MAFIA KART WII [BASIC] - Mafia Sweep

[Sili Quirrels]

 

Could also vote lynn for idk reasons.

Why are you just throwing your vote around if you don't understand someone?

Attempt to answer my question or my vote stays...

[Sili Quirrels]

Stork was a wolf too. I didnt know why i thought they were wolves though.

[Clovdyx]

I haven't read like the last several pages, since page 18, but what I thought of clov's posts (since clov asked) was that I empathized with his logic but felt I needed more detail. Like it is clear to me Seph was super serious, but I don't necessarily think that is scummy. Like it sort of depends on his state of mind, so right now I'd rather lynch celeste because I just did not get her responses and when that happens the person is 7/10 times a wolf.

 

[v]Celeste[/v]

 

So with that being said I am actually going to slank for today and def. some of tomorrow. XD

 

I think he was serious too, and I don't think that's necessarily scummy either (for Seph, or in general).  But it's not necessarily town either, and he's either tripping over his own feet as town or reaching at straws to get pressure off as mafia.  I'm not going to rule out the former, but the latter option just rings more true at this point

[Sili Quirrels]

i.e. why would it be okay for liz to tunnel you, ever, if you are town?

@celeste. U never answered this. Please answer.

[Celeste]

i.e. why would it be okay for liz to tunnel you, ever, if you are town?

when did I ever mention that tunneling was good? Tunneling to me is something that doesn't need to happen unless you actually believe the other person is scum. I have seen a lot of town just not go anywhere because of that.

[Clovdyx]

Seph I cant explain my read on from before but imo he just doesnt stand out in any wolfy way to me and I actually liked his quirkiness and slip ups. They look genuine.

 

I don't understand what you mean here.  If he's genuinely slipping up, doesn't that kind of suggest he IS mafia?

[Sili Quirrels]

I mean sometimes when ppl are serious they overreech. Aka maybe seph.

[Celeste]

I mean sometimes when ppl are serious they overreech. Aka maybe seph.

who is this directed too

[Sili Quirrels]

 

i.e. why would it be okay for liz to tunnel you, ever, if you are town?

when did I ever mention that tunneling was good? Tunneling to me is something that doesn't need to happen unless you actually believe the other person is scum. I have seen a lot of town just not go anywhere because of that.

Why would liz tunnel you unless she thought you were scum and why would you feel different about it if she did?

[Sili Quirrels]

 

I mean sometimes when ppl are serious they overreech. Aka maybe seph.

who is this directed too

Clov

 

But again havent read the last 9 pages

[Sili Quirrels]

God knows i overreeched as town back in the day.

[Clovdyx]

 

Why would we not be talking about it?  It's one of the more significant things that's happened in the thread so far, and it'd be nice to see where people stand on both of them - and there was enough discussion on it for other people to weigh in with their thoughts.  

 

You said Celeste seemed annoyed.  I don't disagree, but I don't know that that makes inherently increases her likeliness to be town.  If she is town, she probably would be annoyed that Liz was scumreading her right off the bat.  If she's mafia, she's probably annoyed that Liz was scumreading her right off the bat.  Is her frustration alignment indicative to you?  Did Liz's response seem genuine to you?

There are a few clear cases of frustrated players in every mafia game. Certain personalities trend that way, but in my experience it is overwhelmingly a townie trait to get really annoyed and frustrated. We have all seen it go both ways, but I am not getting pulled against the frustrated player on D1 when that strategy fails so often.

 

I have to read back on Liz, as my focus has more been on her vote bouncing around.

 

 

I don't know if I agree that it's an overwhelmingly townie trait.  I've seen a lot of mafia get upset when they feel they were being pushed for stupid reasons or felt they were towntelling and being pushed anyway.  I have absolutely no issue with your stance about pushing it, though.

[Celeste]

 

 

i.e. why would it be okay for liz to tunnel you, ever, if you are town?

when did I ever mention that tunneling was good? Tunneling to me is something that doesn't need to happen unless you actually believe the other person is scum. I have seen a lot of town just not go anywhere because of that.

Why would liz tunnel you unless she thought you were scum and why would you feel different about it if she did?

Jeez it's the same question about this annoying topic that I want to drop because it doesn't help my read of her. Read the thread because I answered this already.

[Clovdyx]

God knows i overreeched as town back in the day.

 

[Sili Quirrels]

 

 

Why would liz tunnel you unless she thought you were scum and why would you feel different about it if she did?

Jeez it's the same question about this annoying topic that I want to drop because it doesn't help my read of her. Read the thread because I answered this already.

 

clov can you confirm?

[Sili Quirrels]

It's easy to see why Cander believes emotion is a townie trait - because he as a wolf is very laid-back, but uniformly both mafia and town get annoyed and the particular vaccuum meta depends on the community. Fact is both get annoyed, and often for similar reasons, but you can usually tell the difference by how and when they get annoyed.

[Clovdyx]

 

 

 

Why would liz tunnel you unless she thought you were scum and why would you feel different about it if she did?

Jeez it's the same question about this annoying topic that I want to drop because it doesn't help my read of her. Read the thread because I answered this already.

 

clov can you confirm?

 

 

Eh, pretty much.  It wasn't the best answer but she definitely addressed it, yeah.

[Sili Quirrels]

Which page? Sort of busy at the moment but I'll check it out and see if I believe her.

[Calder]

It's easy to see why Cander believes emotion is a townie trait - because he as a wolf is very laid-back, but uniformly both mafia and town get annoyed and the particular vaccuum meta depends on the community. Fact is both get annoyed, and often for similar reasons, but you can usually tell the difference by how and when they get annoyed.

Ok that is pretty fair view and prob explains a good bit of how I view the issue. I think the truth lies in the latter part of your statement even more though. When I think back to scum teammates that got annoyed it wasnt from the beginning. They usually got there a bit into the fight when they take someone's statement personally and feel they are being called a bad player. It has the feel of an ego thing.

 

Celeste got annoyed at a towny speed to me.

[Darthe]

 

Seph I cant explain my read on from before but imo he just doesnt stand out in any wolfy way to me and I actually liked his quirkiness and slip ups. They look genuine.

I don't understand what you mean here. If he's genuinely slipping up, doesn't that kind of suggest he IS mafia?

Nah, both alignments make mistakes and say things that hurt them as individual slots. I prefer to weigh the merit of what mistakes their making.

[Sili Quirrels]

 

It's easy to see why Cander believes emotion is a townie trait - because he as a wolf is very laid-back, but uniformly both mafia and town get annoyed and the particular vaccuum meta depends on the community. Fact is both get annoyed, and often for similar reasons, but you can usually tell the difference by how and when they get annoyed.

Ok that is pretty fair view and prob explains a good bit of how I view the issue. I think the truth lies in the latter part of your statement even more though. When I think back to scum teammates that got annoyed it wasnt from the beginning. They usually got there a bit into the fight when they take someone's statement personally and feel they are being called a bad player. It has the feel of an ego thing.

 

Celeste got annoyed at a towny speed to me.

 

 

Sometimes you'll come across the rare personality who puts themselves in the shoes of a villager and can act it out though. Gotta look out for them (aka monster, tom, cory).

 

Anyway I agree about Celeste. Her responses are villagery, not in content but in tone (from what I have seen).

[Clovdyx]

 

 

Seph I cant explain my read on from before but imo he just doesnt stand out in any wolfy way to me and I actually liked his quirkiness and slip ups. They look genuine.

I don't understand what you mean here. If he's genuinely slipping up, doesn't that kind of suggest he IS mafia?

Nah, both alignments make mistakes and say things that hurt them as individual slots. I prefer to weigh the merit of what mistakes their making.

 

 

I thought you were referencing slipping his alignment, not just making mistakes.  I'm sure any sort of mistake would be genuine - I doubt he'd deliberately "screw up" to MAKE himself look worse.

[Sili Quirrels]

too many pages to look through yo.

[Lizabeth]

 

You're saying you don't make snap reads?

 

And the part I wanted to follow up on was this: why were you calling out Penny for not addressing my scum read on her but not calling out Calder for not addressing my unexplained vote on him, even after I pointed out to you that he wasn't asking me any questions about it?

 

No I dont.  I call out posts I like or dont like but no I dont make reads off of 3 posts.

 

I did question your vote on Calder. http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/97862-mafia-kart-wii-basic/?p=3641420

 

 

That's not what I asked. I gave you brownie points for being a gentleman and asking me, remember? I gave Calder minus points for failing to be so gentlemanly.

 

My question is: if it's suspicions for Lassie to not challenge my scum read on her, why was it not a problem for you that Calder didn't even acknowledge or question my actual vote on him until I questioned him about it? Celeste at least questioned me when I called her scum. So why the focus on Celeste and none on Calder. That's my question.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I don't see how you can legitimately make that argument.  I quoted everything she said to/about you prior to your comment.  She had barely said anything about you, whatsoever, and she had substantially more content directed towards other players.

She accused me of being scum for my first 3 posts that I made while at dinner and after work!! How does that make me scum? This is why I don't even want to get into it because it becomes this huge argument where people take sides between us. It happened in the tower and true love and we were both wrong. If this is faking then i'm just going to stop this here.

 

Without getting into another circular argument, because I hope you'll take to heart the comments I made in my preceding post: I was not wrong about your alignment in either of those games. You were wrong about mine. You're still under the mistaken belief that because I was pushing you in True Love and because I chose to sacrifice you in the Tower (where I had no choice but to vote for one of my town reads) that I did those things because I thought you were scum. I've told you multiple times that I knew you were town in both those cases and I made choices based on what I thought was the best strategy for the game at that time.

 

But I'm not hashing this out again with you in a game thread. As Chris pointed out, you're not the only person I've been poking in this game, and there are people I've poked far more. So if you're town try to get out of the mindspace that everything I do is about you. If you're scum, I'll just remind you that emotional manipulation ain't going to work on me. Expect me to push you. Figure out how to deal with it.

 

 

 

So Penny lied?

 

And you dont take issue with this???

 

Where did I say that she lied?

 

Here are the comments that I've made on the Celeste issue:

 

1) She posted something that pinged as false to me and I poked her for it (calling her scum!Lassie)

2) She and I have a history in games that includes her becoming paranoid and reactive when I've challenged her

3) She and I have had many a circular argument on this issue of her feeling that I misunderstand her and me feeling that she misunderstands me. (this is additional information, but this discussion has occurred both during and following games)

4) She seems to persist in the belief that I have misread her as scummy in the past when I keep pointing out to her (during and after games) that I didn't misread her.

 

I don't think she's lying, I think she's got the wrong perception of our history. I think that should be clear from the way I've responded to her today, especially with what I said about what I realized from the conversation between Clov and Sili where they were trying to understand what angle she was coming from.

 

 

I see where youre coming from with Liz and I really havent liked any of Penny's responses at all.

 

My one problem with Liz was made worse by Penny stating that they tend to read each other wrong.

 

But much more concerning is Penny's subsequent reaction Liz's read then the read itself.

 

[v] Penny [/v]

If she tends to read me wrong and thinks (emphasis on thinks) that I tend to read her wrong, then wouldn't it make sense if she were town to try not to overreact to me and try to leave room for a clearer read?

 

 

She didnt over react she just brushed it aside.  It didnt become a thing for her really till it was brought up by others like yours truly.

 

Exactly. But then when she reacted to people saying she didn't react enough, people like you started reading her as scummy for it.

If you'll read you'll see what my response to her tunnelling comment was. In a nutshell "yes, I think you're scum. But I'll be able to tell if you aren't". In otherwords, you didn't see me pushing her to give me a reaction.

 

Have you ever played with Celeste? I feel like you should know certain things about her if you've ever played with her... >.>

[Sili Quirrels]

Fiiiiiiiiine. 

 

I'll look for it, but just to be clear you'remaking me tank my exam for this game.