DPR is skibidi aligned

I think I had asked you this earlier too, but what is this supposed big Mafia plan?? Desperately claiming cop if you are literally 2 minutes away from dying and being completely useless to the rest of the mafia team is not some huge plan, it's an extremely basic, necessary maneuver. I need an answer here @Ithillian Turambar, this is super weird. I agree that he's unvoteable right now, but at the top of your town list doesn't make much sense since you were the one that pointed out that if there is another cop, they wouldn't even necessarily counter claim right away, especially not during night now that the first day is over anyways. I was there and ready to change my vote if it was a tie obviously, you think it's scummy to not try and build votes on the person I actually thought was scummy? And not vote for someone who I had a town read on? Can you tell me honestly if that makes sense to you? Also proof that I literally said I will switch to Marsh if people didn't move to DPR, because I also didn't want a tie. Did you just miss this in your catch up? If you didn't post this, I'd be starting to get a larger scum read on you, but this is about as town as it gets from a soft read perspective? But also at the same time, you're right and you should be under scrutiny for that, and as Verbal mentioned, he has put you there. I don't think I've appropriately factored that in tbh, and right now my main focus is DPR in terms of trying to get him voted out, and figuring out what's going on with Dice. But yeah, with the above reasoning on Dice and myself, being the first to vote for Marth (though I don't remember your reasoning sticking out as poorly as DPR's, and mafia are more likely to jump onto a train than start a new one), you are a little sus for sure.

Ah sorry guys, double posted since the reply button wasn't sending me to the last page

Haven't lead any BW's but was one of the leading voices against Marsh trying to, as I think Verb or Heavy pointed out, force the "slip" narrative? This one I want to underline especially because the absolute garbage nature of believing that him saying that Ithi and Turin were misled by him and interpreting it as it could only mean he was purposefully trying to mislead them (which would be an insane slip to have, and is much more likely that he meant that he unintentionally misled them) Onto your second point about "misrepping you" and you believing that what I said was super obvious Am I misinterpreting this or are you literally saying that the concept of Dice not being trustworthy is a joke?? Or my explanation of why he's not immediately trustworthy is a joke? Neither of these read like you're saying what I'm saying is completely correct, but just super obvious and unnecessary. And onto your third point, which doesn't address my 3rd point at all? I wasn't saying that you were less active, or that you weren't accusing multiple people. I'm saying that you are building cases out of garbage reasoning, that's so bad that it indicates you're trying to build something out of nothing to misdirect other town into lynching someone. I don't care about your activity, unlike your "strategy" of trying to ignore IRL reasons for activity and attribute everything to some scum tell. It's how you've been active over the past day and night that points to you being mafia.

Haven't lead any BW's but was one of the leading voices against Marsh trying to, as I think Verb or Heavy pointed out, force the "slip" narrative? This one I want to underline especially because the absolute garbage nature of believing that him saying that Ithi and Turin were misled by him and interpreting it as it could only mean he was purposefully trying to mislead them (which would be an insane slip to have, and is much more likely that he meant that he unintentionally misled them) Onto your second point about "misrepping you" and you believing that what I said was super obvious Am I misinterpreting this or are you literally saying that the concept of Dice not being trustworthy is a joke?? Or my explanation of why he's not immediately trustworthy is a joke? Neither of these read like you're saying what I'm saying is completely correct, but just super obvious and unnecessary. And onto your third point, which doesn't address my 3rd point at all? I wasn't saying that you were less active, or that you weren't accusing multiple people. I'm saying that you are building cases out of garbage reasoning, that's so bad that it indicates you're trying to build something out of nothing to misdirect other town into lynching someone. I don't care about your activity, unlike your "strategy" of trying to ignore IRL reasons for activity and attribute everything to some scum tell. It's how you've been active over the past day and night that points to you being mafia.

You're saying that the vote you placed on Marsh was just a stirring the pot vote? The same vote that you kept all the way until deadline, did not make any note that you were willing to change when we were nearing the end of day, for which you were around? What a convenient way to avoid saying you wanted to lynch a town, it was just a reaction gathering vote! That you kept until EOD as you saw him become the main target! Plenty of time and people there to make it happen??? There was literally 2 minutes, what on earth are you talking about. I didn't have the "conviction" to ride it out because my "conviction" could've resulted in us accidentally voting out the cop on D1, regardless of how likely I think it is the claim is true. Yeah sure, would've been WAY better for town if I left my vote on a train that wasn't getting any steam, and risked the cop dying day 1 Yeah sure, literally nothing to do with the exact coinciding of a weekend being over, during which I was at a wedding, which I mentioned multiple times. Do you think I'm lying about the wedding? Garbage, again and again, the commitment to continue making absolutely nonsensical points is stunning.

Also this is INSANE given how much garbage you've spewed this whole game, and how useless you've been trying to figure out who's scummy and feeling town. I'm also wary about Ed, but at least he's not * Leading BWs on town * Proclaiming everyone should blindly trust a role claim * Building up more bs cases to get some misvotes on town again

Nvm, didn't miss anything of use, what are you even talking about here. You're saying it's a joke to not trust Dice immediately? You think Dice should just be immediately assumed town? Let's walk through your broken logic here. Do you think cop should immediately CC if Dice isn't the cop?

Woah, ok idk if this is a new DM thing, but I only saw DPR's omfg comment when I last refreshed this page, not his other response.

@DPRis just chilling here without responding to any actual points, making more bad accusations after starting off with Marsh yesterday, and has been nothing but a negative effect on the game so far. Anyone else down to have a 5 minute day tomorrow, get him out, and move on with the game? /very slight s

Yup makes complete sense, thanks for the clarification! What new insane thought do you have now? Want to respond to the below btw or are you struggling to put anything together that cohesively makes sense

Makes sense, though to clarify for Dice, will you treat him as cleared town in that you will take his reads without a grain of salt that he could be scum? Or are you saying you'll just treat him as another guy, with a twist of potentially very useful knowledge, but are going to be scumhunting elsewhere? The latter makes sense, the former I think could be very dangerous if the other cop is, smartly, waiting to CC, and would put them in an uncomfortable position of trying to stop the rest of town from following Dice, vs trying to stay alive and optimize the time to CC

Whatever, I was productive for a little lmfao It was chaotic because the situation Dice had created was chaotic. If you're thinking along the lines of me purposely trying to do multiple one-line comments to be chaotic during a tight deadline, I had never even considered that as a possibility truthfully, don't know if that's some new meta, but that's just my commenting style when things are super chaotic? Otherwise, if I do my normal wall of texts, I can't react to everything that's happening or get my thoughts out right away in a time crunch situation. Agreed! But as a result, since I think we're agreeing that it's what mafia would do, what cop would do, and potentially (Ithi's reasoning on town drawing attention away from the cop on night) what any town would do, then Dice's claim doesn't have any alignment indication. Obv we can't vote him out, but I don't think he should be seen as some clear town/scum because of his claim. On the other hand, his absurd reasoning makes me believe he's trying to create cases out of thin air that don't have merit, which is why I find him extremely scummy now, that he's continued doubling down on his nonsense. Also agreed. But him being a target for the real cop would be moot, or helpful even if he's the godfather right? Also, unsure if you're agreeing with me that Dice soft claiming, and then waiting to hard claim 2 minutes before deadline is scummy, if so, yes agreed. If not, my point is that we could've used more time on Day 1 to step back and go another direction properly, as Dice knew he was the strong, strong favorite to get voted out several minutes before EoD, and all he did waiting to hard claim was waste town's time to make a thought out decision. Back to your earlier chaos point, this was the action that easily caused the most chaos, and is exactly what a mafia would try to do. I think the differentiation between what the actual cop would do and what mafia would do, is the real cop would've realized earlier that they are most likely getting voted out, and mentioned it as soon as that was the case, so we could work with the info. I'm not really sure what the purpose of soft claiming/breadcrumbing is when you're about to be voted out? If that was supposed to be enough to cause people to switch votes, then mafia would just do that every time they're about to be voted out, with absolutely no cons for them as they'll throw the town into chaos, be able to manipulate points, and maybe suss out the real power role?

Aight sorry to participate in a burst and leave, but I was supposed to get work done for the last hour lmfao. Gonna be offline, hopefully if I can be disciplined, for the next 3 hours.

Do you agree that this is exactly what Dice would've done if he was mafia? Vague claim, with no chance of ccs, and then claim the most valuable town role 2 minutes before? Not saying that this means he's mafia for sure, but if he was, this is exactly what he'd do.

I haven't played for a long time, I considered myself relatively experienced when I used to play years ago, but am heavily dusty now. I was literally posting what was going on. I went home, had to leave the train that had wifi, and have data issues with my phone. I was going to try and get home to a stable wifi source, but Dice was getting ready for a claim and I couldn't risk missing the deadline which I probably would have and chanced having my data (I had it, and that is not a given with my phone in that location). If I had missed the deadline, and not said anything, that would've caused chaos, I am being as transparent as I can be to help people's reasoning. I don't know how I can make that more clear. I don't disagree that mafia could also post like this, but I do disagree that it's some certain scum read?? Why on earth would town not post like I'm doing above and be explicitly clear in a crazy deadline with lots of actions about what they're doing, why they're doing it, their availability, etc? Thank you on him claiming sooner, all he did was waste 10 minutes of valuable time, he was going to have to claim anyways with the votes on him then. Also, do you not agree that with DPR having one vote already, my switch bringing him to two, if Verbal voted DPR and we had one more person hop in at deadline, he would've gotten out?

I slanked till the wedding I was at was over. Why weren't you helping more during the deadline buddy? Could've used it with everything happening, instead you laze around until the deadline's done and then hop in. The reaching for reasoning is so obvious it hurts. You're right! It makes so much sense that I would try to be the ignition for a brand new bandwagon who's responsibility would fall on me! Instead of, in the scenario where I'm mafia and knew Marsh was town/3p, easily jumping onto the train that had town! That makes so much sense! Can you please make reasonable arguments so we don't waste our time going back and forth on nonsense. Thank you 🙏 was with you most of yesterday on most of your logic as I'd mentioned earlier, glad we're on the same page again.

Agreed here, DPR is my main suspect tomorrow. Do you have a reads list we can look at? Good chance of being a slip honestly (though I'm definitely influenced by already thinking he's scummy). Reminds me again, Dice isn't even cognizant about his nonsensical bias, his entire logic and train on me from the start of day 1 to now has been so filled with nonsense, overreacting to very normal joke votes and busy posts, and then claiming my unvote makes me scummy. Absolute lunacy if he's town, and again a scum tell since I doubt him being this obtuse this game. Welcome to another episode of Dice's insane ramblings. a) Good for you, useless since we don't have enough info to trust you as town b) I literally moved to a place that would secure a lynch by the deadline, and tried before that to get momentum to someone else who seemed more mafia-esque, which has some merit since the person you pushed us to vote out was town, with the incompetence of when you claimed with no time to give us anything. And then the audacity/scumminess to use that time scramble to blame someone else. c) Pure consolidation?? To not allow the cop to potentially go to a tie and die via RNG? I wish I had the time to read your other games and see if you were this tunnely/ridiculous as town. At face value, even with your claim, you are BLARING scum.

Thank you. Agreed and thank you again haha, grateful that someone is on the same train of thought as me, feel like I'm going insane. I voted someone who already had a vote (DPR is Wes), then had two votes when I added mine on, and Verbal was online who had suspected DPR to some extent. In a properly filled deadline room, we have both seen fast trains hop onto someone else, and that was a noticeably higher scum read to me. Once again, Dice with the absolutely nonsensical logic, do you seriously believe this??? I literally switched to the train that would ensure you wouldn't die when I saw that there wasn't time and no one else was on to join the train on DPR. Yeah, I feel like it's gone through phases * Early day 1 - I thought he just had a different type of personality and felt like someone who had played mafia elsewhere but not much here (explaining the joke votes, initial phase), and it seemed like there were some scum that hopped on this as a potential mislynch opportunity. I was leaning town at that point. * Mid day 1 - He kind of continued doing his defensiveness and woe is me talks, and that combined with his defensiveness early is something that I think i can't ignore? Mafia do generally get defensive like this (I guess town do too), and it muddied my read a little bit. * Till now - There are stronger town reads I have then him, and he's one where I'm more confused than anything. As a result, he's on the other half of my scum/town spectrum, but closer to a neutral read. I've already caught up on most of the thread while doing my replies, and his logic during the night seems sound?

Also your breadcrumbing was SO blatantly obvious, are you joking right now? 😂 At least I tried (however poorly) to make a subtle connection you could've ack'ed, that might've been missed by mafia doing a catch up. You literally were like "hey don't vote me guys, srsly don't vote me". How subtle. Whether you're town or not, that was an AWFUL play by you. Slept on it to make sure, but you knew for certain there was an extremely high chance you were about to get voted out based on the activity of players around, your lead amongst the votes. And then instead of giving town the opportunity to use your claim's info, and coordinate a train on a proper scummy suspect, especially with the knowledge of your claim helping us figure tells out, you forced us in a situation where you knew most people weren't active to vote jump onto the next highest train. Either you're scum, or you're making simple mistakes, and knowing your experience is why I'm hesitant to trust you, because I will be shocked at your play if it turns out you're town. And to follow that up, your reasoning that somehow my actions make me more scummy when you, the cop claim, would've died without a fuss if I wanted to, is so utterly dumb that I am once again left with no reasonable option except that you're scummy. Or you're tunneling so hard you've left logic behind completely.

I waited a while to see if this was bait and if others would agree/disagree with it, but before we have some town die, we need to discuss bolded. I need an explanation on why this is not awful logic. WHAT??? does Dice lose by false claiming cop? He is literally about to die, and his only way out was to claim something. I can understand the logic of a town trying to stay alive by claiming cop and deflecting mafia kill, but assuming he's town is nothing short of absurd. I agree with you on taking a closer look at Ed's timeline throughout this, but why is Verb's vote on Dice weird, do you have the bad reasoning? From my analysis, a vote on Dice over Heavy was purely because his actions were more scummy, and just because you think someone is town doesn't mean you agree with who they're trying to lynch, especially before they're proven town by anything besides vibes. +1, I am a little astounded that what you're getting out of this last night is that Verbal is the one that seems most scummy? While I was surprised he didn't vote for someone and just unvoted, that unvote is still a huge town indicator if Dice was actually cop, as it's simply more beneficial for mafia to accidentally get the cop. I guess he unvoted after me, but it was going so fast that him unvoting after seeing me change votes to DPR would be less likely. Also I had a town read on him before all this fwiw. Logic says we can't vote for him. However, due to the reasoning it seems all have agreed on that the cop may not counterclaim right away, he is not verified town either. Will stop this post here for some attempt at brevity, but I really need everyone who doesn't agree with this (Ithi, Turin, anyone else?) to explain why what Dice did isn't exactly what a mafia would do before he got voted out. To a tee. That doesn't mean he's definitely mafia, but it sure as hell doesn't clear him as a for sure cop.

But in a normal game with no strongman/role blocker, that would just out the real cop, when they were not at risk before, and potentially get both towns killed, or even if the first guy retracted their claim, they probably wouldn't be trusted, killed anyways, and now the cop is out?

Did not think it was possible for town to false claim cop, but I guess with the strongman and role blocker magnet it's possible.

Tell me about it

Updated List: DPR Tigraine, Ithi, Dice, Ed ------- Heavy, Key, Lenlo (whoops sry Len) Turin, Nynaeve Verbal