Cadsuane and Nynaeve

[Luckers]

Ok, so more and more parallels are being drawn between Cadsuane and Nynaeve. The fact that they are more powerful then other Aes Sedai. The fact that they don't identify inherently with the Tower, and choose actions that at times are in direct conflict with futhering the Aes Sedai agenda (gaining power). They are both relatively impatient, blunt and unforgiving. The ter'angreals. Cadsuane herself remarks how much Nynaeve reminds her of herself when she was young, before her stay in the Black Hills, and on how she needs to learn the same lessons she herself learnt there.

 

What is suspect is that Nynaeve is being built up to become the next Cadsuane. Concider that Egwene and Elayne have both grown as characters, as well as having their own roles to undertake... but Nynaeve didn't. More and more she is becoming the wandering Aes Sedai that sets herself to random tasks0--by which i mean she has no set role.

 

Under the influence of Cadsuane she has actually begun to calm down as well, and grow as a person... she hasn't done much of that yet, but i suspect that is what she will end up. A Cadsuane-like figure.

 

Sadly, i suspect that what will finalize this is Lan's death... but who knows.

[Guest Majsju]

I've been thinking along the same lines, and more or less agree.

 

Though I think there's a small chance that after Lan's death she'll go into a self-imposed exile, and return to the Two Rivers. She's basically the only main character who'll be able to do so. If they survive, Mat is off to Seanchan, either the continent or the occupiers on this side of the ocean. Perrin is off to Saldea. Egwene will most likely be the Amyrlin of a reunited WT. And Rand will be dead.

 

I just feel it would tie in nicely to have one of them return, and Nynaeve is best suited for the job. With Lan dead, she doesn't have any strings to the outside world, except for her friends, and thanks to Travelling the occasional visit is quite easy.

[mightisright]

Call me crazy but rj's refusal to kill off any many characters so far (even evil ones go down few and far between) make me suspect that the ending is going to have a few less deaths then some expect. Yes yes we have the savior thing going on but I really doubt we are gonna see many people die beside Rand - if him.

 

I agree with you about Nynaeve.

[Hoop Snake]

Though I think there's a small chance that after Lan's death she'll go into a self-imposed exile

But then Lan is going to die on the day that he learns of Nynaeve's death, so that would suggest that if anybody is going to do the dieing, it would be Nynaeve. :P

[Luckers]

Maj, that seems possible. Though what i think may happen is that Lan will die, and Nynaeve will go on till the Last Battle is over, and we will see the change in her happen then. Then i suspect the very last scene of the very last book will be Nynaeve in the Two Rivers reflecting on what's yet to be done and the like. That image strikes me as very powerful, and seems like it could be something RJ has been imagining for some time now.

[Inara]

lan will die first, but that is because Nyneave is AS, and will therefore live hundreds of years, i cant see her joining the kin, so yes, i believe her exile will be to the two rivers. perrin will not be going to saldea, he has a manor to go home to, he is lord of the two rivers etc remember, which i am sure elayne will make official after TG.

there will be lots of mini-perrins- who will play with the mini-lans....

life will be quiet and beautiful

[Luckers]

Excepting that Perrin will wear the Broken Crown... we know that. That means he will be King of Saldaea.

[Inara]

oh yes?

i didnt know it was called that...missed that memo

poor tenobia

[mightisright]

I imagine that the broken crown does refer to the crown of Saldea, but we really don't know for sure. It could be something else. Not for sure what exactly but hey he has never come out and said it directly has he?

[Kadere]

I think he's made that quite clear actually. Faile is the cousin of Tenobia, Tenobia could easily die in the Last Battle, Faile becomes queen, Perrin becomes King. I think it's pretty straight forward. There really isn't any other "broken crown" that has anything to do with Perrin except for watching Colavaere's crown "break" and reforge in ACoS, and that really had nothing to do with him.

[Guest cwestervelt]

Davram Bashere actually mentions the Broken Crown during his first meeting with Perrin. He is suspicious that Perrin is marrying for money.

 

I suppose Zarine told you all about my estates before you...married her. All about the Broken Crown. She was always talkative as a girl.

Lord of Chaos Chapter 46: "Beyond the Gate"

[Guest cwestervelt]

I think he's made that quite clear actually. Faile is the cousin of Tenobia' date=' Tenobia could easily die in the Last Battle, Faile becomes queen, Perrin becomes King. I think it's pretty straight forward. There really isn't any other "broken crown" that has anything to do with Perrin except for watching Colavaere's crown "break" and reforge in ACoS, and that really had nothing to do with him.[/quote']

 

Perrin can never be King of Saldea. While Faile can become Queen if Tenobia dies without an heir, that would make Perrin the Prince Consort. Marrying a female heir to a throne does not make you an heir.

[Kadere]

.....ok, Perrin becoming "King" wasn't really my point, the point was that he has a connection to the Broken Crown which fits very well with the viewing, it seems to be the only connection to any "broken crown" in his future.

[Luckers]

Perrin can never be King of Saldea. While Faile can become Queen if Tenobia dies without an heir, that would make Perrin the Prince Consort. Marrying a female heir to a throne does not make you an heir.

 

Well thats not nessasarily true. We know that in some borderlander nations the king or queens spouse becomes king or queen.

[TaeaDawn]

I think no matter how you look at it.. him being King or his wife being Queen... Faile is not about to rule Saldea from the Two Rivers and Perrin isn't going anywhere without her... so I don't see him going back to the Two Rivers.

 

They have been set up nicely to have a Lord though so I'm not sure what will happen there.

 

[Luckers]

With travelling back in the game you never know... though im not sure what type of channeler will exist just to transport Perrin back and forth...

[Llewin]

How can the broken crown (something refering to Bashere's family history) have anything to do with the current monarch's crown in Saldaea?...

 

I'm pretty sure it refers to Bashere's family being monarchs of a kingdom which died at some point in the past... war of 100 years perhaps.

[Guest Majsju]

How can the broken crown (something refering to Bashere's family history) have anything to do with the current monarch's crown in Saldaea?...

 

I'm pretty sure it refers to Bashere's family being monarchs of a kingdom which died at some point in the past... war of 100 years perhaps.

 

Uhm, perhaps the little fact that Davram Bashere is next in line for the throne...If Tenobia dies, Bashere becomes king of saldea, and thus gets the Broken Crown. When he dies, Faile gets it.

 

Why would Bashere even mention the Broken Crown if it had been something in his familiy's past? He talks about what perrin can gain from marrying Faile, something cool 100 years ago is not exactly a great profit. Marrying someone who's only two heart attacks away from the throne on the other hand...

[kittydesmond]

I am changing the subject a bit right after I say I do think that perrin will go back to the two rivers. He wants no part of ruling and his wife constantly sees him as a general or lord not a "king".

 

Then about Nynaeve, I believe Malkier will be restored and Lan will rule with his wife by his side...this is just MY opinion based on the AS test in the rings... I may be wrong but it is my own perception.

[Hoop Snake]

Then about Nynaeve, I believe Malkier will be restored and Lan will rule with his wife by his side...this is just MY opinion based on the AS test in the rings... I may be wrong but it is my own perception.

I don't think that means much, Egwene is hardly going to end up married to Rand with a daughter named Joia, are they? :P Despite that, if we get many happy endings I think Malkier will have one.

[Minnea]

The Accepted's test is for "what was" "what is" and "what will be" - or something like that.

 

If I remember correctly Nynaeve's scene of being Queen of Malkier was "what will be", Egwene's "what will be" was being Amyrlin and almost executed.

 

The scene for Egwene as Rand's wife was "what is" - and back then she still thougt it might be so.

[UrsulaLV]

Didn't Min see something about a "leaf" around Perrin? The man who gave up the axe for the hammer? The man who wished the Tinkers Way was possible?

 

I think it was in Baerlon, or the next time she saw him. Sorry, I don't keep track of quotes well.

[Luckers]

Min saw the Broken Crown in Perrin's future. Every indication is that something bad is going to happen to Bashere soon, and Tenobia... specifically, i think that the Aes Sedai with the borderlanders are darkfriends and that when Rand goes to meet them, they will attack and bashere and tenobia will be killed in the crossfire. I suspect also that that will be the second time when perrin is needed to stop rand from being hurt by women who can channel. Faile and Perrin come seraching after rand, rally the troops and take on the Aes Sedai.

 

As for Nynaeve, i dont see her being the Queen of Malkier ever. Malkier has fallen, and is gone. Moreover i see Lan dying in any case.

[mightisright]

You guys sure wish for your tragic endings. This isn't that kind of series so far. A sad ending it will be, but one without much tragedy imho. I believe the AOL ending was tragic. The ending of this age just might be heroic.

 

Back on topic - We cannot be for certain I that the Broken Crown is the crown of Saldaea. There are other possible explinations. That seems like a rather obvious and - quite frankly boring answer to me. If I was gambling I would pick it, but I hope RJ can provide us with something a little more intriguing. And as i've said I can't find any direct reference to the broken crown being the crown of Saldaea. Most likely - yes. Definately - no. Holding out hope - most definately

[Luckers]

The death of at least one major character is required, more then likely two. This is not a tragedy.