Tarmon Gaidon [Advanced Mafia] Game Over

[Tiinker]

Heading out at 6 (4 hours) so if anyone wants to ask me anything I'd much prefer to do it now.

[Zander?]

[Cass]

 

Hey back atchya Nol.How confident are you in your Shad = scum read? Is it persisting through all of his recent stuff as well?

Confident enough.His actions reminded me of when I used to catch Des as scum early.He'd get really combative and dismissive, more so than necessary.That's how Shad was coming off to me.He's tempered his tone somewhat but it wouldn't be enough to shake me even if I weren't for a policy lynch.

Why Hellion over anyone else? Especially while Shad's voting there?

Makes no difference to me, scum like to distance early sometimes.Like I said Hellion seems standoffish and I don't like that.Unfortunately for Hellion waiting for a better read isn't going to benefit me since I don't have any meta on him so I'd rather just eliminate someone I'm not sure of rather than keep someone else I'm not sure of around but can possibly read better later.TL;DR Hellion didn't give me enough to work with on D1.

 

I like to hold most of my thoughts until Day 2 since they tend to change rapidly with the lynch and kill because there's so much extra info to go on at that point and I hate pointing to someone and clearing them or condemning them and then doing a 180 within hours because of new info. People tend to get confused and lynch me over it. That said I'm feeling bad about Hallia, Shad, and Hellion.Could lynch any of these three but prefer Shad overall I just don't think it's happening.

 Tbh I don't care if you 180 a thousand times based on rethinking/new information. I'd rather that than keeping mum to see if I can follow your thought process with every change.

Well that's you.I've had bad experiences before and it just makes more sense to me to hold on until I'm more sure of things.I've also given strong reads early before and died and was very wrong.Giving such unsure reads if I feel like I can help it just isn't how I like to play the game anymore.

I don't hate this from Nol.

 

I do feel like he's in a mindset of never-going-to-change-my-mind wrt both Shad and Hellian, which is annoying/maybe something but I pretty much have the same concerns about Shad as he does, just with no balls to tunnel him further D1 unless he does something else that really stands out.

 

They can both live to fight again another day imo.

[Zander?]

[Cass]

\m/ \m/ \m/

 

Yey no more MQ!

[Zander?]

You're totally spewing Cass town when you flip dude cut it out

 

TIGGER IS ALWAYS TOWN LDO!!!!!!

 

<3 <3 <3

 

 

 

 

I totally suck at reading Hallia.  Keeping this foremost in mind regarding her.

 

First, did Ironeyes say that myself and John could be on a team?  Literally makes no sense.

 

I'm out for tonight.  Will check back tomorrow. 

 

For now [v]vote Zaner[/v]

 

And yes that is pure OMGUS.

OMGSUS is never pretty.

 

 

Now I seem to remember a game, one of my more recent ones too, where I said a vote was total OMGUS and everyone said that was the wolfiest thing I could have said.  Here Hellian does it and its taken in stride.  Yes Hallia says its never pretty, but she doesn't go out of her way to say it's wolfy either.  Where if I had posted that and said it was OMGUS she would have been all over me?  What's the difference?  unless Hallia and Hellian are teammates? Maybe? possibly?

 

 

Does it need to be said if I just said it wasn't pretty??? o.O  And why would I have been all over you- guilty conscience already?

 

I don't ever remember Halli taking a dig at Wifi before like this.

 

Struck me as weird.

 

I really need a Cory Curren crash course on reading her. -_-

 

 

Dont see Hallia bringing up RL stuff as Scum.  Explains lack of WIM which is my biggest Hallia concern.

 

Remember (i forget the game) recently where I was misreading amd voting Hallia.  And she posted what was going on with her while I was away and she got strung up.  ANd then when i came back and I seen that post and was like UNVOTE HER.

 

She was TOWN.

 

 

Here is is: 

 

http://web.archive.org/web/20100210092217/http://dragonmount.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=15066

Holy crap you can access actual post content through wayback on there? That's pretty unusual and now I want to go add old lost games into my database instead of playing Mafia. 

 

Seriously though thanks a ton for digging this up.  It's like finding buried treasure for me.

 

 

NERD

 

<3 <3 <3

 

 

 

 

 

-snip-

Well I won't claim to be good at mafia (not any more at least) but I'd love to kill some wolves! Does [v]Unvote vote wolves[/v] work?

[v] ironeyes [/v]

 

Um, what's this for?

 

Obviously b/c I think that post is scummy. Reads as fake confusion

 

Scummy? Maybe. But confusing??? What could actually be confusing about that post. It's just not confusing. This guy is scum.

@Tiink what?

 

Iron asking about my vote feels like false confusion. Feels like he's trying to get someone to defend the poor, confused guy who just got back into mafia. Or something.

This is weird. Iron asked about your vote, you said "Obviously b/c I think that post is scummy. Reads as fake confusion".

 

But now you're saying that him asking about your vote is what read as fake confusion.

 

I can see where you might think the latter, but I don't understand how you got from point A to point B here.

 

 

Im pretty sure point A is point B but thats just my take on it.

[Zander?]

 

Dude shes said more then you in her 1 half of a reads list then youve said content wise all game.

 

All game...

 

The game started on Monday jfc.

 

 

Which would still make it all game tho right?

 

It was brought up because YOU brought activity up.

 

 

These do kinda feel sincere but I think the point youre missing whether on purpose or legitimately is that you KNOW Frustrated Townies do it just as much if not more then Wolves.

 

Ok let's be clear here. The times I've self voted in recent memory I self hammered. I already noted that sometimes people who self vote are just frustrated townies but it is my belief that they need to be lynched regardless. You can't tell the difference between a frustrated townie and a scum manipulating your emotions so it's much safer to just eliminate the frustrated townie because they become a wild card later that can take a well organized town down with them. If someone is so on edge that they're self voting then let them exit the game.

 

 

This is what I was referring to with my question that you didnt know was a question.

 

We discussed it.

 

You voted for policy reasons for self voting.

 

My issue is youve done this yourself as Town at least once before in a game I was in.

[Tiinker]

Jon says that Post A is scummy. Reads as fake confusion. Tink asks Jon about fake confusion. Jon says that Post B reads as fake confusion. Shad notes that Jon implied Post A reads as fake confusion but later says Post B is what was actually fake confusion.

 

 

Confusion doesn't even look like a real word anymore.

[Cass]

Believer's ISO is way more introspective and fluff based here than either of the games before.

 

I don't see a single reaction test or a serious push at anyone except for John Snow/Iron and he doesn't engage with them directly except in response to threats to himself.

 

Could move here now tbh.

 

Need to go back and look at John Snow.

[Zander?]

 

Can I just say I love you Cass.

*Grabs Hallia and dances*

 

YES! AND THEN ... COME ON AND TELL ME MORRRRE!!

 

 

Like a reads list moar??

 

If you're Town I wanna see you ShInE!

 

And also - we all love you too <3

 

Tell me every thought process you've had about everybody in the game since the beginning and let me see your Towny soullllll <3 <3 <3

 

 

YOUR TOWNY SOUL IS AS BRIGHT AS THE SUN CASSGOAT!!!!!!

 

<3 <3 <3

 

Im not used to being not being the most obv Towny in the game but theres NO SHAME IN BEING 2nd TO TIGGER!!!!!!

[Zander?]

 

Nope, I didn't, and methinks he's fishing

 

Vote: John Snow

 

 

*shrug* claiming Nyn is a soft doc claim. She's the most likely candidate for a doc. 

 

Who else would be a doc in WoT?

Don't like the Hallia vote here. She says that JOhn is fishing but it was a "char claim" comment quite early in the game.

 

In any case, the game is not going to be solved by char and role claims.

 

 

 

one thing he did that I didnt like Pral was calling out Nyn as the obvious Doc role

 

 

yes i get that DM players most of all would know that  but i kinda think you dont point it out just in case mafia somehow misses it.  longshot but still

[Zander?]

Are people voting Hellian because lack of activity? 

 

ISO her/him ffs

 

Like youre voting Believer. 

 

Whats the difference between them this game really?

 

Feel like John's post yesterday aren't too bad all things considered. Don't care too much to vote Hellian right now since when he comes back he'll know he's got some answering to do. Doesn't make much sense to add to it atp. 

 

[unvote]

 

[v]Believer[/v] - give some content man. What are your reads? You town read Hallia earlier and haven't said much else since. What do you think about JS after the past 7-8 pages?

 

 

Shad what's your scum team atm? I feel like I'm in a similar situation as you that I've got some good ideas about who's town but my scum reads aren't panning out much. 

 

Shad just posted a reads list a couple pages back.

 

I could swing Nolder from town to scum and vice versa super fast but won't be able to hard place him til later on.

 

Agreed.

[Pralaya]

Ok, finally caught up (had to skim a lof of Shad and Zander posts :/)

 

Not much time but this is what I am feeling

 

 

Dice - I like the way he has been inquisitive and his tone mainly suggests that he is trying to figure out stuff.

Darthe - He had pocketed a lot of people early in the day in the previous game but here is quite different. Not trying hard and mostly standing in the background and this I feel is town!Darthe

WiFi - SImilar to above, doesn't feel like the forced wifi we saw in the previous game. She is more free-flowing and that keeps her green for me.

 

John Snow - Don't see what others are seeing in scum here and I think he is mostly an easy target. Hi char-claim comment is not likely to come from scum. Neither his doc thing.

Zander/Cass - VEry difficult to read Zander early in the game. I had to skim most of his posts. Cass has seemed alright. I think they are town here but need to have flips before I can figure them out completelt

Nolder - Feeling good about Nolder - although he hasn't given detailed lists, he is having enough presence to talk to people. The tone looks townie though.

Ironeyes - He got voted pretty early and I like his reaction to that. I don't agree with his vote on Snow but otherwise his posts have been good

 

 

Shad - His initial posts where he jokes that he is scum is weird. Still think he is a deep as scum and hard to read. Don't like the AtE part and self-voting but it comes likely from town!Shad. So, kind of mixed on him.

Hellian - Not much to comment here. She is new and I don't know how she plays. Still don't know the votes on her.

Believer - Not played with him either. Seems reluctant to give out reads D1. Difficult to say

 

 

Kat - Sigh, I somehow always see Kat scummy and it is the same this game. Posts like these and these where she shows frustration look forced to me.

Hallia - Gun to head, I would say she is scum. I don't like her vote on Snow and it looked quite opportunistic. I am used to her giving more detailed reads than she has given out this game.

Tiinker - He has been just following the crowd the whole game. Kind of reminds me of the game he was scum with me. His strong Darthe town read is out of nowhere.

[Believer]

Believer's ISO is way more introspective and fluff based here than either of the games before.

 

I don't see a single reaction test or a serious push at anyone except for John Snow/Iron and he doesn't engage with them directly except in response to threats to himself.

I've answered every query directed at me, accusing or not.

 

When you label it "threat" you imply that I've been purely defensive, which isn't true.

 

 

I've told you exactly what you can expect from me, don't be surprised when I live up to my own standard. If you don't find me entertaining tomorrow, I hope you'll vote me.

[Zander?]

Morning all

Cass, thanks for those

 

I'll get you a reads lost together this morning

 

YUSSSSS!!!!!!

 

<3 <3 <3

 

 

 

Hey back atchya Nol.How confident are you in your Shad = scum read? Is it persisting through all of his recent stuff as well?

Confident enough.His actions reminded me of when I used to catch Des as scum early.He'd get really combative and dismissive, more so than necessary.That's how Shad was coming off to me.He's tempered his tone somewhat but it wouldn't be enough to shake me even if I weren't for a policy lynch.

Why Hellion over anyone else? Especially while Shad's voting there?

Makes no difference to me, scum like to distance early sometimes.Like I said Hellion seems standoffish and I don't like that.Unfortunately for Hellion waiting for a better read isn't going to benefit me since I don't have any meta on him so I'd rather just eliminate someone I'm not sure of rather than keep someone else I'm not sure of around but can possibly read better later.TL;DR Hellion didn't give me enough to work with on D1.

 

I like to hold most of my thoughts until Day 2 since they tend to change rapidly with the lynch and kill because there's so much extra info to go on at that point and I hate pointing to someone and clearing them or condemning them and then doing a 180 within hours because of new info. People tend to get confused and lynch me over it. That said I'm feeling bad about Hallia, Shad, and Hellion.Could lynch any of these three but prefer Shad overall I just don't think it's happening.

 Tbh I don't care if you 180 a thousand times based on rethinking/new information. I'd rather that than keeping mum to see if I can follow your thought process with every change.

Well that's you.I've had bad experiences before and it just makes more sense to me to hold on until I'm more sure of things.I've also given strong reads early before and died and was very wrong.Giving such unsure reads if I feel like I can help it just isn't how I like to play the game anymore.

I don't hate this from Nol.

 

I do feel like he's in a mindset of never-going-to-change-my-mind wrt both Shad and Hellian, which is annoying/maybe something but I pretty much have the same concerns about Shad as he does, just with no balls to tunnel him further D1 unless he does something else that really stands out.

 

They can both live to fight again another day imo.

 

 

Shad and Nolder can live another day.

 

Cass has spoken, so shall it beeeeeeeeeee!!!!!

[Tiinker]

Ok, finally caught up (had to skim a lof of Shad and Zander posts :/)

 

Not much time but this is what I am feeling

 

 

Dice - I like the way he has been inquisitive and his tone mainly suggests that he is trying to figure out stuff.

Darthe - He had pocketed a lot of people early in the day in the previous game but here is quite different. Not trying hard and mostly standing in the background and this I feel is town!Darthe

WiFi - SImilar to above, doesn't feel like the forced wifi we saw in the previous game. She is more free-flowing and that keeps her green for me.

 

John Snow - Don't see what others are seeing in scum here and I think he is mostly an easy target. Hi char-claim comment is not likely to come from scum. Neither his doc thing.

Zander/Cass - VEry difficult to read Zander early in the game. I had to skim most of his posts. Cass has seemed alright. I think they are town here but need to have flips before I can figure them out completelt

Nolder - Feeling good about Nolder - although he hasn't given detailed lists, he is having enough presence to talk to people. The tone looks townie though.

Ironeyes - He got voted pretty early and I like his reaction to that. I don't agree with his vote on Snow but otherwise his posts have been good

 

 

Shad - His initial posts where he jokes that he is scum is weird. Still think he is a deep as scum and hard to read. Don't like the AtE part and self-voting but it comes likely from town!Shad. So, kind of mixed on him.

Hellian - Not much to comment here. She is new and I don't know how she plays. Still don't know the votes on her.

Believer - Not played with him either. Seems reluctant to give out reads D1. Difficult to say

 

 

Kat - Sigh, I somehow always see Kat scummy and it is the same this game. Posts like these and these where she shows frustration look forced to me.

Hallia - Gun to head, I would say she is scum. I don't like her vote on Snow and it looked quite opportunistic. I am used to her giving more detailed reads than she has given out this game.

Tiinker - He has been just following the crowd the whole game. Kind of reminds me of the game he was scum with me. His strong Darthe town read is out of nowhere.

Lol what. Hallia claimed Nynaeve and you've got her as scum with no comment on that. Have Darthe labeled as town and criticize me for reading him as town. The only strong town read I have is Zander/Cass. Say I'm following the crowd yet I'm the only one voting on believer and there's no "crowd" in this game. There's been like zero consensus agreement on anything except town Zander/Cass. This list is a joke.

[Tiinker]

Idk how you get those reads without having some sort of agenda. Maybe you're hyper skimming or something cuz fair we've got 50 pages on D1 but if those are your actual reads after a proper catch up then I'll swap and vote you instead.

[Zander?]

 

\m/ \m/ \m/

 

Yey no more MQ!

 

 

YA youre lucky i kept my PC down while you went #FULLZANDER with PC!!!!!!

 

:ph34r:

 

.....IM sorry you have to put up with me.....

 

:wub: :wub: :wub:

[Tiinker]

Ok, finally caught up (had to skim a lof of Shad and Zander posts :/)

 

Not much time but this is what I am feeling

 

 

Dice - I like the way he has been inquisitive and his tone mainly suggests that he is trying to figure out stuff.

John Snow - Don't see what others are seeing in scum here and I think he is mostly an easy target. Hi char-claim comment is not likely to come from scum. Neither his doc thing.

@Dice Figure out what? He's primary posts have been outrage at someone self-voting. 

@WiFi which game? How is she more free flowing? Looks exactly the same as always.

@JS - Why can't it come from scum? It's got no actual substance and takes town no where to talk about it. 

 

You lazy or you're scum.

[Tiinker]

WiFi - SImilar to above, doesn't feel like the forced wifi we saw in the previous game. She is more free-flowing and that keeps her green for me.

Accidentally cut this off.

[Zander?]

Jon says that Post A is scummy. Reads as fake confusion. Tink asks Jon about fake confusion. Jon says that Post B reads as fake confusion. Shad notes that Jon implied Post A reads as fake confusion but later says Post B is what was actually fake confusion.

 

 

Confusion doesn't even look like a real word anymore.

 

Can you show me both posts please if you dont mind?

 

Cause now I feel like Im missing something.

 

Believer's ISO is way more introspective and fluff based here than either of the games before.

 

I don't see a single reaction test or a serious push at anyone except for John Snow/Iron and he doesn't engage with them directly except in response to threats to himself.

 

Could move here now tbh.

 

Need to go back and look at John Snow.

 

We are not Believers....or Beliebers.

[Believer]

We are not Believers....or Beliebers.

I will make you one, again.

[Zander?]

Ok, finally caught up (had to skim a lof of Shad and Zander posts :/)

 

Not much time but this is what I am feeling

 

 

Dice - I like the way he has been inquisitive and his tone mainly suggests that he is trying to figure out stuff.

Darthe - He had pocketed a lot of people early in the day in the previous game but here is quite different. Not trying hard and mostly standing in the background and this I feel is town!Darthe

WiFi - SImilar to above, doesn't feel like the forced wifi we saw in the previous game. She is more free-flowing and that keeps her green for me.

 

John Snow - Don't see what others are seeing in scum here and I think he is mostly an easy target. Hi char-claim comment is not likely to come from scum. Neither his doc thing.

Zander/Cass - VEry difficult to read Zander early in the game. I had to skim most of his posts. Cass has seemed alright. I think they are town here but need to have flips before I can figure them out completelt

Nolder - Feeling good about Nolder - although he hasn't given detailed lists, he is having enough presence to talk to people. The tone looks townie though.

Ironeyes - He got voted pretty early and I like his reaction to that. I don't agree with his vote on Snow but otherwise his posts have been good

 

 

Shad - His initial posts where he jokes that he is scum is weird. Still think he is a deep as scum and hard to read. Don't like the AtE part and self-voting but it comes likely from town!Shad. So, kind of mixed on him.

Hellian - Not much to comment here. She is new and I don't know how she plays. Still don't know the votes on her.

Believer - Not played with him either. Seems reluctant to give out reads D1. Difficult to say

 

 

Kat - Sigh, I somehow always see Kat scummy and it is the same this game. Posts like these and these where she shows frustration look forced to me.

Hallia - Gun to head, I would say she is scum. I don't like her vote on Snow and it looked quite opportunistic. I am used to her giving more detailed reads than she has given out this game.

Tiinker - He has been just following the crowd the whole game. Kind of reminds me of the game he was scum with me. His strong Darthe town read is out of nowhere.

 

I mean I could be really off on my reads but....

 

His read on us feels like hes just trying to be different.

 

He's not figuring in at all Hallia's soft claim and before people jump over me saying theres FAKE CHAR AND ROLE claims.  He's not even factoring in the timing of it or anything.

 

Define free flowing irt to Wifi?

 

I dont feel like Tink is playing like Overwatch.  Can you show/give me some examples?

 

Regardless the activity at least is a good sign form him.

 

Ill see how he progress before passing full judgement.

[Zander?]

 

We are not Believers....or Beliebers.

I will make you one, again.

 

 

[Tiinker]

 

 

Not in particular. If I die, that just gives the town more information. But I think that "joke" vote is starting to look more like a scummy camouflage. 

 

Feel disingenuous

 

 

 

-snip-

Well I won't claim to be good at mafia (not any more at least) but I'd love to kill some wolves! Does [v]Unvote vote wolves[/v] work?

[V] ironeyes [/v]

 

Um, what's this for?

 

 

Obviously b/c I think that post is scummy. Reads as fake confusion

 

Okay, the first I can get as being disingenuous cause of "scummy camouflage" (no one actually does this) but the second post? Scummy? Maybe. But confusing??? What could actually be confusing about that post. It's just not confusing. This guy is scum.

 

 

This is the post he was replying to.