[BASIC/STANDARD] Warcraft: War of the Ancients Mafia - GAME OVER, MAFIA WINS

[wish-tree]

Okay, fair enough. I'm going to go, mouth is numb from doing dental work.

[Nolder]

 

 

3) No no see you're getting it wrong. You read Xander, he reads you. That's fine. It's when someone else looks at Xander and concludes you are town. A third party who's not privy to that uhhh connection you have. Keep in mind he made this read fairly early. Also keep in mind at the time wish/celeste being w/w was still a possibility imo.

I don't think you read my full note on that.

 

CAN and DO you read two other players based on how you perceive them to treat each other as same/different alignment?

 

I also do see your point in that it could be a front and w/w. I would concede that point if Wish wasn't playing a very town game, imo. And being that I KNOW that she reads Celeste well due to experience as hydra and outside of mafia, then I can trust her read of Celeste, is that not correct? I think this is what makes it easy, at least for me.

 

Now, if Wish is scum, I'm going to feel like an idiot because Wish probably pocketing Celeste; or if Wish was playing a poor game, I probably wouldn't trust her read. But that's not the case here, afaict.

 

I try not to but I'm sure it happens. I don't like relying on meta.

 

And I am absolutely not saying Wish is scum.

What I'm saying is, at the time Shad made his reads, I'm not sure he could have made that call with 100% confidence.

How did he know they weren't w/w? Was he even worried about that possibility? Doesn't seem like he was to me which is what tips me off.

[Shad_]

I would like to Cass in real time before day ends, I have one question for her and I want it answered within a few minutes of me asking it.

 

Otherwise my vote stays. What's your time frame, Cass?

Me too, actually. Wonder if it's the same question.

[Shad_]

There's actually a very glaring and obvious reason why Cass is probably the final scum.

[Askthepizzaguy]

I wouldn't say it's obvious, but could you tell me what it is? Now I'm curious.

 

Basically I have a question only innocent-Cass has a good answer to and I don't want her to be prepared for it.

[Cass]

 

 

fwiw she laid out all of his reads lists in a later post Pral. No need to dig for them.

 

Ýep, saw that on my read through now. Thanks Alanna

Confirms what I was thinking.

Zander mixes it up but at the same time he likes to distribute his reads. It could be town-null or town-scum etc. In this case, csarmi wasn't exactly playing - so he had no choice but to put him in null. The other wolf, based on my other reads, is in shad/cass/nolder or celeste. I have townish leaning reads on Shad and Nolder and as I said yesterday, wolfish read on Cass.

So, that is where I am - cass/celeste

I even put them in chronological order! (thumbs up) Will be handy in future games too lol

#4150 @CASS, is Cory telling you to be less paranoid?

Also, some of the things I see you pointing out about Nolder are townie for him. He tends to be scummy in both roles, but a lot of his interactions this game are not scum!Nolder.

 

 

1. I think chances are Zander put the last scum in his Town reads. I don't see why Nolder should get a pass for scummy actions because he does scummy things as both alignments. If it's scummy, it has scum equity. If I also don't see why you would vote me over him when I'm willing to keep working and provide opinions where I can.

 

Which of the things bugging me are Town?

If not Nolder or I, who?

 

2. Cory is severely frustrated with my hesitation and paranoia, Imo. He's not telling me anything at the moment because he got frustrated with the Town and went to vent in the DT. His advice was basically if someone plays enough Town moves, call them Town, focus on finding scum. Give then the read, move on. Post more, stop overnight and being my own biggest problem. He was vehement that Kaylee was Town ftr, but I didn't feel it was ethical to simply sheep his reads if I couldn't trust that she was Town.

 

 

Notes from early game: Cass super excited. Seems weird compared to her current attitude. Penny seems more subdued, more calm, not in a hurry.

  

 

So... what does this mean in relation to Penny's alignment for you?

 

Same with me, do you believe this is aliment indicative/worth pointing out without providing further thoughts/conclusions?

 

I pretty much could not have got more excited in Mafia-world than I was at the beginning of this game ( :D ) I rolled Town and I had Cory as a mentor. Chances were I was gonna learn stuff and get better at being Town. I would have been bitterly disappointed if I'd randed scum, and I doubt I could've faked the enthusiasm to that extent.

 

The super excited was real, the vote on Csarmi was real, backed with the confidence of having Cory agreeing with the read/calling for his lynch. My read on Zander was legit and I ended up stoked at confidently finding two scum.

Then Zander got taken out before I could case him, and I was back to square one and suddenly reversed into deep Wolf on WIFOM and misreads.

 

My current attitude is the result of not surmounting my flaws to the extent I'd been hoping to, and ending up in the same problem spot I always do beyond early game - lack of clear direction/understanding and insecurity making me overthink/doubt everyone and everything. Plus a lack of time, which was always going to be a problem.

 

In this situation, confidence/direction is easier to fake as Wolf. If anything, my mood and hesitation/lack of direction here is more indicative of my Town game than scum.

 

Cass also talks about maybe being T-T with Laine and tinfoiling to misreads. Doesn't want to vote to lynch Laine yet, but promises to hunt her down if wolf. This post (#181) doesn't sound like Cass really believes that Laine is a wolf.

 

 

And?????

 

 

#177: what aspect of the Laine/Zander interaction wasn't normal, Shad?

 

#187: Cass, why did you joke vote Penny if you don't joke vote? (And why would you joke vote Dice, if that's relevant)

Change in confidence level/enthusiasm for the RVS/connection stage of the game compared to previous games.

 

Because she voted me and it seemed like a fun way to start figuring each other out. I was excited and excited to play with her again so it was acknowledgement of those facts. Why does anybody place joke votes? I'd joke vote Dice in return for the same reasons and I don't think any of this is relevant to the rest of the actual game!

 

On the other hand, Penny voted me first when she could've picked you or anyone else on the board.

 

@Penny, are joke votes normal for you? Why'd you pick me?

 

I took it as a sign/test but it could equally have been a budding move if she's scum. Thoughts?

[Askthepizzaguy]

Cass, you're here.

 

I gots a question for you. Lemme know when you're caught up.

[Cass]

 

I would like to Cass in real time before day ends, I have one question for her and I want it answered within a few minutes of me asking it. Otherwise my vote stays. What's your time frame, Cass?

Me too, actually. Wonder if it's the same question.

  

There's actually a very glaring and obvious reason why Cass is probably the final scum.

Because I'm perfect for mislynch?

 

*eyeroll*

 

I'm going to shower and then clean the bathrooms. After that I'll break for lunch and can talk in real time.

 

Give me an hour from now.

 

While you're at it, keep looking at who else you think is likely scum. I'm fail-Town right now, not scum. I don't want to waste today with my mislynch.

[Cass]

Pizza, since you're here post your question.

[Cass]

I likely have less than 10 mins before being called back into cleaning up the house.

[Askthepizzaguy]

In your own words, can you tell me what you've learned from your mentor this game about how to village differently/better?

[Cass]

Trust that people are Town

[Shad_]

Everything seems more obvious when you have that "a-ha" moment than after you stop and think about it a bit.

[Shad_]

Cass is on and I have a cranky kid piled on my lap. I'll try to dig this out.

[Cass]

There are more Town than scum, someone who is repeatedly Town probably is. Stop tinfoiling and move on. Address ' possible deep wolves' in later game.

[Cass]

And, importantly (though I still cannot for the life of me actually do this yet) go for Occam's and stop creating so many 'what ifs'

[Cass]

Post more, stop hiding in QT

[Askthepizzaguy]

Is that everything you feel comfortable sharing?

[Askthepizzaguy]

Oh I see there was more.

[Cass]

What I hoped to learn but haven't was what to do/how to be more proactive/confident when noone strikes me as overtly scum.

[Askthepizzaguy]

There's 8 alive.

 

6 tomorrow most likely. That's lynch or lose with 4 original scums.

 

Assuming we lynch correctly today or tomorrow, or there's only 1 scum left, we have between two and three lynches remaining.

 

Name those lynches in order.

[Cass]

I learnt Cory has a list of how he thinks people play as Town and Scum and that's where he compares play/consolidates his reads.

 

I'll take away this method and lay out the same expectations for players I know at the start of games to come.

[Askthepizzaguy]

There's 8 alive.

 

6 tomorrow most likely. That's lynch or lose with 4 original scums.

 

Assuming we lynch correctly today or tomorrow, or there's only 1 scum left, we have between two and three lynches remaining.

 

Name those lynches in order.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Website just had a little hiccup and you mentioned you had to run.

 

Thanks for stopping by, your answer was good. I want to know more but this is fine for now.

[Cass]

There's 8 alive.

 

6 tomorrow most likely. That's lynch or lose with 4 original scums.

 

Assuming we lynch correctly today or tomorrow, or there's only 1 scum left, we have between two and three lynches remaining.

 

Name those lynches in order.

I am not confident at all in doing this.

 

Based on where I'm at

 

Nolder/Pral

Wish/Celeste