How did the show hold up for you?

[Ralph]

59 minutes ago, ashi said:

 

Consider the Oneness and the Flame and the Void.

Apologies for answering for someone else :-

 

But this is a reason why we should want him to want to do it, not a reason why he should

[ashi]

3 minutes ago, Ralph said:

Apologies for answering for someone else :-

 

But this is a reason why we should want him to want to do it, not a reason why he should

I am not sure I understand.

 

Sword training is a way for Rand to learn and master the Flame and the Void - and Oneness (which moreover is of spiritual significance), which is necessary for his mastery of Saidin, and ultimately of himself, and arguably gives him his intuitive thoughtless (in a positive way) ability to use the One Power.

 

Sword training and not pure Channeling / meditation / whatever also allows Rand to be his body as well as his mind. This improves, along with mental reflexes, the physical reflexes that are necessary for his survival.

 

The life and death confrontation that is a sword fight requires and teaches non-conceptual focus (including the body) in a way that channeling exercises do not.

 

Lastly, he should practice the sword because it makes him feel good, no? :)

[Ralph]

4 minutes ago, ashi said:

I am not sure I understand.

 

Sword training is a way for Rand to learn and master the Flame and the Void - and Oneness (which moreover is of spiritual significance), which is necessary for his mastery of Saidin, and ultimately of himself, and arguably gives him his intuitive thoughtless (in a positive way) ability to use the One Power.

 

Sword training and not pure Channeling / meditation / whatever also allows Rand to be his body as well as his mind. This improves, along with mental reflexes, the physical reflexes that are necessary for his survival.

 

The life and death confrontation that is a sword fight requires and teaches non-conceptual focus (including the body) in a way that channeling exercises do not.

 

Lastly, he should practice the sword because it makes him feel good, no? ?

I believe the question was why would channelers actually fight with swords. 

[ashi]

5 minutes ago, ashi said:

Lastly, he should practice the sword because it makes him feel good, no? :)

Quote

Memory of Light, chapter 15

 

“Let go, son,” Tam said.“Let go of what?”
“Everything.” Tam came rushing in, throwing shadows in the lantern light, and Rand sought the void. All emotion went into the flame, leaving him empty and whole at once.

[...]
This focus… he had missed this focus. With so much to worry about, so much to carry, he had not been able to dedicate himself to something as simple as a duel. He found it now, and poured himself into it. For a time, he wasn’t the Dragon Reborn. He wasn’t even a son with his father.

[ashi]

6 minutes ago, Ralph said:

I believe the question was why would channelers actually fight with swords. 

If so, my mistake.

 

I was under the impression that @EmreY relegated Rand's sword training to physical fitness, and didn't view it as a necessary part of Rand's arc. If he (you) didn't, my mistake!

Edited January 12, 2022 by ashi

[Katherine]

14 minutes ago, ashi said:

I am not sure I understand.

 

Sword training is a way for Rand to learn and master the Flame and the Void - and Oneness (which moreover is of spiritual significance), which is necessary for his mastery of Saidin, and ultimately of himself, and arguably gives him his intuitive thoughtless (in a positive way) ability to use the One Power.

 

Sword training and not pure Channeling / meditation / whatever also allows Rand to be his body as well as his mind. This improves, along with mental reflexes, the physical reflexes that are necessary for his survival.

 

The life and death confrontation that is a sword fight requires and teaches non-conceptual focus (including the body) in a way that channeling exercises do not.

 

Lastly, he should practice the sword because it makes him feel good, no? ?

 

 

I think that the sword training and his journey to becoming a sword master were a part of his arc and his growth. It was a visible symbol that illustrated how different he became from the kid who had no idea what to do with his daddy's sword. RJ used his sword training to symbolize his journey from boy to man. IMO that metaphor would work well on the TV medium as well... so I do think that seeing him train in the sword would serve his character on the show really well. 

[ArrylT]

4 hours ago, DojoToad said:

So a show you couldn't stand watching past 3 episodes ends up with an 8 out of 10?  Doesn't say much for the 8.5 you gave to WoT. What does it take to get a 5 out of 10?

 

I certainly would not have given S1 Game of Thrones an 8 on 10 back in 2011 when I first tried to watch it.  That grade is from 2020 when I did finally decide to give it a 2nd viewing.  

[Terry05]

6 hours ago, Raal Gurniss said:

Me saying “WoT TV is not that good” isn’t opinion…It really is not that good of a TV show! If it was a movie it would be of the straight to TV variety…What joy you get from the show or how much someone doesn’t like it is separate from whether the show is any good or not….

 

 

 

I’m starting to wonder if you understand what an opinion is. You keep giving one but then state that it’s not an opinion ?

[AdamA]

I want to be fair. I still think season one was at least as good as Witcher season one, which is to say good enough to keep watching, but I do think it's hard.

 

But it isn't fair. I agree with a lot of the more or less somewhat objective issues of poor production quality, forgettable music, sets that look too much like sets, bad CGI. On the other hand, I started a re-read when the first episode aired and am now halfway through Knife of Dreams, and you know what? If I'm being honest, the books are just as amateurish on the book equivalent of "production value." Dialog is often flat and unconvincing, descriptions are way too detailed, Jordan never met an adjective he didn't love, a lot of stuff is extremely repetitive, including exact phrases and sentences that are just written over and over again. The gender dynamics of both men and women constantly being so dismissive of and hostile and unfair to the other sex is tiring to read and makes the people annoying. There are way too many side plots that aren't interesting or stall forward movement of the main plot and didn't need to be there. This is clearly not Flaubert/Hemingway level writing any more than Wheel of Time TV is Lord of the Rings level film production.

 

So why do I still love the books so much and just overlook all of that and not care, but scrutinize the show so closely on every detail? There seems to be some dynamic with books where, even if the act of reading is often tedious and the writing questionable, as long as the story, the world, and the characters are compelling enough, it doesn't matter. This is still a great story with great characters, and as far as I'm concerned, the best world building in any genre in any medium ever. And there are tons of great individual moments that make me smile, cheer, laugh, or even cry. Every book and most plots, even the slogs, tend to have very thrilling climaxes. The memory of the experience ends up being a lot better than the whole experience.

 

Maybe this is even still true of television? Like Katherine, I frickin love Cobra Kai, even though it is unrepentantly silly with all these cartoon villains and bad acting. Going back to fantasy, Buffy the Vampire Slayer remains one of my all-time favorite shows, in spite of the teen heartthrob cast that is largely not great actors, extremely silly looking sets and costumes, mustache twirling ridiculous bad guys.

 

Some shows seem to have the ability to put themselves on a curve by not taking themselves very seriously, lowering expectations. I think Witcher is kind of like this? I don't really expect that much from it, like the fantasy equivalent of the Fast and Furious series (which I also love) more than Lord of the Rings on television. But I'm not at all willing to accept Wheel of Time on that level. Wheel of Time, to me, really needs to be Lord of the Rings quality or bust.

 

And what even is "Lord of the Rings quality?" Truth be told, I didn't even see Return of the King in theaters. These didn't even become favorites until the extended editions were released and I started rewatching them annually with my then superfan girlfriend and also watched the appendices with all the behind the scenes features that gave me an appreciation for how much effort and care really went into it.

[Juan Farstrider]

8 hours ago, Katherine said:

 

 

My thoughts this morning: 

 

So I am with you. I think that is show is poorly done in almost every way, and not just IMO but objectively. 

 

Then I started watching Cobra Kai again (we cancelled Netflix a couple of years ago so am picking it back up). 

 

Oh man I love this show! But it is full of tropes, older actors who have seen better days, 1 dimensional bad guys, and (what should be cringy) high school karate brawls. 

 

And somehow.... its awesome. 

 

So maybe it is all subjective. 

I think the cringy aspects of it and the 1 dimensional bad guys are what Karate Kid is at the core. I recently watched KK3 and the Next KK and wow, so over the top they were. If anything the villains are much more deep in the series. Silver admits as much. I think Cobra Kai would benefit from just admitting Sam is a villain, but I know many would not agree. 

I think our WoT lost more than one would suspect when they aged-up the Two Rivers 5. The director of Wonder Woman said something in an interview about the need to defend (I'm going to get it wrong) I think she said earnestness, not everyone is hip or ironic. Our plucky late-teens embarking out into the world brought an innocence that would play well when they see more jaded cities. I feel like that quality is shared by Cobra Kai at least a little. 

[Chivalry]

9 hours ago, EmreY said:

 

While nowhere near as weird as the infamous Hobbit emu cover, I find the original cover artwork sadly unimpressive.

LOL, I looked at the cover and said "Hmm, this looks like an interesting adventure..."

[Chivalry]

9 hours ago, JeffTheWoodlandElf said:

This is great...

[Cauthonfan4]

22 hours ago, Terry05 said:

47.6% 7-9

18.2% 2-6

simple math

10944*9 = 98496

14882*8 = 119056

10154*7 = 71078

5104*6 = 30624

3104*5 = 15520

1891*4 = 7564

1912*3 = 3824

1804*2 = 3608

49795 total voters. 349770 total score.

349770/49795 = an average of 7.02.

that means the average is around 70%, which would be around a C minus in school or a 1.7 GPA. hardly something to celebrate.

 

 

[Cauthonfan4]

21 hours ago, Deviations said:

1.  Are these newer actors 'blowing up'

 

not from what i can see.

21 hours ago, Deviations said:

2.  Is this series water cooler talk at anyone's job?

 

again not really, and no where close to anything GoT got.

 

[Terry05]

21 minutes ago, Cauthonfan4 said:

simple math

10944*9 = 98496

14882*8 = 119056

10154*7 = 71078

5104*6 = 30624

3104*5 = 15520

1891*4 = 7564

1912*3 = 3824

1804*2 = 3608

49795 total voters. 349770 total score.

349770/49795 = an average of 7.02.

that means the average is around 70%, which would be around a C minus in school or a 1.7 GPA. hardly something to celebrate.

 

 

 

Cheers. Confirmed what I expected that removing the top and bottom ratings wouldn’t really affect the overall IMDb rating. Close to my rating of the season as a 7.5 as well.

[Cauthonfan4]

1 minute ago, Terry05 said:

Cheers. Confirmed what I expected that removing the top and bottom ratings wouldn’t really affect the overall IMDb rating. Close to my rating of the season as a 7.5 as well.

it didn't but it also didn't make them go up either. and still a failure in the eyes of most grading systems.

[Terry05]

24 minutes ago, Cauthonfan4 said:

not from what i can see.

again not really, and no where close to anything GoT got.

 

It depends where you are I guess. More people I know are talking about WoT compared to GoT season 1 but that’s an unfair comparison given how much more accessible WoT is compared to GoT season 1. I’m from Australia so no HBO over here. Back then torrenting was the only option unless you wanted to wait to buy the dvds.

[Terry05]

3 minutes ago, Cauthonfan4 said:

it didn't but it also didn't make them go up either. and still a failure in the eyes of most grading systems.

7/10 as a failure? Don’t think so. 

[Cauthonfan4]

3 minutes ago, Terry05 said:

More people I know are talking about WoT compared to GoT

what? not even close. back when GoT came out i couldn't go anywhere without hearing about it. my job at the time literally had a rule where you couldn't spoil anything until the next episode had aired.

3 minutes ago, Terry05 said:

season 1 but that’s an unfair comparison given how much more accessible WoT is compared to GoT season 1. I’m from Australia so no HBO over here.

ahh okay. i guess that makes more sense.

[Cauthonfan4]

2 minutes ago, Terry05 said:

7/10 as a failure? Don’t think so. 

70% as the best? yeah that's not good. considering that most people rarely rate a show below a 5?

 

think about it this way. if we adjust for how most people rate, 5->9 then you got the equivalent of 3 stars out of 5. hardly something stellar.

Edited January 13, 2022 by Cauthonfan4

[Terry05]

2 minutes ago, Cauthonfan4 said:

70% as the best? yeah that's not good. considering that most people rarely rate a show below a 5?

I think you’ll find on IMDB that a lot of people vote shows lower than a 5. 70k voted GoT lower than a 5. 
It’s hard for shows that have an established fan base from another medium. Always lots of people who get upset and vote 1.

[Cauthonfan4]

9 minutes ago, Terry05 said:

It’s hard for shows that have an established fan base from another medium. Always lots of people who get upset and vote 1.

doesn't help when you change so much stuff for absolutely not reason.

[Terry05]

To each there own. This is really nothing new. I was on Westeros when GoT first came on and it was exactly the same - show haters, show defenders and people in the middle who just enjoyed the show for what it was. The main difference now is the increased use of social media

[Jaysen Gore]

1 hour ago, Cauthonfan4 said:

simple math

10944*9 = 98496

14882*8 = 119056

10154*7 = 71078

5104*6 = 30624

3104*5 = 15520

1891*4 = 7564

1912*3 = 3824

1804*2 = 3608

49795 total voters. 349770 total score.

349770/49795 = an average of 7.02.

that means the average is around 70%, which would be around a C minus in school or a 1.7 GPA. hardly something to celebrate.

 

 

What freaking school did you go to? a 1.7 GPA is a C-. 70% is a B where I went to school

[Cauthonfan4]

5 minutes ago, Jaysen Gore said:

What freaking school did you go to? a 1.7 GPA is a C-. 70% is a B where I went to school

where did you go to school?

90% and above is an A

80% to 89% is a B

70-79% is a C

60-69% is a D

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Academic_grading_in_the_United_States

 

Edited January 13, 2022 by Cauthonfan4