. Dyelin reports that the six High Seats camped to the south are still neutral. Vandene reports that several of the Kin were murdered. (KoD,Ch17)

# Elayne has an uncordial audience with Duhara, sent by Elaida to be her advisor. (KoD,Ch31)

# Elayne and Birgitte plan a raid on the Black Ajah house. Elayne is captured when more Black Ajah sisters unexpectedly appear. (KoD,Ch31)

# The Black sisters bundle Elayne into a wagon and head out of town but Birgitte organizes a rescue party with the Windfinders and cuts them off. Birgitte sends Dyelin to hold off Arymilla's attack on the Far Madding Gate. (KoD,Ch32)

# After her rescue, Elayne and Birgitte attack Arymilla's army from the rear while Dyelin's force attacks from the front. They capture Arymilla and the others. (KoD,Ch33)

# Elayne holds an audience with High Seats Abelle, Aemlyn, Arathelle, Ellorien, Luan and Pelivar. When Dyelin tells them she has published her support for Elayne, all but Ellorien acquiesce and throw in their support as well. (KoD,Ch35)

 

Here is the page:

http://encyclopaedia-wot.org/characters/e/elayne.html

 

[Arkelias]

Thanks MB!

[Arath Faringal]

To sum it up even quicker:

 

Change clothes.

I hate Rand al'Thor for knocking me up!

Change clothes.

I am invincible!

Complain about pregnancy and then change clothes.

Oww!  Stun gun!

Charge!

Ooooo ... I'm queen! ... I should probably change my clothes ...

 

 

[Arkelias]

To that I can only say LMAO!!!  That was eerily accurate Arath.

[Charlz Guybon]

To sum up Elayne in KoD very briefly:

 

She's having Charlz watched and followed.

The Kin are used for troop movements within and around the city and the Windfinders to transport grain from Tear to Andor.

They finally figure out where Charlz goes at night, two Black Ajah sisters are there.  She links with Sareitha and Vandene links with Careane and they attempt to surprise the two BA sisters.  There are other BA sisters there that they didn't know about.  Careane is exposed as BA,

 

I wasn't being followed, that was Hanlon.

 

I loved Elayne's storyline in this book. I'm a big fan of politics and there was plenty of action.

[Arkelias]

I love politics ala George R.R. Martin or Michael Stackpole.  Too few of Jordan's characters are likable for me to really enjoy how he tackles politics.  When you want both sides to die its hard to be empathetic.  The only down side to Elayne being burnt to a cinder, for example, is that you couldn't kill her again because she was already dead.

[Arath Faringal]

The only down side to Elayne being burnt to a cinder, for example, is that you couldn't kill her again because she was already dead.

 

Well ... that's not quite true in WoT.  Simply have an unliked minion do the killing, balefire the minion, then do it all over again!

 

The victim wouldn't remember dying every time, but you'd still get the satisfaction of seeing it over and over again.

[Arkelias]

Arath, you are a man of rare genius.

[Charlz Guybon]

I love politics ala George R.R. Martin or Michael Stackpole.  Too few of Jordan's characters are likable for me to really enjoy how he tackles politics.  When you want both sides to die its hard to be empathetic.  The only down side to Elayne being burnt to a cinder, for example, is that you couldn't kill her again because she was already dead.

 

While I like Elayne, I don't see why characters have to be likable for one to enjoy reading about them. I find almost none of G.R.R. Martin's characters likable but I certainly enjoy reading about them.

 

 

[dholm]

I honestly don't see why people have so much against Elayne.

[Arkelias]

I love politics ala George R.R. Martin or Michael Stackpole.  Too few of Jordan's characters are likable for me to really enjoy how he tackles politics.  When you want both sides to die its hard to be empathetic.  The only down side to Elayne being burnt to a cinder, for example, is that you couldn't kill her again because she was already dead.

 

While I like Elayne, I don't see why characters have to be likable for one to enjoy reading about them. I find almost none of G.R.R. Martin's characters likable but I certainly enjoy reading about them.

 

 

 

Let me rephrase that.  The characters don't have to be likable, but they do have to be compelling.  I may not like Jaime Lannister, but I understand his motivations and his role in the conflict he's involved in.  I care, because I want to see whether or not the Lannisters or the Starks triumph.

 

Imagine if Martin suddenly stopped telling you about Tyrion, Jon Snow and Arya and started telling you about some random magisters and what they were doing.  You have no investment in these characters so you care less about them.  All the magic he's built over previous books is lost, because we haven't spent time in these characters heads like we have Jon and Arya.

 

The same holds true for Jordan.  The reader doesn't care about Elenia or her struggle for the Lion Throne, because we haven't spent time learning her likes and dislikes, or about her motivations.  We don't care what happens to her.  She exists as a foil for Elayne, and its obvious to the reader.

 

What we do care about is Tarmon Gaidon and the Edmonds Field crew.  Some of the new editions like Elayne or Faile may draw reader empathy, because we've learned who they are through the course of the series.  But we must also care about the conflict they are involved in, and there must be tension for it to matter.

 

If we believed for a minute that Elayne might not get the throne most readers would be much more interested in her storyline.  But we all know right off the bat that she's going to get it.  When we're shown the story from her enemies point of view we don't get the sense that they are competent schemers with a chance at the throne.  They come across as idiots destined to fail and that's exactly what happens.

 

Martin kills characters off by the score.  Jordan recycles forsaken, but no one else dies...not even Moraine.  For political intrigue to work you need risk.  I need to worry that Elayne could die, or at the very least not get the throne.  I don't so there's this disconnect that prevents me from getting fully invested.

 

Jordan ROCKS at action adventure.  Jordan's attempts at intrigue can be used as a sleeping aid.  At least, in my opinion.

[Mr. Micawber]

Imagine if Martin suddenly stopped telling you about Tyrion, Jon Snow and Arya and started telling you about some random magisters and what they were doing.  You have no investment in these characters so you care less about them.  All the magic he's built over previous books is lost, because we haven't spent time in these characters heads like we have Jon and Arya.

 

Unlike RJ, he has traditionally reserved this treatment for the prologues. Which is probably why I always prefer his prologues, since they're actually, y'know, prologues - like the ones for TEOTW and TGH were.

 

Now, I think one of the reasons AFFC was less well received than the other three books, is that GRRM actually *did* do this, with the chapters on the Iron Born and the Dornish.

 

That, and the two most popular POV characters are probably Tyrion and Jon, and Davos is considered rightly a really good one too, and they didn't have any of the POVs.

[Arkelias]

Right Mic, that's exactly why the fourth book had so much criticism.  You can't make people care about characters, and then take them away to replace them with characters don't care about.  I like Sam in that series, but I'd rather have Jon Snow.

 

In RJs work Rand is given less and less page time in each successive book.  In some he's not really in them at all.  I'm hoping Martin realizes his mistake and book five goes back in the direction people loved.  If not it threatens to go askew just like the later books in the WoT did =/

[WWWwombat]

GRRM is the has made me so pissed off at him when reading him and that is why he is brilliant.  He is ruthless.  I remember raging pretty hardcore after the Oberyn vs. Gregor duel.  Also, the first half of AFFC was a real struggle for me.  I just found all of the story arcs boring until near the end.  My favorite characters were the Starks.  Can't wait 'til Bran, Sansa and Arya start pwning shit up.

[WWWwombat]

Right Mic, that's exactly why the fourth book had so much criticism.  You can't make people care about characters, and then take them away to replace them with characters don't care about.  I like Sam in that series, but I'd rather have Jon Snow.

 

In RJs work Rand is given less and less page time in each successive book.  In some he's not really in them at all.  I'm hoping Martin realizes his mistake and book five goes back in the direction people loved.  If not it threatens to go askew just like the later books in the WoT did =/

 

But people start liking Rand less and less :)  I think it's pretty cool character development and that he was setting Rand up for some uber pwnage in terms of character as well as plot.  The only book I actually found the lack of Rand disturbing in was CoT.  I mainly found CoT disturbing because it felt like it didn't move forward at all.  It stepped back to before the cleansing and didn't even give us a definite answer on the state of the taint and not too much exciting stuff happened.  I think that was a run-on but I don't care because man did I not like CoT.

[Arkelias]

CoT is the leading cause of suicide among geeks.  It is also used as a form of torture by Homeland Security.  They use the audio version to break prisoners I hear.

 

Yeah, Rand is less likable which is another problem I have with the series.  I know people have painted it like 'art', but the fact is people want protagonists we can empathize with.  I miss the old Rand =(

[Rand Skywalker]

I find chapters from the POV of the original 8 from Emond's Field (except Egwene, who does not feel as authentic, likable, or relateable to me) the most-compelling and I look forward to reading them the most.  If the chapter is not from their POV but still directly concerns them (some of the Elayne chapters with Ny in TSR, for instance) then that qualifies too.

 

Another problem with an exponentially expanding cast is that characters you love (Thom, Juilan, Uno, Aglemar, Verin, Hurin, Basel Gill, etc) and love to hate (Fain, Slayer, various Forsaken) are necessarily spread thin, even missing or barely given a mention for sometimes thousands of pages.  

 

One thing I noticed about Elayne's chapters in CoT, and KoD during my last reread was that they basically follow the same pattern.

 

   1.  Elayne tries to get support for the throne

   2.  She faces trouble with Aes Sedai

   3.  She faces trouble with Windfinders

   4.  She faces trouble with Wise Ones

   5.  She faces trouble with Mellar.

   6.  Takes a bath or gets out of wet clothes with Avi

 

All of this is interspersed with ruminations on her Warder bond with Birgitte, inability to channel smoothly, wildly erratic emotions, frustrations with Rand for her pregnancy (which no one I know does without a heavy dose of playful banter), and her "support-feminism" Queen's Guard.  

 

Another thing that I found distracting was how it states multiple times how you should treat your servants with respect or even deferrance or they will make life hell for you.  I was shocked how many times this was stated over the course of Elayne and Egwene's chapters.  We get it!

 

On the other hand, I love these books and read every word closely (no skimming), it's just that I didn't fall in love with them based on what we get in these chapters.  

 

My favorite part of Elayne's taking the throne chapters is Mellar--scenes with him always seem more interesting to me.

 

[WWWwombat]

I still like Rand a lot.  I give him a lot of latitude because he is kind of insane and he was always a woolhead.  Whatever Cadsuane and Sorilea do is going to be huge.  Maybe that and his love interests will finally bring Rand some sense of balance or peace.  Moiraine coming back could also help a lot.  I'm excited for Rand's character development in the last few books.

[Rand Skywalker]

As to CoT, what I could not believe (even more than the lack of Rand) when I first read it was that we got no payoff from the Cleansing at all, really.  I was really waiting for such a big event to have a correspondingly large impact and turn things on heads.  

 

What I miss about the "old Rand" is just more chapters about him!

[Rand Skywalker]

I still like Rand a lot.  I give him a lot of latitude because he is kind of insane and he was always a woolhead.  Whatever Cadsuane and Sorilea do is going to be huge.  Maybe that and his love interests will finally bring Rand some sense of balance or peace.  Moiraine coming back could also help a lot.  I'm excited for Rand's character development in the last few books.

 

Nothing Cadsuane has done seems to me to be helpful to Rand, more like she's doing her darndest to get him to pay homage to her personal shrine, but I suppose that is for a different topic. . .

[WWWwombat]

I still like Rand a lot.  I give him a lot of latitude because he is kind of insane and he was always a woolhead.  Whatever Cadsuane and Sorilea do is going to be huge.  Maybe that and his love interests will finally bring Rand some sense of balance or peace.  Moiraine coming back could also help a lot.  I'm excited for Rand's character development in the last few books.

 

Nothing Cadsuane has done seems to me to be helpful to Rand, more like she's doing her darndest to get him to pay homage to her personal shrine, but I suppose that is for a different topic. . .

 

I agree with Cadsuane that Rand needs to be taken down a peg.  Her Aes Sedai arrogance is annoying, but what can you expect from a legendary Aes Sedai.  I think the water oath she made with Sorilea is a very good sign though.  Also, Rand and Moiraine had a nice rapport towards the end and I'm hoping for a continuation of that.

[Rand Skywalker]

I still like Rand a lot.  I give him a lot of latitude because he is kind of insane and he was always a woolhead.  Whatever Cadsuane and Sorilea do is going to be huge.  Maybe that and his love interests will finally bring Rand some sense of balance or peace.  Moiraine coming back could also help a lot.  I'm excited for Rand's character development in the last few books.

 

Nothing Cadsuane has done seems to me to be helpful to Rand, more like she's doing her darndest to get him to pay homage to her personal shrine, but I suppose that is for a different topic. . .

 

I agree with Cadsuane that Rand needs to be taken down a peg.  Her Aes Sedai arrogance is annoying, but what can you expect from a legendary Aes Sedai.  I think the water oath she made with Sorilea is a very good sign though.  Also, Rand and Moiraine had a nice rapport towarss the end and I'm hoping for a continuation of that.

 

Agree.  I much prefered Moiraine as his counsellor.  While Rand certainly needs help (anyone in his position would), I disagree with Cadsuane's methods.  You don't teach someone to respect and be compassionate to others by showing them disrespect, sarcasm, and cruelty, all of which Cadsuane has done to Rand.  Contrast this with Moiraine.  She treated Rand with dignity, although (mistakenly) believing that she know best.  However, Moiraine went though a terrific character development arc (that included humbling herself) in how she learned to effectively influence Rand.