Semirhage

[trakand_01]

I do not know if this has been resolved by the end of book 11 because i havent got there yet. I do know, however, that Semirhage is captured.

 

I was wondering, given her track record and 'hobbies', what would be the result of collaring her with an a'dam?

 

Do you think she could be broken by something similar to her own treatment of prisoners?

 

OR, if they captured, say, Graendal too, could they collar and force Semirhage to torture Graendal into talking? Or do you think Graendal would simply let herself be killed? She's quite ambitious... i'm not sure she would.

 

 

[Guest Dreadlord]

I think either woman would let themselves be killed, they both know by now that Lanfear, Aginor and Balthamel have been recycled and since neither seem to be in the bad books of the Dark One they will both be confident they'll be reincarnated.

[Harmless Bandit]

Some suggest that Cadsuane will browbeat or break Semirhage, but I don't know.

 

And who could possibly administer such treatments to Semi? Alivia?

 

In any case, even with the assurance of rebirth, I don't think either woman would let herself be killed, Graendal more so that Semirhage, IMHO.

[aevogt]

In this case, HB beat me to the draw.

 

Graendal has said right out she would flee and reestablish herself elsewhere if discovered or surrender.  She has no intention of dying after she has been promised immortality.

 

Semihrage was almost certainly collared immediately.  Rand's people found a half dozen a'dam right there at the house she had brought with her.

 

She may be unafraid but Cadsuane is pretty tough too.

 

I don't think any of that really matters as a couple of days, a week at the most, under the tender ministrations or Sorilea and Semihrage will be doing Rand's laundry, speaking when spoken to and keeping her eyes on the floor the rest of the time.  If Sorilea can't break her and make her talk no one can.  I doubt she'd even need to use the a'dam, though since Sorilea is able to channel, however weakly, she certainly could.

 

 

 

[42Bonzo88]

    Either way, it would be nice to see Semi get a little taste of what she has done in the past to others. Scary part is she might enjoy it.

 

    A question comes to mind. Do we know who invented the A'dam? I thought it was mentioned in one of the books, but I can't remember.

[Rahlian]

A Seanchan Aes Sedai. Her name started with a D, but beyond that i cant recall. It was told in TGH when Eggy was collared

[42Bonzo88]

Thank you.

[Guest leebarr]

I hope Cadsaune beats her down the way she tries with rand

[Harmless Bandit]

Now, Sorilea and Cadsuane ganging on Semirhage is an idea I like, though it sounds too good to be true.

 

About that Seanchan individual who invented the a'dam (I'm not sure it was an Aes Sedai), I can't remember her name, but I do recall that she found herself at the wrong end of one sometime later. Ironic.

[Elwinn Taron]

The only a'dam they have is the one on the suldam/damane pair that got killed.  The wooden box is full of a'dam for men.  I had kinda thought that Cadsuane would use it for Semirhage, but, Aevogt, I like your idea, I agree that Sorilea would be perfect!  The inventor's name was Deain.

[Luckers]

Semihrage was almost certainly collared immediately.  Rand's people found a half dozen a'dam right there at the house she had brought with her.

 

I think thats a pretty big assumption to make. It may well turn out to be true, but still... a pretty big assumption.

 

[Guest Dreadlord]

Rand should deal with Semirhage himself. Not kill her-she is too useful-but I think if anyone would make her pay for her sins it should be Rand. I don't think he should let anyone else be in charge of her punishments, he needs to start getting abit more involved again. Maybe when Moiraine comes back he will be encouraged to do something himself

[Luckers]

The obvious answer to me is to have a man bond her. Total unrelenting control, with the fact that she would have to fear what would happen if her bondmate died... and beyond that we know that a bond can be used to draw the strength of a bondee until they die, so that provides an immediate endgame.

 

Not that i actually think that will happen. Still if i was joe-random in the story, i'd suggest it.

[benr]

Wow - who would be willing to bond Semi?  Good idea, though.

[aevogt]

    Either way, it would be nice to see Semi get a little taste of what she has done in the past to others. Scary part is she might enjoy it.

 

    A question comes to mind. Do we know who invented the A'dam? I thought it was mentioned in one of the books, but I can't remember.

 

That makes me think of the scene from the remake of "The Little Shop of Horrors"  with Bill Murray as the masochistic root canal patient and Steve Martin as the sadistic, Elvis impersonating, mororcycle riding dentist who throws him out for enjoying the pain a little too much.  

 

"It's you professionalism that I respect"

 

Here's a link to youtube if you haven't seen the film.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iAKYQjpDtpA&feature=related

 

The only a'dam they have is the one on the suldam/damane pair that got killed.  The wooden box is full of a'dam for men.  I had kinda thought that Cadsuane would use it for Semirhage, but, Aevogt, I like your idea, I agree that Sorilea would be perfect!  The inventor's name was Deain.

 

From KoD, A plain Wooden Box p 594.

 

"Within lay coiled a'dam and a number if circlets made of black segmented metal, some large, some small."  .  

 

Farther down

"There were six of the larger circlets and five of the silvery leashes."

Semihrage brought enough a'dam and male adam for the entire party in case they were all taken alive.  They ties off the sheilds on the other and sent them back to Ebou Dar to request a real meeting with Tuon.  

 

and Yes Lickers, it is a big assumption to make but we already know that one member of the party, Nynaeve al'Meara, has no qualms whatsoever about leashing one of the Forsaken.  They would have been foolish not to.

 

I do prefer the idea of having her bound to a powerful Asha'man, since, as we've seen with Moghedien, a collar can be removed all too easily.

 

 

[Luckers]

and Yes Lickers, it is a big assumption to make but we already know that one member of the party, Nynaeve al'Meara, has no qualms whatsoever about leashing one of the Forsaken.  They would have been foolish not to.

 

Lickers? I don't usually do that without being bought dinner first, lol.

 

And i dunno... they used the a'dam in large part because they needed to keep Moghedian secret. Its possible, but yeah... i dunno....

 

Wow - who would be willing to bond Semi?  Good idea, though.

 

Obviously a Saldaean Asha'men. Subdueing women is, as we know, the only way to deal with them. Just ask Faile.

 

 

[aevogt]

D'oh, fumble fingers.

 

I like the idea of a Saldean Ashaman better than the rest but it's still got problems.

 

Semihrage once frightened her captors into releasing her.  Can you imagine being bonded to that.  Makes my worst nightmares seem like kindergarten.

 

Look at Toivein and Gabrelle.  Bonded to Logain, they still plot against him from day one.  Semihrage would turn her captor into a quivering basket case in a week unless it was a woman.  Maybe one of the Aes Sedai bonded to an ashaman could bond her.

[Bob T Dwarf]

Just curious.  Why do you think Semi will remain a captive long enough to be either questioned or bonded?

[dyring]

Just curious.  Why do you think Semi will remain a captive long enough to be either questioned or bonded?

 

Tbh. Rand is aware that TG is coming closer and closer. He´s been very clear about his goal to bring the world together. Time he made an effort on the WT.

 

How about a visit, and delivering Semirhage on a leash?

(I don´t really think this is gonna happend, but I would so love it, specially if the pov of the occasion was belonging to a BA sister;)

[Luckers]

I like the idea of a Saldean Ashaman better than the rest but it's still got problems.

 

Semihrage once frightened her captors into releasing her.  Can you imagine being bonded to that.  Makes my worst nightmares seem like kindergarten.

 

Look at Toivein and Gabrelle.  Bonded to Logain, they still plot against him from day one.  Semihrage would turn her captor into a quivering basket case in a week unless it was a woman.  Maybe one of the Aes Sedai bonded to an ashaman could bond her.

 

Don't get me wrong, i was joking--the fact is none of the Asha'men are strong enough in themselves, or self-aware enough to be able to control a woman like Semirhage. Someone like Thom might be able to do it... with experience, as well as self knowledge... but the Asha'men seem clearly lacking in either.

 

Just curious.  Why do you think Semi will remain a captive long enough to be either questioned or bonded?

 

Because i dont think anyone has the strength nessasary to free her--or kill her. Short of all out defeat of Rand and his cadre, that is, and i dont see that happening.

 

 

[Rasta Ashaman]

Just curious.  Why do you think Semi will remain a captive long enough to be either questioned or bonded?

 

Because i dont think anyone has the strength nessasary to free her--or kill her. Short of all out defeat of Rand and his cadre, that is, and i dont see that happening.

 

Shaidar Haran can do both - free her and kill her; and neither any Aes Sedai nor Asha'man could stop him since SH can just jam their OP, and his TP abilities would make sure that none of the Saldeans in Rand's camp would be able to even come close enough to strike at him.

[Guest Dreadlord]

Taim

[aevogt]

His ability to block the source has only been seen in an enclosed space so I doubt it would extend more than a dozen or so yards from his person if you could call it that.

 

Further, I don't think SH has any true channeling abilities, True Power or otherwise.  So as long as a channeler is far enough away from him to be able to embrace the source, even a middling channeler could blast him into grolm food.  A lightening bolt fro 100 paces will turn just about anything into a smear on the rocks.  True, it's an exceptional fade, but let's face it, it's still just a fade.

 

Also, I don't think there is anything about him that would render him immune to good old fashioned steel.  A good power wrought blade will take his head just like any other.  although the weilder would liekly need a box upon which to stand.

 

 

As for freeing or killing her.  Slayer could do it.  Any DF in Rand's camp could do it, although not without the risk of exposure.

[Luckers]

Just curious.  Why do you think Semi will remain a captive long enough to be either questioned or bonded?

 

Because i dont think anyone has the strength nessasary to free her--or kill her. Short of all out defeat of Rand and his cadre, that is, and i dont see that happening.

 

Shaidar Haran can do both - free her and kill her; and neither any Aes Sedai nor Asha'man could stop him since SH can just jam their OP, and his TP abilities would make sure that none of the Saldeans in Rand's camp would be able to even come close enough to strike at him.

 

We don't know that, his ability to jam the source has only ever been used on the Forsaken, and their abilities are open to him to access through the black threads, and we don't know that he can channel the True Power. Yes he has a number of peculiar tricks, but we've as yet to see how effective they are in battle.

 

As for freeing or killing her.  Slayer could do it.  Any DF in Rand's camp could do it, although not without the risk of exposure.

 

Under Cadsuane's guard? I doubt it for both.

[Rasta Ashaman]

We don't know that, his ability to jam the source has only ever been used on the Forsaken, and their abilities are open to him to access through the black threads

Not exactly true:

Unthinking, she [Alviarin] reached for the Source. And nearly screamed. The Source was gone! She was not shielded; there was simply nothing there for her to embrace! CoT, ch.21

So the jamming works on any channeler, right? And, even if the jamming works only in the presence of any of the Forsaken, that shouldn't be a problem - Semi's still got her black thread attached.

 

and we don't know that he can channel the True Power. Yes he has a number of peculiar tricks, but we've as yet to see how effective they are in battle.

 

You mean Shady is just incredibly hot that it can do THIS?  ;D

Angry black flames raced down the spear haft from Shaidar Haran’s hand, the hand of the Hand of the Shadow. In an instant the wooden haft was charred and twisted; the spearhead dropped off. The Myrddraal let the blackened stick fall and dusted soot from its palm. ACoS, ch.40

Anyway, we don't know that he CAN'T channel the True Power either, so why dismiss SH as a possible candidate for the task?

 

As for freeing or killing her.  Slayer could do it.  Any DF in Rand's camp could do it, although not without the risk of exposure.

 

Under Cadsuane's guard? I doubt it for both.

 

Cads has to sleep sometimes, and she drinks tea.