Question on Gateways

[Jarred Darque]

ok, here is a phsysics problem with this. in a vertical alignment of gateways, gravity WILL act on the object. Now, we consider gravity to be a constant, 9.81 m/s^2 or 32.1 ft/s^2 I prefer the first just cause I realize that the metric system makes alot more sense, anyways, In reality, gravity is not truelly constant. it decreases the higher in elevation you go up, and changes in a small amount with teh amount of land/water mass underneath you and the density of this mass

 

so, if you place two gateways 1 inch or 1 mile apart vertically, you will have a differance in gravitational force, everyone with me?

 

the force will be higher with the lower elevation, or the enterance gateway we will call it (the lower one)

 

now, reason says that the gravitational force will act on whatever part of the object is in the physical realm, i.e. the part still not through the gateway and the part already out of the gateway.

 

Well, since the gravitational field on the lower gateway wil lbe stronger, then the force acting on the ovject (hamster, cannonball, whatever) is greater than that of the object leaving the exit gateway. so thus the object will continue to accelerate THROUGH the gateway, as the part of the object still entering the exit gateway is being pulled with more force to accelerate with and will push the part that is leaving the enterance gateway which has less force.

 

 

Another thing you must remember, the gateway MUST have more distance between it than the length of the object i nteh direction it is traveling, otherwise it will try to occupy the same space at the same time with itself, gravity alone would pull this apart...and I dont WANT to know the consequences

 

basically, if you have a 12 inch diameter cannonball, and a 1 inch gap between gateways, as the ball enters the gateway, one inch above that gateway will be the exit, so then 11 inches of the ball will be above that trying to go THROUGH the exit gateway...I dont think things can go through the back side of a gateway (I am only on book 8 atm, so perhaps more is divulged on this subject in the next 3 books). this alone would cauzse disaster perhaps... and then lets suppose you used two persons to create two seperate gateways to avoid this...

 

now you have the gateways 1 inch apart with the process started. so lets say the ball has left the exit gateway. which means 11 inches is throguh the enterance gateway and out the exit gateway. well (you really need to draw this or be good at picturing in your head) 11 inches will be below the exit, but only 1 inch of room, which the trailing inch of the ball already occupies, but after an inch, that 11 inches will be through the enternace gateway, and through teh exit, thus you have 10 inches through the exit for a second time around, you will have this dang ball tryin to occupy the same space 12 times over when allis said and done. I have no idea what the consequences of this are, but they cannot be good.

[Roxinos]

That's something I hadn't thought on. Thank you for brining it up.

 

Now I'm just.... Lost for words.

[Jonn]

ok, here is a phsysics problem with this. in a vertical alignment of gateways, gravity WILL act on the object. Now, we consider gravity to be a constant, 9.81 m/s^2 or 32.1 ft/s^2 I prefer the first just cause I realize that the metric system makes alot more sense, anyways, In reality, gravity is not truelly constant. it decreases the higher in elevation you go up, and changes in a small amount with teh amount of land/water mass underneath you and the density of this mass

 

so, if you place two gateways 1 inch or 1 mile apart vertically, you will have a differance in gravitational force, everyone with me?

 

the force will be higher with the lower elevation, or the enterance gateway we will call it (the lower one)

 

now, reason says that the gravitational force will act on whatever part of the object is in the physical realm, i.e. the part still not through the gateway and the part already out of the gateway.

 

Well, since the gravitational field on the lower gateway wil lbe stronger, then the force acting on the ovject (hamster, cannonball, whatever) is greater than that of the object leaving the exit gateway. so thus the object will continue to accelerate THROUGH the gateway, as the part of the object still entering the exit gateway is being pulled with more force to accelerate with and will push the part that is leaving the enterance gateway which has less force.

 

 

Another thing you must remember, the gateway MUST have more distance between it than the length of the object i nteh direction it is traveling, otherwise it will try to occupy the same space at the same time with itself, gravity alone would pull this apart...and I dont WANT to know the consequences

 

basically, if you have a 12 inch diameter cannonball, and a 1 inch gap between gateways, as the ball enters the gateway, one inch above that gateway will be the exit, so then 11 inches of the ball will be above that trying to go THROUGH the exit gateway...I dont think things can go through the back side of a gateway (I am only on book 8 atm, so perhaps more is divulged on this subject in the next 3 books). this alone would cauzse disaster perhaps... and then lets suppose you used two persons to create two seperate gateways to avoid this...

 

now you have the gateways 1 inch apart with the process started. so lets say the ball has left the exit gateway. which means 11 inches is throguh the enterance gateway and out the exit gateway. well (you really need to draw this or be good at picturing in your head) 11 inches will be below the exit, but only 1 inch of room, which the trailing inch of the ball already occupies, but after an inch, that 11 inches will be through the enternace gateway, and through teh exit, thus you have 10 inches through the exit for a second time around, you will have this dang ball tryin to occupy the same space 12 times over when allis said and done. I have no idea what the consequences of this are, but they cannot be good.

 

That's EXACTLY what I was trying to get to. Well done!

I was thinking of the object occupying the same space, just didn't have the words to explain it.

 

I think you're onto something. The atoms would probably be smashed together rather unnaturally! How exciting!

The pressure would be immense, with nothing to do but to probably have the atoms split and fly apart in a huge explosion.

 

What fun!

 

Wonderful connection Jarred.

[Jarred Darque]

thanks, now I can say that the tens of thousands of dollars I am spending to go to school for engineering are doing something for once!

[Graendals favourite]

Perhaps I should point out that actually, since the bringing of the gateways closer will have to be done in a continuous fashion, bringing the ends of the cannon ball together amounts to pushing two cannon balls together. To bring the gateways closer than the balls diametre means an effort put into it that flattens the cannon ball, as though squeezed by the walls symmetrically. Here it is the two sides of the ball pushing each other.

 

An effort to understand atom-atom interactions requires a quantum mechanical approach, since classical physics fails in this, you cannot describe the metallic structure in classical terms for instance, classical physics doesn't understand metals. What this amounts to in a cannon ball, the atoms will move from their original positions so as not to be forced into a higher energy state. This would result from no two fermions being allowed in the same quantum mechanical state. The end result is an increasingly oval shape for the cannon ball.

 

Cuendillar is a difficult thing, since physics doesn't understand it at all. It is probably something like diamonds, a very rigid structure, that for some reason requires infinite energy to mould. An infinitely deep potential well for the atoms, then. Since the atoms are allowed no other states than those which they occupy, the drawing the gateways closer would require infinite amounts of the One Power, and is thus not possible. The gateways will not move.

 

Occupying the same place with itself is in itself not especially dramatic, in the quantum mechanical picture, but it will result in an higher energy state than the simple reallignement of the atoms. The reallignement will take energy, since some of the energy will be tranfsformed into heat, but like kicking a ball uphill, it will bend downwards rather than try to climb in a straight line.

[NEisberg]

alright so going by what u all just said...i think that if we could use the OP...we would have put an end to any energy crisis ever created....

[irriadal]

alright so going by what u all just said...i think that if we could use the OP...we would have put an end to any energy crisis ever created....

Not to mention a terroist could cycle a hampster through a gateway several million times then drop it in New York City, obliterating it.

 

All your physics talk has been getting me confused, so maybe im not understanding something about gateways.

Gateways are like windows right? You go through them into somewhere else, so why does it matter how close the entrance, exit are?

 

 

G= Land Mass

E= Entrance

X= Exit

H= Hampster

Numbers = Snapshots over time.

1. 2. 3. 4. 5.

X X X X X

H

H H

H H

E E E E E

G G G G G

 

So each time the hampster goes through it acelerates?

It would at some point reach 99.99999...% the speed of light?

So its prepetual energy?

A simple yes/no would be better then a paragraph, unless im misunderstanding gateways.

[Slothman]

From my perspective, i always saw gateways instead of transporting you at high speed they are infact 2 distinct gates into one of the "other worlds" seen in the portal stones, but a world so small that every point in the universe is the same location. The initial gate would open to that world, and then another would open from that world back to randland but in a new location, because all points in this "other world" are the same, you would not notice that you are passing through the other world.

 

The 2 portals would be infinitely close to eachother (as every part of the world is the same place) so you would effectively see in one portal and out of the 2nd, without seeing where the 2 meet inside the other world. there wouldnt be any acceleration to move your particles over a great distance instantaniously (and consequently deceleratig the particles at high speed at the new location, as you are moving to the same place in another dimension, its just that the place in the other dimension is also the place you want to be so you just step through.

 

ok that may sound confusing to you but it makes sense to me so ner :P

[Jonn]

alright so going by what u all just said...i think that if we could use the OP...we would have put an end to any energy crisis ever created....

Not to mention a terroist could cycle a hampster through a gateway several million times then drop it in New York City' date=' obliterating it.

 

All your physics talk has been getting me confused, so maybe im not understanding something about gateways.

Gateways are like windows right? You go through them into somewhere else, so why does it matter how close the entrance, exit are?

 

 

G= Land Mass

E= Entrance

X= Exit

H= Hampster

Numbers = Snapshots over time.

1. 2. 3. 4. 5.

X X X X X

H

H H

H H

E E E E E

G G G G G

 

So each time the hampster goes through it acelerates?

It would at some point reach 99.99999...% the speed of light?

So its prepetual energy?

A simple yes/no would be better then a paragraph, unless im misunderstanding gateways.[/quote']

 

Yes, but it depends.

 

That's the short answer.

 

Energy cannot be created or destroyed according to common scientific doctrines. Energy can only be transformed. So the term "perpetual energy" is kind of redundant. Energy spreads out, dissipates, or amasses, depending on the conditions.

 

Using a gateway you can create a seemingly endless loop of motion and momentum. Depending on even further conditions, yes, I am sure you can create what you term perpetual energy.

 

Here's the kick though...If you have the ability to create what is essentially a stable wormhole, I'm pretty certain that there would be far more direct ways to create generating conditions than to use gateways and hampsters.

 

If you can create a wormhole, with applied knowledge you could probably syphon energy from the sun if you wanted...or some other sun far away with no living planets. Heck , you might be able to make your own sun...Possibil;ites are quite endless, only the knowledge would be needed to execute.